DUST Search - Being A Logi Is NOT Profitable, This HAS To Change

Scheherazade VII wrote:

We are the ones putting our life on the line, we are the ones healing you, resupplying you, giving you useful spawn points
and we get NOTHING in return.

I just went 9/10, I had my rep tool out most of the time and only made a kill when it was absolutely necessary,
mostly I was sacrificing myself trying to keep our heavies alive and also through healing everyone I saw.

3000WP, 332K ISK was made, 460K ISK was lost,

THIS HAS TO CHANGE

What's the ******* point of being a logi? What would I had to have made to break even? 4000wp? TO BREAK EVEN?!

This has been said TIME AND TIME again and NOTHING is being done! If ISK payouts don't change for logis in 1.8
then I may as well just play Call of Duty! Some of us get bored with doing nothing but shooting all the ******* time.

The role is there for a reason, so make it work CCP! Make it viable, being a logi is fun but seeing the end screen just
makes me pissed off and wish I pulled out a rail rifle instead. Which I did the next game, and I made ISK...

Is this just a spamfest? Are there supposed to be other roles or are we all supposed to spam the FOTM?
If you want this to be nothing but another cookie-cutter shooter then go ahead, keep going down the path you're going.
If this is going to be anything more than a casual lobby shooter then there needs to be a reason to put down the gun
and support your team!!

I guess I'll just go back to spamming the OP triple damage modded rail rifle! Because you get more ISK for mindlessly
slaughtering masses of newberries in starter fits.

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Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 1539	Posted - 2014.03.09 05:28:00 - [31] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: Henchmen21 wrote: Everyone is just going to tell you to run cheaper fits to make ISK in. I mean why would would you skill into something you never get to use because you always have to run the cheapest fit possible to make ISK. The thing is if I make a cheaper fit I'll die more and I'll still lose the same amount of ISK! Run advanced. Nothing proto. I usually break even and if I don't, I lose around 50-100k so it's not that much. Just use plenty of spawns, resupply and Triage/Guardian points. Ditch the needle and scanner.
RemingtonBeaver Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 180	Posted - 2014.03.09 05:35:00 - [32] - Quote Sgt Buttscratch wrote: I made a couple of million today running my logi chick. suits cost me 40k,lost an everage of 3 per match, made an average of 350k per match Sorry to be completely off topic but I just sat here for way too long trying to figure out where I had heard Buttscratch's sig. Mr.Bungle...******* Mr.Bungle. +1 to you sir, for you enjoy the finer things in life. and to be on topic. A logi should make way more money..because paying back all the College Foundation of New Eden student loans on a medical degree is outrageous. Space doctors get paid crap and it's not right. We can pickle that.
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 4938	Posted - 2014.03.09 05:49:00 - [33] - Quote I don't know about everyone else but if I run anything other than basic I'm prepared to lose cash..... Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 4 STB-Infantry (Demolition)
