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Maniak Madness
Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives
1
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Posted - 2014.01.22 03:40:00 -
[61] - Quote
The Issue isnt the tanks or the tank mechanics, Ill try to sum it up in the most simple way I can.
CCP rushed the vehicle release because everyone was QQing about the repeated push back dates, so all they were able to do was release Militia and Standard tanks. Now to compensate for this they nerfed all forms of AV so that Tanks stood a chance. So now Militia tanks and Standard tanks are being flooded because they are cheap, and powerfull. However once Advanced and Proto tanks are released CCP will buff AV to deal with the higher quality of Tanks available. Once that happens you'll find that cheaper tanks will pop easily to the buffed AV, However Advanced and Proto Tanks will remain roughly the same difficultly to pop as it is now except they will be:
A: Expensive
B: Require a substantial amount of SP to be used
This will stop tank spam as not everyone will have the SP and/or afford these higher quality Tanks. To sum it up this problem will only be solved by releasing higher tier tanks. |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
124
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Posted - 2014.01.22 03:43:00 -
[62] - Quote
Maniak Madness wrote:The Issue isnt the tanks or the tank mechanics, Ill try to sum it up in the most simple way I can.
CCP rushed the vehicle release because everyone was QQing about the repeated push back dates, so all they were able to do was release Militia and Standard tanks. Now to compensate for this they nerfed all forms of AV so that Tanks stood a chance. So now Militia tanks and Standard tanks are being flooded because they are cheap, and powerfull. However once Advanced and Proto tanks are released CCP will buff AV to deal with the higher quality of Tanks available. Once that happens you'll find that cheaper tanks will pop easily to the buffed AV, However Advanced and Proto Tanks will remain roughly the same difficultly to pop as it is now except they will be:
A: Expensive
B: Require a substantial amount of SP to be used
This will stop tank spam as not everyone will have the SP and/or afford these higher quality Tanks. To sum it up this problem will only be solved by releasing higher tier tanks.
The current STD tanks are stronger than any 1.6 tanks however (unless using glitched reppers), and AV was nerved to account for that.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Charlotte O'Dell
Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention
1720
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Posted - 2014.01.22 04:29:00 -
[63] - Quote
Nothing Certain wrote:I think one problem is that we allowed tankers to convince us that tanks being OP is the way it should be. They count as one character, one entity, on the field yet if we take a militia tank, no modules and compare it to drop suits what do we see? A tank can one shot anybody, a forge gun takes 3 or 4 shots to kill a tank. Sprint speed is around 7 meters a second, tank speed is 5 times that, drop suits can be killed by small arms, tanks are immune to small arms, if a suit jumps on a tank it is funny, if a tank runs over a suit it is dead, suits can only change suits at supply depots, tanks can be recalled or called at any time, when a suit is in the verge of death, they die, a tanker can jump out and fight as a suit do is essentially playing as two characters. Forget about hardeners and Speed boosts, tanks are OP. The funny thing is that we are willing to accept it, until they broke the camel's back.
Tankers, even though they are only one character, think they should be entitled to all these advantages. I'm actually OK with it, just don't insult our intelligence saying tanks are balanced or that this is even the goal.
well, if they cost an ungodly amount of isk and SP, then itd be balanced but they dont and that's my problem with most of it...well, part of it. theyre jacked up still. wont lie.
Charlotte O'Dell is the highest level unicorn!
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Darken-Soul
Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire
83
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Posted - 2014.01.22 05:28:00 -
[64] - Quote
Maniak Madness wrote:The Issue isnt the tanks or the tank mechanics, Ill try to sum it up in the most simple way I can.
