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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
318
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Posted - 2013.12.12 22:41:00 -
[1] - Quote
I fight for the caldari - im not going to ***** and moan about the fact we suck so dont worry
What I will moan about though is the fact that it is insanely hard to get my caldari standing up becuase we lose so much
So I purpose that the losing team still receives some standing points for effort and trying
I went in there, killed some feds, I tryed as hard as I can to win but factions won't like you anymore unless you win?
Show some mercy CCP - Give the losing tea like 10-30 points for trying you already give a small amount of LP for losing, at least let us try and get our standings up a level so we can earn more
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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Moochie Cricket
SyNergy Gaming
EoN.
532
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Posted - 2013.12.12 22:48:00 -
[2] - Quote
Completely agree |
Everything Dies
Chatelain Rapid Response
Gallente Federation
333
|
Posted - 2013.12.12 22:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yes, leave the all-or-nothing for the diehards over in PC, because until PC is fixed (specifically the lag) those players are going to shift over to FW and bring nothing but pain for those that grow tired of being restricted to Pubs (either in terms of skill or simple funding.)
Life is killing me.
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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
324
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Posted - 2013.12.13 01:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Glad im not the only one who wants this
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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Roy Ventus
Foxhound Corporation
General Tso's Alliance
695
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Posted - 2013.12.13 01:44:00 -
[5] - Quote
Foley Jones wrote:I fight for the caldari - im not going to ***** and moan about the fact we suck so dont worry
What I will moan about though is the fact that it is insanely hard to get my caldari standing up becuase we lose so much
So I purpose that the losing team still receives some standing points for effort and trying
I went in there, killed some feds, I tryed as hard as I can to win but factions won't like you anymore unless you win?
Show some mercy CCP - Give the losing tea like 10-30 points for trying you already give a small amount of LP for losing, at least let us try and get our standings up a level so we can earn more
Agree. Was thinking about it earlier today.
"There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all."
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bolsh lee
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
696
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Posted - 2013.12.13 01:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
If any I think it should be based off of WP or KD because only giving standings for winning gives incentive to WIN
So if its just default 10 standing or something small people will afk and farm the +10 standing.... |
Viktor Hadah Jr
0uter.Heaven
Proficiency V.
1442
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Posted - 2013.12.13 01:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
I agree cal and amarr need pity standing points
Very angry Amarrian
Dual tanking is a sin
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Azri Sarum
BurgezzE.T.F
Public Disorder.
190
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:20:00 -
[8] - Quote
bolsh lee wrote:If any I think it should be based off of WP or KD because only giving standings for winning gives incentive to WIN
So if its just default 10 standing or something small people will afk and farm the +10 standing....
then make it based off of WP. Something like 0.1 standing per WP, max of 20 per match.
So a 2000+ WP match adds 20 bonus standing.
500 WP gives 5 standing.
0 WP gives 0 standing.
EVE - Victor Maximus
DUST - Azri Sarum
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DeadlyAztec11
2746
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 02:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
Yes.
Madness is the emergency exit. You can just step outside, and close the door on all those dreadful things that happened.
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Boot Booter
Omega Elite Mercs INC.
220
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
Get good? |
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bolsh lee
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
697
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:I agree cal and amarr need pity standing points
There needs to be a chat channel for vet/skilled players who play for CAL/Amarr cause I agree Caldari life is a rough life we need to combine forces I can't even count the losses Ive taken tonight and the end score board reads ; the bottom 10 players as 2/15 0/10 0/4 etc etc ***** getting ridiculous... |
True Adamance
Scions of Athra
4854
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 02:31:00 -
[12] - Quote
Sigh.....I just don't care anymore, nothing is worth having from the Amarr LP store, no tanks, no scouts, not one worthwhile item.
"Shudder. Again another smart idea from an Amarr..."- Forlorn Destrier (11/12/13) LAWL
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Harpyja
DUST University
Ivy League
898
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 02:33:00 -
[13] - Quote
I also agree
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Cpt Merdock
The Exemplars
Top Men.
153
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:34:00 -
[14] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:Get good?
Wrong attitude and counter productive. Please allow my fellow corp mate to express himself without arrogance flooding the thread. Thanks. |
bolsh lee
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
697
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:36:00 -
[15] - Quote
Azri Sarum wrote:bolsh lee wrote:If any I think it should be based off of WP or KD because only giving standings for winning gives incentive to WIN
So if its just default 10 standing or something small people will afk and farm the +10 standing.... then make it based off of WP. Something like 0.1 standing per WP, max of 20 per match. So a 2000+ WP match adds 20 bonus standing. 500 WP gives 5 standing. 0 WP gives 0 standing.
I agree but i think it even needs to be a bit more strict, something like you'll only receive standings if you hit 1000 WP ?
Because is 500WP really contributing ?
And think about it, you get what +75 for wining a FW match ? If people on the loosing side step up and actually strive for 1000WP game maybe they can turn the tide and help get the +75 ?
