DUST Search - Blue tag for shotgun buff in 1.8?

Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:

i think operation should give it a boost to RoF, so at Op V, you have chromosome level RoF at the least. Also, range needs to be increased to chromosome levels, and damage on ADV and PRO shotguns needs to be upped, as well as proficiency being changed to 3% damage.

I disagree with pellet increase per level, as i think it would create hit detection problems, so i would prefer the shotguns at ADV and PRO level to receive an increase in damage per pellet so that it is equivalent to +3 pellets at ADV, and +5 at PRO. In other words,

ADV dpp=42
42x3=126 damage bonus to ADV shotguns
PRO dpp=44
44x 5=220 damage bonus to PRO shotguns

i believe there are 12 pellets total to be fired, so 126/12=10.5 damage increase per pellet on ADV shotgun, 220/12=18.3 damage increase per pellet, for a total of 52.5 and 62.3 damage per pellet respectively, this number will probably need to be reduced in light of upcoming rifle nerds that are occurring

So, to conclude, fixing the shotgun involves
-changing operation skill to a 5% bonus to RoF
-changing proficiency skill to 3% bonus to damage
-increasing damage stats on ADV and PRO shotguns by 10.5 and 18.3 respectively, (and scaling the breach shotgun to match)
-increasing the range to chromosome levels
-OPTIONAL:change sound, I believe the new sound may have something to do with shoddy hit detection

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Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 912	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:03:00 - [1] - Quote Can any dev please say the shotgun will get some sort of buff in 1.8? I would really liketo see a +1~2 meter increase to optimal range as well as a change to pellets 10 pellets by default Operations skill: +1 pellet per shot per level TBH a spread reduction makes no sense for a shotgun skill and instead ADS should reduce spread.
Bormir1r WarRavens League of Infamy 47	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:04:00 - [2] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Can any dev please say the shotgun will get some sort of buff in 1.8? I would really liketo see a +1~2 meter increase to optimal range as well as a change to pellets 10 pellets by default Operations skill: +1 pellet per shot per level TBH a spread reduction makes no sense for a shotgun skill and instead ADS should reduce spread. Completely Agree Minja. We run and hide. And then we kill you.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4127	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:13:00 - [3] - Quote I think they're fine. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 912	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:17:00 - [4] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure
Lightning xVx R 0 N 1 N 374	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:26:00 - [5] - Quote Let's be real honest about the "Chromosome Shotgun" vs. "Uprising Shotgun", in Chromosome the shotgun was FAR SUPERIOR then what we have now. The Spread was controlled, powerful and fair. (IMO) It also had a buff on range too which also gave it a fair advantage against some of the other OP weapons of the time. It shot faster, reloaded faster, Hit Detection (was decent as well), had a sweeter sound (crank like sound) and was just a nasty weapon to run with. By far my favorite iteration of the shotgun. Now the "Uprising Shotgun" while said to "improve" the Shotgun of Chromosome, was just a complete disaster especially for a FAIR AMOUNT of updates. The Hit Detection was HORRENDOUS, the weapon had reload glitches (while reloading you are locked into a freeze animation), Range was nerfed IMMENSELY, sound was gone and for some reason the shots felt different.....like for some reason they felt "Cone-Like" as opposed to Chromosomes was more "Funneled". Idk, call me weird but I have been using it religiously since Closed Beta and it never has felt the same since then.
Beck Weathers Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 448	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:31:00 - [6] - Quote I think they just need a big range buff, tho more pellets with a wider spread to hit those pesky QCQ strafers would be nice... I feel like i have to have them dead center of the circle to get any damage on them.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4127	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:36:00 - [7] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure Well, my advanced Shotgun can two shot just about every single medium suit and three-four shot heavies. I think that's pretty good. If I add a complex damage mod I get a lot more one shot kills. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
2100 Angels The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 316	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:45:00 - [8] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Dexter307 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure Well, my advanced Shotgun can two shot just about every single medium suit and three-four shot heavies. I think that's pretty good. If I add a complex damage mod I get a lot more one shot kills. 3-4 shots is good? mmm... have to disagree there. I think 3 at the absolute outside on a fully tanked suit is acceptable, with the majority of heavies being 2 shots
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 916	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:46:00 - [9] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Dexter307 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure Well, my advanced Shotgun can two shot just about every single medium suit and three-four shot heavies. I think that's pretty good. If I add a complex damage mod I get a lot more one shot kills. Quite alot of proto suits take 3 shots to kill Against heavies 3 shots is ok but mediums should never take more than 2. Thats why i think 15 pellets would work as ~600 damage would 1-2 shot mediums while heavies would take 2-4 shots depending on how tanked the heavy is (3-4 most of the time)
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p TRA1LBLAZERS 534	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:48:00 - [10] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure and that right there is the problem Kills- Archduke Ferdinand Balance!

