DUST Search - Shared Tacnet needs to GO, CCP

Doc DDD wrote:

Dampeners on a logi or assault would be nice, the problem is that lvl 5 gal scouts with one dampener, plates, Kincats, cloak and shotgun make it nearly mandatory to have someone full time scanning to stop the bloodbath. It's not uncharacteristic to see those cloaked flankers average 30 kills being invisible 90% of the time.

Removing cloaks would do more for making fewer people run multiple precision enhancers than removing shared scans. Then you would see more dampened assault's, logis, and heavies. But that is never going to happen. Instead we have invisible scouts that are also invisible on tacnet, one or two shotting you from behind, necessitating a squad mate to sacrifice most of their ehp for sensors, only to be met with cries for the nerf bat from the perpetually invisible shotgun flankers.

After active scanners were nerfed, shared tacnet became the only thing keeping dampened gal scouts in check, which has the side effect of making dampened medium suits a waste.

How would you fix this without having every match turn into " let's find one of the 16 cloaked gal scouts on the other team before they one shot me "... ?

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Doc DDD TeamPlayers 257	Posted - 2014.07.30 14:33:00 - [61] - Quote Agreed Monkey... the scouts that don't want to run 3 dampeners to get under 3 precisions are the problem.
Cass Caul 77	Posted - 2014.07.30 17:35:00 - [62] - Quote I'm very surprised to see Doc DDD being a little b*tch. Such rage there. Probably why he hasn't set foot outside a vehicle in so long. If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
Rusty Shallows Caldari State 1960	Posted - 2014.07.30 23:59:00 - [63] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Tie active scans to suit precision, and you have a deal. Gal Logis might hate that. snip Get gud scrubs . Snip I want balance. I just find it ironic that you want a broken system that allows heavies with perfect sight, and a Cal scout to run around without worries of weakness for maxing precision and range because all his heavy squad mates have to do is protect him, then call others a scrub. Only scrubs protect a crutch like shared scanning. That shared passive works for Mediums and Light Assaults as well. If we want to sound disparaging about it then we need to be thorough. It screws with Nova Knife Minjas like nothing else. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
Doc DDD TeamPlayers 259	Posted - 2014.07.31 00:43:00 - [64] - Quote Cass Caul wrote: I'm very surprised to see Doc DDD being a little b*tch. Such rage there. Probably why he hasn't set foot outside a vehicle in so long. Just put another dampener on appia. . And some deodorant. (You stink)
Cass Caul 123	Posted - 2014.07.31 00:51:00 - [65] - Quote lol If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
Cass Caul 125	Posted - 2014.07.31 01:21:00 - [66] - Quote You went all, "OMG I HAVE CAPS LOCK! THAT MAKES ME IMPORTANT!" Seriously though, you can see my current opinion on the passive vs active scans in the Charlie EWAR thread, I don't think the Gal-Logi should have a bonus to precision that's better than the other Logistics. I like the current proposed value of the Focused Scanner being better than maxed out passive scans. I liked pre-1.8 when no-one knew passive scans were shared. When I could stack 3 precision mods on my Logi suit and detect almost every scout. When Assault suits could participate in Stealth. Removal of shared passive scans should help Medium Frames out while flanking. It should make Active Scanners useful- not OP like before and not nearly useless like now. It won't make them useful in their current iteration because the Gal-Logi bonus to precision needs to be shared across all Logistics but that's more of a Logistics issue that they need to have a comprehensive EQ bonus that makes them better with all EQ instead of just 1. Did you see the current thought (not yet proposed) of increasing fitting requirements of regular plates on Light Frames to disincentivize them? Would that affect your opinion if Scouts could not use both Plates and Dampeners at the same time? Without removing slots to still allow things like range amps, codebreakers, repair modules, shield regulators, kinetic catalyzers or cardiac regulators? I want to run a double-dampened assault or logi again and not have to worry about it being useless, I want the option to not have my position displayed for an entire team when I want to try flanking. My opinion on removal of shared passive scans has very little to do with any of my 4 scout suits and has more to do with my 4 logistics and 4 assaults that I run I am sorry I smell bad, the perfume had a really pretty flower and with a name like titan aurm I thought it would be really cool. If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