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bolsh lee
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
697
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:38:00 -
[16] - Quote
edit double post.. |
Michael Arck
Anubis Prime Syndicate
2222
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 02:38:00 -
[17] - Quote
We should combine forces...Caldari is too loose. Let us unite with q syncs...
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
For the State!!
[email protected]
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Heathen Bastard
The Bastard Brigade
738
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 02:39:00 -
[18] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:Get good?
one good fighter can't make up for an entire team of blueberries.
If you hear the words "WORTH IT!" look about, something hilarious just happened.
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Michael Arck
Anubis Prime Syndicate
2223
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Posted - 2013.12.13 02:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
Heathen Bastard wrote:Boot Booter wrote:Get good? one good fighter can't make up for an entire team of blueberries.
BOOM!!
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
For the State!!
[email protected]
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Bojo The Mighty
Zanzibar Concept
2363
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 03:03:00 -
[20] - Quote
Hmmmm.....I don't know, it should be a real motivation to try and up your game or your allies. |
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True Adamance
Scions of Athra
4870
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Posted - 2013.12.13 03:03:00 -
[21] - Quote
Bojo The Mighty wrote:Hmmmm.....I don't know, it should be a real motivation to try and up your game or your allies.
Indeed all I have seen for the last month is garbage mercs getting worse.
"Shudder. Again another smart idea from an Amarr..."- Forlorn Destrier (11/12/13) LAWL
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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
347
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:03:00 -
[22] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:Hmmmm.....I don't know, it should be a real motivation to try and up your game or your allies. Indeed all I have seen for the last month is garbage mercs getting worse.
Confirmed
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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Darth-Carbonite GIO
Dust2Dust.
Top Men.
289
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:09:00 -
[23] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:Get good?
I will slap you in a gentlemanly fashion. Prepare your facial region.
Preeminent Scrambler Rifle User & Dropship Enthusiast
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Sgt Buttscratch
1133
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
75/25 split would be fair IMO. Not as if you werent loyal if you lose.
I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas
Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans
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Jacques Cayton II
Providence Guard
Templis Dragonaors
299
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:16:00 -
[25] - Quote
Foley want to fight tonight I'll be squaring with a group for Caldari you in?
We fight for the future of the State not our
personal goals
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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
352
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:20:00 -
[26] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:Foley want to fight tonight I'll be squaring with a group for Caldari you in?
Of course! What time?
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
1898
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:25:00 -
[27] - Quote
Caldari is hard
My tank crew keeps the enemy tanks at bay and gets rid of plently of them but frankly the infantry just cant seem to do anything
Well that and it doesnt help when you are the only squad in the game and everyone else is unsquadded |
Kain Spero
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
2301
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:26:00 -
[28] - Quote
Foley Jones wrote:I fight for the caldari - im not going to ***** and moan about the fact we suck so dont worry
What I will moan about though is the fact that it is insanely hard to get my caldari standing up becuase we lose so much
So I purpose that the losing team still receives some standing points for effort and trying
I went in there, killed some feds, I tryed as hard as I can to win but factions won't like you anymore unless you win?
Show some mercy CCP - Give the losing tea like 10-30 points for trying you already give a small amount of LP for losing, at least let us try and get our standings up a level so we can earn more
My concern would be if you give a standing gain you then have both LP and Standing gains you would be giving to potential AFK awoxers and/or farmers. Why on the surface standings for loosing may seem good they can get exploited in a hurry.
Owner of Spero Escrow Services
Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
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KatanaPT
Tech Guard
RISE of LEGION
426
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:28:00 -
[29] - Quote
+1
Tech Guard Recruiting Spot
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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
352
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:37:00 -
[30] - Quote
Kain Spero wrote:Foley Jones wrote:I fight for the caldari - im not going to ***** and moan about the fact we suck so dont worry
What I will moan about though is the fact that it is insanely hard to get my caldari standing up becuase we lose so much
So I purpose that the losing team still receives some standing points for effort and trying
I went in there, killed some feds, I tryed as hard as I can to win but factions won't like you anymore unless you win?
Show some mercy CCP - Give the losing tea like 10-30 points for trying you already give a small amount of LP for losing, at least let us try and get our standings up a level so we can earn more My concern would be if you give a standing gain you then have both LP and Standing gains you would be giving to potential AFK awoxers and/or farmers. Why on the surface standings for loosing may seem good they can get exploited in a hurry.
Then we can go for the wp system as suggested before
But you can't deny the fact that the losing player should still receive bsome standings points
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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Vrain Matari
ZionTCD
Public Disorder.
1356
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Posted - 2013.12.13 15:43:00 -
[31] - Quote
Azri Sarum wrote:bolsh lee wrote:If any I think it should be based off of WP or KD because only giving standings for winning gives incentive to WIN
So if its just default 10 standing or something small people will afk and farm the +10 standing.... then make it based off of WP. Something like 0.1 standing per WP, max of 20 per match. So a 2000+ WP match adds 20 bonus standing. 500 WP gives 5 standing. 0 WP gives 0 standing.
