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A Plea to CCP to take more reasonably sized steps.

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KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1076	Posted - 2014.03.30 11:41:00 - [1] - Quote Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. But what is known is that these huge changes done, seemingly on the spur of the moment or in response to Forum QQ Kittens is very divisive to the player base. The QQ Kittens feel vindicated while those being effected feel like they got the short end of the stick or a knife in the back. Two items are on the current quick change list to get or have just received a Nerf Hammer of Doom from CCP/Shanghai. First was the announcement that all Heavies would lose 20% of their armor. Then it was clarified that it was not immediate and might change a little, sort of, but not much. No specific ETA was mentioned. Second was the truncating of the rail gun turrets range in half. That was done with no appreciable warning. The armor Nerf might have been mentioned elsewhere but these forums were surprised that a patch that had been extremely slow in coming was going to get a Nerf almost immediately. This caused anguish to your customers and disdain by those by the same customers. These actions are unprofessional and ill thought out. Combined these actions are not those of a reasonable company in control of their own decision making progress. I propose that you make smaller adjustments. Rail Guns decreased by 50m or 100m. Heavies get a 5% decrease. Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. Without this level of exchange CCP/Shanghai is being perceived as arbitrary and capricious. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. Many of us do not actively follow Twitter or the Devs and some of us actually avoid Facebook like the plague. Welcome to Dust And so it goes.

CCP Saberwing C C P C C P Alliance 3042	Posted - 2014.03.30 12:14:00 - [2] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. We do, and we do. :) Hotfix Announcement! CCP Saberwing // DUST 514 Community Manager // @kanafchian

KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1077	Posted - 2014.03.30 12:26:00 - [3] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. We do, and we do. :) Hotfix Announcement! When was the twitter/facebook announcement done versus the forum announcement. If they preceded the forum they you have missed my point. If they were at the same time then why do the extreme adjustments? If you do play other FPSs then why don't we have the most basic data from the game? How many kills this week? A histogram of kills by weapon type? Did the newest weapon jump to the top of the chart? Suits lost, clone revived, vehicles destroyed (by vehicles/by AV). The list could go on but we have absolutely nothing and we are approaching the one year anniversary of Dust. Exactly how much longer is SOON(tm) supposed to cover? Also I did note that you deleted my comments on being less dramatic in the violent changes to the game. Merely as a suggestion to reduce the rage and QQ on the forums if for no other reason. And so it goes.
ANON Cerberus Tiny Toons 413	Posted - 2014.03.30 12:31:00 - [4] - Quote CCP Saberwing always gets the short end of the stick on these forums and I do feel sorry for him. However people like him are our main "Go to" devs on the forums. We dont blame you Saberwing, however it would be much appreciated if we could get more info out of the devs in shanghai and where ever else. More than anything I just think people want to know the thinking behind changes and especially any stats backing up your theories.
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Dirt Nap Squad. 1439	Posted - 2014.03.30 12:47:00 - [5] - Quote ccp, continue to make huge and epic changes. eatsbabies cienfuegos steward of the renegade alliance.
BrownEye1129 Death In Xcess Corporation 260	Posted - 2014.03.30 12:58:00 - [6] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. ^That would go a long way to help the communication between CCP and the player! Not to mention cutting down the amount of, Nerf this, Buff that threads. Also if I may, any future "balancing for vehicles" should be looked at as such Tank vs Tank, Tank vs AV, AV vs DS Any change to one inherently affects the other. Making one of the "3" OP/UP/Broken. Would like nothing more than to have balance with vehicles and infrantry. When the time comes......
Dalmont Legrand 351	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:00:00 - [7] - Quote Undeniably misunderstood... The best is yet to come CPM1 Fabulous Candidate
Akdhar Saif Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative 398	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:12:00 - [8] - Quote CCP seem to be very heavy handed when it comes to balancing. Vehicles were in a bad place so instead of buffing vehicles or nerfing AV , they did both!
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Lokun Listamenn 3820	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:18:00 - [9] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: But what is known is that these huge changes done, seemingly on the spur of the moment or in response to Forum QQ Kittens is very divisive to the player base. The QQ Kittens feel vindicated while those being affected feel like they got the short end of the stick or a knife in the back. ^Above is one of my main concerns. I would like to see the vision of this game come forth. I do believe that some of the community holds the game back from its potential. We spent how long nerfing and buffing things? I understand its part of the process. Yet, we have the TTK change back and forth. Mercs saying the heavies need attention, now the forums say it needs a nerf. Folks wanting scouts to get their just due, now think the cloaks are OP. It's so bad that you have threads where baseless concerns really has no merit. It's almost a trend to cry OP nowadays that most are hardly believable. It's this push/pull thing that can be disappointing. I'm attempting to adapt, why aren't they? Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Are you OUKH?
KaTaLy5t-87 Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 141	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:22:00 - [10] - Quote I agree that CCP make too many game changing updates at the same time. I am getting tired of them moving the goalposts so to speak with every new patch. The last two patches especially have made it feel like I am a new player to the game and that I have to learn to play the game all over again with all the changes. A lot of people in my Corp feel the same way too. They have played one particular role in a particular style for so long and then with one fell swoop that role has changed and is no longer viable or is unplayable so you need to learn to play all over again to try to keep up with the changes and avoid being stomped. It's getting really annoying and frustrating and I'm afraid that more people will just turn away from the game because they are unhappy with the new changes. I've seen lots of people saying they are going to sit out 1.8 until things are better and this is kinda sad because most of them have played the game for nearly 2 years since the very start of closed beta and now they've simply had enough. CCP needs to make smaller changes more quickly, if something is OP or UP then fix it quickly with a small buff or nerf then do another small change shortly after that if the first one wasn't enough. The current trend of over buffing or nerfing things only serves to irritate people and make things either useless or too OP that it becomes game breaking.

Ansiiis The Trustworthy Mocking Bird Inc. 944	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:49:00 - [11] - Quote Both of these changed were necessary. (Not counting armor which didn't change anyways.) Scout survey.
ANON Cerberus Tiny Toons 416	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:54:00 - [12] - Quote low genius wrote: ccp, continue to make huge and epic changes. Are you a CCP employee? I never see you explain your reasoning to be honest. Also I feel like your own personal definition of 'Huge' and 'epic' are quite far from actual definitions.
