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Poncho Polous
The Phoenix Federation Proficiency V.
38
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Posted - 2014.02.28 18:23:00 -
[31] - Quote
And then there's the players that made hundreds of files donating their starting ISK to their main file for hours on end. While it is a tedious process, there's definitely a good chunk of players that make some serious coin from doing it. But for some just taking 20-30 minutes a day before they get on is more than enough to pay for them to run proto suits all day in their pub matches.
CEO
> The Phoenix Federation
> We da BUSSS!! We takin over!
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Fraceska
Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation
501
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Posted - 2014.02.28 18:28:00 -
[32] - Quote
Poncho Polous wrote:I dont think anyone has a problem with players getting rich the right way by conserving and creating smart fittings, but when people are locking districts to farm more ISK than they could ever spend, it gets ridiculous.
Nyain San currently holds 61 districts, lets do some quick mental math here - 80 clones a day per district, 80 clones sell for 8.8M ISK, if all districts remain uncontested for one day that's 61 x 8.8M = 536,800,000 ISK for one days income. now do that for a few months and tell me your worried about losing your 5 or 10 proto suits in a match.
And though the fault is on CCP's hands for ever allowing this situation to take place in the first place, we are now left with a small fraction of the players in the game making so much money that they can just pay the top players to ring for them and make it nearly impossible to compete in any real way.
Even if they fix the way ISK made in the game, I still think it would take quite some time for the economy to balance back out of favor of those who have already pocketed their billions during this phase. I suppose I can only hope.
One Plex in a single day in the highest region for a Plex. In a F2P game. They need to adjust that immediately. |
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows
1788
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Posted - 2014.02.28 18:33:00 -
[33] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:I love how people cry that respecs damage the game when at will respecs would cause less damage than the PC mess has been causing for months now Classic While I do not endorse "at will respecs", I do agree with your assertion.
Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives
Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten
Closed Beta Bittervet Bomber
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Poncho Polous
The Phoenix Federation Proficiency V.
38
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Posted - 2014.02.28 18:45:00 -
[34] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:I love how people cry that respecs damage the game when at will respecs would cause less damage than the PC mess has been causing for months now Classic While I do not endorse "at will respecs", I do agree with your assertion.
I feel like those are two totally different subjects that do not effect each other in any way. I want fixed PC, and no at will respects, but because PC is messed up I wouldn't then just say screw it let people have respecs as well. One screw up is enough for me :)
CEO
> The Phoenix Federation
> We da BUSSS!! We takin over!
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Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
2995
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:00:00 -
[35] - Quote
The Robot Devil wrote:KatanaPT wrote:PC overly exploited (if you can still say its an exploit because its all made with CCP full knowledge) I am pretty sure lots of the forum posters cried that the clone packs were too expensive and I think CCP changed the price. I will have to check on that but if so then you can't blame CCP for the mess nearly as much.
Clone packs are still too expensive.
That is if you want to see PC active. It is VERY difficult to beat even an evenly matched team with a clone pack. It's also a reason why you won't see a massive attack on Renegade Alliance. It's too expensive.
Timers are the problem in PC, they allow for too much coordination before battles. 24-48 hours is too much time. The number of players actively participating in PC is very small. The number of players that determine victories is much smaller. The timers allow for these players to be called in for battles deemed important enough to hire ringers. It is MUCH cheaper to hire ringers than to capture a district using clone packs.
What is alarming is that the overall skill level in Dust is very, very low at the moment and it's only getting worse. Battles are filled with solo players making up at least 50% of each team. In the summer I thought we'd see a spike in activity in PC by this time because more and more players would have enough SP to specialize a role in full proto, but that hasn't been the case.
Some of the top corps fight in multiple PC battles everyday and they sync into FW battles together to continue honing their skills as a team. It's no accident that they are more rich and more skilled at the game.
ML Director
Eve Toon - Raylan Scott
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
11826
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:05:00 -
[36] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:I love how people cry that respecs damage the game when at will respecs would cause less damage than the PC mess has been causing for months now Classic While I do not endorse "at will respecs", I do agree with your assertion. Neither do I, I was simply illustrating my point.
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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Meknow Intaki
83
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:06:00 -
[37] - Quote
PC belongs to the 1% =ƒÿÆ |
Poncho Polous
The Phoenix Federation Proficiency V.
