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The Terminator T-1000 Skynet Incorporated 359	Posted - 2014.04.09 12:24:00 - [1] - Quote How afe they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR?
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 2437	Posted - 2014.04.09 12:25:00 - [2] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How afe they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? Don't you mean, when is the AR better than anything? For the Federation!
Vapor Forseti THE-TITANS 327	Posted - 2014.04.09 12:26:00 - [3] - Quote Gallente. Just sayin' >CCP Saberwing: "NERF EVERYTHING!!!" *THE-TITANS* Director and the one-and-only Mr. Contradiction
Donwalis Carbon 7 33	Posted - 2014.04.09 12:28:00 - [4] - Quote when it's in the hands of a gallente scout,assault or heavies or commandos
Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 402	Posted - 2014.04.09 12:36:00 - [5] - Quote CR is handicapped by button mashing, physically throwing off your aim (unless you're a turbo cheater). AR has full auto. There will be bullets. ACR+SMG [CEO of Terror]
The Terminator T-1000 Skynet Incorporated 359	Posted - 2014.04.09 12:37:00 - [6] - Quote I think ccp makes the old weapons obsolute on purpose so people will buy boosters to skill into the new weapons faster.
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 897	Posted - 2014.04.09 13:03:00 - [7] - Quote Luk Manag wrote: CR is handicapped by button mashing, physically throwing off your aim (unless you're a turbo cheater). AR has full auto. Well tapping a button is not THAT hard and there is still the ACR...the full auto version
Scheneighnay McBob Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 4712	Posted - 2014.04.09 13:05:00 - [8] - Quote Well, people have to start using ARs again before we can tell. I would imagine the AR's clip longevity would give it an advantage in certain situations. I'm from the weird side of the internet
ResistanceGTA D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 736	Posted - 2014.04.09 13:19:00 - [9] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: Well, people have to start using ARs again before we can tell. I would imagine the AR's clip longevity would give it an advantage in certain situations. Ack, fine, I officially state I shall spec into the demon AR I haven't touched in a year now. There, one person will now use the thing, can we just agree it is still missing something. JK, I wouldn't do that, I swore it off so long ago, can't use it now. I will keep that single gun at level 1 while everything else is close to Proto (even the PLC). With the 3x cap next week, may just go ahead and finish off all the remaining LWs, HWs, and SAs, though my fitting screen will become really difficult then... Though, I feel that you are right, the AR clip always lasted longer (from my recollection) in terms of clip longevity. I burn thru a CR clip in no time flat, never felt that way with the AR. Is that a positive, no clue. All I know is, I'm still killed by ARs quite often, more than any other Rifle variant (probably because everyone and their mom specced them to the max early on). xSivartx is my Heavy. There are many like him, but he is my own... So, other Logi's back off, those are my Warpoints!
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 1391	Posted - 2014.04.09 13:28:00 - [10] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? Just give the AR, the Scope... Not the thick iron sight... Problem solved...

Kaylee Veloc Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 66	Posted - 2014.04.09 13:36:00 - [11] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? When fps hits that low point and no matter how well you time your CR bursts it takes an eternity to fire the next? Balance through bugs o.O
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 518	Posted - 2014.04.09 13:37:00 - [12] - Quote Or just give the thing limitation's . It's good at long ranges and close ranges with no drop off , the closer you get the faster you die and the further you are you will die fast as well because of how fast the thing fires and the accuracy . Maybe reduce the accuracy of the thing if they are not going to give it a niche . Hip firing accuracy great . Long range accuracy great . CQC accuracy great . It's just the best all around weapon in the assault rifle category . Stop asking for tiercide , your killing variety and the fun of this game at the same dam time .