CCP rushed the vehicle release because everyone was QQing about the repeated push back dates, so all they were able to do was release Militia and Standard tanks. Now to compensate for this they nerfed all forms of AV so that Tanks stood a chance. So now Militia tanks and Standard tanks are being flooded because they are cheap, and powerfull. However once Advanced and Proto tanks are released CCP will buff AV to deal with the higher quality of Tanks available. Once that happens you'll find that cheaper tanks will pop easily to the buffed AV, However Advanced and Proto Tanks will remain roughly the same difficultly to pop as it is now except they will be:
A: Expensive
B: Require a substantial amount of SP to be used
This will stop tank spam as not everyone will have the SP and/or afford these higher quality Tanks. To sum it up this problem will only be solved by releasing higher tier tanks.
maybe a long time down the road. Last time tanks were this bad they got a Nerf hammer for the better part of a year.
I am the real Darken
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star. EoN.
2268
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Posted - 2014.01.22 16:21:00 -
[65] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:
Its not been invalidated at all
The CPU needed is pathetic, a tank could easily fit it as a small turret
Also the PLC fires a ball of plasma, not a projectile at high speed, its more like an RPG of sorts which doesnt need a powerful dropsuit to operate it because the suit and weapon are not joined together, essentially you could improve the ammunition to make it more powerful but as a consequence recoil could be alot stronger and also it may hinder movement and reload speeds like the Breach FG does with limited movement due to the high damage output and long spool up time
The railgun is a electrically powered electromagnetic projectile launcher in which a pair of parallel conducting rails, along which a sliding armature is accelerated by the electromagnetic effects of a current that flows down one rail, into the armature and then back along the other rail - This alone requires vasts amounts of PG but also accelerates the projectile alot quicker than the plasma cannon does and with it increases the damage output and distance it can travel, increase the size of the railgun it increases the amount of PG needed and also increases the damage and range output hence why the FG has half the range and reduced damage and requires a heavy suit to use
Would you like to know more?
I would simply like a summary of your main points so that i may continue to refute them. So far, the information that I have gleaned from your post about why a railgun should be exponentially better than any other anti vehicle weapon in the game isGǪ 1. Plasma Cannon CPU usage is very low, allowing it to be fitted as a small turret (please report back to me the CPU usage of the prototype non-specialist cannon, as I am certain that if you attempted to fit one or more of these on a tank as well as modules, you would be sorely disappointed) 2.The plasma fired from a plasma cannon does not move as fast as the railgun shell, so because of this, the plasma cannon shot, which has much more kinetic molecular energy, and is compressed inside of a magnetic field, causing increased pressure should be less efficient, where in reality, a railgun shot is useful for destroying tanks because it moves so fast that it pierces the tank shell and destroys the interior electronic and mechanical engineering. A mass of plasma that is being compressed should be incredibly potent due to its potential and kinetic-molecular energy, and would therefore completely obliterate any entity within the blast's proximity, if the mass/heat/pressure of the plasma were high enough. I know what I am talking about in this field, so please don't try to bluster your way through. 3. The railgun is a railgun, made with what is known in this game as rail technology, and has less than a second of charge time, so it should be better than an anti vehicle weapon with a 4+ second charge time that uses rail technology. 4.Self created conceptions about the game>Actual weapon descriptions and real life physics>AV/ tank balance Please correct me if i misconceived any of these points, or if you have additional points to offer.
PLC fits on a gunlogi fine
The plasma round tho still has to be safe and stable for infantry to carry and use, cant have it melting through the launcher and the suit
Railgun is a railgun - Its a 80gj railgun tbh, small turrets are 20gj and FG could be around 40-60gj but with massive drawbacks
4. lol your doing the same thing
Intelligence is OP
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
132
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Posted - 2014.01.22 20:00:00 -
[66] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:
PLC fits on a gunlogi fine
The plasma round tho still has to be safe and stable for infantry to carry and use, cant have it melting through the launcher and the suit
Railgun is a railgun - Its a 80gj railgun tbh, small turrets are 20gj and FG could be around 40-60gj but with massive drawbacks
4. lol your doing the same thing
Yes it may fit on a gunlogi, but try fitting modules as well (such as triple complex damage mods), and you may find a problem will arise that doesn't when trying to fit a railgun.