Would only agree to this if it was active WP, meaning that the 5WP/s passive in-match charity WP were not included. Then at least the losers would be recognized for having made a real effort to support their team. And the payout should be small, so that if you bust your ass all match for the faction you get maybe 10 standings points being on the losing side.
I support SP rollover.
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Everything Dies
Chatelain Rapid Response
Gallente Federation
338
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Posted - 2013.12.13 16:07:00 -
[32] - Quote
Vrain Matari wrote:Would only agree to this if it was active WP, meaning that the 5WP/s passive in-match charity WP were not included. Then at least the losers would be recognized for having made a real effort to support their team. And the payout should be small, so that if you bust your ass all match for the faction you get maybe 10 standings points being on the losing side.
I think you're confusing WP with SP. You only get WP for in-game actions (kills, team spawns, hacks, etc.) SP is earned both passively and as a result of match performance. So in the original suggestion, you'd at least receive recognition for your effort by earning standing for performing well (i.e. racking up WPs.)
Life is killing me.
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Judge Rhadamanthus
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
954
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Posted - 2013.12.13 16:14:00 -
[33] - Quote
Kain Spero wrote:My concern would be if you give a standing gain you then have both LP and Standing gains you would be giving to potential AFK awoxers and/or farmers. Why on the surface standings for loosing may seem good they can get exploited in a hurry.
We have the issue where it it looks like we are going to lose I have zero incentive to try. Why push if it's pretty certain it will end in a loss? All that does is get me the same reward but costs more ISK. IF we lose and i used 5 suits i get the same reward if we lose and I use 15 suits. In public matches even if loseing if i try and do well i get more ISK. Not so in FW. Effort does not equal reward. Strategic retreat is the best approach. This is not good for fun or balance among factions. There is no reward for effort. The logical decision is to give up on a weak looking team.
This will lead to the possible death of certain factions. Why waste isk for so little? I may as well fight for another faction.
Everything Dropship youtube channel
my Community Spotlight
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Vrain Matari
ZionTCD
Public Disorder.
1356
|
Posted - 2013.12.13 17:38:00 -
[34] - Quote
Everything Dies wrote:Vrain Matari wrote:Would only agree to this if it was active WP, meaning that the 5WP/s passive in-match charity WP were not included. Then at least the losers would be recognized for having made a real effort to support their team. And the payout should be small, so that if you bust your ass all match for the faction you get maybe 10 standings points being on the losing side. I think you're confusing WP with SP. You only get WP for in-game actions (kills, team spawns, hacks, etc.) SP is earned both passively and as a result of match performance. So in the original suggestion, you'd at least receive recognition for your effort by earning standing for performing well (i.e. racking up WPs.)
Right you are. Edited my op.
I support SP rollover.
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
1480
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Posted - 2013.12.14 18:30:00 -
[35] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Caldari is hard
My tank crew keeps the enemy tanks at bay and gets rid of plently of them but frankly the infantry just cant seem to do anything
Well that and it doesnt help when you are the only squad in the game and everyone else is unsquadded
It was worse before 1.7 when we were also on the top of the boards as infantry.
Tankers leading the way.
Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
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Silas Swakhammer
GamersForChrist
Orion Empire
284
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Posted - 2013.12.14 18:35:00 -
[36] - Quote
Foley Jones wrote:MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
I love you.
Also, as a Minmatar interested in the other 'underdog' of EVE, I haven't been able to gain standings with the State yet. =(
Pineapples on pizza.
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Joel II X
Lo-Tech Solutions Ltd
332
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Posted - 2013.12.14 18:36:00 -
[37] - Quote
Agreed. |
Oswald Rehnquist
881
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 18:42:00 -
[38] - Quote
I am caldari as well, but I do like that winning matters, that is literally what is saving FW, people try hard (which is why people feel so tired), so I am hesitant to just give standing for loses due to afkers, perhaps as someone mentioned only for those who break 1000? Joining a squad or two generally overcomes the losing aspect.
Below 28 dB
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AP Grasshopper
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar
DARKSTAR ARMY
74
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Posted - 2013.12.14 18:46:00 -
[39] - Quote
Agreed |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
669
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 18:48:00 -
[40] - Quote
This is one of the things I suggested in a feedback thread. My concept is that the faction will still "pay" you (in standings) for a "good loss."
I'm all for incentives to win but the current system, but like Rhadamanthus said, when you see you are on a losing team there is zero incentive to try because you get nothing for your efforts.
I suggested that the top 1-3 people on the board and/or everyone who gets more than a certain number of WP should still be awarded at least a small amount of standings for their trouble. Even if it's only 10-20% of what you get for a win! there's at least a reason to give your best effort.
