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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
Test out increased head shot damage..
and / or
slightly increased base damage on prototype rifles to fix the required amount of shots against proto suits. |
boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
only if you come out of the redline...
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Atiim
Heaven's Lost Property
8842
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Which reminds me.
I should have that thread I was talking about made in about an hour or so.
HvLP Spreadsheet Warrior
Why Do Slayers Get All The Credit? :(
-HAND
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Atiim
Heaven's Lost Property
8842
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
boba's fetta wrote:only if you come out of the redline...
Fallacious drivel is fallacious.
HvLP Spreadsheet Warrior
Why Do Slayers Get All The Credit? :(
-HAND
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Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
3969
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:39:00 -
[5] - Quote
The very, very, very last thing Dust needs right now is more passive, campy gameplay.
Level 3 Forum Warrior
PSN: wbrom42
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
boba's fetta wrote:only if you come out of the redline...
I don't snipe from the red line.. you get way less kills from the red line generally.
THAT MAKES ZERO SENSE! I HAVE ENOUGH MONEY TO RUN PROTOTYPE OUTSIDE OF THE RED LINE EVERY MATCH. |
DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:The very, very, very last thing Dust needs right now is more passive, campy gameplay.
It needs a counter to passive, campy gameplay..
1. HEAVIES IN HALLWAYS
2. CLOAKED SCOUTS.
what should nail them both into oblivion? SNIPERS. |
Leeroy Gannarsein
Legio DXIV
293
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
My 'Templar' ScR four-shots untanked MLT Caldari Mediums.
A bricked Assault ck.0 can take up to 13 shots from a prof 5 Viziam, assuming all my shots land.
Why, exactly, should sniper rifles be any different?
MY ACTUAL NAME IS LORHAK
It would seem like wisdom, but for the warning in my heart...
CCP BLOWOUT FOR CPM1
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
because yours isn't a sniper rifle? it can AIM DOWN SIGHTS and hip fire with way more accuracy. |
Leeroy Gannarsein
Legio DXIV
293
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
While the statement is absolutely an example of said fallacy, your dismissing it is an equally good example of a straw man.
The sniper rifle is absolutely abused by redline campers. You cannot deny this. The general drop in sniper rifle effectiveness has led to a drop in their usage, absolutely, but the fact remains: throughout DUST's history redline campers have made up a large proportion of snipers.
Buffing the sniper rifle without addressing this core issue is no more than aiding and abetting.
MY ACTUAL NAME IS LORHAK
It would seem like wisdom, but for the warning in my heart...
CCP BLOWOUT FOR CPM1
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Leeroy Gannarsein
Legio DXIV
295
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:49:00 -
[11] - Quote
DJINN GITAXIS wrote:because yours isn't a sniper rifle? it can AIM DOWN SIGHTS and hip fire with way more accuracy.
It takes me three times as long to kill the red.
I'm in a highly dangerous position while doing it (i.e. IN FRONT OF HIM) whereas you are sitting pretty 3-600 metres away.
You can kill things as quickly as me when you come down with the test of us.
And you're missing the point.
It takes me near enough to three times as long to kill the ck.0 (I'm not prof 5). Why should a sniper rifle be able to do it more quickly, aside from "it's a tank sniper rifle"?
MY ACTUAL NAME IS LORHAK
It would seem like wisdom, but for the warning in my heart...
CCP BLOWOUT FOR CPM1
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Red Line Snipers
1. Not combat effective (generally very low kill counts)
2. If they concern you, counter them. (ADS, Tank, Sniper, OB)
3. Most of them are bad, the best sniping locations are outside of the red line
You shouldn't get worked up defending the player base who refuses to counter snipers, or are too hapless and will consistently stand still so a sniper 500+ meters away can take an easy shot at them. |
DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:53:00 -
[13] - Quote
If you're getting killed by red line snipers you're probably winning the match anyway.. |
boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:58:00 -
[14] - Quote
while its true that some snipers do come out of the redline i havnt seen many and i doubt you have either. yeah yeah just because i didnt see them doesnt mean they were not there. what i can say is that when ive been shot by a sniper the fire 9/10 times comes from the redline.
so sorry to say this but your acusation this time lacks merit. we all know the redline is an issue and that sniper rifle is the weapon most used to fire from the redline.
and you could post something a little bit more useful than links to explantion i already know and understand. and to think you were almostan amusing troll. 1/10 for effort.
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2014.05.25 13:59:00 -
[15] - Quote
Leeroy Gannarsein wrote:DJINN GITAXIS wrote:because yours isn't a sniper rifle? it can AIM DOWN SIGHTS and hip fire with way more accuracy. It takes me three times as long to kill the red. I'm in a highly dangerous position while doing it (i.e. IN FRONT OF HIM) whereas you are sitting pretty 3-600 metres away. You can kill things as quickly as me when you come down with the test of us. And you're missing the point. It takes me near enough to three times as long to kill the ck.0 (I'm not prof 5). Why should a sniper rifle be able to do it more quickly, aside from "it's a tank sniper rifle"?