Meee One The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 468	Posted - 2014.03.09 05:51:00 - [34] - Quote OP no one cares about us logis. To them we're like bathroom tissue, they like to use us and throw us out...but god forbid you aren't there. These people don't care that we leave ourselves 100% defenseless while using a rep tool. They don't care that we become the only target while our rep tool is in action. They tell you to "stack this" or "stack that" essentially telling you to have gear just like a slayer would. OP you will receive 0 sympathy from those suit layout jealous assaults,who want this game to be a knock off of COD. I know your pain OP,i truely do,but everyone who says "yur team shud defeend you" are morons. These people are fools who would sell their eternal souls for 15 minutes of fame. Only users lose drugs. Time wounds all heels.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4521	Posted - 2014.03.09 06:05:00 - [35] - Quote I run a Stadard Caldari LogI with.only standard equipment and I average high returns from games. Just run a cheaper fit and remember that sometimes your gun is a better choice than your rep tool. Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
darkiller240 WarRavens League of Infamy 554	Posted - 2014.03.09 06:06:00 - [36] - Quote medomai grey wrote: darkiller240 wrote: aaaauuu thats cute Being an ADS pilot murders your wallet does one of your suits cost half an million then gets 2 shoted out of existence by a noob? You're lucky. There are forge guns and large rail turrets that can 1 shot my dropship. yer, a doble moded proto rail or a fully skilled breach FG can 1 hit me "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
Kira Takizawa WARNING LABEL Inc. 168	Posted - 2014.03.09 08:58:00 - [37] - Quote darkiller240 wrote: aaaauuu thats cute Being an ADS pilot murders your wallet does one of your suits cost half an million then gets 2 shoted out of existence by a noob? xD Either learn to dodge or stop flying cause if you get shot down by a noob that makes you a noob right?
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 665	Posted - 2014.03.09 09:13:00 - [38] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: Henchmen21 wrote: Everyone is just going to tell you to run cheaper fits to make ISK in. I mean why would would you skill into something you never get to use because you always have to run the cheapest fit possible to make ISK. The thing is if I make a cheaper fit I'll die more and I'll still lose the same amount of ISK! No... no you won't. It doesn't work that way. Proto gear is disproportionally more expensive than any other kind of equipment. You are supposed to be using STD or ADV gear to earn money. Example... if I earn 150,000 isk in a battle... I died 10 times, that cost me 40,000 isk. Profit 110,000 isk. If I had been using a Proto suit, I would have died possibly 4 times or less which is around 60K a suit.. 240,000 isk so a loss of 90,000 isk etc. I don't actually know proto prices cause I don't use Proto gear. If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
Kitt 514 True North. 140	Posted - 2014.03.09 09:35:00 - [39] - Quote My cheap logi suit is ~2500 isk. Assuming an average 200k payout, thats 80 deaths. How are you dying more than 80 times in a match?
Ronan Elsword Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 210	Posted - 2014.03.09 09:42:00 - [40] - Quote It's kind of funny now that I think about it, Logies are getting a huge nerf with equipment and everything else being nerfed. Yet everything cost the same. One of the reasons I'm ending my Logisitics Career in 1.8 (Until it's feasible again) PvE 2014