The way it is now only frustrates and crushes the morale of the Caldari and Amarr sides making us less interested in playing because we have no real control over outer own fates. I mean, I've played 10-15 battles for the Amarr so far, averaging 1500 WP, topped the board (overall - both teams) in WP for fully 1/2 of them, and yet I have not advanced a single level yet. Disheartening.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Logi Bro
Greatness Achieved Through Training
EoN.
2461
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Posted - 2013.12.14 18:52:00 -
[41] - Quote
I agree.
No, I am not CCP Logibro.
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Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
416
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:15:00 -
[42] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:Get good?
Says the guy I killed 5 times straight.
Seriously, I fight for Caldari, too. What is the deal that I don't gain standings with Caldari unless I win? I mean, I came in THIRD OVERALL and first on my team and we lost and... nothing? Really?
Names of playstyles
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Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
1993
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:16:00 -
[43] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:Get good?
Please Don't
DUST 514 just went full COD.
Never go full COD.
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Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
417
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:25:00 -
[44] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Boot Booter wrote:Get good? Please Don't
I'm serious, Atiim. I saw you liked my post and I think it was about the killing 5 times? If so, here's the deal: I'm using my Rail Rifle and watching a door that's about 53 m. I have my scanner out and I scan, and see someone out the door so I wait. He enters and I fire. Dead. I did that 5 TIMES.
Names of playstyles
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Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
1999
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:29:00 -
[45] - Quote
Luna Angelo wrote:Atiim wrote:Boot Booter wrote:Get good? Please Don't I'm serious, Atiim. I saw you liked my post and I think it was about the killing 5 times? If so, here's the deal: I'm using my Rail Rifle and watching a door that's about 53 m. I have my scanner out and I scan, and see someone out the door so I wait. He enters and I fire. Dead. I did that 5 TIMES.
XD
And he tried to tell someone to get good?
If you die 5 times to the exact same tactic in a row then you truly need to "Get Good".
DUST 514 just went full COD.
Never go full COD.
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Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
418
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:32:00 -
[46] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Luna Angelo wrote:Atiim wrote:Boot Booter wrote:Get good? Please Don't I'm serious, Atiim. I saw you liked my post and I think it was about the killing 5 times? If so, here's the deal: I'm using my Rail Rifle and watching a door that's about 53 m. I have my scanner out and I scan, and see someone out the door so I wait. He enters and I fire. Dead. I did that 5 TIMES. XD And he tried to tell someone to get good? If you die 5 times to the exact same tactic in a row then you truly need to "Get Good".
Indeed. It was glorious. I even killed three of his allies with that tactic. Anyways, I was using STD Rail Rifle, one Adv damage mod and Prof 4. But I still shouldn't kill someone 5 times in a row.
Names of playstyles
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Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
1999
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:33:00 -
[47] - Quote
Both Lore wise and Realisicly I don't see how this works out.
Even if you lose the match, why wouldn't you get a higher standing and reputation by simply fighting for them?
Reputable military leaders didn't gain their reputations by wining every single battle they've fought (though a few have); so I don't get CCP's logic with the whole "You must win to gain a higher standing/reputation" ideal.
But Logic and CCP should not be used in the same sentence.
DUST 514 just went full COD.
Never go full COD.
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Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
418
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:35:00 -
[48] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Both Lore wise and Realisicly I don't see how this works out.
Even if you lose the match, why wouldn't you get a higher standing and reputation by simply fighting for them?
Reputable military leaders didn't gain their reputations by wining every single battle they've fought (though a few have); so I don't get CCP's logic with the whole "You must win to gain a higher standing/reputation" ideal.
But Logic and CCP should not be used in the same sentence.
The only 2 leaders that I can think of that won every fight are Alexander the Great and Napoleon Bonaparte. Even Julius Caeser lost several battles.
Names of playstyles
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Obodiah Garro
Tech Guard
RISE of LEGION
451
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:37:00 -
[49] - Quote
Signed
Right now its a show of mastery to get a win with caldari, everybody has blue balled up and are farming gal lp since its so easy atm, need to get some incentive to make FW somewhat worth playing instead of havin to run bpo suits cause its a terrible waste of isk to do otherwise on the caldari side. |
Shooty Dangerman
One Bad Dude
1
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:40:00 -
[50] - Quote
I think 5 standing points for 500 WP is the best idea. It could apply to winners and losers with a cap at 20 or 25. When you know your team is gonna lose the match there is really no incentive to keep playing, but a change like this would keep me fighting at least. |
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Bethhy
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
467
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:40:00 -
[51] - Quote
We wanted this. A venue where Winning matters. that isn't PC. now that you have it ... it's not fair enough for you? CCP gives you all the tools in a sandbox to build a FW team... to organize whatever you see fit.
We have normal public matches where little difference happens when you loose... don't do that to this.
I'll never understand why everyone want's to be rewarded for just participating... with no drive to improve them self's or their surroundings... just sit down and be rewarded.. its sick. |
Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
419
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:41:00 -
[52] - Quote
I win in Caldari more than I lose, that makes me a master, as Obodiah said. But on the ones that I lose, it's a complete and utter waste of my time.