You can spam fire until dead.. (Every shot is a skill shot for me)
Chase down your target.. (I only have a limited view)
You can utilize a cloak.. (might as well be hiding in the hills)
Your dangerous position isn't dangerous at all against most of the people left playing this game. |
DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
6
|
Posted - 2014.05.25 14:01:00 -
[16] - Quote
boba's fetta wrote:while its true that some snipers do come out of the redline i havnt seen many and i doubt you have either. yeah yeah just because i didnt see them doesnt mean they were not there. what i can say is that when ive been shot by a sniper the fire 9/10 times comes from the redline.
so sorry to say this but your acusation this time lacks merit. we all know the redline is an issue and that sniper rifle is the weapon most used to fire from the redline.
and you could post something a little bit more useful than links to explantion i already know and understand. and to think you were almostan amusing troll. 1/10 for effort.
and 9/10 times you shrug off the damage they do.. it's an annoyance at best to let you know there's a sniper.. they're not generally actively pinning you down.. you just figure out how to avoid them.. it's pretty simple.. run a cloak.. switch to heavy.. those are effective passive counters. |
DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:03:00 -
[17] - Quote
a slight buff to sniper rifle headshot damage won't buff red line snipers hardly at all.. 400-500 meters away your head is smaller than the dot in the center of the screen.. it would reward the snipers who are much closer. seems fair. |
Atiim
Heaven's Lost Property
8844
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:04:00 -
[18] - Quote
Leeroy Gannarsein wrote:My 'Templar' ScR four-shots untanked MLT Caldari Mediums.
A bricked Assault ck.0 can take up to 13 shots from a prof 5 Viziam, assuming all my shots land.
This isn't a valid argument, because the RoF on the Scrambler Rifle is far higher than that of the Sniper Rifle. With 705.88 RPM, you can fire 11 shots in a single second, while the Sniper Rifle can only fire 1 shot.
That would be like saying Combat Rifles are underpowered because they take 4-5 bursts to kill a target, while a Forge Gun only requires one shot.
((However, it should be noted that the Scrambler Rifle is Semi-Automatic, meaning that the RoF can vary from person to person, and it should also be noted that I used the Kaalakiota Tactical Sniper Rifle's RoF in my comparison.))
Leeroy Gannarsein wrote:
Why, exactly, should sniper rifles be any different?
Because unlike the SCR, the Sniper Rifle doesn't have a 45 round magazine, and using a Sniper Rifle requires you to go into a "tunnelvision" view where you lose most situational awareness capabilities; making you easy prey for a Scout or anyone with a Scanner.
Because unlike the SCR, Sniper Rifles have [virtually] no effectiveness in CQC, and highly restricted efficency in mid-range combat, to the point where a Rail Rifle would be far more useful.
It should also be noted that you cannot compare a niche weapon to a conventional rifle, in the same sense that you cannot compare a conventional rifle to an Anti-Vehicle weapon.
A more valid comparison, would be the Shotgun and Nova Knife (additional niche weapons which rely on high alpha damage to perform well). In which case, I'd be forced to laugh at you because Nova Knives and Shotguns 1-2HK just about everything when fully specced into, and used on the proper suit. (ie, Matari Scout Frames).
HvLP Spreadsheet Warrior
Why Do Slayers Get All The Credit? :(
-HAND
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boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:05:00 -
[19] - Quote
DJINN GITAXIS wrote:boba's fetta wrote:while its true that some snipers do come out of the redline i havnt seen many and i doubt you have either. yeah yeah just because i didnt see them doesnt mean they were not there. what i can say is that when ive been shot by a sniper the fire 9/10 times comes from the redline.
so sorry to say this but your acusation this time lacks merit. we all know the redline is an issue and that sniper rifle is the weapon most used to fire from the redline.
and you could post something a little bit more useful than links to explantion i already know and understand. and to think you were almostan amusing troll. 1/10 for effort. and 9/10 times you shrug off the damage they do.. it's an annoyance at best to let you know there's a sniper.. they're not generally actively pinning you down.. you just figure out how to avoid them.. it's pretty simple.. run a cloak.. switch to heavy.. those are effective passive counters.
actully i AM a heavy... how about you try some of thesse counters you suggest?
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Cpl Foster USMC
The dyst0pian Corporation
Zero-Day
890
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:09:00 -
[20] - Quote
Sniper bump for Sniper Chat
I find a corp I like just when the game is dying....figures....
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:11:00 -
[21] - Quote
I run a Caldari Commando for sniping.. when I have to hit a heavy 4x with a charge sniper rifle.. I ignore them. If there are multiple heavies or a logi train.. I also ignore them. If it's a solo heavy wandering the desert alone without a LAV you bet your bottom dollar I kill them. (is this you?)
I run a Caldari Scout to participate in the meat grinder. (and because getting a drop ship to get to a tower in ambush is like flipping a coin and trying to win every time) USING A CLOAK I ALMOST NEVER GET SNIPED.. THIS WORKS SO WELL.
