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ReGnYuM Escrow Removal and Acquisition Negative-Feedback 3205	Posted - 2014.09.03 21:51:00 - [1] - Quote An absolutely broken and flawed mechanic that should not exist in any FPS. Why? 1. People with Inherent Wall Hacks are considered CHEATERS in the FPS community. 2. Squad vision removes the need for active scanners in socket based game play, which is generally the focal point of any PC battle. 3. Active Scans notify the enemy when being scanned, Passives don't. I only bring this up because I like to know when someone has broken my dampened Assault suit. 4. Giving a highly mobile suit, like the scout, a motion sensor is just asking for trouble. Solutions: Short Term: Take away the precession bonuses from scouts and give it to the commander role. A role focused more on Passive Slaying and therefore less mobile Long Term: Make passive scans more of "you have been tagged" rather then LOL wallhackz Escrow Removal and Acquisition- Our ERA has only just begun... Gym Bro/ Meat Head -- CrossFit enthusiast
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 2779	Posted - 2014.09.03 21:57:00 - [2] - Quote Passive scan is a broken mechanic, but scout should keep the EW superiotiy that they have, but it should be limited to stats, none of the suits should have bonus on EW. I would tone down stats too, scouts should be better than the rest, but not unreachable like now. I almost never hear complain of min scout (except a few for NK, but now all suits are able to stab with efficiency now), the reason is EW imo. PSN: ogamega "Dust is full of communists who despise people with enough isk to buy expensive items" LOCK REGIONS
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 16340	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:02:00 - [3] - Quote Would love a fall off system Would love a saturation system Would like a purge system and an indicator of how detectable you yourself are. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Advanced Large Blaster =// Unlocked
medomai grey warravens Capital Punishment. 952	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:06:00 - [4] - Quote Passive scans are OP. But so is dampening + cloaks. Why cry foul on only a piece of the broken whole, unless your trying to gain something? What percentile of Dust514's infantry arsenal belongs to the category of machine guns?
Hakyou Brutor Pure Evil. 1217	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:11:00 - [5] - Quote Even though I'm a Cal Scout that run 3 Precisions... I agree. Heavies should ALWAYS be on passive scans, Medium Frames should be invisible to anyone without Precisions on. Medium Frames are FAR too easy to be seen with passives, it gives scouts far too much of a benefit.
I-Shayz-I I----------I 4762	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:12:00 - [6] - Quote http://memegenerator.net/instance/54014818 7162 wp with a Repair Tool! List of Legion Feedback Threads!
ReGnYuM Escrow Removal and Acquisition Negative-Feedback 3209	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:14:00 - [7] - Quote medomai grey wrote: Passive scans are OP. But so is dampening + cloaks. Why cry foul on only a piece of the broken whole, unless your trying to gain something? I agree with you on the cloaking portion. However, as for general dampening I would disagree. Dampening, to me, is more of a counter play measure, "Ok I have been scanned, now its time to switch into something, where he cannot scan me". Furthermore, you giving away something to achieve that stealth in most cases. Where with passive scans and scans in general you're enabling yourself to get the jump on your opponent, and TFS is everything in a FPS. Escrow Removal and Acquisition- Our ERA has only just begun... Gym Bro/ Meat Head -- CrossFit enthusiast
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 3732	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:16:00 - [8] - Quote This has been discussed before. At length. According to Rattati, the fix is more difficult than they perhaps initially thought it might be. medomai grey wrote: Passive scans are OP. But so is dampening + cloaks. Why cry foul on only a piece of the broken whole, unless your trying to gain something? If I am invisible, it only benefits me. If I am able to broadcast the positions of enemies around me, it benefits my whole squad. Even heavies that have no EWAR skills. Suddenly, they are able to see undampened scouts and dampened medium frames with no sacrifice whatsoever, all the while wielding that Burst HMG. Shared passives is a much bigger problem. You can always tell a Millford Minja
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2208	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:18:00 - [9] - Quote The passive scan mechanic puts a bad taste in the mouths of many fps'ers, true. On the other hand the passive scanning mechanic has the potential to add an interesting tactical layer to the game, if we can find a way to make it less wallhacky. I think we'd get a lot of mileage from introducing a considerable variance to the passive scan results(i remember way back when the descriptions we got regarding the passive scan mechanics implied there would be significant error in the passive scans - i always thought that meant location error). This might be doable without a client update, dunno. Presumably when the game paints a chevron on the HUD or minimap the location information is coming from the server. The precision/profile skills could serve double duty for the error calculation. The net result would be that when you saw that chevon through the wall or that dot on a minimap, the real location of the merc might be -¦ 10 meters away, depending on your suit type, ewar skills, ewar mods, target profile, etc. For calibration purposes make it so the most blinged-out max-level proto ewar scout still has a -¦ 1.0m error. PSN: RationalSpark