xSir Campsalotx G0DS AM0NG MEN 191	Posted - 2014.04.09 14:06:00 - [13] - Quote Damage per clip is higher on AR G0DS AM0NG MEN Director 1.8 is going to be Heavy 514 they said... Looking around all I see are twig men
Myron Kundera The Generals General Tso's Alliance 58	Posted - 2014.04.09 16:24:00 - [14] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? Never, CR eats shields just as fast as armor so, CR > AR. "Greed, the forgotten mental disease" "Spray and pray makes my day" "Will use proto gear in self defense"
1pawn dust Algintal Core Gallente Federation 133	Posted - 2014.04.09 16:37:00 - [15] - Quote Dust doesnt have falloff ranges, hence winmatar weapons will always be better than not only their racial counterparts, but their intended role
CRNWLLC Screwy Rabbit ULC 185	Posted - 2014.04.09 16:55:00 - [16] - Quote Yeah, I agree--the AR is solid. I see more and more Duvolles and GEKs in the killfeed these days, and I've recently started running an advanced GEK on an advanced Cal assault to good effect. I think the main advantages of the AR are, as noted before by others, its lack of disadvantages as compared to almost all other weapons. Its shorter range as compared to the other rifles are noteworthy, but it does have the largest clip and ammo capacity, doesn't overheat, offers full-auto by default, doesn't have a charge delay (which negates burst fire and forces the user to keep their finger on the trigger after the charge), and it reloads very fast. Compared to other weapons generally (SGs, PCs, SRs, MDs, etc.), its versatility and adaptability is unmatched. IMO, it's a great choice for an assault fit. It won't usually win in a standoff against other rifle types outside its optimal range, but lure them in and the accuracy, ROF, and burst/full-auto versatility will shred them. My other dropsuit is a Python.
Yan Darn Science For Death 553	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:03:00 - [17] - Quote My lv1 CR outperforms prof/sharpshooter 2 in AR. At all ranges. I don't want to be a negative nancy or anything, but the AR kinda sucks. The Ghost of Bravo
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 4657	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:09:00 - [18] - Quote Also, nobody shield tanks. The combat rifle will always be better no matter what as long as the majority of people armor tank. AR's are a little UP and need something but it's also not them sucking entirely. Almost everyone is fit to resist an AR. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Mike Ox Bigger Skill Shots 256	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:20:00 - [19] - Quote Don't worry there's already been talks from devs about the CR getting a nerf. Which means if you're using one you should worry :) I'm still loyal to my RR but would like to be able to run my BPO AR again at some point in time.
G Torq ALTA B2O 626	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:25:00 - [20] - Quote April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE

Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3443	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:41:00 - [21] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: Damage per clip is higher on AR Which is irrelevant when it takes twice as long to empty that clip.
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 480	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:48:00 - [22] - Quote You used to be able to use that clip size to kill multiple people before reloading, but with the recent popularity of armor stacking and the last nerf I don't see that happening anymore, so let's just toss the AR on the pile of weapons CCP made useless. Like the flaylock. The AR is still popular with those that are new to the game and are advancing from the MLT AR, but other than that I don't see anyone using it. Personally I think the AR should just receive a plain 10% damage buff. Short range, high RoF, fierce DPS.
Bojo The Mighty L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 3723	Posted - 2014.04.09 17:55:00 - [23] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1971959#post1971959 Yeah G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 Militia Assault Rifles and blueberries. When Uprising Deployed nowhere near 97894 people were using the ScR. By comparison, the Combat Rifle use has accelerated greater than any weapon thus far except maybe bouts of MD spam.
Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 405	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:01:00 - [24] - Quote Right now, the RR beats everything else hands down. RR>ScR(on Amarr)>CR (no turbo)>AR...so I would agree that the AR could get a bit of a damage buff. There will be bullets. ACR+SMG [CEO of Terror]
The Terminator T-1000 Skynet Incorporated 371	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:04:00 - [25] - Quote The AR is mostly effective against shields but most people prefer armor plates. The AR does +10 dmg against shields but -10% against armor. CR does -5% shields and +10% armor. Why only -5% against shields? It should be -10% against shields to try to kerp balance between the two weapons.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 2902	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:07:00 - [26] - Quote Korvin Lomont wrote: Luk Manag wrote: CR is handicapped by button mashing, physically throwing off your aim (unless you're a turbo cheater). AR has full auto. Well tapping a button is not THAT hard and there is still the ACR...the full auto version Tapping does nothing for the Burst HMG. I am surprised they set the Combat Rifle up with a different mechanic than the Burst HMG. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 2903	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:09:00 - [27] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: It's just the best all around weapon in the assault rifle category . I call it the Infantry Rifle category to avoid confusion. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Izlare Lenix Arrogance. 378	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:09:00 - [28] - Quote G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 What is this, kills per weapon? Also, where did you obtain this info? Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
G Torq ALTA B2O 626	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:10:00 - [29] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1971959#post1971959 Yeah G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 Militia Assault Rifles and blueberries. When Uprising Deployed nowhere near 97894 people were using the ScR. By comparison, the Combat Rifle use has accelerated greater than any weapon thus far except maybe bouts of MD spam. Militia AR is a fine weapon, and kills just nicely :) As for the weapon seeing the fastest uptake, that is by far the Rail Rifle. Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 2903	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:16:00 - [30] - Quote G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 Which rifle is on all the default starter fits? (Rhetorical question.) Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.

