DUST Search - Tanks are still OP and they will remain that way...

Derpty Derp wrote:

NAV HIV wrote:

- Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV)

- Swarms = useless

- FG = only for heavy suits.

- AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear Idea

- Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG)

- Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both)

- Effectiveness of AV = LOL

- Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, **** and harry can have one

And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right Shocked

Forge gun doesn't count because you need a heavy slot? Now I'm not a fan of tanks & I want them nerfed to ****, but this is stupid, shall we dismiss the rail rifle as being an anti infantry weapon because it requires a light weapon slot, which not all suits can equip?

You've also forgotten the Laser cannon, it may be difficult to use, but some people can make it quite effective.

You also forgot remote explosives, which even without an LAV attached to them are quite effective, even if you can't be bothered to stick them to the tank, or leave them on the floor until a tank drives over it, you can also attach them to a dropship, park it on top of them, then climb out and detonate... Boom!

Tanks are fine, it's damage mods, large turrets & armour repair modules that are the problem... Price could possibly use an increase.

Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.

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NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 1163	Posted - 2014.03.18 12:29:00 - [1] - Quote - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, **** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right
PARKOUR PRACTIONER Reapers' Assailant 942	Posted - 2014.03.18 12:37:00 - [2] - Quote I only tank to get EZ-mode blaster tanks away from my teammates. All you have to do is be aware. That's it. No skill. It takes more skill to pop blasters with a Rail then to blast infantry. My Sica will 2-shot any garbage tank without a problem. Psycho Scout Speedy McFaster- Psycho Logi Cool McCoolNess- Psycho Pilot
Xirian Fin Endless Hatred Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 3	Posted - 2014.03.18 12:52:00 - [3] - Quote i was playing with my corp last night and were taking down tanks left and right with a combo of swarms and forges without dmg mods in the suits. it is possible. it takes teamwork and someone to call it out and ask for help taking it out. tanks are very hard to solo on foot. it can be done cause I have seen it. but in pubs when u are soloing it it becomes hard. I just learn to avoid the roads and trails when tanks are on the field. I will agree that milita tanks are just a little op but I don't think u should be able to easily solo a tank. Yup
Cenex Langly D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 653	Posted - 2014.03.18 12:57:00 - [4] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, **** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right I clearly recall your entire squad, yesterday, spamming tanks and dropships. Needless to say after that match I logged out of dust. Your squad ruined my 3 match streak of no tanks being deployed on either side... Dust was fun for a moment... Newb
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2176	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:08:00 - [5] - Quote I only tank because I have ten million SP into it. QQ moar. Real men do it with missiles. "True says I have to let Lorhak yell at people in PIE GC from now on."
Derpty Derp It's All Gone Derp 138	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:17:00 - [6] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, ** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right Forge gun doesn't count because you need a heavy slot? Now I'm not a fan of tanks & I want them nerfed to **, but this is stupid, shall we dismiss the rail rifle as being an anti infantry weapon because it requires a light weapon slot, which not all suits can equip? You've also forgotten the Laser cannon, it may be difficult to use, but some people can make it quite effective. You also forgot remote explosives, which even without an LAV attached to them are quite effective, even if you can't be bothered to stick them to the tank, or leave them on the floor until a tank drives over it, you can also attach them to a dropship, park it on top of them, then climb out and detonate... Boom! Tanks are fine, it's damage mods, large turrets & armour repair modules that are the problem... Price could possibly use an increase.
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 758	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:26:00 - [7] - Quote Xirian Fin wrote: i was playing with my corp last night and were taking down tanks left and right with a combo of swarms and forges without dmg mods in the suits. it is possible. it takes teamwork and someone to call it out and ask for help taking it out. tanks are very hard to solo on foot. it can be done cause I have seen it. but in pubs when u are soloing it it becomes hard. I just learn to avoid the roads and trails when tanks are on the field. I will agree that milita tanks are just a little op but I don't think u should be able to easily solo a tank. Unless the Pilot is smart and brings either another (or two or three) tanks to support him, or has supporting Infantry. The thing is in the current state you can beat stupid tankers with teamwork with ease (you can also solo them). But against smart Pilots working together AV is helpless, the same is true if the Pilot brings some Infantry with them... So in general 5 Tanks > 5 AV (assuming both either work together or solo) 1 Tank 4 AI infantry men > 5 AV (assuming both sides work together) That leads to 5 of Team A > 5 of Team B this is a problem as long as we have equal team sizes....
Zirzo Valcyn Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 233	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:31:00 - [8] - Quote plasma cannon and AV nades need buff u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll. forum warrior .189
Zirzo Valcyn Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 233	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:35:00 - [9] - Quote Xirian Fin wrote: i was playing with my corp last night and were taking down tanks left and right with a combo of swarms and forges without dmg mods in the suits. it is possible. it takes teamwork and someone to call it out and ask for help taking it out. tanks are very hard to solo on foot. it can be done cause I have seen it. but in pubs when u are soloing it it becomes hard. I just learn to avoid the roads and trails when tanks are on the field. I will agree that milita tanks are just a little op but I don't think u should be able to easily solo a tank. right i've seen this more lately people are putting effort into killing the tank, we usually descend on with dropship. XT-missile sometimes steals the kill but the important thing is someone lost a tank, my gunner gets WP and i stay at the bottom of scoreboard. u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll. forum warrior .189
Proto Annihilator Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 158	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:35:00 - [10] - Quote The tanks are decent. If AV was slightly modified it would be pretty balanced. Swarms are explosive damage and most ground troops try and kill shield tanks with them. Infantry needs to be smarter. If you see AV killin tanks keep the reds off of them. Everyone has to do something. Every player is capable of using a sica rail. Scanners, flux, REs. There's tons of things you can bring to the table. You don't have to run AVprimary but be prepared to help out. I killed a tank 3days ago with a templar ScP.

Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 983	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:44:00 - [11] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, ** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right Forge gun doesn't count because you need a heavy slot? Now I'm not a fan of tanks & I want them nerfed to **, but this is stupid, shall we dismiss the rail rifle as being an anti infantry weapon because it requires a light weapon slot, which not all suits can equip? You've also forgotten the Laser cannon, it may be difficult to use, but some people can make it quite effective. You also forgot remote explosives, which even without an LAV attached to them are quite effective, even if you can't be bothered to stick them to the tank, or leave them on the floor until a tank drives over it, you can also attach them to a dropship, park it on top of them, then climb out and detonate... Boom! Tanks are fine, it's damage mods, large turrets & armour repair modules that are the problem... Price could possibly use an increase. Which suit can't equip the rail rifle? Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 983	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:46:00 - [12] - Quote Proto Annihilator wrote: The tanks are decent. If AV was slightly modified it would be pretty balanced. Swarms are explosive damage and most ground troops try and kill shield tanks with them. Infantry needs to be smarter. If you see AV killin tanks keep the reds off of them. Everyone has to do something. Every player is capable of using a sica rail. Scanners, flux, REs. There's tons of things you can bring to the table. You don't have to run AVprimary but be prepared to help out. I killed a tank 3days ago with a templar ScP. When CCP gives us an AV weapon effective against shields we'll use it. And don't say the plasma cannon because that's no AV weapon. Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Takron Nistrom Tinfoil Hatz 261	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:46:00 - [13] - Quote The way I see it is this: 1). Tanks in their current state should be soloable because they dont cost any more than dropsuits do, and they are pretty much a dropsuit variant, so increase the cost to pre 1.7 2). You want to be killed by more than 1 merc? REQUIRE there to be however many mercs in your tank to run it, as you wanna be killed by. You wanna be killed by 4 mercs, your tank needs 4 mercs in it before it will drive. Then I'll accept tanks being killing machines. GÇ£Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)GÇ¥ GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5846	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:54:00 - [14] - Quote Xirian Fin wrote: i was playing with my corp last night and were taking down tanks left and right with a combo of swarms and forges without dmg mods in the suits. it is possible. it takes teamwork and someone to call it out and ask for help taking it out. tanks are very hard to solo on foot. it can be done cause I have seen it. but in pubs when u are soloing it it becomes hard. I just learn to avoid the roads and trails when tanks are on the field. I will agree that milita tanks are just a little op but I don't think u should be able to easily solo a tank. Nor should you be able to easily solo AV inside a tank. AV > HAV > INF > AV \| Not: HAV > AV GëÑ INF [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Bax Zanith 89	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:56:00 - [15] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, **** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right Well, I really didn't want to do this, but it looks like I'll have to spek into rail tanks to fight tank spame now. I'd say walk in my shoes for a day, but you probably still won't understand.
Sam Booty Valor Coalition 40	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:56:00 - [16] - Quote The major problem is that they continuously nerfed swarms and AV grenades. Tanks are not the only problem, dropships are also the problem. With 1.8 further nerfs: - Swarms are going to be nerfed because of nerf to damage mods - You can only carry 2 AV grenades So what is CCP going to do to compensate these additional nerfs? I agree with only carrying 2 locus grenades but CCP needs to buff Swarm and AV grenade damage by at least 50%. Also make swarm missile speed much faster. Why can a dropship outrun a swarm missile? This is stupid. Once the missile is locked the dropship can still avoid being hit by turning behind a building. That's OK and makes sense. Just make the freaking swarm missiles faster.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 1091	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:56:00 - [17] - Quote Let my nova knives to full damage to a tank and I will be happy :)
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 3267	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:57:00 - [18] - Quote Why would someone start a thread complaining about anything literally hours before the 1.8 patch notes? CCP is aware that tanks are not balanced and have said they have some tweaks planned. Adapt or Die // Republic Lance Commander // @ReesNoturana
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5846	Posted - 2014.03.18 13:58:00 - [19] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: Why would someone start a thread complaining about anything literally hours before the 1.8 patch notes? CCP is aware that tanks are not balanced and have said they have some tweaks planned. When? Acording to the CPM, CCP has no plans for adjusting vehicles in Uprising 1.8. Links please. AV > HAV > INF > AV \| Not: HAV > AV GëÑ INF [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 3267	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:01:00 - [20] - Quote Atiim wrote: Reav Hannari wrote: Why would someone start a thread complaining about anything literally hours before the 1.8 patch notes? CCP is aware that tanks are not balanced and have said they have some tweaks planned. When? Acording to the CPM, CCP has no plans for adjusting vehicles in Uprising 1.8. Links please. I don't bookmark everything CCP says but I do remember one comment by CCP Saberwing. I think the plan is to adjust the cost of tanks. I haven't seen anything about fixing AV though. Adapt or Die // Republic Lance Commander // @ReesNoturana