ratamaq doc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 852	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:30:00 - [10] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: An absolutely broken and flawed mechanic that should not exist in any FPS. Why? 1. People with Inherent Wall Hacks are considered CHEATERS in the FPS community. 2. Squad vision removes the need for active scanners in socket based game play, which is generally the focal point of any PC battle. 3. Active Scans notify the enemy when being scanned, Passives don't. I only bring this up because I like to know when someone has broken my dampened Assault suit. 4. Giving a highly mobile suit, like the scout, a motion sensor is just asking for trouble. Solutions: Short Term: Take away the precession bonuses from scouts and give it to the commander role. A role focused more on Passive Slaying and therefore less mobile Long Term: Make passive scans more of "you have been tagged" rather then LOL wallhackz As a full fledged ewar abuser, I agree. Every heavy and medium frame + 3/4 of the light frames must be able to withstand 400 to 1000 hp of damage depending on your reaction time because I'm going to shoot you in the back most of the time. And I'm going to try and do it from a position where I can get back behind cover to reposition myself using the same ewar advantage for a second attack on you if you manage to survive the first attack long enough to turn around and look at me. The only time you're going to kill me is if you happen to spot me out in the open outside of 45 meters and are good enough to shoot me while I'm moving to cover or dancing like James Brown. OR, you come around the corner facing me and I'm out of REs and don't output enough damage to kill you first, but you better be a heavy if the latter is the case because anything less than that is going to be crippled to my 20k suit. It needs to be fixed. It's so much worse now compared to the scanarina days. Worse now than when we had team shared vision. The staring DB for scouts is too damn low, and more than the gallogi needs to be able to effectively use an active scanner. I said this when I saw the changes to scouts pre 1.8. Hell a few of us were pointing out how OP passives were when they gave the gal scout the range buff BEFORE the active scanner nerf/scout buff. I don't think this will be fixed in dust though. We are so far down this rabbit hole and so many things would need to change on so many levels that I would hope this could be surprised if this could be fixed by legion. YouTube

Joel II X Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 3260	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:31:00 - [11] - Quote Am I the only one who thinks... Caldari Scout Bonus: 10% Scan Range per level ... is a bit TOO much?
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 4730	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:34:00 - [12] - Quote Joel II X wrote: Am I the only one who thinks... Caldari Scout Bonus: 10% Scan Range per level ... is a bit TOO much? No one knows. It is currently bugged at 3%. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Dreis Shadowweaver D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 113	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:43:00 - [13] - Quote Imagine if passive scans didn't exist... Now that I think about it, wouldn't it make the game much more balanced? Just think... Well, I once meleed an R.E.... I've only ever known 1.8... Caldari blood, Minmatar heart <3
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1447	Posted - 2014.09.03 22:49:00 - [14] - Quote This game was much better before the introduction of EWAR and cloaking, IMO. Not sure we can turn back the clock on these changes, but the observation stands.
iliel 150	Posted - 2014.09.03 23:24:00 - [15] - Quote Shared passives are powerful. But so are suits with 2k ehp which deal 1.8k dps at 30 meters. Game was more fun in 1.7 because everyone had the ability to scan or be unscannable to everyone else and had similar ehp and dealt similar dps. Now stealthy killshots are the only antidote to the monster suits. So scouts sneak around and heavies loom. Pretty stupid. But I don't like to be an immobile fortress, so I made a choice. Everyone else can make theirs. All I can say is: if passives vanish and superman suits still exist, this game will become that much more tedious - - I guarantee it.
taxi bastard Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 250	Posted - 2014.09.03 23:26:00 - [16] - Quote remove squad shared passive scans IMO and its good
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3443	Posted - 2014.09.03 23:37:00 - [17] - Quote While I agree with you that scanning needs to redone. I always find your posts contain more whining than most. Would you prehaps like to try something more objective than 'LOL Wallhacks' They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 386	Posted - 2014.09.03 23:38:00 - [18] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: 3. Active Scans notify the enemy when being scanned, Passives don't. I only bring this up because I like to know when someone has broken my dampened Assault suit. You always know when you've been passively scanned, because 3 people shoot at you from different directions & a scout pops out infront... You don't need something to tell you that's what's happening, lol.