42
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:11:00 -
[38] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:The Robot Devil wrote:KatanaPT wrote:PC overly exploited (if you can still say its an exploit because its all made with CCP full knowledge) I am pretty sure lots of the forum posters cried that the clone packs were too expensive and I think CCP changed the price. I will have to check on that but if so then you can't blame CCP for the mess nearly as much. Clone packs are still too expensive. That is if you want to see PC active. It is VERY difficult to beat even an evenly matched team with a clone pack. It's also a reason why you won't see a massive attack on Renegade Alliance. It's too expensive. Timers are the problem in PC, they allow for too much coordination before battles. 24-48 hours is too much time. The number of players actively participating in PC is very small. The number of players that determine victories is much smaller. The timers allow for these players to be called in for battles deemed important enough to hire ringers. It is MUCH cheaper to hire ringers than to capture a district using clone packs. What is alarming is that the overall skill level in Dust is very, very low at the moment and it's only getting worse. Battles are filled with solo players making up at least 50% of each team. In the summer I thought we'd see a spike in activity in PC by this time because more and more players would have enough SP to specialize a role in full proto, but that hasn't been the case. Some of the top corps fight in multiple PC battles everyday and they sync into FW battles together to continue honing their skills as a team. It's no accident that they are more rich and more skilled at the game. Im not sure that its much cheaper to hire ringers, there are full teams are up into the several hundreds of millions to ring in one battle. But I think a large part in them being ''more skilled'' as a group then most corps is because theyr able to approach all the top players from other corps and offer them pay checks to leave and join their corp that none of the little guys could ever compete with. I'd have lost my top players as well to offers of 50+M a week just to play games in other corps, if not for us building a corp based around loyal players and people who have played together since they started, rather than going after who ever is richest at the time.
CEO
> The Phoenix Federation
> We da BUSSS!! We takin over!
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Alabastor 'TheBlaster' Alcar
Silver Bullet Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
386
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:21:00 -
[39] - Quote
HERES TO THE REDISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH!! +10
LETS GET PC FARMING FIXED AND REDISTRIBUTE ALL THE ISK THAT HAS BEEN FARMED, FREE ISK FOR EVERYONE NOT INVOLVED IN PC |
BMSTUBBY
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
653
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:23:00 -
[40] - Quote
CCP said that the BPO's are what have caused such a difference, hence the reason why they took em away.
They also said that we where getting a rollover SP system so meh, what do they know.
Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514
Working as intended.
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Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
2995
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:33:00 -
[41] - Quote
Poncho Polous wrote:Thor Odinson42 wrote:The Robot Devil wrote:KatanaPT wrote:PC overly exploited (if you can still say its an exploit because its all made with CCP full knowledge) I am pretty sure lots of the forum posters cried that the clone packs were too expensive and I think CCP changed the price. I will have to check on that but if so then you can't blame CCP for the mess nearly as much. Clone packs are still too expensive. That is if you want to see PC active. It is VERY difficult to beat even an evenly matched team with a clone pack. It's also a reason why you won't see a massive attack on Renegade Alliance. It's too expensive. Timers are the problem in PC, they allow for too much coordination before battles. 24-48 hours is too much time. The number of players actively participating in PC is very small. The number of players that determine victories is much smaller. The timers allow for these players to be called in for battles deemed important enough to hire ringers. It is MUCH cheaper to hire ringers than to capture a district using clone packs. What is alarming is that the overall skill level in Dust is very, very low at the moment and it's only getting worse. Battles are filled with solo players making up at least 50% of each team. In the summer I thought we'd see a spike in activity in PC by this time because more and more players would have enough SP to specialize a role in full proto, but that hasn't been the case. Some of the top corps fight in multiple PC battles everyday and they sync into FW battles together to continue honing their skills as a team. It's no accident that they are more rich and more skilled at the game. Im not sure that its much cheaper to hire ringers, there are full teams are up into the several hundreds of millions to ring in one battle. But I think a large part in them being ''more skilled'' as a group then most corps is because theyr able to approach all the top players from other corps and offer them pay checks to leave and join their corp that none of the little guys could ever compete with. I'd have lost my top players as well to offers of 50+M a week just to play games in other corps, if not for us building a corp based around loyal players and people who have played together since they started, rather than going after who ever is richest at the time.
You can find full teams of some rockstar players for 40 mil. It would take 3-5 clone packs minimum to take a district from a competent corp, that's up to 180 million. Again why buying a district is better than trying to take one.