Names of playstyles
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
673
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:44:00 -
[53] - Quote
Napoleon? Waterloo is synonymous with a military debacle.
George Washington famously lost more battles than he won (debatable but he had barely over a .500 at best) as well.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Doc Noah
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
993
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:44:00 -
[54] - Quote
I agree, but it needs limitations to prevent AFK farming. |
Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
419
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:46:00 -
[55] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:Napoleon? Waterloo is synonymous with a military debacle.
George Washington famously lost more battles than he won (debatable but he had barely over a .500 at best) as well.
Up until Waterloo, Napoleon was undefeated. One of the greatest military leaders in history. Obviously, I was referring to BEFORE that one battle. Besides, ALL military leaders lost ONE fight, Alexander the Great lost in India, that's why his Empire stopped in the Middle East.
Names of playstyles
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Obodiah Garro
Tech Guard
RISE of LEGION
455
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Posted - 2013.12.14 19:47:00 -
[56] - Quote
Bethhy wrote:We wanted this. A venue where Winning matters. that isn't PC. now that you have it ... it's not fair enough for you? CCP gives you all the tools in a sandbox to build a FW team... to organize whatever you see fit.
We have normal public matches where little difference happens when you loose... don't do that to this.
I'll never understand why everyone want's to be rewarded for just participating... with no drive to improve them self's or their surroundings... just sit down and be rewarded.. its sick.
tbh this whole statement is a load of pish taken in the context that 1, you guys run gal fw and synch and 2, there isnt an equal player response on the caldari side.
**** even my corp run gal (damn frogs) but for us plebs that do caldari to either 1, have a solid challenge or 2, RP for the sake of the game, there is simply nothing at this stage that makes FW anything other than a massive isk sink.
**** is too 1 sided atm, and there is no reason you shouldnt get standing increases based of wp instead of either a W or L anyway.
Least it stops the moaning and makes it an even keel regardless of who gets stomped. |
Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
419
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 19:52:00 -
[57] - Quote
Obodiah Garro wrote:Bethhy wrote:We wanted this. A venue where Winning matters. that isn't PC. now that you have it ... it's not fair enough for you? CCP gives you all the tools in a sandbox to build a FW team... to organize whatever you see fit.
We have normal public matches where little difference happens when you loose... don't do that to this.
I'll never understand why everyone want's to be rewarded for just participating... with no drive to improve them self's or their surroundings... just sit down and be rewarded.. its sick. tbh this whole statement is a load of pish taken in the context that 1, you guys run gal fw and synch and 2, there isnt an equal player response on the caldari side. **** even my corp run gal (damn frogs) but for us plebs that do caldari to either 1, have a solid challenge or 2, RP for the sake of the game, there is simply nothing at this stage that makes FW anything other than a massive isk sink. **** is too 1 sided atm, and there is no reason you shouldnt get standing increases based of wp instead of either a W or L anyway. Least it stops the moaning and makes it an even keel regardless of who gets stomped.
This. I have noticed Bethhy on the Gallente side fairly often, usually on the other side of my ACOG. If it wasn't for her teammates, she'd have been killed many a time. Needless to say, I think we need to get less for losing, but still get some.
Names of playstyles
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
674
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 20:06:00 -
[58] - Quote
Bethhy wrote:We wanted this. A venue where Winning matters. that isn't PC. now that you have it ... it's not fair enough for you? CCP gives you all the tools in a sandbox to build a FW team... to organize whatever you see fit.
We have normal public matches where little difference happens when you loose... don't do that to this.
I'll never understand why everyone want's to be rewarded for just participating... with no drive to improve them self's or their surroundings... just sit down and be rewarded.. its sick.
Easy for a Gallente player to say. Besides, nobody is asking for it to be like pubs where the reward is essentially the same win or lose. Those of us who are fighting for Caldari/Amarr are sick of banging into a wall of awoxers every match and just want some token reward for our efforts.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Crimson Cerberes
Hammer Of Light
Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
132
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 20:07:00 -
[59] - Quote
Kain Spero wrote:Foley Jones wrote:I fight for the caldari - im not going to ***** and moan about the fact we suck so dont worry
What I will moan about though is the fact that it is insanely hard to get my caldari standing up becuase we lose so much
So I purpose that the losing team still receives some standing points for effort and trying
I went in there, killed some feds, I tryed as hard as I can to win but factions won't like you anymore unless you win?
Show some mercy CCP - Give the losing tea like 10-30 points for trying you already give a small amount of LP for losing, at least let us try and get our standings up a level so we can earn more My concern would be if you give a standing gain you then have both LP and Standing gains you would be giving to potential AFK awoxers and/or farmers. Why on the surface standings for loosing may seem good they can get exploited in a hurry.
Are you kidding?
You can already do this extensively as long as you choose the FotM minmatar/gallente. Join minne/gall match, AFK, +standings like crazy.
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Cpt Merdock
The Exemplars
Top Men.