Nirwanda Vaughns Death Firm. 443	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:03:00 - [21] - Quote in 1.8 tanks will be more invincible until AV is re-balanced. swarms already do pathetic damage even at proto level and 3x complex DMs with the DM nerf they'll be even worse and we lose a packed AV nade too. some ideas i batted about were 1. the damage of AV needs to be at back to pre-nerf. 2. a hislot mod which give 30%, 40%, 50% (no stacking penalty) to lock range of swarms so AV guys choose between either further lock or higher damage. that way upclose and personal vs tanks you get high damage whereas vs dropships you're able to lock them but the damage is lower. 3. New swarm launcher specialization skills. Swarm missile flight time, swarm missile velocity. 10% per level to each. that way it allows us better chance of hitting fleeing vehicles. 4. Stasis Webbifier equipment. this basically works the same as in EVE. its an equipment item which locks onto an enemy vehicle like a repair tool, but reduces the max speed of the vehicle by say STD - 40% 25m range ADV - 60% 30m range PRO - 80% 35m range this way it gives AV'ers chance ot get more locks in but the tankers can shoot the infantry using the webber and may influence tankers ot start running a secondary gunner again. one or more of the above would help make AV vs tanks more fun and tactical again Rolling with the punches
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 3267	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:04:00 - [22] - Quote Also, CCP doesn't announce price changes to avoid stockpiling. If there is a change to HAV pricing they'll keep it quiet until after the change. Adapt or Die // Republic Lance Commander // @ReesNoturana
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5847	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:08:00 - [23] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: Also, CCP doesn't announce price changes to avoid stockpiling. If there is a change to HAV pricing they'll keep it quiet until after the change. And? You could make them 900k. Won't stop them from being OP, nor will it stop people with crud tons of ISK from spamming them. AV > HAV > INF > AV \| Not: HAV > AV GëÑ INF [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Incin3rate New Age Empire. 55	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:14:00 - [24] - Quote Wait until proto hulls for vehicles.
Angus McBeanie Seraphim Initiative.. 44	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:18:00 - [25] - Quote Nirwanda Vaughns wrote: in 1.8 tanks will be more invincible until AV is re-balanced. swarms already do pathetic damage even at proto level and 3x complex DMs with the DM nerf they'll be even worse and we lose a packed AV nade too. some ideas i batted about were 1. the damage of AV needs to be at back to pre-nerf. 2. a hislot mod which give 30%, 40%, 50% (no stacking penalty) to lock range of swarms so AV guys choose between either further lock or higher damage. that way upclose and personal vs tanks you get high damage whereas vs dropships you're able to lock them but the damage is lower. 3. New swarm launcher specialization skills. Swarm missile flight time, swarm missile velocity. 10% per level to each. that way it allows us better chance of hitting fleeing vehicles. 4. Stasis Webbifier equipment. this basically works the same as in EVE. its an equipment item which locks onto an enemy vehicle like a repair tool, but reduces the max speed of the vehicle by say STD - 40% 25m range ADV - 60% 30m range PRO - 80% 35m range this way it gives AV'ers chance ot get more locks in but the tankers can shoot the infantry using the webber and may influence tankers ot start running a secondary gunner again. one or more of the above would help make AV vs tanks more fun and tactical again Yet, I come back to the game, go into an ambush, meet a madrugar with Ion cannon, he puts his hardner on. I still ripped off nearly half his armor in one volley with my wyrkomi with 2 proto dmg mods. The problem is more likely the amount of tanks that can be called in, in ambush games. I cannot fight 3 tanks, while I have infantry shooting at me in an ambush games. Further, i'm pretty sure, alot of you will have it easier playing Domination or Skirmishes, as tanks are easier to take out. Again, it's the AMOUNT of tanks, that can be called in, in AMBUSH matches that are ruining it in my opinion. These tanks are nothing compared to the tanks existing, just when the game launched into beta. Invincible missile tanks.