DEZKA DIABLO 0uter.Heaven 351	Posted - 2014.03.09 09:57:00 - [41] - Quote Make 3 uplink suits with biotic mods 3 hive suits with biotic mods All on adv with proto gear Make lv 1 scout with links that's fast Make your fighting fit Run in scout get the depot run around as far as you can safely and spam and repeat, lastly get fight suit and regroup with sqd, little risk, the equip works for you by being stationary and your fight fit should have only personal gear plus your rep tool. Use ur scanner, allotek hives, needle/r9 link rep tool, use a shyt needle an your tool or hives, you should barely die if your smart an leave 1 link at new location so your never without backup Dead trigger master , an ya I do that ISH ON PURPOSE!
darkiller240 WarRavens League of Infamy 558	Posted - 2014.03.09 11:27:00 - [42] - Quote Kira Takizawa wrote: darkiller240 wrote: aaaauuu thats cute Being an ADS pilot murders your wallet does one of your suits cost half an million then gets 2 shoted out of existence by a noob? xD Either learn to dodge or stop flying cause if you get shot down by a noob that makes you a noob right? Heres one, Heres one who thinks Flying a ADS is easy Get him Boys! "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
Derpty Derp It's All Gone Derp 112	Posted - 2014.03.09 11:32:00 - [43] - Quote Logi not profitable... I made a fit just for the fun of it, mines 26k each and I sure as hell don't die that much, but yet come away with a **** ton of money every time I do it... It's literally the easiest way to get money... All I can say is, play better?
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 173	Posted - 2014.03.09 11:44:00 - [44] - Quote -1 If your Logi isn't profiting on ISK, either you suck or your blueberries suck. Pull out a BPO or Militia suit and get over yourself. Scouts are the only suit that are guaranteed to make a profit, and even then at proto level I doubt it. Sign my petition for mortal tanks
Racro 01 Arifistan 501st Knights of Leanbox INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 197	Posted - 2014.03.09 11:45:00 - [45] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: I just went 9/10, I had my rep tool out most of the time and only made a kill when it was absolutely necessary, mostly I was sacrificing myself trying to keep our heavies alive and also through healing everyone I saw. 3000WP, 332K ISK was made, 460K ISK was lost, you do relize that this is the standard non-slayer logi type of wp gain right? i eman. your compaling your not makeing a profit when you made your own OB> not many people do that. obvisly your a good logi. but your complaing your not makeing a profit. thats mainly becuase your a logi and people wnat to kill you and your risk got you a whole fck ton of wp. so stop QQing and get back logi'ing'
Marc Rime 306	Posted - 2014.03.09 11:56:00 - [46] - Quote Nothing is profitable if you lose that much ISK in one game. Change your priorities - survival comes first, or make sure someone else is carrying a needle. Also, switch to a BPO/stater/militia fit after you lose 5-6 (or whatever) of the suits you were using. ...or do what CCP wants us to do - buy lots and lots of AUR and spend it on suits etc.
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 1225	Posted - 2014.03.09 12:27:00 - [47] - Quote I'll just leave this here 41-7 in a pub skirmish with 3100WP I would have profited had the other team not decided to drop 3 strikes on just me I ran proto callogi with duvolle quantum scanner, Ishukone gauged hive, and wiyrokomi nanite injector and a boundless CR 194K suit. Its far better to be both to and logi then to just pigeon hole yourself into one role. That match was so ISK heavy because the other team had 4 full proto gal logis who got to taste what my boundless CR did to armor and they had 2-3 guys spamming tanks that got wrecked by my two squad mates with proto breach FGs. STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado, Cannabis Sativa Connoisseur
SteelheadPep SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 63	Posted - 2014.03.09 13:08:00 - [48] - Quote Such is the life of a support logi, there is a lot of good advise in this post that you can try.You have to think about your play style and adjust accordingly. I like to be on the front line and support my team in the thick of it, this gets me killed a lot but I am were I am most needed. Run cheap logis in ambush to help make ISK. Pick out the gems in this post and experiment.
Piraten Hovnoret Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 385	Posted - 2014.03.09 13:08:00 - [49] - Quote darkiller240 wrote: aaaauuu thats cute Being an ADS pilot murders your wallet does one of your suits cost half an million then gets 2 shoted out of existence by a noob? Sick and tyerd of ADS pilots conplaning, you are the tankers of 1,7 in the same way that tankers war bitching in 1,6 My logi suit cost 267 000 isk... Bring that out to a heavy frontline fight and I gatantie that I die at least 2 times on every death of a decent pilot. War never changes
darkiller240 WarRavens League of Infamy 561	Posted - 2014.03.09 13:34:00 - [50] - Quote Piraten Hovnoret wrote: darkiller240 wrote: aaaauuu thats cute Being an ADS pilot murders your wallet does one of your suits cost half an million then gets 2 shoted out of existence by a noob? Sick and tyerd of ADS pilots conplaning, you are the tankers of 1,7 in the same way that tankers war bitching in 1,6 My logi suit cost 267 000 isk... Bring that out to a heavy frontline fight and I gatantie that I die at least 2 times on every death of a decent pilot. what we never complain we just remind anyone else ho is that they have it better then us "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein

Henchmen21 Planet Express LLC 719	Posted - 2014.03.09 14:27:00 - [51] - Quote DEZKA DIABLO wrote: Make 3 uplink suits with biotic mods 3 hive suits with biotic mods All on adv with proto gear Make lv 1 scout with links that's fast Make your fighting fit Run in scout get the depot run around as far as you can safely and spam and repeat, lastly get fight suit and regroup with sqd, little risk, the equip works for you by being stationary and your fight fit should have only personal gear plus your rep tool. Use ur scanner, allotek hives, needle/r9 link rep tool, use a shyt needle an your tool or hives, you should barely die if your smart an leave 1 link at new location so your never without backup Thanks for getting equipment nerfed for the rest of us. CCP you better nail 1.8, as it stands 1.7 is a total disaster. Henchmen21: Infantry Gotyougood Ufkr: Vehicles
Sum1ne Else WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 962	Posted - 2014.03.09 14:37:00 - [52] - Quote I have been saying this since around May 2013.. I totally agree with the OP and is why I rarely run logi anymore and so do many others. These guys on the forum replying do not understand a true logi and how they can make money. If you dont do PC or are not apart of the PC money glitch corps and just play pubs you will find that most games you go negative in isk. I have already posted this and you just get bunch of KDR trolls replying.. but what they dont realise is when they need a hive, uplink, rep, needle, whatever they moan and then end up loosing the game anyways. I have just run games with completely free gear and when you usually are a key role in your corp/team they all realise. I have tried many different combinations using as many BPOs as possible but with the current way the game is-ie. TTK being low, proto pub stompers etc its just pointless. If I was you, I would just use FOTM, or buy a militia tank, snipe even, but then the game just is boring and you end up quitting. I am at 30m and fluctuate between 30m and 60m for 12 months- and with 31m SP its hard not to run ADV gear- I never run proto and do 2 or 3 PCs per month. Public Relations WJR Its a leopleuradon Charlie a magical leoplueradon, its gunna guide our way to candy mountain!
Obodiah Garro Tech Guard RISE of LEGION 809	Posted - 2014.03.09 15:01:00 - [53] - Quote Logis need to slay less and support more, IE dont be at the head of the pack and use better cover , running out in the open to pick up a snipe victim only to feed the sniper more wp etc Nemo me impune lacessit
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 3007	Posted - 2014.03.09 15:26:00 - [54] - Quote You have to run smart to make money. Never carry expensive equipment into a firefight, and don't go into firefights. That means no uplinks or proto hives as you follow a squad around with a rep tool. It makes dying very expensive. All deployable equipment goes on seprate suits that avoid combat. You will be shot at, but you won't be rushing into danger with your expensive gear. Lay all that out untethered to a fatty who wants to waddle into a nest of red. Once that is done you can spawn a cheap suit for repping if you want to. The best is a BPO SEVER suit with BPO rep tool, hives, and needle, shield extenders, etc. Entirely BPO. The MLT rep tool and needle will earn more points than te ADV and far more than PRO. Your squad mates can pay for the good stuff if they want it, otherwise they get MLT. The key is only extremely cheap suits carry rep tools because they will die frequently.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 699	Posted - 2014.03.09 16:22:00 - [55] - Quote Being an effective logibro does require some investment ISK-wise. Just the nature of the beast.
Gelan Corbaine Gladiators Vanguard 314	Posted - 2014.03.09 16:41:00 - [56] - Quote Feh ...try being an AV trooper for awhile then come complain about logi being hard to make a profit . No job is worth doing if you don't get paid in the end .
Kristoff Atruin Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1801	Posted - 2014.03.09 17:13:00 - [57] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Try asking the null-sec dwellers why they bring a multi-billion ISK ship into the battlefield not expecting much in the way of ISK gains. Not sure if this has been responded to yet. Sometimes you find players who are so wealthy that they don't think twice about risking a multi billion isk ship for no possible gain if they'll have fun getting blown up. Usually wormwhole dwellers, who rake in giant piles of extremely valuable salvage from sleeper npcs. Most of the time though there's an alliance reimbursement plan to take the sting out of any losses, because the reason you're there is to secure a source of income for your corp / alliance. This does seem to present a bit of an interesting problem for Dust, because in Eve the way these bigger more powerful ships are balanced is that they have an easy time hitting ships that are a class below them. Against anything smaller than that they need smaller ships there to protect them. That doesn't work with infantry suits. CCP doesn't really like to balanced purely on cost because players will grind their faces off doing the most boring things imaginable if they can get an advantage. To the OP, I run logi all the time and I make quite a lot of isk at it. You make just as much with lower tier gear as with proto. There's no need to run a core focused rep tool if you're not running with an organized squad who has another logi who can pick you up if you fall. Unless you have more isk than sense that's the only time you should be running proto at all, if you've got people around who can save your ass.