zDemoncake Horizons' Edge 58	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:53:00 - [11] - Quote I personally have no issue with shotguns. Using them or having them used against me. With a standard shotgun I get by pretty well. The CRG-3 is a weapon I rarely bring out. I have never suffered from someone turning around and killing me (I've done it to other people) or the "bad hit detection" it has. I will admit that my shots have only not registered against a min.scout, but that was a one time thing for me since uprising. CEO of Horizons' Edge mercenary division *My soul, your beats!* Enemy to many; equal to none.
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p TRA1LBLAZERS 534	Posted - 2014.02.13 03:59:00 - [12] - Quote i think operation should give it a boost to RoF, so at Op V, you have chromosome level RoF at the least. Also, range needs to be increased to chromosome levels, and damage on ADV and PRO shotguns needs to be upped, as well as proficiency being changed to 3% damage. I disagree with pellet increase per level, as i think it would create hit detection problems, so i would prefer the shotguns at ADV and PRO level to receive an increase in damage per pellet so that it is equivalent to +3 pellets at ADV, and +5 at PRO. In other words, ADV dpp=42 42x3=126 damage bonus to ADV shotguns PRO dpp=44 44x 5=220 damage bonus to PRO shotguns i believe there are 12 pellets total to be fired, so 126/12=10.5 damage increase per pellet on ADV shotgun, 220/12=18.3 damage increase per pellet, for a total of 52.5 and 62.3 damage per pellet respectively, this number will probably need to be reduced in light of upcoming rifle nerds that are occurring So, to conclude, fixing the shotgun involves -changing operation skill to a 5% bonus to RoF -changing proficiency skill to 3% bonus to damage -increasing damage stats on ADV and PRO shotguns by 10.5 and 18.3 respectively, (and scaling the breach shotgun to match) -increasing the range to chromosome levels -OPTIONAL:change sound, I believe the new sound may have something to do with shoddy hit detection Kills- Archduke Ferdinand Balance!
Hoover Damn H.A.R.V.E.S.T. Legacy Rising 42	Posted - 2014.02.13 04:06:00 - [13] - Quote It seems pretty short-ranged, even for something as fast-diffusing as a plasma blastgun.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 916	Posted - 2014.02.13 04:08:00 - [14] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: i think operation should give it a boost to RoF, so at Op V, you have chromosome level RoF at the least. Also, range needs to be increased to chromosome levels, and damage on ADV and PRO shotguns needs to be upped, as well as proficiency being changed to 3% damage. I disagree with pellet increase per level, as i think it would create hit detection problems, so i would prefer the shotguns at ADV and PRO level to receive an increase in damage per pellet so that it is equivalent to +3 pellets at ADV, and +5 at PRO. In other words, ADV dpp=42 42x3=126 damage bonus to ADV shotguns PRO dpp=44 44x 5=220 damage bonus to PRO shotguns i believe there are 12 pellets total to be fired, so 126/12=10.5 damage increase per pellet on ADV shotgun, 220/12=18.3 damage increase per pellet, for a total of 52.5 and 62.3 damage per pellet respectively, this number will probably need to be reduced in light of upcoming rifle nerds that are occurring So, to conclude, fixing the shotgun involves -changing operation skill to a 5% bonus to RoF -changing proficiency skill to 3% bonus to damage -increasing damage stats on ADV and PRO shotguns by 10.5 and 18.3 respectively, (and scaling the breach shotgun to match) -increasing the range to chromosome levels -OPTIONAL:change sound, I believe the new sound may have something to do with shoddy hit detection I would be more than OK with this as well
