DUST Search - A serious question about Scrambler Rifles

True Adamance wrote:

1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote:

Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:

1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote:

The ScR is the best 1v1 weapon, if you take on any ScR user worth their salt solo you'll go down.

Bring friends and rush em, I guarantee you will overwhelm them.

Yeah which is kind of my point. You can't take them 1v1 at any range with confidence that isn't beyond their optimal if that player isn't half brain dead.

I am a good player and scrambler are the most infuriating things to fight when someone knows you're there because they can pop you so damn quick.

Exactly, which is why its the ultimate 1v1 weapon; its weakness comes in prolonged engagements and multiple opponents

I'm going to go out on a limb and say given the Amarr predilection for long range fire power and the ability to control the engagement at long range they are made for open country.

All I can say from using the combat rifle is that any ScR user will be torn up/ given a run for their money by the Combat rifle in CQC
given its 1200 RoF.

I mean in close quarters I am unstoppable given my sheer bullet out put and high Armour coupled with fast reps. Its only nades that stop me.

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Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2351	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:38:00 - [1] - Quote At what range are you supposed to actually fight against these things? They're good out to 100m. They fire as fast as you can pull the trigger. CQC is just as if not even more dangerous due to the high ROF, high alpha, and super tight hipfire spread. You never have to reload them. They practically never overheat. Where are these things supposed to be bad again? Here I am supposed to be the mid to short range champ in my minmatar assault, combat rifle, and smg and I can't out range them. I can't fight them in CQC. I can't out run them. I can't out flank them. I pretty much have to rely on them being slow or not good players. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1256	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:39:00 - [2] - Quote Just because they HIT at 100, doesn't mean they're doing much damage. Rail Rifle out ranges Scrambler rifle by a decent margin. ADS Reports - Defining Racial Themes
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Unit Unicorn 1316	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:44:00 - [3] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Just because they HIT at 100, doesn't mean they're doing much damage. Rail Rifle out ranges Scrambler rifle by a decent margin. This, also, if Scrambler users miss the first charged shot they're over. Tank 514.
Protocake JR Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 1160	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:44:00 - [4] - Quote I overheat sometimes with the Viziam in CQC or popup cover battles. Also, the current Scrambler Rifle is on par, in terms of stopping power and versatility, with rail rifles and combat rifles. The PC and SL should fit into Sidearm/ Equipment slots so it's accessible and practical to carry one. AV spam vs V spam
Martyr Saboteur Amarrtyrs 4	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:45:00 - [5] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: At what range are you supposed to actually fight against these things? They're good out to 100m. They fire as fast as you can pull the trigger. CQC is just as if not even more dangerous due to the high ROF, high alpha, and super tight hipfire spread. You never have to reload them. They practically never overheat. Where are these things supposed to be bad again? Here I am supposed to be the mid to short range champ in my minmatar assault, combat rifle, and smg and I can't out range them. I can't fight them in CQC. I can't out run them. I can't out flank them. I pretty much have to rely on them being slow or not good players. The Rail Rifle has just as much range as them, and is a great counter to them because of this. It doesn't overheat and is better at short and med range because of its tight hipfire. ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQTSTALLION... I AM THE STALLION
1st Lieutenant Tiberius 0uter.Heaven 676	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:48:00 - [6] - Quote The ScR is the best 1v1 weapon, if you take on any ScR user worth their salt solo you'll go down. Bring friends and rush em, I guarantee you will overwhelm them. The Sinwarden
Scheneighnay McBob Bojo's School of the Trades 3289	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:49:00 - [7] - Quote As with most weapons, possible range is not realistic range, due to recoil and sights. We used to have a time machine
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2352	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:50:00 - [8] - Quote 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: The ScR is the best 1v1 weapon, if you take on any ScR user worth their salt solo you'll go down. Bring friends and rush em, I guarantee you will overwhelm them. Yeah which is kind of my point. You can't take them 1v1 at any range with confidence that isn't beyond their optimal if that player isn't half brain dead. I am a good player and take some pride in my ability to fight in CQC 1v1 and scramblers are the most infuriating things to fight. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
1st Lieutenant Tiberius 0uter.Heaven 676	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:53:00 - [9] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: The ScR is the best 1v1 weapon, if you take on any ScR user worth their salt solo you'll go down. Bring friends and rush em, I guarantee you will overwhelm them. Yeah which is kind of my point. You can't take them 1v1 at any range with confidence that isn't beyond their optimal if that player isn't half brain dead. I am a good player and scrambler are the most infuriating things to fight when someone knows you're there because they can pop you so damn quick. Exactly, which is why its the ultimate 1v1 weapon; its weakness comes in prolonged engagements and multiple opponents The Sinwarden
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2353	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:01:00 - [10] - Quote 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: Exactly, which is why its the ultimate 1v1 weapon; its weakness comes in prolonged engagements and multiple opponents Well at least they made that charge sound loud as hell so I can hear when my death is about to be served. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.