Marston VC SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 1661	Posted - 2014.03.30 13:55:00 - [13] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. We do, and we do. :) Hotfix Announcement! When was the twitter/facebook announcement done versus the forum announcement. If they preceded the forum they you have missed my point. If they were at the same time then why do the extreme adjustments? If you do play other FPSs then why don't we have the most basic data from the game? How many kills this week? A histogram of kills by weapon type? Did the newest weapon jump to the top of the chart? Suits lost, clone revived, vehicles destroyed (by vehicles/by AV). The list could go on but we have absolutely nothing and we are approaching the one year anniversary of Dust. Exactly how much longer is SOON(tm) supposed to cover? Also I did note that you deleted my comments on being less dramatic in the violent changes to the game. Merely as a suggestion to reduce the rage and QQ on the forums if for no other reason. why would they waste their time adding something like that when theres so much more missing right now? Marston VC, STB Director
The Terminator T-1000 Skynet Incorporated 276	Posted - 2014.03.30 14:13:00 - [14] - Quote This company is nothing but a roller coaster. They always seem to go to the extreme. I agree the railguns needed a nerf but 50% is just insane. When you are trying to balance a scale you add and take off weight in small amounts until it is balanced. By doing that you can get balance faster that adding or removing lots of weight. Get the picture? On another note, i was exicited to finally go proto in the heavy of my choice with the arrival of 1.8. After reading about a future nerf i still have not spent any SP in heavy suits and still using my Dren bpo.
Gyn Wallace OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 91	Posted - 2014.03.30 14:20:00 - [15] - Quote Despite my low opinion of most of Kaloftherathi's posts, I begrudgingly have to agree with him here. I can understand CCP's motive making huge balance changes, to keep the game fresh, and encourage aurum sales. But I hope they understand the downside to making these horrible balance overreactions. Why should I spend aurum on the flavor of the month, when I can expect it to be nerfed into oblivion next patch? I don't. I'm an older game player, with a huge disposable income to spend on entertainment. Every time you overreact to an imbalance by creating an imbalance in the opposite direction, you convince me a little more, that I should never spend money on this game. If you want me to become a paying customer, you need to do much much better,i.e. smaller steps when correcting imbalances is necessary if you really want to build a triple-A shooter. I would love it, if you could win me over in to spending money on Dust514. I'm about to go build a cloaky shotgun scout, with remote explosives, to see if it requires as little skill as I imagine. A free build, with no aurum, of course. I'm not that stupid.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Dirt Nap Squad. 727	Posted - 2014.03.30 15:15:00 - [16] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. But what is known is that these huge changes done, seemingly on the spur of the moment or in response to Forum QQ Kittens is very divisive to the player base. The QQ Kittens feel vindicated while those being effected feel like they got the short end of the stick or a knife in the back. Two items are on the current quick change list to get or have just received a Nerf Hammer of Doom from CCP/Shanghai. First was the announcement that all Heavies would lose 20% of their armor. Then it was clarified that it was not immediate and might change a little, sort of, but not much. No specific ETA was mentioned. Second was the truncating of the rail gun turrets range in half. That was done with no appreciable warning. The armor Nerf might have been mentioned elsewhere but these forums were surprised that a patch that had been extremely slow in coming was going to get a Nerf almost immediately. This caused anguish to your customers and disdain by those by the same customers. These actions are unprofessional and ill thought out. Combined these actions are not those of a reasonable company in control of their own decision making progress. I propose that you make smaller adjustments. Rail Guns decreased by 50m or 100m. Heavies get a 5% decrease. Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. Without this level of exchange CCP/Shanghai is being perceived as arbitrary and capricious. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. Many of us do not actively follow Twitter or the Devs and some of us actually avoid Facebook like the plague. Welcome to Dust I totally agree man. I don't know why they have to use big nerf numbers to achieve balance (or the attempt at it). Smaller steps get you closer to the goal, where big leaps leave a lot of room for over shooting it. Not to even mention they didn't address the root of the problems on a lot of these issues. Triple reps on the blaster maddie ftw! Stacked damage mods and reps and a plate for my rail gunnlogi. Or sica WOO. Rails are OP in tank engagements, maddies stacking reps are still invincible to anything but a proto forge or rail (not counting RE's, GG scout, you got me good, after dying to me 8 times.) I'm losing hope here CCP, at the very least you could provide reasoning for your actions, as we are the ones getting the short end of the stick. Is it right to let us sit here and wonder, because if your past actions prove anything, things are only going to get worse. If you play the game as you say, what made you think hardeners as a whole were the problem. Or more specifically the strength of hardeners. That was something people who had no experience with tanks say. I'm still butthurt. Tanks - Balancing Turrets
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Dirt Nap Squad. 727	Posted - 2014.03.30 15:21:00 - [17] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. We do, and we do. :) Hotfix Announcement! You need to make this information visable for the huge number of players that give 0 **** about your forums, or your twitter, or your facebook. This is info that should be on that lovely information screen at the start. Hell man, the entirety of my corp, and some of the alliance, never pay attention to your social media. We actually have a person that mails out all this information to keeps us updated and ahead of the curb, as you are failing in that aspect. Remember, in game, is your best bet for conveying such important information like this. Tanks - Balancing Turrets
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4686	Posted - 2014.03.30 15:40:00 - [18] - Quote Another big problem with CCP's attempts at balancing DUST is the way they consistently buff one side while also nerfing the other. 1.6 problem: Vehicles are too easy to kill with AV, making them UP, or AV weapons OP. 1.7 solution: Revamp vehicles to make them significantly more powerful AND nerf AV while doing so. What SHOULD have happened: ONE SIDE OR THE OTHER. Buff vehicles, leave AV alone, or nerf AV, leave vehicles alone. Closed beta problem: Breach AR is OP, has great range, damage and accuracy. Too many advantages, no disadvantages. Solution to problem: Nerf EVERYTHING about the weapon so hard that it's still the worst weapon with Rifle in the name. What SHOULD have happened: Pick ONE aspect of the weapon to nerf, then see how it performs. Nerf another if needed. Closed beta problem: Missile Turrets OP. large splash radius with high damage and good rate of fire at pinpoint accuracy. Open beta solution: Nerf range (which wasn't complained about), nerf splash radius, nerf direct AND splash damage, and add such a severe scatter effect that you literally can't hit a Dropsuit standing 10m in front of you. What SHOULD have happened: Reduce splash damage, but raise direct damage proportionally. Add scatter, but leave range and splash radius alone. This would have allowed Missiles to be used against infantry, but not as an instakill at any range weapon, and would have kept them as viable anti-vehicle weapons instead of turning them into peashooters that literally couldn't hit a dropsuit while it was standing 10m in front of them and not moving.
RydogV Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 707	Posted - 2014.03.30 15:41:00 - [19] - Quote I for one would be very interested to know the exact size of the Dust 514 Quality Assurance team and what their actual experience is. I don't need names or resumes but I'd be keen on knowing how many people and an rough tally of combined QA experience along with what games they tested prior to this one. Might go a little ways in restoring some confidence, no? I don't really expect to get it. Honestly at this point I think the 180 players we have in our parent Clan could do a better job testing the game and most of them would do it for free .
JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game 237	Posted - 2014.03.30 15:45:00 - [20] - Quote Wait so you want rail guns to shoot across the map? Caldari Loyalist I speak for the rabbits

Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 3156	Posted - 2014.03.30 15:48:00 - [21] - Quote I dont think they have ever made small incremental changes and seen how they worked for like a week before they change something else Its always lets nerf this hard and then change these 5 other things so its all ****** up Intelligence is OP
Meee One Hello Kitty Commandos 639	Posted - 2014.03.30 16:04:00 - [22] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. But what is known is that these huge changes done, seemingly on the spur of the moment or in response to Forum QQ Kittens is very divisive to the player base. The QQ Kittens feel vindicated while those being effected feel like they got the short end of the stick or a knife in the back. Two items are on the current quick change list to get or have just received a Nerf Hammer of Doom from CCP/Shanghai. First was the announcement that all Heavies would lose 20% of their armor. Then it was clarified that it was not immediate and might change a little, sort of, but not much. No specific ETA was mentioned. Second was the truncating of the rail gun turrets range in half. That was done with no appreciable warning. The armor Nerf might have been mentioned elsewhere but these forums were surprised that a patch that had been extremely slow in coming was going to get a Nerf almost immediately. This caused anguish to your customers and disdain by those by the same customers. These actions are unprofessional and ill thought out. Combined these actions are not those of a reasonable company in control of their own decision making progress. I propose that you make smaller adjustments. Rail Guns decreased by 50m or 100m. Heavies get a 5% decrease. Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. Without this level of exchange CCP/Shanghai is being perceived as arbitrary and capricious. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. Many of us do not actively follow Twitter or the Devs and some of us actually avoid Facebook like the plague. Welcome to Dust TL;DR You're a rail tanker that wears a fat suit inside their vehicle,and you're upset you have to leave the redline to get any kills and that you may die. Big words or not this can be summarized with two letters "QQ". I game over like a boss.
Altina McAlterson Pure Innocence. EoN. 975	Posted - 2014.03.30 16:19:00 - [23] - Quote Obviously no one at CCP has ever directly said this but I get the impression that Sony's QA policies have a lot to do with it. Every time they want to change something they have to submit it to Sony for approval so constantly making small changes isn't really feasible. Nothing is ever as simple as "just changing a single value". If they make a small change to something only to find out it wasn't enough they have to go through the QA process all over again to try and fix it. But since new content and changes made by other teams are also going through QA if you have to go back a second time to change it again it messes everybody up. When you have several small groups simultaneously working on individual components of a larger whole those kinds of delays tend to snowball. Everybody else can't just sit around and wait because they have their own deadlines to meet so even a small unexpected delay from one team can cause major problems for everyone. CCP has a reputation for doing the exact same thing in EVE as well so I'm not saying it isn't their fault. What I am saying is that Sony's QA process only serves to exacerbate CCP's natural tendency to overreact. Unfortunately CCP has always been like that so I doubt it will change any time soon. Running a blaster tank in ambush is like bringing Anthrax to a pillow fight.
KaTaLy5t-87 Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 142	Posted - 2014.03.30 16:50:00 - [24] - Quote RydogV wrote: I for one would be very interested to know the exact size of the Dust 514 Quality Assurance team and what their actual experience is. I don't need names or resumes but I'd be keen on knowing how many people and an rough tally of combined QA experience along with what games they tested prior to this one. Might go a little ways in restoring some confidence, no? I don't really expect to get it. Honestly at this point I think the 180 players we have in our parent Clan could do a better job testing the game and most of them would do it for free . EDIT: Here is a tip on how to handle changes in your game with your Community: http://community.killzone.com/t5/Killzone-Shadow-Fall-PS4/live-Insurgent-Q-amp-A-on-Twitch-31-Mar-2014-17-00-BST/td-p/1510546 I hear that brotha! It makes me kinda sad to see the lack of progress in the game in general. I started playing Dust because it had a lot of stuff to offer, things other shooters did not have. There were a lot of claims from CCP about persistent shooter this and massive integration with Eve that and I think most people would agree that the game has simply not delivered on almost all of those claims. It has gone to the stage now that I just don't care about the link to Eve now, miniscule as it is! I think a lot of players share my feeling when I say I just want the game to function properly, I want the shooter and vehicle aspects to be balanced and enjoyable, I want a couple of new maps, a new game mode and for some of the ridiculous bugs to be eliminated. These are the some of the most important aspects of any shooter and I think CCP needs to focus on these things. Get the basics right and THEN work on the link with Eve! I'm getting a sense of despair and frustration from the general player base. We still want to play Dust but my God do you guys (CCP) make it hard to keep coming back sometimes. When I jump on Dust in the evening after a long day in work I want to have some fun with my friends, shoot some people in the face and hopefully win a couple of matches. Dust is becoming less and less appealing because it is becoming more and more infuriating. I'm not one of those "I've had it with Dust and I'm leaving to play a different game" kind of guys but I see more and more good players turning away from the game and it makes me sad when good players who have been around a long time decide that they've had enough of the game. I still have hope, however misplaced, that Dust can be a great game. I'm just not sure if CCP will be able to do it before they push their most loyal players away. A lot of early Eve Vets have said that Eve was crap for the first couple of years and now look at it! I think CCP made a huge mistake in thinking that console gamers would stick it out for a couple years until the game actually works right. Console gamers are not like that, if a game is crap we will just move on to the next game. Step it up CCP before it is too late!
see see-pee A.O.D. VP Gaming Alliance 10	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:05:00 - [25] - Quote this topic is on point .. & I feel not enough blue tags have responded u make new add ons to the game... when we spend our time playing and skill into those items .. the following update seems to always get them nerfed... no sh!t that anything new is gonna be "op" .. be cause everyone is gonna be using them to try them out so the chances of u being killed by the new item... goes up triple fold .. in reality its not "op" its just over used.. so .. when your being shot by 5 guys in a match and 3 are using said "op" item... and u are killed by 1 then these forums fill with the cry babies .. who scream "op" then the nerd devs come along .. who im sure DO NOT PLAY THE GAME .. they come along read these meaningless threads.. n take it upon them selves to save these babies. 1.8 update gave us all the necessary variants we been waiting for.. THANK YOU u did a good job on that .. and it should not be over looked... thank you ccp for that... but stop the stupid nerf hammer .. and start buffing... wanted shorter ttk .. why take from what we have grown used to .. and why not buff... leave the heavies alone .. raise medium suits up 100 hp = 50 to shields .. 50 to armor... round the board.. scouts raise 50 hp = 25 shields .. 25 armor .. round the boards.. n that's that.. y would u lower the output damage on weapons some have been using since the start of closed beta? it makes no sense... no one wants to have wasted their time playing something that as time goes on is less effective and less effective what in the hell did u do to the av class? av grenades .. down to 2 .. really.. the forge is completely unusable ... it fires maybe 2/5 times u shoot it .. u lowered its damage silently .. like wtf? swarms suck .. proximity are a joke if not in a cluster.. I mean .. WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO THIS GAME? then your answer to that is more nerfing.. & u nerf the tanks... come on.. u just did a vehicle respect.. after "redoing tanks" only for a few weeks to pass & then there u come... NERF NERF AWAY!... wake up and save your game.. all weapons nerfs ... undo them .. do the buff to meds & lights as I said above .. leave heavies alone!!! heavies have 2 weapons and had 1 suit up until last week .. are u really already ready to destroy the class cuz of these unskilled cry babies.? STOP NERFING & START BUFFING this has been a see see-pee certified statement See See-Pee On U Fools~ see see-pee or not to pee ... that's the question
Orion Sanjeet Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 53	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:11:00 - [26] - Quote Nerfing the range of something by 50% (large railguns) is definitely not doing something incrementally, doing it incrementally would be reducing it by 5% a week until you find balance, do not start thinking you are smart enough to just know the magic number, otherwise why the hell are you developing a game you should be a god of the stock market with that kind of intuition.