159
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 21:55:00 -
[60] - Quote
How are those flavour of the month? Hmm? Please explain how what side we choose is flavour of the month. It doesnt matter, you dont get bonuses for choosing a specific side, you just get access to the limited gear in the loyalty point store. Minmatar has never been flavour of the month for anything, we finally get an item that can match with the Armour tanking, damage mod stacking amarr and caldari players and you all get more pissy than ever. Go get some team players and come back before whining on the forums, CCP cant help that you guys cant work together. |
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Crimson Cerberes
Hammer Of Light
Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
135
|
Posted - 2013.12.14 22:23:00 -
[61] - Quote
Cpt Merdock wrote:How are those flavour of the month? Hmm? Please explain how what side we choose is flavour of the month. It doesnt matter, you dont get bonuses for choosing a specific side, you just get access to the limited gear in the loyalty point store. Minmatar has never been flavour of the month for anything, we finally get an item that can match with the Armour tanking, damage mod stacking amarr and caldari players and you all get more pissy than ever. Go get some team players and come back before whining on the forums, CCP cant help that you guys cant work together.
People inherently flock to what is easy*. Minnie/gallente FW is just about the easiest thing you can do in this game at the moment.
*proof of flocking in order of apperance:
LR spam
flaylock spam
MD spam
AR spam
SCR spam
Tank spam |
Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
371
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 05:25:00 -
[62] - Quote
Crimson Cerberes wrote:Kain Spero wrote:Foley Jones wrote:I fight for the caldari - im not going to ***** and moan about the fact we suck so dont worry
What I will moan about though is the fact that it is insanely hard to get my caldari standing up becuase we lose so much
So I purpose that the losing team still receives some standing points for effort and trying
I went in there, killed some feds, I tryed as hard as I can to win but factions won't like you anymore unless you win?
Show some mercy CCP - Give the losing tea like 10-30 points for trying you already give a small amount of LP for losing, at least let us try and get our standings up a level so we can earn more My concern would be if you give a standing gain you then have both LP and Standing gains you would be giving to potential AFK awoxers and/or farmers. Why on the surface standings for loosing may seem good they can get exploited in a hurry. Are you kidding? You can already do this extensively as long as you choose the FotM minmatar/gallente. Join minne/gall match, AFK, +standings like crazy.
Tis why the wp system suggested before is a good idea
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
677
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 08:46:00 -
[63] - Quote
Cpt Merdock wrote:How are those flavour of the month? Hmm? Please explain how what side we choose is flavour of the month. It doesnt matter, you dont get bonuses for choosing a specific side, you just get access to the limited gear in the loyalty point store. Minmatar has never been flavour of the month for anything, we finally get an item that can match with the Armour tanking, damage mod stacking amarr and caldari players and you all get more pissy than ever. Go get some team players and come back before whining on the forums, CCP cant help that you guys cant work together.
Yes, of course. We scrubs need simply to git gud. Squads are a brilliant idea, I wish I had thought of that. How could we have not figured out how to use our dedicated FW channel and FW oriented corp to make squads without your help? 
I'm pretty sure we have some actual TeamPlayers (or at least former ones, like Cubs), doesn't matter. When you consistently have 5 or 6 blueberries (presumably awoxers) who end the match with 0 WP, unless you are able to get 2 full squads into every battle you are SOL.
Also: I'm pretty fond of the CR myself but let's not go crazy attributing your success to it.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Galvan Nized
Deep Space Republic
393
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 09:48:00 -
[64] - Quote
Shooty Dangerman wrote:I think 5 standing points for 500 WP is the best idea. It could apply to winners and losers with a cap at 20 or 25. When you know your team is gonna lose the match there is really no incentive to keep playing, but a change like this would keep me fighting at least.
I know gaining for losing lends itself open to AFK farming but the WP system isn't perfect either.
You can just exploit the revive mechanic, or call in BPO vehicles and have a friend awoxing the other side destroy them constantly. Actually with AWOXING this would be way to easy to exploit.
Plus this completely favors certain playstyles, Logis would explode and could generate more points than a guy actually defending/capping objs.
This could be terrible for battles, once they even seem like a chance for a loss it's going to be about gaining WP not fighting hard to actually win. Or before a battle even starts see that your up against a decent squad and don't even bother trying, just milk WPs. Destroy all turrets even if they could help your team, revive with crappy injectors so you get more rep points. Run only free gear and sit and milk wps any way you can. |
Obodiah Garro
Tech Guard
RISE of LEGION
456
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 12:06:00 -
[65] - Quote
WP system is by far the best suggestion, it would also hurt afkers on the winning side, people could try and exploit but it wouldnt be worth their time. Step up CCP |
Acturus Galaxy
Lo-Tech Solutions Ltd
299
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 12:15:00 -
[66] - Quote
I do not like the rewards based on WP in FW matches. It will end up like pub matches where everyone is trying to farm WP rather than winning the match. As it is now you will gain very little for loosing. If you join FW for passive LP farming you decrease the chance of your team winning and you will get next to nothing for spending 20-30 minuttes of your time.