OP FOTM Commando Perkone Caldari State 237	Posted - 2014.07.31 02:25:00 - [67] - Quote Cass Caul wrote: I don't think the Gal-Logi should have a bonus to precision that's better than the other Logistics. . you better be talking about passive scans... because what else would you propose? taking ALL the logi bonuses away? i mean that's the whole point of having amarr with better uplinks, caldari better hives, etc Dust servers will be a ghost town on 09/09/14 Destiny kicks ass... Like Halo knocked up Mass Effect and gave birth
Doc DDD TeamPlayers 263	Posted - 2014.07.31 02:54:00 - [68] - Quote Dampeners on a logi or assault would be nice, the problem is that lvl 5 gal scouts with one dampener, plates, Kincats, cloak and shotgun make it nearly mandatory to have someone full time scanning to stop the bloodbath. It's not uncharacteristic to see those cloaked flankers average 30 kills being invisible 90% of the time. Removing cloaks would do more for making fewer people run multiple precision enhancers than removing shared scans. Then you would see more dampened assault's, logis, and heavies. But that is never going to happen. Instead we have invisible scouts that are also invisible on tacnet, one or two shotting you from behind, necessitating a squad mate to sacrifice most of their ehp for sensors, only to be met with cries for the nerf bat from the perpetually invisible shotgun flankers. After active scanners were nerfed, shared tacnet became the only thing keeping dampened gal scouts in check, which has the side effect of making dampened medium suits a waste. How would you fix this without having every match turn into " let's find one of the 16 cloaked gal scouts on the other team before they one shot me "... ?
Cass Caul 129	Posted - 2014.07.31 03:01:00 - [69] - Quote OP FOTM wrote: Cass Caul wrote: I don't think the Gal-Logi should have a bonus to precision that's better than the other Logistics. . you better be talking about passive scans... because what else would you propose? taking ALL the logi bonuses away? i mean that's the whole point of having amarr with better uplinks, caldari better hives, etc No, I don't mean homogenizing Logsitcs skills, I mean each one has a bonus to every equipment. There are two parts to all EQ bonuses. The Gal has Precision and Duration. MN, CA, and AM should all get precision but only GA gets Duration. AM has number of uses and speed. so give all logistics increase usage. same for the other two. It means that Logistics are the choice for using support Equipment. If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 3028	Posted - 2014.07.31 03:13:00 - [70] - Quote Doc DDD wrote: Dampeners on a logi or assault would be nice, the problem is that lvl 5 gal scouts with one dampener, plates, Kincats, cloak and shotgun make it nearly mandatory to have someone full time scanning to stop the bloodbath. It's not uncharacteristic to see those cloaked flankers average 30 kills being invisible 90% of the time. Removing cloaks would do more for making fewer people run multiple precision enhancers than removing shared scans. Then you would see more dampened assault's, logis, and heavies. But that is never going to happen. Instead we have invisible scouts that are also invisible on tacnet, one or two shotting you from behind, necessitating a squad mate to sacrifice most of their ehp for sensors, only to be met with cries for the nerf bat from the perpetually invisible shotgun flankers. After active scanners were nerfed, shared tacnet became the only thing keeping dampened gal scouts in check, which has the side effect of making dampened medium suits a waste. How would you fix this without having every match turn into " let's find one of the 16 cloaked gal scouts on the other team before they one shot me "... ? There are problems, but your solutions are oversimplified and cause just as many if not more problems. You don't just take a hammer to all scouts just because there are problems with 1/4 of the racial options. For example, CCP is discussing placing the bonus to module efficacy so that scouts have to equip the modules in order to get the bonuses, and will result in less tanking. They have also talked about having a significant penalty to scouts for using armor plates (ferro and reactive would be exempt). Not to mention the fact that you are greatly exaggerating being perpetually invisible, as duration of cloaks was significantly reduced, and that they still require at least 50% of the cloak stamina to be available in order to cloak. Lastly, cloaks don't make anyone invisible, only less visible. It is still possible to see a cloaked scout, and is rather easy when they are moving. This is how a minja feels