ML Director
Eve Toon - Raylan Scott
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CLONE117
True Pros Forever
702
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Posted - 2014.02.28 19:39:00 -
[42] - Quote
a few million made from never running proto is nothing compared to owning most of pc area and making billions a day. and running proto all day long at the same time. |
Meknow Intaki
85
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Posted - 2014.02.28 20:40:00 -
[43] - Quote
Even if they made it harder for all these ultra rich corps to come up to hi sec space and proto stomp us. Almost feels like a little burn Jitta every day =ƒÿÉ |
abarkrishna
WarRavens
319
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Posted - 2014.02.28 21:13:00 -
[44] - Quote
Because CCP gave me 100 million isk when 1.7 came out. And over 300 when Dust went live. Uprising 1.0
That and being stingy with my wallet.
No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2.
When will they learn!
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Skihids
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
2944
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Posted - 2014.02.28 21:14:00 -
[45] - Quote
Allowing a few to become billionaires and throw proto gear around like it was militia for months makes me question CCP's will to make this economy work. Meanwhile they fret about the virtual "losses" they incur as a result of selling BPOs for real money. Losses that are as real as those claimed by recording companies for illegal downloads.
It's things like this that temper any enthusiasm I get thinking about the next "evolution" of DUST. |
Alaika Arbosa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows
1790
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Posted - 2014.02.28 21:40:00 -
[46] - Quote
Poncho Polous wrote:Alaika Arbosa wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:I love how people cry that respecs damage the game when at will respecs would cause less damage than the PC mess has been causing for months now Classic While I do not endorse "at will respecs", I do agree with your assertion. I feel like those are two totally different subjects that do not effect each other in any way. I want fixed PC, and no at will respects, but because PC is messed up I wouldn't then just say screw it let people have respecs as well. One screw up is enough for me :) You miss my point.
Personally, I think "at will respecs" would **** this game right in the *******, no lube, no warning.
Now, having stated that, IMHO, PC has done/will do far more damage than "at will respecs" could ever hope to and it is being allowed to continue.
CCP needs to just pull the plug on PC and reclaim all wealth (asset or liquid) that can be traced back to PC. If those who lose Isk wish to leave over that, let them. We'll lose much less of the playerbase by them leaving than we would if the current situation is allowed to continue much longer.
Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives
Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten
Closed Beta Bittervet Bomber
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Leadfoot10
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
561
|
Posted - 2014.02.28 21:42:00 -
[47] - Quote
Meknow Intaki wrote:I was playing some games the other night and half the people I was playing with we're filthy rich going full proto every round well the other half could barly run basic?!
Did something go wrong along the way or is this how CCP planed it?!
Billionaires Vs. The Poor
Grind for a half a year in starter / BPO suits, and you too can be rich.
Not only will it give you a huge pile of ISK to play with, at the end your skils will have advanced enough such that you don't die nearly as much....but your KDR will suffer in the interim. |
Leadfoot10
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
562
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Posted - 2014.02.28 21:49:00 -
[48] - Quote
CLONE117 wrote:a few million made from never running proto is nothing compared to owning most of pc area and making billions a day. and running proto all day long at the same time.
Your numbers, and the impact they have on the few that benefit as a result, are WAY off.
The (very few) people making all the money via PC farming were already rich to begin with, and the "billions a day" is just wrong.
That doesn't change the fact that farming is going on, and people are profiting from it, but to blame proto stomping on PC farming is a mistake, IMO.
The real culprit? Skill and equipment refunds.
Respecfully...Leadfoot |
Turtle Hermit Roshi
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
192
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Posted - 2014.02.28 21:58:00 -
[49] - Quote
Meknow Intaki wrote:I was playing some games the other night and half the people I was playing with we're filthy rich going full proto every round well the other half could barly run basic?!
Did something go wrong along the way or is this how CCP planed it?!
Billionaires Vs. The Poor
lol its call economic diversity
for some to be rich many must be poor
Anything worth fighting for is worth fighting dirty for,
welcome to New Eden
-ill b there SoonGäó
KAMEHAMEHA TANK KILLA
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Rynoceros
Rise Of Old Dudes
2907
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:11:00 -
[50] - Quote
Most of the long-term (Closed Beta) players have BPOs and ran those for months (when it was extremely feasible to survive and dominate with STD fittings) saving up millions of ISK. Uprising 1.0 bought out all of our Market gear for ridiculously high profits. Shortly afterward, there was a glitch that awarded several millions of ISK to players, which CCP admitted was a mistake and asked players not to spend it. The smart ones smelled weakness, spent every dime and got to keep everything they had bought when the inappropriately allocated ISK was removed from all accounts. Then came Planetary Lock Club. Which was recent enough for everybody to see how awesome that is.