Dauth Jenkins Ultramarine Corp 331	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:16:00 - [27] - Quote BrownEye1129 wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. ^That would go a long way to help the communication between CCP and the player! Not to mention cutting down the amount of, Nerf this, Buff that threads. Also if I may, any future "balancing for vehicles" should be looked at as such Tank vs Tank, Tank vs AV, AV vs DS Any change to one inherently affects the other. Making one of the "3" OP/UP/Broken. Would like nothing more than to have balance with vehicles and infrantry. Honestly, the hardener nerf +rail turret nerf was all up needed. I'm shredding hardened tanks with my mini commando dual wyrkomi swarm launchers. And the swarms corrected efficiency against dropships keeps them from being OP. I can come in second place, solely by running available the entire match. It's now reached a good risk/reward balance Sees prototompers... Sees blueberries start to snipe... Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
RINON114 B.S.A.A. General Tso's Alliance 559	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:24:00 - [28] - Quote I couldn't agree more. I always look at the TAC AR when thinking about sweeping changes, they managed to get a few things right but ended up ruining the gun. I don't understand why it's so hard to change things quickly in hotfixes. Buff or nerf a single stat at one time and see what happens, then we will find balance. What CCP does to balance now is essentially putting two children on a seesaw (do the North Americas say teeter-totter?) where one child is a hamster and the other is an elephant dropped from a great height.
Orion Vahid Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 270	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:27:00 - [29] - Quote by the way CCP, it won't kill you if you made some close quarter maps. What good is a HMG when all your damn maps are so wide open?
KaTaLy5t-87 Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 144	Posted - 2014.03.30 18:35:00 - [30] - Quote Orion Vahid wrote: by the way CCP, it won't kill you if you made some close quarter maps. What good is a HMG when all your damn maps are so wide open? I'd love to see some enclosed, infantry only maps. I think it would be great to have a change of pace to the wide open maps we have had for so long. Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy the big maps but I like to mix it up and have some close-quarters infantry on infantry combat as well. The Gallente Research facility when a short way towards giving us this kind of play and I really enjoy playing that map and socket but I'd really love to see an entire map of just the inside of some facility, tight corridors, adjoining rooms and all that good stuff. I think it'd be cool, no matter what role you play. I hate to keep drawing comparisons between Dust and Battlefield but I think a map something like Operation Metro from Battlefield would be cool. Obviously with a Dust oriented twist, it could be like the underground part of the Gallente Research Facility or some other kind of weapons or supply facility. I think it would breath a bit of life into the map rotation and give everyone a change of pace. A man can dream . . .

Orion Sanjeet Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 53	Posted - 2014.03.30 18:50:00 - [31] - Quote Orion Vahid wrote: by the way CCP, it won't kill you if you made some close quarter maps. What good is a HMG when all your damn maps are so wide open? Dude, are you a heavy? I'm logi, I think it would be amusing to have Orion repping Orion. lol, I know WAY out of left field comment.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 14037	Posted - 2014.03.30 18:58:00 - [32] - Quote I hate monthly patch restrictions but gotta live with it. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Leanna Boghin B.O.D.A.S 36	Posted - 2014.03.30 19:04:00 - [33] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: We do, and we do. :) You know it would be nice if you guys actually stopped reading the garbage threads from QQers about this and that being over powered and actually started playing the crap game you guys created and start asking the actual players in that game what they think of it. All you have done is ruin a perfectly good game and its sickening. I have more fun AFKing than i do actually playing the game now because you wont give a full respec so i got a list of useless skills weaponry and so on i cant use in a real fight (dropulinks, nanohive, etc etc etc.) and its a boring game now. Heck i used to play dust everyday until you nerfed everything i skilled into so much that i just cant play it. Your gonna say just skill into something else problem is i do that every update and then next update comes and i have to skill into something else thanks to CCPs wonderful nerf hammer and their inability to listen to players who actually play Dust514 I let my sniper rifle bullet to your face do all the talking :P
RINON114 B.S.A.A. General Tso's Alliance 560	Posted - 2014.03.30 19:15:00 - [34] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I hate monthly patch restrictions but gotta live with it. Patches: Fine. Hotfixes: ? Why can we not just see some healthy number balancing every day or two. It can't be that bad for one of the devs to just go into the game and change the damage on a weapon (for example). Surely foresight was not so short that they didn't implement an easy way of doing this?