Kristoff Atruin Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2034	Posted - 2014.04.09 18:27:00 - [31] - Quote I'm pretty sure this is market data. ie: people are buying 28% more ARs than CRs
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8195	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:09:00 - [32] - Quote Prof IV into AR, optimization III, rapid reload to IV, sharpshooter to IV, Gallente assault bonus, result? CR + prof II and nothing else is still better than my AR. My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
HYENAKILLER X WILL FIGHT ANYONE 718	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:13:00 - [33] - Quote Gonna say a gek in a scouts hands is better off than in a commando. But my fav weapon all time HAS been surpassed. Im not from new eden. I dont need back up, political power or support. I, unlike you dont fear nuetral territory.
Ziiro Celeste Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 25	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:19:00 - [34] - Quote I use the GEK and Duvolle quite effectively on my Amarr Scouts. The only time I really start to run into problems is when I run into heavy frames that have a TON of armor stacked on them, other than that, the AR still shreds suits quite nicely. The forgotten "A" in AAA
Auris Lionesse Capital Acquisitions LLC Dirt Nap Squad. 711	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:30:00 - [35] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? Theyre not balanced. Ars are supposed to do more damage and actually blasters have a higher rof than the same tier auto cannon electron blasters fire every 3 seconds. The dual 180mm auto says every 4.5 seconds. Right now there's no reason to use an ar other than personal preference because it's outclassed in it's own role which means the ar and combat rifle are broken. Gallente Heavy Ninja Turtles! Gallente Heavy Ninja Turtles! Heroes in a half Gank! *TURTLE POWER!!!*
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 12173	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:33:00 - [36] - Quote G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 According to your own site, for the last 10 days it's 349,540 CRs vs 157,467 ARs, with players in general preferring the CR 2.22:1 Is April 6th an anomaly or are we looking at different data? You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. EUrobro
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 4092	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:34:00 - [37] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? Damage per Clip. When you wanna drop 3-4 targets in rapid succesion, the AR will be better every time. Duvolle has 1980 DPC Six Kin only has 1428 DPC Boundless has 1603 Granted, you can only really kill 1 extra target with an AR, but it is easier to control in CQC, even if it kills slower. It has its perks, but it is severly mitigated by the range advantage. I just want the AR to have a slight damage buff. It needs more damage so that people would choose it over another rifle when fighting point blank. It's range problems will stop it from dominating at range. High DPS + High Range is OP beyond reason. I got my cloak and daggers, I'm a very happy Ghost I hack at Mach V
Johnny Guilt Algintal Core 642	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:43:00 - [38] - Quote When you invest afew million SP into something else to make it comparable to the CR, that the CR already has by default,which is pretty stuipd. Tighten the hipfire while moving alittle and increase the rof(800?) on the AR and maybe youll get something. A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. GalHeav E-vo
The Terminator T-1000 Skynet Incorporated 377	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:59:00 - [39] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Prof IV into AR, optimization III, rapid reload to IV, sharpshooter to IV, Gallente assault bonus, result? CR + prof II and nothing else is still better than my AR. I have prof 5, sharpshooter 5, reload and ammo at 3. So much wasted sp :(
Onesimus Tarsus 703rd Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 1874	Posted - 2014.04.09 19:59:00 - [40] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think ccp makes the old weapons obsolute on purpose so people will buy boosters to skill into the new weapons faster. We have a winnah! 1.8 (!) forum warrior. SMG wielder. Mama's boy. 703rd for life! (or at least, for now).