I GÖú Kittens.
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Alternate Insano
SUICIDE SPITE SQUAD
200
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:22:00 -
[51] - Quote
The corps that exploit PC spend money on the game. Basically every flaw this game can be traced back to that. Pay players on a free game always play at the expense of the free to lose players. Look at DCUO, another example of a free to lose game. Subscription players used a mail glitch to destroy the game's economy, and players take group loot they can't use away from players that could use it just they can sell it in the market. The result is a free player cannot advance without opening their wallet. The DC devs love this arrangement. What we have here is very similar. It is funding the game, i.e. supplying a buch of devs with a pay check for screwing the rest of the playerbase.
DUST 514 Super Scrub
Level 262 Forum Troll
Play, or play not. There is no balance.
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ReGnYuM
Escrow Removal and Acquisition
2329
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:29:00 -
[52] - Quote
@ The angry mob ready to witchhunt PC players
Is the general anger here because PC Corporations are able to PubStomp in full Proto Gear, and because you run pubs, you're unable to afford Proto 24/7?
Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset
I Slay, for thy Empress
Do you even PC... Brah
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Meeko Fent
Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State
1822
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:31:00 -
[53] - Quote
Hecarim Van Hohen wrote:Poor stay poor either by choice (giving money away mostly) or because they don't know how to manage their wallet Rich stay rich because they don't give their money away and know how to manage their wallet Adn because PC.
Mostly PC. Proto is unsustainable with normal Pub payouts, adn PC matches have nigh ended, oh so I have heard. And since they can farm millions if ISK from the districks, and the corp can't spend it on anything, they just hand it out to the Corp members.
Districts would be better if they renamed then ISK Printers.
Looking for a Interesting Character Name?
Why Not Zoidberg?
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Fraceska
Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation
509
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:32:00 -
[54] - Quote
It is the exploitation of a glitch that concerns me when they are able to take a F2P game and turn it into a game that most of 500,000 people on Eve pay for. That is where I draw the line. Pubstomping would stop if you linked match making to meta levels, the only way to eliminate all factors of gear and bring it back to just skill of those involved. Want to run proto join the proto match making, same for adv/std/militia lower rewards for the lower tiers. Everyone wins. |
Fraceska
Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation
509
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:34:00 -
[55] - Quote
For your playing the game for competition and fun then you would be in support of a split in the tier/meta system. If you're in it for the lulz and want a quick victory then of course you would be opposed to anything that diminishes the chance of an even fight once gear is made equal to all others in the match. |
Ronan Elsword
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
195
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:36:00 -
[56] - Quote
The fact that CCP hasn't halted all PC income and locked all districts until the problem is fixed is just another reason to lose confidence in CCP.
"War doesn't determine who is right, only who is left."
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Fraceska
Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation
509
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:37:00 -
[57] - Quote
Ronan Elsword wrote:The fact that CCP hasn't halted all PC income and locked all districts until the problem is fixed is just another sign of how few fluxes they give.
As I said it's BoB all over again. |
ReGnYuM
Escrow Removal and Acquisition
2330
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:42:00 -
[58] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:@ The angry mob ready to witchhunt PC players
Is the general anger here because PC Corporations are able to PubStomp in full Proto Gear, and because you run pubs, you're unable to afford Proto 24/7?
Guess its a really hard question
Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset
I Slay, for thy Empress
Do you even PC... Brah
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Fraceska
Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation
509
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:44:00 -
[59] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:@ The angry mob ready to witchhunt PC players
Is the general anger here because PC Corporations are able to PubStomp in full Proto Gear, and because you run pubs, you're unable to afford Proto 24/7? Guess its a really hard question
Pretty sure I answered your question in both of my posts. Would you run full pro if the system only put you in matches were the other team was going to run full pro? You are playing this for a fair competition right, a game of skill with friends? Or do you do it for the lulz and not care for the overall experience. Seems pretty straight forward to answer. |
emtbraincase
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
62
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Posted - 2014.02.28 22:47:00 -
[60] - Quote
3 pages in and we still haven't figured out this question has a 2 letter answer.....PC
you're welcome.
P.S. yes it was brought up, but why isn't there a general consensus that this is true. Almost all uuber-rich are farming, or been forever in, PC. Never saw someone with a billion isk any other way. |
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