DUST Search - Message To The DUST 514 Conventional Rifle Users

True Adamance wrote:

Buster Friently wrote:

Delta 749 wrote:

Atiim wrote:

Delta 749 wrote:

Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled
Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches
Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on

-Hand

The niche weapons (for the most part) were already effective in their niche.

I could buff Mass Drivers to where the Breach would 1HK you, but that still wouldn't change the fact that my Combat Rifle would wipe half your squad in one clip now would it?

I could buff Sniper Rifles to the point where the Tactical had the power of a Thale's, but that still wouldn't stop my Rail Rifle from being a Long Range Shotgun with the CQC effectiveness of an actual Shotgun now would it?

The Rifles had to be nerfed. When you have a plentiful source of weapons and the only ones people use are four of them, you know there's a problem with your game.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but CCP made the right swing with their nerfbat.

You are talking straight power buffs while Im talking situational ones that are geared to a weapons niche, big difference there
The rifles really really didnt need to be nerfed, hell the point of an assault rifle type weapon is to be widely used by an army since it can cover multiple roles well and let a soldier adapt to multiple situations without having to carry more gear/swap out gear all the time

Your argument is like asking a real world army why they dont have more guys using pistols shotguns and sniper rifles rather than a M4 or what have you

This is a Game. The AR/Rifles in this game definitely did need nerfed due to the stupidly short TTK in the game. Comparing a real military use of a weapon to a game mechanic is absurd.

All weapons should be niche weapons.

I don't see why AR shouldn't be adaptable and useable all around? All FPS see AR use as their core/ most used weapons.

No they should not. Not all weapons should be niche weapons.

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Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5361	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:21:00 - [1] - Quote I see a lot of you guys going around saying things such as "my rifle sucks, kitten this crap I quit" or "now it's gonna take forever to kill something" and "now our rifles are gonna suck" Have you ever stopped and thought about something? Perhaps the rifles aren't supposed to be as good as the niche weapons, so that people are encouraged to used them. Perhaps CCP intended this game to be unique, as opposed to simply a COD remake where all you see are rifles with different skins on them. Perhaps your rifles are being balanced around the amount of skill they require. Sure your Rail Rifle may not be the king of long range combat, but how about the Laser Rifle? And your Combat Rifle may not shred through armor like it used to, but why not try the Mass Driver? Please stop being so self-entitled. Your rifles weren't meant to be "the best around." They are "Jack of All Trades, Master of None" weapons. -HAND lolPLC [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Dauth Jenkins Ultramarine Corp 163	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:23:00 - [2] - Quote +1, try using a difficult weapon, and when you go back to the rifle, it's easy mode. Ion cannon 1.8! Sees prototompers... Sees blueberries start to snipe... Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 2591	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:24:00 - [3] - Quote Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on -Hand I'll start my own war, with hookers, and blackjack! In fact forget the war and the blackjack.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 675	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:24:00 - [4] - Quote Thanks for saying this, Atiim. I agree wholeheartedly. I also find it rather noteworthy that, generally speaking, it's not the really good players who are complaining -- as usual, they will simply adapt and overcome -- while the weaker players QQ.