Onesimus Tarsus 703rd Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 1874	Posted - 2014.04.09 20:01:00 - [41] - Quote Ziiro Celeste wrote: I use the GEK and Duvolle quite effectively on my Amarr Scouts. The only time I really start to run into problems is when I run into heavy frames that have a TON of armor stacked on them, other than that, the AR still shreds suits quite nicely. My exact experience. 1.8 (!) forum warrior. SMG wielder. Mama's boy. 703rd for life! (or at least, for now).
Jastad D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 693	Posted - 2014.04.09 20:01:00 - [42] - Quote Easy fix coming from a heavy. Why don't give the g-Ar the Balac ROF and the Krin sin overheat? Cal.Heavy-Min.Heavy-Amarr.Heavy Believe in the FORGE, young padawans SoloDoloreSuCharlie
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8196	Posted - 2014.04.09 20:18:00 - [43] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Prof IV into AR, optimization III, rapid reload to IV, sharpshooter to IV, Gallente assault bonus, result? CR + prof II and nothing else is still better than my AR. I have prof 5, sharpshooter 5, reload and ammo at 3. So much wasted sp :( I have ammo to 3, I just didn't include it because it wouldn't affect it's direct performance. My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
Scheneighnay McBob Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 4714	Posted - 2014.04.09 23:26:00 - [44] - Quote ResistanceGTA wrote: Scheneighnay McBob wrote: Well, people have to start using ARs again before we can tell. I would imagine the AR's clip longevity would give it an advantage in certain situations. Ack, fine, I officially state I shall spec into the demon AR I haven't touched in a year now. There, one person will now use the thing, can we just agree it is still missing something. JK, I wouldn't do that, I swore it off so long ago, can't use it now. I will keep that single gun at level 1 while everything else is close to Proto (even the PLC). With the 3x cap next week, may just go ahead and finish off all the remaining LWs, HWs, and SAs, though my fitting screen will become really difficult then... Though, I feel that you are right, the AR clip always lasted longer (from my recollection) in terms of clip longevity. I burn thru a CR clip in no time flat, never felt that way with the AR. Is that a positive, no clue. All I know is, I'm still killed by ARs quite often, more than any other Rifle variant (probably because everyone and their mom specced them to the max early on). I'll actually start using it VERY soon, as soon as I unlock gallente commandos. I make it a point to have every weapon at operation 3 or higher. I'm from the weird side of the internet
Rifter7 Ancient Exiles. Dirt Nap Squad. 376	Posted - 2014.04.09 23:33:00 - [45] - Quote ive used ar's this entire time. i've got every skill except ammo maxed. the duvolle ar is still good.. i can't speak for the other ones, but the full auto one is great. the problem isn't the ar.. it's the map design.
DozersMouse XIII Ultramarine Corp 373	Posted - 2014.04.09 23:38:00 - [46] - Quote Luk Manag wrote: CR is handicapped by button mashing, physically throwing off your aim (unless you're a turbo cheater). AR has full auto. not really if you lower your sensitivity and let aim assist take over while strafing it will never throw of your aim Bacon pancakes makin' bacon pancakes Take some bacon and I'll put it a pancake Bacon pancakes thats what it's gonna make
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Lokun Listamenn 1267	Posted - 2014.04.10 00:04:00 - [47] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? If I had both skilled equally I would take the AR over the CR in CQC, however, overall the CR is the best all around infantry rifle in the game. Low fitting costs Performs relatively well at both CQC, mid, and long ranges Best damage profile 95/110 I think it is the "jack of all trades" gun of Dust 514 Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI 10373	Posted - 2014.04.10 00:20:00 - [48] - Quote Luk Manag wrote: CR is handicapped by button mashing, physically throwing off your aim (unless you're a turbo cheater). AR has full auto. Actually not hard at all to get use to tapping R1 in a good rhythm. As for the automatic thing, when the AR is compared with the automatic assault variant of the comabat rifle (aCR), the aCR has more range, more damage per second, and the superior damage profile that gives a net 5% damage advantage; projectile weapons do +10% against armor, but only -5% against shields, the gains vs loss is not equivalent, unlike all other weapon damage profiles. Thread on damage profiles. Thread on rifle balance KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: For background, I think it is necessary that everyone understands what is meant by *type, & CCP's