Vespasian Andendare Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 755	Posted - 2014.03.30 19:47:00 - [35] - Quote Sorry your tank isn't invincible anymore, but just deal with it. >> Play Dust 514 FREE! Sign up for exclusive gear today! <<
Hoover Damn H.A.R.V.E.S.T. Legacy Rising 88	Posted - 2014.03.30 20:21:00 - [36] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. We do, and we do. :) Hotfix Announcement! Can you explain the reasoning or lack thereof that led to a railgun more than a thousand times more powerful than any built to date having a meaningful maximum range, never mind one less than three hundred metres? Besides the implications of the gun behaviour being absolutely absurd, I mean, there are rifles that shoot farther than that. Why would anybody ever replace their conventional tank guns with these railguns? "Any job worth doing with a laser is worth doing with many, many lasers." - Unknown
XxGhazbaranxX The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 1247	Posted - 2014.03.30 20:40:00 - [37] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: I propose that you make smaller adjustments. Rail Guns decreased by 50m or 100m. Heavies get a 5% decrease. Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. I disagree with this. The railgun turret function very well at current ranges. The redline sniping epidemic was out of control and had no reason to exist. People where destroying vast amount of wealth without putting their isk at risk. Before the railgun turrets where balanced, we had other turrets that did have that same exact range with no ill side effects. By this I mean the missile turret, which, if we letouselves be guided by the missile turret instalations should have a much longer distance but it doesn'. This is a balancing factor CCP decided on and it works well for the missile turret. The railgun turrets having 300 meter range does not affect the gameplay of anyone who was playing FAIRLY and did not exploit game mechanic. This means that railgun tanks have to actually risk their tank to kill thing now. This is balanced and there are now more engaging battles because, instead of scrubs being on the redline dominating the field, they have to no come out of the redline and fight a fair fight and possibly lose their tanks. Plasma Cannon Advocate Heavy event survivor
XxGhazbaranxX The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 1247	Posted - 2014.03.30 20:41:00 - [38] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: I propose that you make smaller adjustments. Rail Guns decreased by 50m or 100m. Heavies get a 5% decrease. Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. I disagree with this. The railgun turret function very well at current ranges. The redline sniping epidemic was out of control and had no reason to exist. People where destroying vast amount of wealth without putting their isk at risk. Before the railgun turrets where balanced, we had other turrets that did have that same exact range with no ill side effects. By this I mean the missile turret, which, if we letouselves be guided by the missile turret instalations should have a much longer distance but it doesn'. This is a balancing factor CCP decided on and it works well for the missile turret. The railgun turrets having 300 meter range does not affect the gameplay of anyone who was playing FAIRLY and did not exploit game mechanic. This means that railgun tanks have to actually risk their tank to kill thing now. This is balanced and there are now more engaging battles because, instead of scrubs being on the redline dominating the field, they have to no come out of the redline and fight a fair fight and possibly lose their tanks. Plasma Cannon Advocate Heavy event survivor
Rusty Shallows 1330	Posted - 2014.03.30 20:44:00 - [39] - Quote ANON Cerberus wrote: CCP Saberwing always gets the short end of the stick on these forums and I do feel sorry for him. However people like him are our main "Go to" devs on the forums. We dont blame you Saberwing, however it would be much appreciated if we could get more info out of the devs in shanghai and where ever else. More than anything I just think people want to know the thinking behind changes and especially any stats backing up your theories. *Frames the hangs it on the wall* A perfect to the point summery. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
DRE PrEaCh Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 61	Posted - 2014.03.30 20:48:00 - [40] - Quote I'm glad they nerf'd the rail gun range. That'll get the damn red line tankers outta there. Forge guns range nerf should always = rail gun range nerf

KaTaLy5t-87 Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 146	Posted - 2014.03.30 21:19:00 - [41] - Quote DRE PrEaCh wrote: I'm glad they nerf'd the rail gun range. That'll get the damn red line tankers outta there. Forge guns range nerf should always = rail gun range nerf EDIT: one more thing, stfu and quit ur whining, I like these quick hot fixes, let em' hot fix this baby all day long. It's better for the game, u try ****, it doesn't work, u try something new. None of this waitin' and talkin' to the player base for months before u decide to implement changes. The thing is, this game changes very very rapidly, When u talk about things, most of the time these talks become irrelevant after a certain time period. Fast pace changes + Fast pace game = faster progress Are we playing the same game? I wouldn't call waiting 4 months for a patch fast paced changes! What changes did they make in the interim period between 1.7 and 1.8? Very few! People are sick of CCPs slowness to react to issues that crop up in the game. We've had World of Tanks for the last 4 months and did CCP do anything to alleviate that? No! They like to sit back and look at the data that shows up in their speadsheets about how many kills or how much damage was done with a particular weapon. Then after an excruciatingly long wait, they break out the nerf bat and mess up whatever weapon their data said was OP. I'm not just talking about railguns either, what about the laser rifle, mass driver, flaylock, Tac AR and others? There seems to be no middle ground with CCP, something is either ridiculously OP or stupidly UP after they make changes. If you took the time to actually read what most people are saying you would see that a lot of it is not just generic whining and QQ. Yes, there is plenty of whining but there is also a lot of constructive feedback and suggestions in the posts and threads. Do CCP listen to any of it? I don't think so. That is what is annoying people the most. If you read the OP you might realise that the guy was asking for smaller changes to be made more often to try to find that middle ground between OP and UP instead of making a big change that I have to say looks to me like a shot in the dark instead of a carefully weighed and calculated alteration.
TODDSTER024 Revive Repair Resupply 190	Posted - 2014.03.30 21:43:00 - [42] - Quote Im just upset that all my min suit lost their auto reps
Hoover Damn H.A.R.V.E.S.T. Legacy Rising 88	Posted - 2014.03.31 02:18:00 - [43] - Quote DRE PrEaCh wrote: I'm glad they nerf'd the rail gun range. I don't suppose you'd bat an eyelash if a game had flashlights that had a hard falloff at 2 feet as long as it balanced gameplay somehow. "Any job worth doing with a laser is worth doing with many, many lasers." - Unknown
Shion Typhon Intara Direct Action Caldari State 453	Posted - 2014.03.31 04:40:00 - [44] - Quote Michael Arck wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: But what is known is that these huge changes done, seemingly on the spur of the moment or in response to Forum QQ Kittens is very divisive to the player base. The QQ Kittens feel vindicated while those being affected feel like they got the short end of the stick or a knife in the back. ^Above is one of my main concerns. I would like to see the vision of this game come forth. I do believe that some of the community holds the game back from its potential. We spent how long nerfing and buffing things? I understand its part of the process. Yet, we have the TTK change back and forth. Mercs saying the heavies need attention, now the forums say it needs a nerf. Folks wanting scouts to get their just due, now think the cloaks are OP. It's so bad that you have threads where baseless concerns really has no merit. It's almost a trend to cry OP nowadays that most are hardly believable. It's this push/pull thing that can be disappointing. I'm attempting to adapt, why aren't they? The very nature of the game with the SP system and specialisations promotes tribalism. People specialise then gravitate to camps because no one except extremely SP-rich vets can ford to omni-soldier. If they redesigned the SP system to be more like EVE where unlocks happen at L3 in a skill for the next tier then you'd find more people spreading out so everyone was psychologically invested in all sides of the balance "map". Sadly that will never happen because CCP and the vets are too heavily emotionally attached to the current system. So, we'll continue in this endless cycles of no agreement on balance.