Makuta Miserix Better Hide R Die 263	Posted - 2014.09.03 23:45:00 - [19] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Joel II X wrote: Am I the only one who thinks... Caldari Scout Bonus: 10% Scan Range per level ... is a bit TOO much? No one knows. It is currently bugged at 3%. Didn't they fix that? Source October 9th > September 9th. Dust 514 Private Beta
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3444	Posted - 2014.09.03 23:54:00 - [20] - Quote Personally I don't think passive scaning should be nerfed into the ground entirely, but it should be redone. 1) All Light and Medium Suits should be capable of avoiding all but prescision modules. This is a simple one, medium suits should sacrifice 1 dampener to get under the majority of passive scans, dependent on the amount of prescision mods equipped. 2) Passive Scans should be changed to a sonar format. Currently Passive Scans give the same data as Active, you can see exactly where they are, what direction they are facing and you can see them moving. I instead propose that passive scans provide 'blips' which don't come with directional indicators and only update once every 1,2,4 seconds for light medium and heavy suits respectively 3) Active Scanning should also be redone. Active Scanning currently is equally broken, you ping once and you've got 10-15 seconds worth of data. This allows a logi to effectively multi-task, scan, rep, rez, repeat. The player can 10 seconds worth of potentially game changing intel for about 2 seconds worth of time where he can't fight back. Instead I think active Scanning should require the Scanner to be constantly equipped, turning it into a kind of magic torch. You will only receive intel on the section the torch is shone on, but as soon as the enemy leaves the 'light' you loose their data. This stops scannerina's since doing such a trick only results in you getting a wlrse version of passive scans. It also puts the player at greater risk for his reward and stops the whole Scan, Rep, Rez, Repeat cycle. Scanning gets another layer of tactics. When do you scan? When dl you stop scanning? Is better to track a single 'fast-moving' target or maintain intel on the main pack? They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3

Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4812	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:00:00 - [21] - Quote Passive scan is indeed stupid. I am all for radar mechanics, but the precision vs dampening formula just isn't a very good structure for it. I'm not even a fan of hand held active scanners either, honestly. I'm more of the mind that it is a piece of equipment that should be deployed somewhere, and only works within a certain radius.
HOWDIDHEKILLME Dying to Reload 423	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:28:00 - [22] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: This has been discussed before. At length. According to Rattati, the fix is more difficult than they perhaps initially thought it might be. medomai grey wrote: Passive scans are OP. But so is dampening + cloaks. Why cry foul on only a piece of the broken whole, unless your trying to gain something? If I am invisible, it only benefits me. If I am able to broadcast the positions of enemies around me, it benefits my whole squad. Even heavies that have no EWAR skills. Suddenly, they are able to see undampened scouts and dampened medium frames with no sacrifice whatsoever, all the while wielding that Burst HMG. Shared passives is a much bigger problem. I proved this point to a group I randomly squaded with... I ran a maxed out ewar scout, a rep tool and ammo on a city map. I didn't go for any kills just kept them alive and stocked. 5 heavys knew exactly where anyone within 60+ meters of me was ( huge area in cqc ) , and the only ones they had to worry about could be killed in less than second, while they ran no scans or ewar. All my benefits none of the downside and I still scored over 1000 wp passively. I only have 249 total hp ( with maxed core skills ) fairly vulnerable alone but I have 5 guys with over 1500 hp and over 800 dps maybe throw in a commando for av, ranged weapons and an injector around me with the same "vision" as me with 6 times the hit points and double my dps ammo and reps... as long as they don't get cocky their almost unstoppable. Lonewolf till I die
taxi bastard Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 252	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:28:00 - [23] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Personally I don't think passive scaning should be nerfed into the ground entirely, but it should be redone. 1) All Light and Medium Suits should be capable of avoiding all but prescision modules. This is a simple one, medium suits should sacrifice 1 dampener to get under the majority of passive scans, dependent on the amount of prescision mods equipped. proto damp with max passives gets a medium suit to 33.75 which is bellow caldari and mini scout passive scans.
HOWDIDHEKILLME Dying to Reload 423	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:30:00 - [24] - Quote Just get rid of shared vision all together. Lonewolf till I die
hold that Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 225	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:32:00 - [25] - Quote Do only scouts have passive scan squad vision? Say I have 3 complex precision on my medium. Will my squad also see what I do?
HOWDIDHEKILLME Dying to Reload 423	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:33:00 - [26] - Quote taxi bastard wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Personally I don't think passive scaning should be nerfed into the ground entirely, but it should be redone. 1) All Light and Medium Suits should be capable of avoiding all but prescision modules. This is a simple one, medium suits should sacrifice 1 dampener to get under the majority of passive scans, dependent on the amount of prescision mods equipped. proto damp with max passives gets a medium suit to 33.75 which is bellow caldari and mini scout passive scans. Unless they have maxed skills... One precision enhancer and no medium suit can sneak by. Lonewolf till I die
HOWDIDHEKILLME Dying to Reload 423	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:34:00 - [27] - Quote hold that wrote: Do only scouts have passive scan squad vision? Say I have 3 complex precision on my medium. Will my squad also see what I do? Yes but at gimped range maxed ewar scout can see around 90 meters supposedly Lonewolf till I die
hold that Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 225	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:37:00 - [28] - Quote 90 range is too much. The best active is only 100 with a 5 sec window and minute recharge
Kaze Eyrou Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 573	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:43:00 - [29] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Joel II X wrote: Am I the only one who thinks... Caldari Scout Bonus: 10% Scan Range per level ... is a bit TOO much? No one knows. It is currently bugged at 3%. No it was hotfixed recently. It's working correctly now. Closed Beta Vet // Logi Bro // @KazeEyrou
HOWDIDHEKILLME Dying to Reload 423	Posted - 2014.09.04 00:53:00 - [30] - Quote hold that wrote: 90 range is too much. The best active is only 100 with a 5 sec window and minute recharge No active goes out to 200 m Lonewolf till I die



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