plan for the racial "assault rifles" before moving forward. This is a quote from CCP Remnant on what rifle types and variants. "The idea being that each race will have it's base variant be Assault (Gallente), Burst (Minmatar), Breach (Caldari) or Tactical (Amarr) and then the variants are a specific race's take on the others using their own tech. So, you'd get an Assault Rail Rifle that attempts to somewhat mimic the behavior of the Gallente Assault Rifle and a Tactical Assault Rifle that attempts to mimic the Amarr Scrambler Rifle and so on." It is also important to know the ranges of weapons of different damage profiles. Can be found here, from 1.7 weapon dev blog. Assault type* AR (hybrid-plasma damage profile: short range) Assault SCR (laser damage profile: medium to long range) Assault RR (hybrid-railgun damage profile: long range) Assault CR (projectile damage profile: short-medium range) Tactical type SCR (laser: medium to long range) Tactical AR (hybrid-plasma: short range) Future tactical variants for RR (hybrid-railgun: long range) Future tactical variants for CR (projectile: short-medium range) Burst type CR (projectile: short-medium range) Burst AR (hybrid-plasma: short range) Future burst variants for RR (hybrid-railgun: long range) Future burst variants for SCR (laser: medium to long range) Breach type RR (hybrid-railgun: long range) Breach AR (hybrid-plasma: short range) Future breach variants for SCR (laser: medium to long range) Future breach variants for CR (projectile: short-medium range) [Comparison] So we have identified the types, & their comparative ranges (short to long, everything in between) within the type. Now lets compare the rifles by type using 1.8 stats. All stats prototype. Assault AR: 412.5 DPS, shortest range (45 optimal/78 effective) aCR: 420, short-medium range (56/84) aSCR: 420.59, medium-long range (56/90) aRR: 400, longest range (75/102) Tactical tAR: 462 DPS (acheivable without modded controller), 69.3 damage per shot, restrictive ROF (you can tap R1 faster than it can shoot). Shortest range range (57/84) SCR: 841.17 DPS (not acheivable without modded controller), 71.5 damage per shot, non-restricive ROF. Medium-long range (75/96) Burst buAR: 474.38 DPS, shortest range (50/78) CR: 594 DPS, short-medium range (67/84) Breach brAR: 330, shortest range (46/78) RR: 397.69, longest range (75/102) [Conclusion] The assault SCR is OP compared to the AR; has both more DPS, on top of more range. Perhaps if the aSCR had overheat play a bigger factor, it would be balanced. The assault CR is OP compared to the AR; has both more DPS, on top of more range. The assault RR does have less damage per second in exchange for range, but it gets 30 meters more optimal to deal full damage in exchange for only 12.5 less damage per second. The aRR gets the much better end of the deal. The spool-up time may be enough to balance things, but not clear at this point. The tactical AR sucks compared to the SCR. SCR has more damage per shot, more rate of fire, way more range, the charge shot ability, better hipfire accuracy; unless you're really really bad at managing overheat, there is no reason to use the tac AR over the SCR. The burst AR sucks compare to the CR. CR has more massively more DPS, & more range. The breach AR sucks compared to the RR. Less range, less DPS, less magazine size, there's just no reason to ever use the breach AR. While not of the same type, the AR & RR are comparable because they are both automatic. The AR has about 14 points more damage per second, but the RR gets 30 meters more optimal range to do full damage in. While it is a tradeoff, it seems far from equitable; the RR gets the better end of that deal. The spool-up time may be enough to balance things, but not clear at this point. All weapons of the AR family pretty much suck. [Solutions] Rifles need to be balanced against others of the same type: the tac AR balanced against the SCR, or assault CR against the AR, etc. The main thing is the DPS vs range is not something CCP seems to actively think of as a tradeoff for weapons. Generally (meaning not always, yes there are other factors) If a weapon has more DPS than another of the same type, it should have less range; likewise, if a weapon has less ... Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
Zaaeed Massani RisingSuns Dark Taboo 128	Posted - 2014.04.10 01:11:00 - [49] - Quote Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Don't worry there's already been talks from devs about the CR getting a nerf. Which means if you're using one you should worry :) I'm still loyal to my RR but would like to be able to run my BPO AR again at some point in time. If it gets nerfed beyond -10% to shields then that isn't quite fair imho. I wondered why it was only -5% anyway. Proud Federal Marine & Republic Commando / Do you even lift?