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 3021	Posted - 2014.03.18 14:26:00 - [26] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, **** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right 1.They generally are, if my main turret is weaker than the portable handheld version then something is wrong tho the breach FG is lovely to use 2. Against shield and shiny tanks 3. Made for heavy suits in mind, this is not medium frame 514 no matter how much you cry about it 4. Secondary AV weapon for extra damage, also still home in on target and never miss, want more damage? then get rid of the auto seeking crutch so your aim actually has to do the work 5. Its mainly to improve TTK for infantry 6. ISK is not a factor - Well thats what AV used to say when it was 20k worth of AV nades able to kill a 2mil tank but now the shoe is on the other foot and they dont like it 7. My FG still works, so does swarms that i have seen, also proxy can but are not used and RE work very well, AV nades are good at getting a bit more damage in 8. MLT tanks effective, thats something you dont say everyday So far 3 months of lovely vehicles Intelligence is OP
Copharus Arkana Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 1	Posted - 2014.03.18 15:01:00 - [27] - Quote Bax Zanith wrote: NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, ** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right Well, I really didn't want to do this, but it looks like I'll have to spek into rail tanks to fight tank spame now. Stay the ** out of our tanks you scrub! Just use a SL and team work. You will be fine.
Dauth Jenkins Ultramarine Corp 251	Posted - 2014.03.18 15:02:00 - [28] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: - Tanks are way more powerful than Any kind of AV (JLAV doesn't count, since it's not listed as AV) - Swarms = useless - FG = only for heavy suits. - AV nades = well with 3 nades, still useless. CCP is reducing the number of nades i hear - Damage mods = getting nerfed (Less damage from Swarms and FG) - Cost of AV > Cost of Tanks (Compare SP and ISK both) - Effectiveness of AV = LOL - Effectiveness of Tank = Every tom, **** and harry can have one And you need l33t tanking skills to survive... Right No weapon is useless. Swarms just require a bit too much team work. It takes 4 mlt swarms to scare a tank Sees prototompers... Sees blueberries start to snipe... Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 252	Posted - 2014.03.18 15:17:00 - [29] - Quote Pure AV fit for 1.8: - Commando suit - Either Gallente or Minmatar (Thanks, CCP, for giving the swarmer damage bonus not to Caldari ) - PLC to strip shields - Swarmer to strip armor - REs for situation where the cover grants the necessary advantage - Alternatively, nanohives due to the low ammo values in the two weapons Considering the fact that PLCs easily strip shields, while swarmers need all the buffing they can get, the Minmatar Commando will likely be the better skill investment. Don't even attempt to armor up. I don't know the slot layouts, but damage mods should be used if possible (despite their downgrade), as well as kin cats for more effective RE usage. Dunno what you would put on the lows if you decide to use a nanohive. Maybe an Ewar module, if tank signatures and scanner strength are fixed. So yes, AV actually got buffed. Now you can get a 5% damage mod with a 10% skill damage increase, as well as +25% reload speed on a PLC. If you run with a friend, you can negate the reload cycle on the swarmer for six shots before reloading. Which is very important for speedy tanks. The other guy can use a PLC to strip the shields and another gun for anti-infantry.
Supernus Gigas sNk Syndicate 476	Posted - 2014.03.18 15:23:00 - [30] - Quote Y'all want to solo tanks? Here I'll tell you how to solo tanks, it'll most likely change in 1.8, but it's what I've been using for a while. ADV Amarr Heavy Frame Two Complex Heavy Damage Mods Enhanced CardReg Basic Armor Rep Wiyrkomi Breach Forge Gun STD SMG C-7 Flux Grenades One shot to the weakspot of the tank and it goes kablooey unless it's stacking plates and/or extenders or has it's hardener on. If plates/extenders are the case then a simple follow up shot will do as it'll barely have any HP left.. In the case of a hardener, why the hell are you shooting at a tank with it's hardener up? I'm fairly sure you could pull this off with a DCMA-5 as well, but I personally haven't tried it yet as I've just been burning through my stockpile of Wiyrkomis. Smoke 'em if ya got 'em and all that. *FIRE UP THE HEAVY MEAT GRINDER! WE'RE HAVIN' CLONE BURGERS TONIGHT, BOYS!*



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