The Robot Devil Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2227	Posted - 2014.03.31 05:15:00 - [45] - Quote RydogV wrote: I for one would be very interested to know the exact size of the Dust 514 Quality Assurance team and what their actual experience is. I don't need names or resumes but I'd be keen on knowing how many people and an rough tally of combined QA experience along with what games they tested prior to this one. Might go a little ways in restoring some confidence, no? I don't really expect to get it. Honestly at this point I think the 180 players we have in our parent Clan could do a better job testing the game and most of them would do it for free . EDIT: Here is a tip on how to handle changes in your game with your Community: http://community.killzone.com/t5/Killzone-Shadow-Fall-PS4/live-Insurgent-Q-amp-A-on-Twitch-31-Mar-2014-17-00-BST/td-p/1510546 When they post threads asking for feedback and comments we give them but most are "Hire better programmers", "Port to PS4", "Fix the bugs", "Play the game", "Release the core because we're still in beta" and every nerf this and buff that post you can think of. Asking this community of constructive feed back is like trying to teach a cat sign language, it just isn't going to happen and if it does it is far and few between. I would also bet that QA is more than just shooting the guns and finding sticky spots on maps. I am not there I and I don't know their process but I would say that it is more than just playing the game. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
The Robot Devil Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2228	Posted - 2014.03.31 05:24:00 - [46] - Quote KaTaLy5t-87 wrote: DRE PrEaCh wrote: I'm glad they nerf'd the rail gun range. That'll get the damn red line tankers outta there. Forge guns range nerf should always = rail gun range nerf EDIT: one more thing, stfu and quit ur whining, I like these quick hot fixes, let em' hot fix this baby all day long. It's better for the game, u try ****, it doesn't work, u try something new. None of this waitin' and talkin' to the player base for months before u decide to implement changes. The thing is, this game changes very very rapidly, When u talk about things, most of the time these talks become irrelevant after a certain time period. Fast pace changes + Fast pace game = faster progress Are we playing the same game? I wouldn't call waiting 4 months for a patch fast paced changes! What changes did they make in the interim period between 1.7 and 1.8? Very few! People are sick of CCPs slowness to react to issues that crop up in the game. We've had World of Tanks for the last 4 months and did CCP do anything to alleviate that? No! They like to sit back and look at the data that shows up in their speadsheets about how many kills or how much damage was done with a particular weapon. Then after an excruciatingly long wait, they break out the nerf bat and mess up whatever weapon their data said was OP. I'm not just talking about railguns either, what about the laser rifle, mass driver, flaylock, Tac AR and others? There seems to be no middle ground with CCP, something is either ridiculously OP or stupidly UP after they make changes. If you took the time to actually read what most people are saying you would see that a lot of it is not just generic whining and QQ. Yes, there is plenty of whining but there is also a lot of constructive feedback and suggestions in the posts and threads. Do CCP listen to any of it? I don't think so. That is what is annoying people the most. If you read the OP you might realise that the guy was asking for smaller changes to be made more often to try to find that middle ground between OP and UP instead of making a big change that I have to say looks to me like a shot in the dark instead of a carefully weighed and calculated alteration. Name some other games that are two years old and still have new things introduced throughout the year with plans to release more. I would say there are a few but not too many. Most games are box and sell with some DLC later that should have been in at release but they know they can make more money by selling a few maps three months later. I agree that some of the changes should have been done in smaller increments but we all don't know how the deal with SONY works or how much work and data it takes to make a change that we think is good or bad. They do listen to the feedback and many of the problems we have are because of suggestions we have made. Just because they can't please you individually doesn't mean that they are taking our input into consideration. CCP is not a traditional game developer and by forcing your idea about how they should develop the game on them sets yourself up for constant disappointment. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 549	Posted - 2014.03.31 05:24:00 - [47] - Quote What armor nerf? The hardeners? B.D. Wong AKA Dr. Wu returns to Jurassic Park sequel
Shion Typhon Intara Direct Action Caldari State 453	Posted - 2014.03.31 05:37:00 - [48] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Name some other games that are two years old and still have new things introduced throughout the year with plans to release more. I would say there are a few but not too many. Most games are box and sell with some DLC later that should have been in at release but they know they can make more money by selling a few maps three months later. What?? Every MMO ever made? Half the games released today have new content added, some for money, some for free. Please don't pretend CCP are special princesses for deigning to release content. To be perfectly blunt CCP have a successful record of 1 (one) game that's proven itself. Not really a statistical sample size or repeat track record. I also note that Dust has chosen to ignore many of the hard learnt lessons the EVE devs realised long ago. CCP Shanghai is the misshapen drooling younger brother that the embarrassed Icelandic older brother doesn't bring out in polite company.
The Robot Devil Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2228	Posted - 2014.03.31 05:57:00 - [49] - Quote Shion Typhon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Name some other games that are two years old and still have new things introduced throughout the year with plans to release more. I would say there are a few but not too many. Most games are box and sell with some DLC later that should have been in at release but they know they can make more money by selling a few maps three months later. What?? Every MMO ever made? Half the games released today have new content added, some for money, some for free. Please don't pretend CCP are special princesses for deigning to release content. To be perfectly blunt CCP have a successful record of 1 (one) game that's proven itself. Not really a statistical sample size or repeat track record. I also note that Dust has chosen to ignore many of the hard learnt lessons the EVE devs realised long ago. CCP Shanghai is the misshapen drooling younger brother that the embarrassed Icelandic older brother doesn't bring out in polite company. Some content added yes but the game usually doesn't last longer than a year and usually not even that, FPS are yearly releases and most MMOs are on six month cycles that require a subscription or purchase of the content. Other games may release content every six months but it is not a the pace at which we receive here. Make the list of games that plan on living more that a year or have actually done it and have content released more often than every six months. I would wager the list is very small. Most games don't last because they are finished products when they ship and only offer content for a while after that. Yes other games do receive content release but not like CCP does it, for the most part. I am basing my post off their one game because CCP doesn't work like other game companies and I am not comparing them to other games because that is where your problem is. You can not compare how they work with how EA works or for any other game company. They are the odd one out and if you are trying to make the comparison to another company then that is the problem. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
Altina McAlterson Pure Innocence. EoN. 977	Posted - 2014.03.31 06:17:00 - [50] - Quote RINON114 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I hate monthly patch restrictions but gotta live with it. Patches: Fine. Hotfixes: ? Why can we not just see some healthy number balancing every day or two. It can't be that bad for one of the devs to just go into the game and change the damage on a weapon (for example). Surely foresight was not so short that they didn't implement an easy way of doing this? Altina McAlterson wrote: Obviously no one at CCP has ever directly said this but I get the impression that Sony's QA policies have a lot to do with it. Every time they want to change something they have to submit it to Sony for approval so constantly making small changes isn't really feasible. Nothing is ever as simple as "just changing a single value". Running a blaster tank in ambush is like bringing Anthrax to a pillow fight.