CRISIS BATTLESUIT RisingSuns Dark Taboo 35	Posted - 2014.04.10 01:22:00 - [50] - Quote The assault rifle is better against shields. I really don't know why the OP didn't think of it something as simple as that.

Zaaeed Massani RisingSuns Dark Taboo 128	Posted - 2014.04.10 01:26:00 - [51] - Quote CRISIS BATTLESUIT wrote: The assault rifle is better against shields. I really don't know why the OP didn't think of it something as simple as that. I think the OP's point is that as armor tanking is common and next to nobody shield tanks currently, the AR was somewhat predisposed to suckage. Proud Federal Marine & Republic Commando / Do you even lift?
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4982	Posted - 2014.04.10 01:29:00 - [52] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: How are they balanced? The CR seems better in every aspect the CR has more range but it is also great at close range. The CR also has higher dps than AR. CR has better damage profile. So my question is when is the AR better than the CR? The CR is better in every aspect. (You forgot how easy it is to equip too) Like drones? = https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=153604&find=unread
Thang Bausch Pierrot Le Fou Industries 94	Posted - 2014.04.10 02:21:00 - [53] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think ccp makes the old weapons obsolute on purpose so people will buy boosters to skill into the new weapons faster. Have to make up for not being able to retain new players because of the bad new player experience. I also think this is why they removed matchmaking after a month or so.
LEHON Xeon Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 411	Posted - 2014.04.10 02:23:00 - [54] - Quote I pulled out my duvolle today because I felt like something different. Was fun to use again, but found myself routinely outdone by RR and CR users both in terms of range (to be expected) but also for damage. So after while I pulled out my Boundless again. Always the last person to leave. Always the one cleaning up people's messes.
G Torq ALTA B2O 630	Posted - 2014.04.10 05:58:00 - [55] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 According to your own site, for the last 10 days it's 349,540 CRs vs 157,467 ARs, with players in general preferring the CR 2.22:1 Is April 6th an anomaly or are we looking at different data? Arkena, if you're looking at The TryhardinatorGäó, please be aware that it excludes MLT gear, while the numbers above include MLT. Sorry for the confusion, but otherwise The TryhardinatorGäó would constantly be suggesting people run in Milita fits :) Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE
G Torq ALTA B2O 630	Posted - 2014.04.10 05:59:00 - [56] - Quote Izlare Lenix wrote: G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 What is this, kills per weapon? Also, where did you obtain this info? Sorry, could have been more clear: These are units sold, via the EVE Market data from CCP Games. Yeah, was thinking people had read my Market Review posts :) Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE
Meisterjager Jagermeister 53	Posted - 2014.04.10 12:55:00 - [57] - Quote G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 Since starter fits have AR this is to be expected.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 12250	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:00:00 - [58] - Quote G Torq wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 According to your own site, for the last 10 days it's 349,540 CRs vs 157,467 ARs, with players in general preferring the CR 2.22:1 Is April 6th an anomaly or are we looking at different data? Arkena, if you're looking at The TryhardinatorGäó, please be aware that it excludes MLT gear, while the numbers above include MLT. Sorry for the confusion, but otherwise The TryhardinatorGäó would constantly be suggesting people run in Milita fits :) But... there is no militia CR. This immediately skews the comparison. Why not compare tiers that we have for both weapons? You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. EUrobro
G Torq ALTA B2O 636	Posted - 2014.04.12 14:43:00 - [59] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: G Torq wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: G Torq wrote: April 6th: 97.894 Combat Rifles 125.329 Assault Rifles Not saying either is better, but the players in general are so far preferring the Assault Rifle 1.28:1 According to your own site, for the last 10 days it's 349,540 CRs vs 157,467 ARs, with players in general preferring the CR 2.22:1 Is April 6th an anomaly or are we looking at different data? Arkena, if you're looking at The TryhardinatorGäó, please be aware that it excludes MLT gear, while the numbers above include MLT. Sorry for the confusion, but otherwise The TryhardinatorGäó would constantly be suggesting people run in Milita fits :) But... there is no militia CR. This immediately skews the comparison. Why not compare tiers that we have for both weapons? Because I'm lazy :) Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE


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