True Adamance Scions of Athra 5084	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:02:00 - [11] - Quote 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: The ScR is the best 1v1 weapon, if you take on any ScR user worth their salt solo you'll go down. Bring friends and rush em, I guarantee you will overwhelm them. Yeah which is kind of my point. You can't take them 1v1 at any range with confidence that isn't beyond their optimal if that player isn't half brain dead. I am a good player and scrambler are the most infuriating things to fight when someone knows you're there because they can pop you so damn quick. Exactly, which is why its the ultimate 1v1 weapon; its weakness comes in prolonged engagements and multiple opponents I'm going to go out on a limb and say given the Amarr predilection for long range fire power and the ability to control the engagement at long range they are made for open country. All I can say from using the combat rifle is that any ScR user will be torn up/ given a run for their money by the Combat rifle in CQC given its 1200 RoF. I mean in close quarters I am unstoppable given my sheer bullet out put and high Armour coupled with fast reps. Its only nades that stop me. To a Texan like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Gunlogi. Reference = ISK
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2353	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:05:00 - [12] - Quote True Adamance wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: The ScR is the best 1v1 weapon, if you take on any ScR user worth their salt solo you'll go down. Bring friends and rush em, I guarantee you will overwhelm them. Yeah which is kind of my point. You can't take them 1v1 at any range with confidence that isn't beyond their optimal if that player isn't half brain dead. I am a good player and scrambler are the most infuriating things to fight when someone knows you're there because they can pop you so damn quick. Exactly, which is why its the ultimate 1v1 weapon; its weakness comes in prolonged engagements and multiple opponents I'm going to go out on a limb and say given the Amarr predilection for long range fire power and the ability to control the engagement at long range they are made for open country. All I can say from using the combat rifle is that any ScR user will be torn up/ given a run for their money by the Combat rifle in CQC given its 1200 RoF. I mean in close quarters I am unstoppable given my sheer bullet out put and high Armour coupled with fast reps. Its only nades that stop me. Maybe on another suit perhaps. Toe to toe in my proto minnie assault vs a proto amarr assault I lose almost every time. Being shield based my main buffer is down before their shields are down. If you can get past their shields you have a chance to keep poking at them to take them down but I always get alphad down in CQC unless I hit that guy from his 6 oclock first. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 6478	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:47:00 - [13] - Quote I find that CQC with a high RoF weapon can work, or going right up and goading them into overheating. Level 6 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution Gallente FW - 'Turalyon'
Sigberct Amni Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 298	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:53:00 - [14] - Quote Your engaging a weapon designed to melt shields in a shield suit? Well thats smart. That would be like me whining about CRs and RRs in my gal logi suit. Get another suit or choose your engagements better. Or write some more words about it.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1304	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:54:00 - [15] - Quote Are charged shot can be are greatest downfall. Plus with all the cqc maps why the hell are you complaining about? "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
Arx Ardashir Imperium Aeternum 279	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:56:00 - [16] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: They practically never overheat. I must be terrible. :(
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4251	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:06:00 - [17] - Quote If you're bringing a Combat Rifle, and you're dying against a Scrambler Rifle, they have the advantage in eHP. If they straight-up have more HP than you, you're at a disadvantage because you have to out-DPS them just to keep up, and need even more damage if you want to try and win. If they have a shield-tanked suit and so do you, then their shields give them a natural resistance to your weapon, while your own shields are at a disadvantage against them. If they can open the encounter with a charged shot - especially if it's a headshot - you've basically lost because of the high burst damage putting you at a disadvantage. A good headshot modifier on top of the bonus to shield damage AND a charged shot means you don't have much you can do to turn the fight back to your favour. Your weapon is slightly more efficient in CQC, but not by enough to negate the advantage of damage type. If you buff your suit's armour, that should help you to turn things more into your favour, but it will get eaten fast by enemies with armour-shredding weapons like your own.
True Adamance Scions of Athra 5086	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:09:00 - [18] - Quote Arx Ardashir wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: They practically never overheat. I must be terrible. :( Same I seem to overheat at the worse possible time..... To a Texan like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Gunlogi. Reference = ISK
True Adamance Scions of Athra 5086	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:10:00 - [19] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: I find that CQC with a high RoF weapon can work, or going right up and goading them into overheating. Rail Rifles are our easiest counter, but a CQC Combat Rifle melts armour suits To a Texan like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Gunlogi. Reference = ISK
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1305	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:13:00 - [20] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Arx Ardashir wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: They practically never overheat. I must be terrible. :( Same I seem to overheat at the worse possible time..... I am also a victim of this terrible mechanic. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein

True Adamance Scions of Athra 5086	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:14:00 - [21] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: True Adamance wrote: Arx Ardashir wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: They practically never overheat. I must be terrible. :( Same I seem to overheat at the worse possible time..... I am also a victim of this terrible mechanic. I like overheat in general...I just hate when I inflict it upon myself. To a Texan like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Gunlogi. Reference = ISK
Dimmu Borgir II The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 206	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:18:00 - [22] - Quote Well I think that even as an incredibly good player (like you!), you shouldn't always be able to beat every single weapon 1 v 1, that's kind of the point of having different weapons to create balanced teams and give everyone a shot. If paper covered scissors (crappy christmas present!) everyone would pull out the paper in RPS every time, if it weren't for scissors the game would be horribly unbalanced and everyone would be paper (ironically, kind of what our drop-suits feel like they're made out of when faced with a scrambler rifle!). Scissors = Scrambler rifle. Paper = All dropsuits except for heavies. Rock = Heavies. Blue is good, red is bad, orange you glad you're not red?
Lanius Pulvis Kinsho Swords Caldari State 118	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:25:00 - [23] - Quote Your example of going against a proto suit that is precisely optimized for this weapon is a poor choice to demonstrate it being OP. If you go head to head against a proto Amar assault wielding a SCR, you should expect, nay....deserve to die... Nothing against you personally, I'm sure you're a lovely person. Not new, just new to you.
Lynn Beck Granite Mercenary Division Top Men. 386	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:28:00 - [24] - Quote I still find it a problem that there isn't a single weapon 'bar shotgun/novas' that can 1v1 a SINGLE player using scramblers. This was what got the heavy nerfed back in chromo "it takes 2-3 people to drop 1 guy? THAT's Op!" I find it extremely annoying that even if i shoot FIRST, and hit him 3-4 bursts before he shoots 1 shot, he's already won, simply because i didn't bring a 1hko nor more HP than him. Under 28db Officially nerfproof (predicting CR nerf February '14) I have a God, His name is Dakka.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Dust2Dust. Top Men. 300	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:40:00 - [25] - Quote Another QQ post wrote: You never have to reload them. They practically never overheat. Exaggerating much? Pro-Tip: Don't run straight at a scrambler, take him out from the flank. You'll be surprised how much better you will do if you start playing smart. Preeminent Scrambler Rifle User & Dropship Enthusiast
True Adamance Scions of Athra 5092	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:44:00 - [26] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: I still find it a problem that there isn't a single weapon 'bar shotgun/novas' that can 1v1 a SINGLE player using scramblers. This was what got the heavy nerfed back in chromo "it takes 2-3 people to drop 1 guy? THAT's Op!" I find it extremely annoying that even if i shoot FIRST, and hit him 3-4 bursts before he shoots 1 shot, he's already won, simply because i didn't bring a 1hko nor more HP than him. .... Combat Rifle, Rail Rifle, AR, Shotgun, Scrambler Pistol (yes it can be done pop yourself into a dual ScP scout suit and you will see how easy). To a Texan like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Gunlogi. Reference = ISK