The railgun has to be safe for the tank, and with its current power, the equal and opposite force must be applied, so by this logic that real life physics should apply to a video game, which it doesn't in this video game, by firing a railgun that produces more power than a compressed mass of plasma, the force should theoretically destroy the tank where the turret was mounted. In real life, rail guns can only be fired for about 3 shots on average or so (from my most recent knowledge) before they wear out, therefore, the tank should take damage from shooting the railgun, and after a few shots should be unable to fire any longer. Please discontinue this physics argument, as it is inapplicable to a video game that does not follow real life physics.
By this logic, that the small turrets have no drawbacks but the forge gun at 40gj does, the large railgun should have twice the charge time of the forge gun, and the small turrets one half the charge time.
No actually Im not. Im attempting to stoop to your level in order to enlighten you about why you are wrong in order for both of us to come to a common consensus.
That is all. Please respond, I am enjoying this.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
210
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:49:00 -
[67] - Quote
Wow just off of these posts i think i got 74 likes. Thanks forum community!
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Our Deepest Regret
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
491
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:47:00 -
[68] - Quote
Personally, I think if you limited the ability to summon vehicles to players with a 1,000,000 SP minimum investment, it would solve a lot of the militia spam that's strangled the fun out of pub games. |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
214
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:49:00 -
[69] - Quote
Our Deepest Regret wrote:Personally, I think if you limited the ability to summon vehicles to players with a 1,000,000 SP minimum investment, it would solve a lot of the militia spam that's strangled the fun out of pub games.
The problem with that is that new players can't skill into tanks, leading it to be taken up by only the elite veterans, which is something CCP should stay away from. I think weakening all MLT and STD variants even more than ADV and PRO types would lead to equality
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Our Deepest Regret
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
491
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:50:00 -
[70] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Our Deepest Regret wrote:Personally, I think if you limited the ability to summon vehicles to players with a 1,000,000 SP minimum investment, it would solve a lot of the militia spam that's strangled the fun out of pub games. The problem with that is that new players can't skill into tanks, leading it to be taken up by only the elite veterans, which is something CCP should stay away from. I think weakening all MLT and STD variants even more than ADV and PRO types would lead to equality
Good point. |
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
214
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:56:00 -
[71] - Quote
Our Deepest Regret wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Our Deepest Regret wrote:Personally, I think if you limited the ability to summon vehicles to players with a 1,000,000 SP minimum investment, it would solve a lot of the militia spam that's strangled the fun out of pub games. The problem with that is that new players can't skill into tanks, leading it to be taken up by only the elite veterans, which is something CCP should stay away from. I think weakening all MLT and STD variants even more than ADV and PRO types would lead to equality Good point.
The hardeners and damage mods need to be nerfed, but all other modules are fine. Railguns need a slight nerf to rotation speed, damage, and pre-shot charge time, as well as range. Blasters need bullet speed instead of instantly hitting the target when they are fired, as well as a slight damage decrease at MLT and STD level. They also need a range reduction so that they can't snipe infantry and 2 shot a juking scout from 175 meters away by spraying and praying. Missiles need to work like shotguns for reloading, and all tank speed needs a 50% nerf (at least). In addition to this, AV needs to be buffed so that it is able to kill tanks.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
3829
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:59:00 -
[72] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Wow just off of these posts i think i got 74 likes. Thanks forum community! You don't seem to have enough.
So here's another
Next On To-Do List:
Particle Cannons
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
214
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:59:00 -
[73] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Wow just off of these posts i think i got 74 likes. Thanks forum community! You don't seem to have enough. So here's another
Thanks Atiim
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
214
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Posted - 2014.01.23 02:06:00 -
[74] - Quote
You know what i would like even more than a lot of likes is for Tankihiro to come back on this page to defend his "insurmountable logic", or at least give me the public apology and acknowledge that he agrees with me, and denounces all of his prior misinformed opinions.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
339
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Posted - 2014.01.30 21:42:00 -
[75] - Quote
bump for Tankahiro
Kills- Archduke Ferdinand
Help Shields
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