The Robot Devil Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2228	Posted - 2014.03.31 06:20:00 - [51] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: RINON114 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I hate monthly patch restrictions but gotta live with it. Patches: Fine. Hotfixes: ? Why can we not just see some healthy number balancing every day or two. It can't be that bad for one of the devs to just go into the game and change the damage on a weapon (for example). Surely foresight was not so short that they didn't implement an easy way of doing this? Altina McAlterson wrote: Obviously no one at CCP has ever directly said this but I get the impression that Sony's QA policies have a lot to do with it. Every time they want to change something they have to submit it to Sony for approval so constantly making small changes isn't really feasible. Nothing is ever as simple as "just changing a single value". Yes, this is probably the most accurate answer. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
DeeJay One Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 248	Posted - 2014.03.31 07:01:00 - [52] - Quote BrownEye1129 wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. ^That would go a long way to help the communication between CCP and the player! Not to mention cutting down the amount of, Nerf this, Buff that threads. Also if I may, any future "balancing for vehicles" should be looked at as such [list] Also that would be a lot more than any other company is doing. These things need a terrible amount of work to be usable by the public, work that usually is spent better otherwise. I'd appreciate a post or two on the economics of Dust (yes, economics - as it includes all the K/D ratios, as economics in an FPS was one of the promises of Dust) like http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/mineral-trade-in-the-wake-of-the-battle-of-b-r5rb-price-indices-february-2014/ But even in EVE these post a rare and the CSM doesn't get to see all the data either.
The Robot Devil Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2230	Posted - 2014.03.31 07:06:00 - [53] - Quote DeeJay One wrote: BrownEye1129 wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. ^That would go a long way to help the communication between CCP and the player! Not to mention cutting down the amount of, Nerf this, Buff that threads. Also if I may, any future "balancing for vehicles" should be looked at as such [list] Also that would be a lot more than any other company is doing. These things need a terrible amount of work to be usable by the public, work that usually is spent better otherwise. I'd appreciate a post or two on the economics of Dust (yes, economics - as it includes all the K/D ratios, as economics in an FPS was one of the promises of Dust) like http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/mineral-trade-in-the-wake-of-the-battle-of-b-r5rb-price-indices-february-2014/ But even in EVE these post a rare and the CSM doesn't get to see all the data either. Agree on the graphporn, I would love to see how many dollars are destroyed if you were buy it with AUR or any thing like that. We need more maths n' graphs. We're nerds and we like things like that. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
G Torq ALTA B2O 540	Posted - 2014.03.31 07:30:00 - [54] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: If you do play other FPSs then why don't we have the most basic data from the game? How many kills this week? A histogram of kills by weapon type? Did the newest weapon jump to the top of the chart? Suits lost, clone revived, vehicles destroyed (by vehicles/by AV). Can I suggest everyone to support the earlier call for an aggregated Kill-feed API, that allows us (amongst other things) to compile these types of graphs and charts? DeeJay One wrote: I'd appreciate a post or two on the economics of Dust (yes, economics - as it includes all the K/D ratios, as economics in an FPS was one of the promises of Dust) like http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/mineral-trade-in-the-wake-of-the-battle-of-b-r5rb-price-indices-february-2014/ But even in EVE these post a rare and the CSM doesn't get to see all the data either. While not exactly what you're looking for, see the recently-announced market statistics and data endpoints and implementations? Should at least help you determine what weapons are popular, what equipment is used etc. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=147095&find=unread https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2003490#post2003490 https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=152548&find=unread Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1110	Posted - 2014.03.31 18:02:00 - [55] - Quote Meee One wrote: TL;DR You're a rail tanker that wears a fat suit inside their vehicle,and you're upset you have to leave the redline to get any kills and that you may die. Big words or not this can be summarized with two letters "QQ". I drive Maddy Rail Gun or Blaster depending on what the state of the battlefield is. I only do the Rail Gun Red Line dance when being a lone wolf against multiple tanks with ADV or PRO gear. I prefer to get in closer and slug it out with tanks, blasters are for wiping all the Red Belles off the map. Since 1.8 I dropped my standard suit (never have run a heavy in a tank, always try to kill them that do). I run a free scout suit with an uplink or a repair tool. Again, depending on the battlefield. My last one cost me 25k and this one Zero. I have hammered QQ Kittens on these forums plenty. I hammer CCP/Shanghai as well. I was a software developer for 25+ years and am now retired. The near mythical failure of this game would make a good book on what not to do. Although one would have to flip a coin to determine if it was a comedy or a tragedy. Not everything is as you would make it out to be. Maybe you aren't what you seem to be either. Closed minded does look like a perfect fit so far. And so it goes.
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1110	Posted - 2014.03.31 18:10:00 - [56] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: Obviously no one at CCP has ever directly said this but I get the impression that Sony's QA policies have a lot to do with it. Every time they want to change something they have to submit it to Sony for approval so constantly making small changes isn't really feasible. Nothing is ever as simple as "just changing a single value". Small disagreement. If Sony makes them do this massive testing how did the last to hot fixes come through to bite us in the butt? Sony does some testing and those are tied to the patches, I would guess so anyway. Their previous statements regarding their own QA was that the next patch would be in QA when the current one dropped. If QA said it needed to continue then the patch slipped. The 1.7 tank reboot was delayed for many months as I am sure all tankers remember. Much of the big deal Sony (and MS) testing is on original games and major patches. I would suspect that changing something like the rail gun range was relatively simple. There are only four turrets in the game, with the additional version the turret installations use. So, not one but not major code changes. Otherwise we would be at 1.7 stats until 1.9 dropped. And so it goes.
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1110	Posted - 2014.03.31 18:36:00 - [57] - Quote Shion Typhon wrote: The very nature of the game with the SP system and specialisations promotes tribalism. People specialise then gravitate to camps because no one except extremely SP-rich vets can ford to omni-soldier. I seriously haven't experience that in my squads, a full mix of suit types and play styes. In fact the only time I have seen the tribalism you mentioned was with squads of dual wielding Flaylock pistols were devastating everything before them. EVE and Dust have different customer bases. EVE is a point and click space ship game played on PCs with a spreadsheet at its core and a space ship UI. Dust was supposed to be about Mercs in Spaaace that had some interesting tie ins to EVE but the average player is a controller wielding console players. Some of my friends are loyal PS3 owners that never play on a PC. Making the SP system more like EVE would mean SP was Only Passive. How would you get RPG/FPS/MMO players to even download it when there is no SP reward for actually playing the game? ISK, AUR nor LP matter in Dust, only SP matters. KR started as a sniper, switched to Minmatar Logi, added Heavy then HAVs. Is considering Assault Derps but is waiting to spend SP in suits until they Say they are finished Nerf Hammering Heavies while waiting until all the medium suits are updated to their actual CPU/PG/Slot configurations. And so it goes.