Now you have to parcicipate to secure that you get an LP payout even if it is in starter suits or BPO suits. Doing nothing decreases your own chance of getting any loyality points. Most FW matches I have been in has been close as it is obvious everyone is fighting to the end to win the match. Join a pub skirmish and redlining and pub stomping is the norm. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
679
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 12:20:00 -
[67] - Quote
Acturus Galaxy wrote:I do not like the rewards based on WP in FW matches. It will end up like pub matches where everyone is trying to farm WP rather than winning the match. As it is now you will gain very little for loosing. If you join FW for passive LP farming you decrease the chance of your team winning and you will get next to nothing for spending 20-30 minuttes of your time.
Now you have to parcicipate to secure that you get an LP payout even if it is in starter suits or BPO suits. Doing nothing decreases your own chance of getting any loyality points. Most FW matches I have been in has been close as it is obvious everyone is fighting to the end to win the match. Join a pub skirmish and redlining and pub stomping is the norm.
The difference is that you keep the mechanic where the winning side gets dramatically better payouts. The only real change from the current system is that good players on the losing side still get something for actually trying. Don't want to make it purely WP based, then give something to the top 3 players on the board for the losing side instead.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Acturus Galaxy
Lo-Tech Solutions Ltd
299
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 12:29:00 -
[68] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:Acturus Galaxy wrote:I do not like the rewards based on WP in FW matches. It will end up like pub matches where everyone is trying to farm WP rather than winning the match. As it is now you will gain very little for loosing. If you join FW for passive LP farming you decrease the chance of your team winning and you will get next to nothing for spending 20-30 minuttes of your time.
Now you have to parcicipate to secure that you get an LP payout even if it is in starter suits or BPO suits. Doing nothing decreases your own chance of getting any loyality points. Most FW matches I have been in has been close as it is obvious everyone is fighting to the end to win the match. Join a pub skirmish and redlining and pub stomping is the norm. The difference is that you keep the mechanic where the winning side gets dramatically better payouts. The only real change from the current system is that good players on the losing side still get something for actually trying. Don't want to make it purely WP based, then give something to the top 3 players on the board for the losing side instead.
I understand that you wish to reward the members that might be spending the most isk trying to win the match. But you will also open up the option to WP farming instead of trying to win the match.
I see FW matches as a team gamemode unlike pub commercial contracts. FW does not discreminate new players from old players, they get an equal share of LP and is expected to do their best within the limits of their SP.
I hate pub matches for the rush to destroy every single installtion on the map for war points. I dislike pub matches for letting down players with a prefered role that provides little warpoints. Look at snipers, they are anoying, they get very little warpoints for their effort trying to help the team remotely. Tanks and logis get tons of war points.
In FW everyone is selecting a role that improves the chance of winning the match and not a role that yeild the highest amount of warpoints. I like that there is this difference between pubs and FW matches. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
680
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 12:36:00 -
[69] - Quote
Again, says the Gallente. Go ahead and play some Amarr battles. You won't lose standings for Gallente, so it's cool. Try that for a few days and see how much you like the losing side getting nothing.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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RKKR
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
539
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 12:51:00 -
[70] - Quote
Players that are loyal enough to lose for their faction time over time deserve their loyalty points and standing too, it's as easy as that.
Then again...CCP also named the ambush spawn button 'Smart Spawn'. They like to give unrelated names to stuff. |
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Acturus Galaxy
Lo-Tech Solutions Ltd
299
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 13:11:00 -
[71] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:Again, says the Gallente who's probably won 3/4 of his battles. Go ahead and play some Amarr FW. You won't lose standings for Gallente, so it's cool. Try that for a few days and see how much you like the losing side getting nothing.
Take a look at how all the asshats awox all match in the roles they are selecting to lose the battle instead of yielding the most WP or however you put it. Have fun losing 150,000 ISK to get more kills and WP than the top 3 players on the other side and be given nothing in return.
I am actually planning to play a few amar FW matches, could use the special droplinks you have, not that little me will make that big a difference.
Not every Gallente match is a Victory, had four matches yesterday in a row with looses against the Caldari. I have started to run in cheap suits primarily, have SP capped but continue to play FW matches as I find them much more fun than pub matches. Even with 0 payout I would prefer FW matches over pub matches.
I promise to run allot of amar fw matches and will report back, might change my mind if every match is as bad as I hear on the forums.
The Gallente/Amar preference is not bad, the EVE sisters of eve faction is Gallente/Amar, for RP reasons I can support Amar as well as the Gallente. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
680
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 13:37:00 -
[72] - Quote
Acturus Galaxy wrote:John Demonsbane wrote:Again, says the Gallente who's probably won 3/4 of his battles. Go ahead and play some Amarr FW. You won't lose standings for Gallente, so it's cool. Try that for a few days and see how much you like the losing side getting nothing.