Buster Friently Rosen Association 1922	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:25:00 - [5] - Quote Atiim wrote: I see a lot of you guys going around saying things such as "my rifle sucks, kitten this crap I quit" or "now it's gonna take forever to kill something" and "now our rifles are gonna suck" Have you ever stopped and thought about something? Perhaps the rifles aren't supposed to be as good as the niche weapons, so that people are encouraged to used them. Perhaps CCP intended this game to be unique, as opposed to simply a COD remake where all you see are rifles with different skins on them. Perhaps your rifles are being balanced around the amount of skill they require. Sure your Rail Rifle may not be the king of long range combat, but how about the Laser Rifle? And your Combat Rifle may not shred through armor like it used to, but why not try the Mass Driver? Please stop being so self-entitled. Your rifles weren't meant to be "the best around." They are "Jack of All Trades, Master of None" weapons. -HAND Now you're going to force people to actually think. Most will recoil in fear, and rebel in anger.
Aisha Ctarl Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3822	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:27:00 - [6] - Quote Atiim using logic?!? faints P.S. - My Scrambler better still OHK just about everything P.P.S - Amarr > you P.P.P.S - #rollingold #Amarrch I could list the ways how we Amarr are better than you, but your lesser mind wouldn't comprehend it.
Awry Barux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 1449	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:29:00 - [7] - Quote +1 agreed. I'm so excited to be able to be viable without playing the same game as 99% of the FPS market. I can't wait to GTFO rifle land. Respec in 1.8 due to huge battlefield role shift for MinLogi! All my posts are respec posts (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ LockmeBro!
CLONE117 True Pros Forever 717	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:31:00 - [8] - Quote the nerf effects all.. but it makes the lowest level rifles such as the gall ar. useless.. this will only serve to increase the amount of boring stomp matches. nerfing how they can be utilized at the various scenarios. it only looks to be creating a larger imbalance across the multiple tiers.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5365	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:31:00 - [9] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on -Hand The niche weapons (for the most part) were already effective in their niche. I could buff Mass Drivers to where the Breach would 1HK you, but that still wouldn't change the fact that my Combat Rifle would wipe half your squad in one clip now would it? I could buff Sniper Rifles to the point where the Tactical had the power of a Thale's, but that still wouldn't stop my Rail Rifle from being a Long Range Shotgun with the CQC effectiveness of an actual Shotgun now would it? The Rifles had to be nerfed. When you have a plentiful source of weapons and the only ones people use are four of them, you know there's a problem with your game. I can't believe I'm saying this, but CCP made the right swing with their nerfbat. lolPLC [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Buster Friently Rosen Association 1925	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:33:00 - [10] - Quote Awry Barux wrote: +1 agreed. I'm so excited to be able to be viable without playing the same game as 99% of the FPS market. I can't wait to GTFO rifle land. Yes, this is how Dust must go to succeed. They need to be unique. A copycat game had gotten them nowhere so far.

Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5365	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:33:00 - [11] - Quote Dauth Jenkins wrote: +1, try using a difficult weapon, and when you go back to the rifle, it's easy mode. Ion cannon 1.8! I wish my Scout could use 80GJ Turrets. Ion Pistols? For sure. Ion Cannons? Far too heavy. lolPLC [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Awry Barux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 1450	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:39:00 - [12] - Quote Atiim wrote: Dauth Jenkins wrote: +1, try using a difficult weapon, and when you go back to the rifle, it's easy mode. Ion cannon 1.8! I wish my Scout could use 80GJ Turrets. Ion Pistols? For sure. Ion Cannons? Far too heavy. I still want my glass-cannon FG scout and HMG scout. The fitting requirements alone make it balanced. Respec in 1.8 due to huge battlefield role shift for MinLogi! All my posts are respec posts (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ LockmeBro!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7928	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:40:00 - [13] - Quote However and I'd need to test the weapon some in 1.8 ..... it looks to me like the ScR has lost what made it special. We don't hit all that hard now.....now cannot deal with armoured units..... do we still have our 1v1 capacity? "War is not hell, far from it. War is beautiful. War is divine." - Grand Admiral Mekioth Sarum
Supernus Gigas Star Giants 387	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:41:00 - [14] - Quote Atiim wrote: Dauth Jenkins wrote: +1, try using a difficult weapon, and when you go back to the rifle, it's easy mode. Ion cannon 1.8! I wish my Scout could use 80GJ Turrets. Ion Pistols? For sure. Ion Cannons? Far too heavy. How would you equip it though? Put it on your back and crawl around like a turtle to use it? OH I GOT IT! Make it a hat! I can only imagine how silly it would look watching a scout run around with this massive turret just sitting on it's head. *FIRE UP THE HEAVY MEAT GRINDER! WE'RE HAVIN' CLONE BURGERS TONIGHT, BOYS!*
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7157	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:43:00 - [15] - Quote I approve of the nerfs, except for a couple. 1. They nerfed the Breach AR. The mother f'ing Breach AR. WTF? 2. Why did Flux grenades needed a carrying amount nerfed? They were mainly used as equipment destroyers as locus grenades did Anti Infantry better, now with reduced carrying amount they're not even good at that 3. Same problem, only this time with AV nades. Just why? Why the blanket nerf? 4. Why was the Magsec not touched after the AR and SMG nerf? Now the Magsec is a secondary AR, no seriously do the math. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Mortedeamor Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1441	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:43:00 - [16] - Quote i am and will always be a laser rifle master i enjoy equal playing fields in my range of expertise.. i hope all of you are ready for a fair fight the other tac rifles have some blood to deal being fotm comes ata price hope you enjoyed your killing spree. i have not majorly suffered nor have i dropped my morals to specc into caldari tech my racism holds true lol this is AMARRICA and i will burn you with my divine empress's light A laser rifle master for life not just for when it becomes popular Long Live the Empress Burn the Heretics
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 813	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:43:00 - [17] - Quote My only problem with the rifle nerfs are that the HMG wasn't included. I'm all for a slightly increased TTK, but I want it to be proportional. TTK for everyone is going up, TTK for Sentinels is going WAY up. Disproportionately so. Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5371	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:44:00 - [18] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Atiim using logic?!? faints P.S. - My Scrambler better still OHK just about everything P.P.S - Amarr > you P.P.P.S - #rollingold #Amarrch I'm going to make a nerf SCR thread once 1.8 drops, regardless of how UP or OP is is just so I can troll you :3 lolPLC [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Soldier Sorajord Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 153	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:47:00 - [19] - Quote Lol CCP has said themselves a weapon such as riles are not to be the most powerful. They are versatile. Because of that versatility, they have no right to be as powerful as other situational weapons. Try running a MD with clusters of enemies? That should mow through them faster than your rifle and 3 grenades. Long Range? Snipers and Laser rifles should eat you in your place. CQC? The shotgun should dominate you. Don't complain about Rifles. They're honestly OP right now, because they overshadow every Anti Infantry. They kill people in not even seconds. Medium Suits. Built with full plates/full extenders. In not even seconds. Is that fair? NO! Take the Laser Rifle for instance; That gun is extremely situational and only does optimal dmg at a range far from you. Rifles can do the same kind of damage over a higher range than that situational weapon can. Is that fair? I think not. MD's aren't OP either. They should tear people apart at close range, but The RR and CR can take down infantry easier and the shots reach them quicker than a MD does. Click Here to set up a Character that will get an AR, SMG, and a Caldari BPO
knight of 6 SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 1565	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:48:00 - [20] - Quote Atiim wrote: Dauth Jenkins wrote: +1, try using a difficult weapon, and when you go back to the rifle, it's easy mode. Ion cannon 1.8! I wish my Scout could use 80GJ Turrets. Ion Pistols? For sure. Ion Cannons? Far too heavy. you're a scout now? is this how other people feel when you suddenly "become" a class that they spent months leaning? it hurts right here points at upper chest on a more serious note I agree with OP. CCP has a tendency to over buff and over nerf though, so only time will tell if the changes to ARs are justified. GÇ£Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for I am dampened.GÇ¥* Ko6 scout,

Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 5372	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:51:00 - [21] - Quote knight of 6 wrote: you're a scout now? is this how other people feel when you suddenly "become" a class that they spent months leaning? it hurts right here *points at upper chest on a more serious note I agree with OP. CCP has a tendency to over buff and over nerf though, so only time will tell if the changes to ARs are justified. Actually, I'm an Omni-Soldier. I'm no more a Scout than I am a Logi, Assualt, Commando, Sentinel, Sniper, Tanker, or AVer Though if we want to break things down further, I'm not even a scout. I'm a Light Frame. lolPLC [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
knight of 6 SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 1566	Posted - 2014.03.06 19:56:00 - [22] - Quote Atiim wrote: knight of 6 wrote: you're a scout now? is this how other people feel when you suddenly "become" a class that they spent months leaning? it hurts right here points at upper chest on a more serious note I agree with OP. CCP has a tendency to over buff and over nerf though, so only time will tell if the changes to ARs are justified. Actually, I'm an Omni-Soldier. I'm no more a Scout than I am a Logi, Assualt, Commando, Sentinel, Sniper, Tanker, or AVer Though if we want to break things down further, I'm not even a scout. I'm a Light Frame. oh good you're useless as a scout, i feel better now... light frames are terribad right now. until you get scout 5 profile damp 3 on a racial frame you can't passively avoid advanced scanners which really limits your fitting options. GÇ£Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for I am dampened.GÇ¥* Ko6 scout,
TechMechMeds SWAMPERIUM 2791	Posted - 2014.03.06 20:02:00 - [23] - Quote Atiim wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Atiim using logic?!? faints P.S. - My Scrambler better still OHK just about everything P.P.S - Amarr > you P.P.P.S - #rollingold #Amarrch I'm going to make a nerf SCR thread once 1.8 drops, regardless of how UP or OP is is just so I can troll you :3 I'll join that for laughs, a very well justified hype about why amarr suits and gear is op lol., Level 2 forum warrior. Dust on the ps4 asap please I sold my family to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic
8213 Capital Acquisitions LLC Renegade Alliance 1662	Posted - 2014.03.06 20:18:00 - [24] - Quote First day of 1.7, I was with a buddy in a squad, and I had those 50 Burnstalk lasers from somewhere. Me: "I think I'm going to use my laser this match, just for the fun of it." Him: "Why use a laser when you can just use a rail rifle?" I think people have forgotten that there are more than just the 4 rifles in this game. Even Scouts have drifted towards using CRs instead of their trusty SGs and NKs Fish in a bucket! Darken's Testament SKIPPY
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 2582	Posted - 2014.03.06 20:23:00 - [25] - Quote perhaps, there shouldn't be rifles in this fps at all. weRideNDie2getha since 2010 RND's recruitment official phrase
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 2595	Posted - 2014.03.06 20:29:00 - [26] - Quote Atiim wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on -Hand The niche weapons (for the most part) were already effective in their niche. I could buff Mass Drivers to where the Breach would 1HK you, but that still wouldn't change the fact that my Combat Rifle would wipe half your squad in one clip now would it? I could buff Sniper Rifles to the point where the Tactical had the power of a Thale's, but that still wouldn't stop my Rail Rifle from being a Long Range Shotgun with the CQC effectiveness of an actual Shotgun now would it? The Rifles had to be nerfed. When you have a plentiful source of weapons and the only ones people use are four of them, you know there's a problem with your game. I can't believe I'm saying this, but CCP made the right swing with their nerfbat. You are talking straight power buffs while Im talking situational ones that are geared to a weapons niche, big difference there The rifles really really didnt need to be nerfed, hell the point of an assault rifle type weapon is to be widely used by an army since it can cover multiple roles well and let a soldier adapt to multiple situations without having to carry more gear/swap out gear all the time Your argument is like asking a real world army why they dont have more guys using pistols shotguns and sniper rifles rather than a M4 or what have you I'll start my own war, with hookers, and blackjack! In fact forget the war and the blackjack.
Buster Friently Rosen Association 1927	Posted - 2014.03.06 20:41:00 - [27] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: Atiim wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on -Hand The niche weapons (for the most part) were already effective in their niche. I could buff Mass Drivers to where the Breach would 1HK you, but that still wouldn't change the fact that my Combat Rifle would wipe half your squad in one clip now would it? I could buff Sniper Rifles to the point where the Tactical had the power of a Thale's, but that still wouldn't stop my Rail Rifle from being a Long Range Shotgun with the CQC effectiveness of an actual Shotgun now would it? The Rifles had to be nerfed. When you have a plentiful source of weapons and the only ones people use are four of them, you know there's a problem with your game. I can't believe I'm saying this, but CCP made the right swing with their nerfbat. You are talking straight power buffs while Im talking situational ones that are geared to a weapons niche, big difference there The rifles really really didnt need to be nerfed, hell the point of an assault rifle type weapon is to be widely used by an army since it can cover multiple roles well and let a soldier adapt to multiple situations without having to carry more gear/swap out gear all the time Your argument is like asking a real world army why they dont have more guys using pistols shotguns and sniper rifles rather than a M4 or what have you This is a Game. The AR/Rifles in this game definitely did need nerfed due to the stupidly short TTK in the game. Comparing a real military use of a weapon to a game mechanic is absurd. All weapons should be niche weapons.