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 2253	Posted - 2014.03.09 17:18:00 - [58] - Quote Sum1ne Else wrote: I have been saying this since around May 2013.. I totally agree with the OP and is why I rarely run logi anymore and so do many others. These guys on the forum replying do not understand a true logi and how they can make money. If you dont do PC or are not apart of the PC money glitch corps and just play pubs you will find that most games you go negative in isk. I have already posted this and you just get bunch of KDR trolls replying.. but what they dont realise is when they need a hive, uplink, rep, needle, whatever they moan and then end up loosing the game anyways. I have just run games with completely free gear and when you usually are a key role in your corp/team they all realise. I have tried many different combinations using as many BPOs as possible but with the current way the game is-ie. TTK being low, proto pub stompers etc its just pointless. If I was you, I would just use FOTM, or buy a militia tank, snipe even, but then the game just is boring and you end up quitting. I am at 30m and fluctuate between 30m and 60m for 12 months- and with 31m SP its hard not to run ADV gear- I never run proto in pubs and do 2 or 3 PCs per month. EDIT: I have all this gear, yet I cannot use it all the time, I would really like 3 different modes of AMB/DOM/Skirm where meta level is introduced..I really do not think these proto pub stompers would stand a chance with their crutches against most corps that only run STD/ADV gear. Other than that double isk for winning. Something needs to be introduced with regards to isk. I'm not usually in the HTFU scrub crowd but that's just not true. On the contrary, it's those who want to use proto all the time who care about KDR if you ask me. If you really care about ISK and not KDR, like me, you would never use proto in pubs (again, like me.) John Demonsbane lifetime stats (more or less, don't check it religiously) KDR 0.9 Kills 6000 WP 1 mil Number of proto suits used: 1(just to try it out) Profit from PC: 0 ISK Current wallet: 60 mil ISK (with 100s of fully stocked proto and ADV suits bought) I run an overall profit in pubs running BPOs and ADV suits. Equipment is always higher tier than my weapon and I never have any empty equip slots. When I'm drunk or solo on a bad team or in Amarr FW I lose ISK but make it up other times. If you're on a crap team use BPOs and just deal with dying more easily. Tl;dr I meet nobody's definition of l33t but running a profit as a logi is very doable without any exploits. Also: Meh... #1.8fakelogiexodus (I need to Gäó that.) "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Forum Warrior lv.2 Amarr victor!
Auris Lionesse Capital Acquisitions LLC Renegade Alliance 403	Posted - 2014.03.09 18:27:00 - [59] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: Auris Lionesse wrote: Logis are hella profitable. More slots than assaults and CPU/PG for proto mods and a gun. who runs equipment on logis? LOL Point made, I ran health and damage modules the next game and made ISK. But then what is the assault suit for? This game is borked. thats a good question, theres quite a few threads asking the same thing. what are assault suits for? theyre outclassed by logis in every way that matters
Nothing Certain Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 289	Posted - 2014.03.09 19:37:00 - [60] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: We are the ones putting our life on the line, we are the ones healing you, resupplying you, giving you useful spawn points and we get NOTHING in return. I just went 9/10, I had my rep tool out most of the time and only made a kill when it was absolutely necessary, mostly I was sacrificing myself trying to keep our heavies alive and also through healing everyone I saw. 3000WP, 332K ISK was made, 460K ISK was lost, THIS HAS TO CHANGE What's the ***** point of being a logi? What would I had to have made to break even? 4000wp? TO BREAK EVEN?! This has been said TIME AND TIME again and NOTHING is being done! If ISK payouts don't change for logis in 1.8 then I may as well just play Call of Duty! Some of us get bored with doing nothing but shooting all the ***** time. The role is there for a reason, so make it work CCP! Make it viable, being a logi is fun but seeing the end screen just makes me pissed off and wish I pulled out a rail rifle instead. Which I did the next game, and I made ISK... Is this just a spamfest? Are there supposed to be other roles or are we all supposed to spam the FOTM? If you want this to be nothing but another cookie-cutter shooter then go ahead, keep going down the path you're going. If this is going to be anything more than a casual lobby shooter then there needs to be a reason to put down the gun and support your team!! I guess I'll just go back to spamming the OP triple damage modded rail rifle! Because you get more ISK for mindlessly slaughtering masses of newberries in starter fits. This is exactly what the ISK system is for, you have to make decisions about what you run, you can't just run your proto and do whatever you like. I play logi and I make a profit almost every game, and there are plenty of slayers who don't make profits. There is nothing special about the logi that makes it unprofitable, but it comes down to budgeting, don't play what you can't afford. Because, that's why.



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