Take a look at how all the asshats awox all match in the roles they are selecting to lose the battle instead of yielding the most WP or however you put it. Have fun losing 150,000 ISK to get more kills and WP than the top 3 players on the other side and be given nothing in return. I am actually planning to play a few amar FW matches, could use the special droplinks you have, not that little me will make that big a difference. Not every Gallente match is a Victory, had four matches yesterday in a row with looses against the Caldari. I have started to run in cheap suits primarily, have SP capped but continue to play FW matches as I find them much more fun than pub matches. Even with 0 payout I would prefer FW matches over pub matches. I promise to run allot of amar fw matches and will report back, might change my mind if every match is as bad as I hear on the forums. The Gallente/Amar preference is not bad, the EVE sisters of eve faction is Gallente/Amar, for RP reasons I can support Amar as well as the Gallente.
Please do. My CEO plays Gallente so I did some of those, they were quite refreshing. Couldn't follow him into minmatar though.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
376
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 14:48:00 -
[73] - Quote
Alright with some thought I have established a system for this
100 wp = 5 standing
Losers would be capped at 30 so a nice 600 would be rewarded
Winner's wp would be doubled for winning so a cap of 60 would be in order
Most likely a terrible system but hey at least I tryed?
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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Acturus Galaxy
Lo-Tech Solutions Ltd
299
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 15:29:00 -
[74] - Quote
Acturus Galaxy wrote:John Demonsbane wrote:Again, says the Gallente who's probably won 3/4 of his battles. Go ahead and play some Amarr FW. You won't lose standings for Gallente, so it's cool. Try that for a few days and see how much you like the losing side getting nothing.
Take a look at how all the asshats awox all match in the roles they are selecting to lose the battle instead of yielding the most WP or however you put it. Have fun losing 150,000 ISK to get more kills and WP than the top 3 players on the other side and be given nothing in return. I am actually planning to play a few amar FW matches, could use the special droplinks you have, not that little me will make that big a difference. Not every Gallente match is a Victory, had four matches yesterday in a row with looses against the Caldari. I have started to run in cheap suits primarily, have SP capped but continue to play FW matches as I find them much more fun than pub matches. Even with 0 payout I would prefer FW matches over pub matches. I promise to run allot of amar fw matches and will report back, might change my mind if every match is as bad as I hear on the forums. The Gallente/Amar preference is not bad, the EVE sisters of eve faction is Gallente/Amar, for RP reasons I can support Amar as well as the Gallente.
Allright 5 Amar FW matches played and 5 matches lost. All of them have been really close with just 1-5 bars left on the Minmartar MCC, so close. Very fun matches actually, I like the challenge and will continue a few more.
I did notice a fair amount of Amar team members jumping ship as soon as the Minmartar got ahead, bloody hard to turn the match when the Amar is running away from the match. I did do my best getting 1 in two of the matches.
Also, allot of Minmartar are using the Amar suits, seemed to be more frequent than on the amar side. They are a pain to fight with my scout shotgun, they are either amar heavies or minmartar logis.
And I see the Amar have a real challenge here, that CR is insanly strong. I ghouthg the rail rifle used by the Caldari was bad, but that is no match to the assault CR. Wow my scout melts in under a second even at 50+ meters. Against most other rifles I can get 2 shots with my shotgun, but this rifle melts me in an instant.
And with everyone on the Amar side giving up early the 3 proto Minimartar have it easy. Where are all the OP proto scrambler rifles and amar assault suits.
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Darth-Carbonite GIO
Dust2Dust.
Top Men.
296
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 15:53:00 -
[75] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:I've played 10-15 battles for the Amarr so far, averaging 1500 WP, topped the board (overall - both teams) in WP for close to 1/2 of them, and yet I have not advanced a single level yet. Disheartening.
I feel your pain 
Preeminent Scrambler Rifle User & Dropship Enthusiast
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SHANN da MAN
D3LTA FORC3
109
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 21:06:00 -
[76] - Quote
I think the solution to this is that players should get BOTH ...
NEG Standing points to whole team for losing battle
POS standing points for individual effort based on WP
So that at the end of battle some underperforming team members would come out of the match with NEG overall standing
And those that performed well / scored many WP would come out of the match with POS overall standing
This is a computer game, I'm sure it can handle the maths
nothing to see here ... move along
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Foley Jones
The Exemplars
Top Men.
378
|
Posted - 2013.12.15 21:49:00 -
[77] - Quote
Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote:John Demonsbane wrote:I've played 10-15 battles for the Amarr so far, averaging 1500 WP, topped the board (overall - both teams) in WP for close to 1/2 of them, and yet I have not advanced a single level yet. Disheartening. I feel your pain
Yeah its extremely frustrating
Im going to have gray hair by the time im 20 (im 17) at this rate
MY SP BRINGS ALL THE MERCS TO THE CHANNEL AND THEY ARE LIKE "Do you wanna squad up?" DAMN RIGHT I WANNA SQUAD UP
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