Cass Caul 131	Posted - 2014.07.31 03:15:00 - [71] - Quote Doc DDD wrote: Dampeners on a logi or assault would be nice, the problem is that lvl 5 gal scouts with one dampener, plates, Kincats, cloak and shotgun make it nearly mandatory to have someone full time scanning to stop the bloodbath. It's not uncharacteristic to see those cloaked flankers average 30 kills being invisible 90% of the time. Removing cloaks would do more for making fewer people run multiple precision enhancers than removing shared scans. Then you would see more dampened assault's, logis, and heavies. But that is never going to happen. Instead we have invisible scouts that are also invisible on tacnet, one or two shotting you from behind, necessitating a squad mate to sacrifice most of their ehp for sensors, only to be met with cries for the nerf bat from the perpetually invisible shotgun flankers. After active scanners were nerfed, shared tacnet became the only thing keeping dampened gal scouts in check, which has the side effect of making dampened medium suits a waste. How would you fix this without having every match turn into " let's find one of the 16 cloaked gal scouts on the other team before they one shot me "... ? How about you try leaving the hyperbole behind and use one of the many scanning tables available, because it just sounds like you're making up numbers to suit your need and creating a narrative so people think you have some reasonable argument to justify a dependence on permanent visibility. If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
Doc DDD TeamPlayers 264	Posted - 2014.07.31 03:44:00 - [72] - Quote I've used the tables and tried the fittings. If I run one dampener on a gal scout with cloak I can flank, and see nothing but the backs of enemy heads unless there is a scout with precision enhancers making me show up on scans. Switch to weapon, pop, pop, pop, pop, cloak and run away.... yeah they nerfed the duration of cloaks but once out of site it recharges fast enough to cloak up and sprint to the back of the next guys head, pop, pop, pop, cloak and run away. There is no hyperbole here, no need for charts, you simply do this for an entire match. If you turn a corner and see the front of someone you either run away, stop moving, or pop, pop, pop. .. could be your only death.. i spend the entire time away from my team mates and the ONLY thing that counters this is precision enhanced scouts or active scanner pointed in my direction.... if you start running around corners and see enemies tracking you or ready for you then it's time for a suit with more Dampeners. ... I don't understand why you want scan tables regurgitated in here when everyrhing posted follows the tables. Is the word "perpetual " bothering you? I can change it. The only time I show up on the enemies tacnet is when I'm shooting them in the back of the head, right before I cloak. So running 3 complex Dampeners and a complex cloak keeps me completely unscannable except for the instant my shotgun rounds are entering the back of the enemies head. Am I wrong?
Cass Caul 134	Posted - 2014.07.31 03:52:00 - [73] - Quote So you're problem here isn't that cloaks exist, that dampening exists, but that stealth play is viable? If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
Doc DDD TeamPlayers 264	Posted - 2014.07.31 03:58:00 - [74] - Quote I am all for stealth play as long as there is a counter.
Cass Caul 134	Posted - 2014.07.31 04:37:00 - [75] - Quote The counter for stealth is called visual awareness. If you can't keep up, shut up. Math is easy, you're just stupid. The Empress of Alts
Doc DDD TeamPlayers 264	Posted - 2014.07.31 07:29:00 - [76] - Quote Visual awareness enabled by precision enhancement
Echo 1991 WarRavens Final Resolution. 381	Posted - 2014.07.31 07:52:00 - [77] - Quote Cass Caul wrote: The counter for stealth is called visual awareness. visual awareness doesnt work if you cant actually see the person, doesnt work if they are behind either cos you know, no eyes in the back of the head and all.
OP FOTM Commando Perkone Caldari State 248	Posted - 2014.07.31 16:22:00 - [78] - Quote Doc DDD wrote: Dampeners on a logi or assault would be nice, the problem is that lvl 5 gal scouts with one dampener, plates, Kincats, cloak and shotgun make it nearly mandatory to have someone full time scanning to stop the bloodbath. It's not uncharacteristic to see those cloaked flankers average 30 kills being invisible 90% of the time. Removing cloaks would do more for making fewer people run multiple precision enhancers than removing shared scans. Then you would see more dampened assault's, logis, and heavies. But that is never going to happen. Instead we have invisible scouts that are also invisible on tacnet, one or two shotting you from behind, necessitating a squad mate to sacrifice most of their ehp for sensors, only to be met with cries for the nerf bat from the perpetually invisible shotgun flankers. After active scanners were nerfed, shared tacnet became the only thing keeping dampened gal scouts in check, which has the side effect of making dampened medium suits a waste. How would you fix this without having every match turn into " let's find one of the 16 cloaked gal scouts on the other team before they one shot me "... ? Whoa whoa whoa stop right there. Gal logis with shotguns bro? LOL. IT'S SUCH A SERIOUS PROBLEM. Wow Doc... that's like saying brick tanked scouts are better than ewar scouts... My Gal Logi has all 4 equipment slots filled, and is CONSTANTLY USING THEM ALL. NOT SHOTGUNNING. I guaran ******* tee you my fit with 3 scanners and a needle contributes more to the team than a douchebag who wants to be a scout in a Logi suit. Dust servers will be a ghost town on 09/09/14 Destiny kicks ass... Like Halo knocked up Mass Effect and gave birth
OP FOTM Commando Perkone Caldari State 248	Posted - 2014.07.31 16:23:00 - [79] - Quote Cass Caul wrote: No, I don't mean homogenizing Logsitcs skills, I mean each one has a bonus to every equipment. There are two parts to all EQ bonuses. The Gal has Precision and Duration. MN, CA, and AM should all get precision but only GA gets Duration. AM has number of uses and speed. so give all logistics increase usage. same for the other two. It means that Logistics are the choice for using support Equipment. Yeah and give them all better nanite supply as well. Good suggestion. Make a thread about it, that'll be more useful than making a cameo in my thread. Dust servers will be a ghost town on 09/09/14 Destiny kicks ass... Like Halo knocked up Mass Effect and gave birth
Mejt0 Made in Poland... E-R-A 241	Posted - 2014.08.01 02:11:00 - [80] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Cass Caul wrote: The counter for stealth is called visual awareness. visual awareness doesnt work if you cant actually see the person, doesnt work if they are behind either cos you know, no eyes in the back of the head and all. So what you should get notification : Someones behind you! Turn around dumbass! ? Removing passive scan removes cal (amar post charlie) job. They dont do anything else. What role are u playing? Because 2damps +cloak on a scout and youre to scans. If youre medium/heavy then everyone sees you on thier radar. So what you want to remove shared scans because you are scrub that eqiups 2plates rather than 2damps? PS. I see that most of you dont know what flanking is. Its not only on being invisible on radar etc. If they see you and youre flanking them, then they split. They split thier forces and main group can attack more agressive. -~-~-Caldari Loyalist-~-~- Markiplier fan. Hollywood Undead ,rocks.



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