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p TRA1LBLAZERS 535	Posted - 2014.02.13 04:15:00 - [15] - Quote what really irks me is how much of a sharpshooter in CQC you have to be because of reduced spread, whereas even the RR is more effective, because at the range that the SG is effective, the littlest movement completely throws ones aim off, and heavily aim assisted weapons like rifles have a huge advantage with spraying far better than a shotgun, as well as enhanced hit detection for rifles as well Kills- Archduke Ferdinand Balance!
Tectonic Fusion 1049	Posted - 2014.02.13 05:00:00 - [16] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: what really irks me is how much of a sharpshooter in CQC you have to be because of reduced spread, whereas even the RR is more effective, because at the range that the SG is effective, the littlest movement completely throws ones aim off, and heavily aim assisted weapons like rifles have a huge advantage with spraying far better than a shotgun, as well as enhanced hit detection for rifles as well I'm good with it (DS3 controller). Aim assist really messes me up 90% of the time, but if you don't have it on, you are at a disadvantage against rifle users. It just needs a 2-5m range buff and a better skill if people are having problems with it. Solo Player Squad status: Locked
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES Legacy Rising 618	Posted - 2014.02.13 05:10:00 - [17] - Quote The shotgun really needs a buff. I also believe the reduced spread is a totally random bonus to have. Also I am not a huge fan of the RoF increase for proficency. The shot gun needs more range for sure. It needs a little better hit detection but mainly it does not scale well as you go from shooting militia suits and standard suits up to protos. I have put 2-3 rounds in a heavy / proto logis back before and he just casually walks away in armor. Thats crazy to be honest. Not only that, if someone does see me coming with the shot gun they just backpedal and they are totally out of harms way. Shotgun needs some reworking along with some REAL buffs. Chromosome shotgun was awesome. I miss that build so soo much please dont bring it up :( (scouts were wicked in chrome, KB/M controls were nice and very acceptable in chrome, there was no aim assist in chrome....ahhh chrome was so much better IMO)
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES Legacy Rising 618	Posted - 2014.02.13 05:12:00 - [18] - Quote Tectonic Fusion wrote: Aim assist really messes me up 90% of the time, but if you don't have it on, you are at a disadvantage against rifle users. This! Now just imagine how KB/M players feel. We are generally at a disadvantage all the time. AA makes me work extra hard for my kills while idiots that dont even barely aim get lock on mechanisms.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 922	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:17:00 - [19] - Quote Bump
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 380	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:47:00 - [20] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Agreed ... don't they realise that any buff would make them OP and the flood of QQ's that follows would be massive because it would become the WOTM. Future Caldari Heavy so watch out for this Sumo Shinobi with a Caldari HMG .

Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 922	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:52:00 - [21] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Agreed ... don't they realise that any buff would make them OP and the flood of QQ's that follows would be massive because it would become the WOTM. QQ that it could compete with other guns? That's a good thing, the current shotguns are by no means competitive unless your fighting militia and standard suit, and even then a lot of other guns would do its job better At the very least it should be buffed to chromosome level
Sam Tektzby Better Hide R Die 139	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:55:00 - [22] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Agreed ... don't they realise that any buff would make them OP and the flood of QQ's that follows would be massive because it would become the WOTM. QQ that it could compete with other guns? That's a good thing, the current shotguns are by no means competitive unless your fighting militia and standard suit, and even then a lot of other guns would do its job better At the very least it should be buffed to chromosome level Honestly in hands of recon boyo its basicaly running tool of death. Support - Tactician/Support Deteis - Orator
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 923	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:59:00 - [23] - Quote Sam Tektzby wrote: Dexter307 wrote: Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Agreed ... don't they realise that any buff would make them OP and the flood of QQ's that follows would be massive because it would become the WOTM. QQ that it could compete with other guns? That's a good thing, the current shotguns are by no means competitive unless your fighting militia and standard suit, and even then a lot of other guns would do its job better At the very least it should be buffed to chromosome level Honestly in hands of recon boyo its basicaly running tool of death. You could do the same with any of the rifles or even a SMG/scrambler pistol though The shotgun dosent have a competitive place, especially after it's huge nerf in uprising
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 380	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:00:00 - [24] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Dexter307 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure Well, my advanced Shotgun can two shot just about every single medium suit and three-four shot heavies. I think that's pretty good. If I add a complex damage mod I get a lot more one shot kills. And this is how it's suppose to be . Pro suits have just as much HP's as a heavy in most cases and three shots atleast should be required for a heavy ... anything less is just greed and would defeat the purpose and role of a heavy suit. This is what I mean about people not wanting to work and their attempts at making their weapons of choice instakill weapons . If in 1.8 damage is being reduced then it's safe to say that the shotgun won't get a buff and probably won't get touched still making it the CQC beast that it is . Hit detection is a totally separate issue that MOST weapons suffer from. Future Caldari Heavy so watch out for this Sumo Shinobi with a Caldari HMG .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 380	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:04:00 - [25] - Quote Why would or should a shotgun be able to compete with a rifle ? That's totally not it's intended role. Future Caldari Heavy so watch out for this Sumo Shinobi with a Caldari HMG .
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 923	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:04:00 - [26] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Dexter307 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think they're fine. Against militia and standard suit sure Well, my advanced Shotgun can two shot just about every single medium suit and three-four shot heavies. I think that's pretty good. If I add a complex damage mod I get a lot more one shot kills. And this is how it's suppose to be . Pro suits have just as much HP's as a heavy in most cases and three shots atleast should be required for a heavy ... anything less is just greed and would defeat the purpose and role of a heavy suit. This is what I mean about people not wanting to work and their attempts at making their weapons of choice instakill weapons . If in 1.8 damage is being reduced then it's safe to say that the shotgun won't get a buff and probably won't get touched still making it the CQC beast that it is . Hit detection is a totally separate issue that MOST weapons suffer from. I never have problems with hit detection The problem I have is the range is so short it's easy to back out of its range and that advanced and proto suits can tank three shots which is unfair since the shotguns ROF is the same as most pump shotguns in other games
PARKOUR PRACTIONER Reapers' Assailant 635	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:05:00 - [27] - Quote I can three to four shot a heavy no matter how stacked, two hits if I get the head. I use militia and it holds it down real well. Psycho "Never argue with an idiot. They will only pull you down to their level, and then beat you with experience"
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 923	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:05:00 - [28] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: Why would or should a shotgun be able to compete with a rifle ? That's totally not it's intended role. I mean in terms of being a useful weapon in its role, not in terms of range
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 923	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:09:00 - [29] - Quote PARKOUR PRACTIONER wrote: I can three to four shot a heavy no matter how stacked, two hits if I get the head. I use militia and it holds it down real well. Heavys are fine, but proto and advanced suits should not take three shots while being able to walk out of your range Making the shotguns shoot 15 pellets would make mediums die In 2 shots when tanked, while heavys in 1.8 would still take 3-4
Zcynx Rivera S.e.V.e.N. General Tso's Alliance 16	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:56:00 - [30] - Quote I've been using shotguns since beta and the only three problems I find them to have is: - Spread - Range - Hit detection A shotgun should never have a lower spread. It makes no sense and is just a last minute bonus in my opinion. Shotgunners depend on this spread, specially at medium range. As for what should replace this bonus, I think range sounds fine. The point of leveling up a weapon is to improve what it already does, NOT reduce its effectiveness. When it comes to range, it should be improved. Why? Because a shotgun is supposed to kill you at CQC, not tickle like it is doing now. We literally need the enemy in our face to be able to have any sort of effect. If I need to have them this close then, why would I go shotgun when Nova knives would be so much more effective and are balanced properly in my opinion? Now this is where the bonus replacement should be debated. By eliminating the spread reduction and adding an increase to RoF, it will surely make a whole lot of more sense and it should take care of that problem. As for our good friend, hit detection, it would be wise to take a second look at this. It has been improved compared to previous patches (and yes I'm referring to the patch we couldn't hit ppl that were sitting still), but it still an issue. I have had several encounters where the enemy is able to regenerate shields, reload, etc. and I'm still praying for the shot to be registered. Overall, I do believe we are almost there with this gun. Is a matter of adding a bit more time to it. I have used it since beta and never changed to any other weapon, simply because is my style and it is a fun weapon to use. It is not meant to compete with any gun, because it is in its own tier. This does not mean it should be in the conditions it is now.



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