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES 439	Posted - 2013.12.20 02:00:00 - [27] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: Exactly, which is why its the ultimate 1v1 weapon; its weakness comes in prolonged engagements and multiple opponents Well at least they made that charge sound loud as hell so I can hear when my death is about to be served. Haha ain't that the truth! Does anyone else like me have multiple characters and just wishes they had all the SP into one character? I mean I love my tanker character, I actually have more fun on my tanker than anything else. I have over 20m sp here on Commander but I would KILL for a respec. I honestly would.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4251	Posted - 2013.12.20 02:14:00 - [28] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: I still find it a problem that there isn't a single weapon 'bar shotgun/novas' that can 1v1 a SINGLE player using scramblers. This was what got the heavy nerfed back in chromo "it takes 2-3 people to drop 1 guy? THAT's Op!" I find it extremely annoying that even if i shoot FIRST, and hit him 3-4 bursts before he shoots 1 shot, he's already won, simply because i didn't bring a 1hko nor more HP than him. Sniper Rifle or Rail Rifle at extreme range. Any weapon that's strong against the enemy suit's main tank while you're in an armour-tanked suit. When I said eHP, I meant eHP, NOT raw HP. You don't need a higher amount of pure HP to have the eHP advantage. You can have a WEAKER armour-tanked suit and a shield-heavy weapon against that Amarr suit with Scrambler, and even though he has a larger number for total HP, your eHP is higher because he loses damage once he's broken your shields. In a straight-up fight, you're damage-racing your opponent. You win a damage race by one-shotting them with high burst damage, by increasing your DPS and/or reducing theirs, or by increasing your eHP pool. Burst damage: Shotgun, Knives, Sniper Rifle. DPS: Rail Rifle at long range - you get higher damage output, you win. eHP: Bring an armour tank to negate their shield bonus, and bring a weapon that's strong against their tank. The OP is bringing an armour-focused weapon while the enemy has a shield-damaging weapon, and they both have shield-tanked suits. What do you think is going to happen there? It's about as good as using Flux Grenades on a Gallente suit and catching your own Caldari suit in the blast, then complaining that you died faster when using the same weapons.
THEAMAZING POTHEAD Nyain San Renegade Alliance 690	Posted - 2013.12.20 02:21:00 - [29] - Quote An amarr Ak.0 can fit three damage mods and proficiency 5 imperial and still have 700+ armor along w/ an allotek or k17d nanohive, giving him 900 ehp+a super fast rep rate, and the highest DPS of any gun in the game, whilst you're using a combat rifle, the lowest DPS rifle. Yeah, that RPM of 1200 still gives the assault the lowest DPS, and the burst...lolburst. You're completely outclassed cyrius, you got no choice but to use speed and tactis, which are currently unimportant due to aim assist and hit detection, which gave rise to DPS and brick tank, the opposite of what minmatar tech was designed to do.
KING CHECKMATE Scions of Athra 3383	Posted - 2013.12.20 02:27:00 - [30] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: At what range are you supposed to actually fight against these things? They're good out to 100m. They fire as fast as you can pull the trigger. CQC is just as if not even more dangerous due to the high ROF, high alpha, and super tight hipfire spread. You never have to reload them. They practically never overheat. Where are these things supposed to be bad again? Here I am supposed to be the mid to short range champ in my minmatar assault, combat rifle, and smg and I can't out range them. I can't fight them in CQC. I can't out run them. I can't out flank them. I pretty much have to rely on them being slow or not good players. QQ MOAR. Read the first 6-7 posts and learn something. LEt me tell you, if the SCR is so op how come is the LEAST used Rifle now?... Yeah, didnt think so. The mere fact it has a horrible OVERHEAT mechanic and 80% to armor (every other rifle has at MOST a 10% penalty on shield/armor) Makes them on par,if not UNDERPOWERED with the other rifles. Just ....shush... AV-TANK BALANCE = https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1612446#post1612446



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