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 117	Posted - 2014.03.31 19:39:00 - [58] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Whether CCP/Shanghai Devs have played other FPSs isn't known. But what is known is that these huge changes done, seemingly on the spur of the moment or in response to Forum QQ Kittens is very divisive to the player base. The QQ Kittens feel vindicated while those being effected feel like they got the short end of the stick or a knife in the back. Two items are on the current quick change list to get or have just received a Nerf Hammer of Doom from CCP/Shanghai. First was the announcement that all Heavies would lose 20% of their armor. Then it was clarified that it was not immediate and might change a little, sort of, but not much. No specific ETA was mentioned. Second was the truncating of the rail gun turrets range in half. That was done with no appreciable warning. The armor Nerf might have been mentioned elsewhere but these forums were surprised that a patch that had been extremely slow in coming was going to get a Nerf almost immediately. This caused anguish to your customers and disdain by those by the same customers. These actions are unprofessional and ill thought out. Combined these actions are not those of a reasonable company in control of their own decision making progress. I propose that you make smaller adjustments. Rail Guns decreased by 50m or 100m. Heavies get a 5% decrease. Each change should be documented as to why it was being done and what the hoped for outcome would be. Then a time period could pass and some statistics could be published to explain why there was more needed if they had gone too far. Without this level of exchange CCP/Shanghai is being perceived as arbitrary and capricious. In addition, if you announce something on Twitter or Facebook please announce on these forums as well. Many of us do not actively follow Twitter or the Devs and some of us actually avoid Facebook like the plague. Welcome to Dust Who on the forums who weren't FOTM tanks were asking for nothing to happen to tanks? Asking for a scrambler pistol nerf? Asking for heavy nerf? As far as I can tell this update was a Genie Update, IE. CCP took everyone's complaints and then implemented buff/nerfs that weren't what people wanted. They nerfed rail and CR which didn't matter since they nerfed the rest. They committed the cardinal sin they do every time where they nerfed weapon damage across the board while simoltaenously buffing mass drivers, which is why we are always seeing endless buff nerf cycles. They skimmed through the forums and did what they wanted to do anyways, don't blame us.
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 117	Posted - 2014.03.31 19:40:00 - [59] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: KaTaLy5t-87 wrote: DRE PrEaCh wrote: I'm glad they nerf'd the rail gun range. That'll get the damn red line tankers outta there. Forge guns range nerf should always = rail gun range nerf EDIT: one more thing, stfu and quit ur whining, I like these quick hot fixes, let em' hot fix this baby all day long. It's better for the game, u try ****, it doesn't work, u try something new. None of this waitin' and talkin' to the player base for months before u decide to implement changes. The thing is, this game changes very very rapidly, When u talk about things, most of the time these talks become irrelevant after a certain time period. Fast pace changes + Fast pace game = faster progress Are we playing the same game? I wouldn't call waiting 4 months for a patch fast paced changes! What changes did they make in the interim period between 1.7 and 1.8? Very few! People are sick of CCPs slowness to react to issues that crop up in the game. We've had World of Tanks for the last 4 months and did CCP do anything to alleviate that? No! They like to sit back and look at the data that shows up in their speadsheets about how many kills or how much damage was done with a particular weapon. Then after an excruciatingly long wait, they break out the nerf bat and mess up whatever weapon their data said was OP. I'm not just talking about railguns either, what about the laser rifle, mass driver, flaylock, Tac AR and others? There seems to be no middle ground with CCP, something is either ridiculously OP or stupidly UP after they make changes. If you took the time to actually read what most people are saying you would see that a lot of it is not just generic whining and QQ. Yes, there is plenty of whining but there is also a lot of constructive feedback and suggestions in the posts and threads. Do CCP listen to any of it? I don't think so. That is what is annoying people the most. If you read the OP you might realise that the guy was asking for smaller changes to be made more often to try to find that middle ground between OP and UP instead of making a big change that I have to say looks to me like a shot in the dark instead of a carefully weighed and calculated alteration. Name some other games that are two years old and still have new things introduced throughout the year with plans to release more. I would say there are a few but not too many. Most games are box and sell with some DLC later that should have been in at release but they know they can make more money by selling a few maps three months later. I agree that some of the changes should have been done in smaller increments but we all don't know how the deal with SONY works or how much work and data it takes to make a change that we think is good or bad. They do listen to the feedback and many of the problems we have are because of suggestions we have made. Just because they can't please you individually doesn't mean that they are taking our input into consideration. CCP is not a traditional game developer and by forcing your idea about how they should develop the game on them sets yourself up for constant disappointment. In the Free to play market, every game is constantly releasing new content. This is the standard business model for f2p games, to constantly update to encourage micro transactions. Have a look around, I'll wait here.
Testing Turbo Bragian Order Amarr Empire 48	Posted - 2014.03.31 20:46:00 - [60] - Quote ANON Cerberus wrote: CCP Saberwing always gets the short end of the stick on these forums and I do feel sorry for him. However people like him are our main "Go to" devs on the forums. We dont blame you Saberwing, however it would be much appreciated if we could get more info out of the devs in shanghai and where ever else. More than anything I just think people want to know the thinking behind changes and especially any stats backing up your theories. My Cat could give me more info than Saberwing .. NDA n all that ... Saberwing tells us what we already know or lies with looking into it or soon ..

Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 361	Posted - 2014.03.31 23:30:00 - [61] - Quote I've never been killed by anyone with CCP in their name, and I've been killed a lot. Maybe CCP devs play with non CCP names that I would recognize as an expert merc, but it is just as likely that they don't play Dust as much as I do...those SP bonus caps are arbitrarily high for anyone who casually plays a few rounds a week, and those massive changes are merely tweaks to the casual player or dev who isn't really into Dust 514. There will be bullets. ACR+SMG
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1117	Posted - 2014.04.01 03:18:00 - [62] - Quote TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote: In the Free to play market, every game is constantly releasing new content. This is the standard business model for f2p games, to constantly update to encourage micro transactions. Have a look around, I'll wait here. Yes! A thousand likes, here take some. F2P requires constant updates. New players need an enticements, vet players need a reason to try the latest, players that dropped the game need them as well. They are the very basis for long term existence of F2P games. Without updates a F2P will be nothing more than a churn back, new customers come in as old customers leave. That is not a valid business model for F2P. And so it goes.
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1117	Posted - 2014.04.01 03:24:00 - [63] - Quote TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote: --- snip --- They skimmed through the forums and did what they wanted to do anyways, don't blame us. Sorry for the confusion, I am most distinctly not blame Dust users, even the QQ Kittens are free from blame in this. The blame for these changes rest directly on the shoulders of CCP/Shanghai Devs and their massive Nerf/buff swings. CCP/Shanghai carries the weight of doing the right thing here and they drop it nearly every single time. Day One OP, first step to selling AUR weapons and the longer the delay two things change. First is, I am guessing here, they make more AUR sales as the OP FOTM sells more items. Second the respect the community has for CCP/Shanghai decreases. And so it goes.


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