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7936	Posted - 2014.03.06 20:57:00 - [28] - Quote Buster Friently wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Atiim wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on -Hand The niche weapons (for the most part) were already effective in their niche. I could buff Mass Drivers to where the Breach would 1HK you, but that still wouldn't change the fact that my Combat Rifle would wipe half your squad in one clip now would it? I could buff Sniper Rifles to the point where the Tactical had the power of a Thale's, but that still wouldn't stop my Rail Rifle from being a Long Range Shotgun with the CQC effectiveness of an actual Shotgun now would it? The Rifles had to be nerfed. When you have a plentiful source of weapons and the only ones people use are four of them, you know there's a problem with your game. I can't believe I'm saying this, but CCP made the right swing with their nerfbat. You are talking straight power buffs while Im talking situational ones that are geared to a weapons niche, big difference there The rifles really really didnt need to be nerfed, hell the point of an assault rifle type weapon is to be widely used by an army since it can cover multiple roles well and let a soldier adapt to multiple situations without having to carry more gear/swap out gear all the time Your argument is like asking a real world army why they dont have more guys using pistols shotguns and sniper rifles rather than a M4 or what have you This is a Game. The AR/Rifles in this game definitely did need nerfed due to the stupidly short TTK in the game. Comparing a real military use of a weapon to a game mechanic is absurd. All weapons should be niche weapons. I don't see why AR shouldn't be adaptable and useable all around? All FPS see AR use as their core/ most used weapons. No they should not. Not all weapons should be niche weapons. "War is not hell, far from it. War is beautiful. War is divine." - Grand Admiral Mekioth Sarum
Buster Friently Rosen Association 1960	Posted - 2014.03.07 00:40:00 - [29] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Buster Friently wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Atiim wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Theres a difference between being decent all around but overshadowed by niche weapons and having what was decent all around beaten with a stick so its crippled Rather than nerfing them over and over they should have buffed those niche weapons to make them truly more effective in their niches Im talking huge head shot bonuses on sniper rifles, back stab bonuses with knives, and so on -Hand The niche weapons (for the most part) were already effective in their niche. I could buff Mass Drivers to where the Breach would 1HK you, but that still wouldn't change the fact that my Combat Rifle would wipe half your squad in one clip now would it? I could buff Sniper Rifles to the point where the Tactical had the power of a Thale's, but that still wouldn't stop my Rail Rifle from being a Long Range Shotgun with the CQC effectiveness of an actual Shotgun now would it? The Rifles had to be nerfed. When you have a plentiful source of weapons and the only ones people use are four of them, you know there's a problem with your game. I can't believe I'm saying this, but CCP made the right swing with their nerfbat. You are talking straight power buffs while Im talking situational ones that are geared to a weapons niche, big difference there The rifles really really didnt need to be nerfed, hell the point of an assault rifle type weapon is to be widely used by an army since it can cover multiple roles well and let a soldier adapt to multiple situations without having to carry more gear/swap out gear all the time Your argument is like asking a real world army why they dont have more guys using pistols shotguns and sniper rifles rather than a M4 or what have you This is a Game. The AR/Rifles in this game definitely did need nerfed due to the stupidly short TTK in the game. Comparing a real military use of a weapon to a game mechanic is absurd. All weapons should be niche weapons. I don't see why AR shouldn't be adaptable and useable all around? All FPS see AR use as their core/ most used weapons. No they should not. Not all weapons should be niche weapons. It is impossible to balance a generalist weapon. Either it is too useful and makes pointless all the other weapons, or it isn't useful and is itself pointless. Yes, all weapons should be niche. That way some weapons dominate in some circumstances and others elsewhere. Thus we have the seed of tactics.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7947	Posted - 2014.03.07 00:44:00 - [30] - Quote Buster Friently wrote: It is impossible to balance a generalist weapon. Either it is too useful and makes pointless all the other weapons, or it isn't useful and is itself pointless. Yes, all weapons should be niche. That way some weapons dominate in some circumstances and others elsewhere. Thus we have the seed of tactics. We still have tactics and strategies in modern warfare and almost every soldier had access to, and or makes use of Assault Rifles. "War is not hell, far from it. War is beautiful. War is divine." - Grand Admiral Mekioth Sarum



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