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boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:18:00 -
[22] - Quote
no i dont wander the open without an lav.
my issue remains a simple one. sniping from the redline. once that is fixed (HAHAHA) then sure buff them.
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:21:00 -
[23] - Quote
you're just trolling at this point and you've made it obvious thanks for helping to keep this thread at the top though. |
Joel II X
Dah Gods O Bacon
2656
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:24:00 -
[24] - Quote
DJINN GITAXIS wrote:Test out increased head shot damage..
and / or
slightly increased base damage on prototype rifles to fix the required amount of shots against proto suits.
Quoting this to notify the people whining that the OP wants HEADSHOT damage increase (which I agree with), not overall damage increase.
For those crying about the redline, maybe you're just so bad, you don't know how to dodge a sniper with a limited field of view? |
Atiim
Heaven's Lost Property
8844
|
Posted - 2014.05.25 14:28:00 -
[25] - Quote
boba's fetta wrote:while its true that some snipers do come out of the redline i havnt seen many and i doubt you have either. yeah yeah just because i didnt see them doesnt mean they were not there. what i can say is that when ive been shot by a sniper the fire 9/10 times comes from the redline.
Have you tracked down the Sniper 9/10 times to see if it was in the redline?
Or did you look at the 'Distance Away' section on the killboard, and come to the conclusion that s/he is in the redline? Along with this, do you have actual data (such as a list of times you've died to a Sniper Rifle); or can I dismiss this as anecdotal evidence that has no actual merit?
boba's fetta wrote:so sorry to say this but your acusation this time lacks merit. we all know the redline is an issue and that sniper rifle is the weapon most used to fire from the redline.
When you say "sniper rifle is the weapon most used to fire from the redline" which variant do you mean?
Would you be referring to the pre-fitted loadout labeled 'Sniper'? If so, that's an outlier that should be considered irrelevant.
Otherwise, we could gather data to show the battlefield competence of those using a 'pre-fitted Medic' or 'Frontline' fitting with a MLT Assault Rifle, and then use that data to determine the competence of the average Assault Rifle user.
Or would it be safe to assume that those using a pre-fitted Starter Frame are outliers, and a data sample involving them is inaccurate. However, if you are reffering to those who aren't in 'Sniper' fittings, I'd like to see you supply data to support that.
boba's fetta wrote:and you could post something a little bit more useful than links to explantion i already know and understand. and to think you were almostan amusing troll. 1/10 for effort.
Not quite sure what else you wanted me to post.
Your statement was a single incomplete sentence, which was nothing but fallacious drivel. The fact that you acknowledged that it was fallacious drivel and still decided to post it anyway makes you [by definition] a troll.
2/10 ~Falls apart quickly.
HvLP Spreadsheet Warrior
Why Do Slayers Get All The Credit? :(
-HAND
|
boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:30:00 -
[26] - Quote
so you dont refute the arguement yet im the troll?
the redline is my issue here. i dont see why anyone should be allowed to sit in a place where the only counter is suicide or ob.
and saying a sniper is the counter to a sniper is stupid. just like this whole only tanks should kill tanks thing.
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
boba's fetta wrote:so you dont refute the arguement yet im the troll?
the redline is my issue here. i dont see why anyone should be allowed to sit in a place where the only counter is suicide or ob.
and saying a sniper is the counter to a sniper is stupid. just like this whole only tanks should kill tanks thing.
I already told you a great number of counters to snipers. Let's educate the public on your behalf yet again.
How to counter a sniper..
1. Switch to a heavy suit.(passive)
2. Switch to a suit with a cloak. (passive)
3. Play indoors. (passive)
4. Never stop moving. (passive)
5. Avoid their line of sight. (passive)
6. ADS you can kill infantry in the redline in 20 seconds. (active)
^ with splash damage missiles you hardly have to aim ^
7. Rail Tanks can counter snipe effectively. (active)
8 Forge Guns can counter snipe effectively. (active
9. You could switch to counter sniping like a boss. (active)
10. Warbarge Strike that Thale's user in a pub match. (active)
11. Get inside of a vehicle. (passive) |
boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:42:00 -
[28] - Quote
yes atiim i have tracked them down.
no i would not be refearing to the basic sniper. charge and isikone. (yes spelling)
no i dont have any data do you? (burden of proof on me)
does anyone outside of ccp?
i did not acknowlege it was a fallacy. just that you had linked to something i already understand. the post was mearly my thoughts as ive said before. do i think ccp give two ***** about what i think no i dont.
please do provide your own thoughts on the matter or do you refrain because you know no matter what you post its simply an ancedote.
as stupid as i am for saying it i would like to see this game improve. id like the sniper to get a buff its the abuse of the game mechanic i dont like.
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DJINN GITAXIS
Sebiestor Field Sappers
Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:43:00 -
[29] - Quote
Countering is not the same as "Revenge Killing"
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boba's fetta
Dead Man's Game
637
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Posted - 2014.05.25 14:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
DJINN GITAXIS wrote:Countering is not the same as "Revenge Killing"
taking issue with the redline is not having an issue with a playstyle.
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