DUST Search - Monthly Subscription

KayDidYue wrote:

David Spd wrote:

KayDidYue wrote:

calvin b wrote:

This would be the final nail in the coffin of this game. I have spent enough on this game and cannot justify spending anymore, so if it did go this way I would leave.

Now this I really do not understand, as you would still be able to play the way you have been playing and it would be those that are willing to pay a subscription that would be providing the "free" to other players.

Despite "goodwill" free players are an integral part of free to play success. Free & paying players share a symbiotic relationship

Paying players' numbers are typically lower than free players in any free to play title. Free players are CONTENT for paying players. Free players are fickle and easily upset. Paying players usually less so. If you anger the free players they leave (yes, "i'm leaving" threads are normally just attention whoring, but players do actually leave without saying anything). Leaving less content for paying players.

People paying monthly for a free to play title are typically in it until the end, so as free players leave due to unhappiness the amount of people in a game slowly falls off until there's only a couple hundred (oftentimes less) people playing at any given time.

Dust may have solid numbers now but the general happiness level seems quite low right now. There is no guarantee numbers will go up, nor is there guarantee they will go down but the amount of hostility also influences player retention.

All of the games I've seen die haven't done it overnight and it sometimes takes years for a game to finally shut down, but if free players (or "one time customers) are constantly disgruntled then it's just a matter of time.

Actually, the numbers aren't solid right now. Eve players are agitated that the numbers are so low, and also that the quality of the players (which include their attitude) are very low compared to what they where told the numbers would be.

If you are looking at the numbers when you are logging in, don't think that that is the number of DUST players, because that is not the number of dust only players.

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KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 3	Posted - 2013.11.23 20:46:00 - [1] - Quote CCP, you seem to want to be able to bring in funds to help support your existence. You have been doing this by trying to sell items through AUR sales; and while sometimes it seems you have things too expensive, people have been doing this already. Well here is an idea, that I think many would be inclined to except. of course there will be many that will oppose this too, but by allowing someone to have a weapon subscription BPO (sBPO) and a dropsuit of choice (sBPO) while they are paying a monthly subscription, you would be able to pretty much depend on a monthly stipend. While I know that there would be many that would call this a "Pay to Win" as they already do, I have not thought of what you have been doing as such, but rather a "Pay to Advance" system that helps people advance faster. Of course having a monthly subscription system you would have to make it affordable, and you can get an idea of a price by observing what you get with the Plus system that PSN has in operation. So for instance a subscription for 30,000 AUR you get a 30 day active booster and a type of sBPO for a dropsuit of choice and an weapon of choice (including an officer weapon.) If you drop your subscription, you loose these items. If someone still wanted a passive booster, then they would still need to purchase them the same way that is currently in operation. Of course, for those that do not want to pay a monthly subscription, you would still have all the items for sale as is currently in operation, and for those that do not want to pay anything, they still get to play the way they have been playing - by not having to make any purchases. I think that this might be a good option to try to make some (and I think many) people happy, and at the same time, give your project a regular stipend that you could depend on to help you continue your operations. Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 329	Posted - 2013.11.23 20:55:00 - [2] - Quote I like it...flexible and gives options to casual and serious players. You can either pay as you go for accelerated SP and some items like now or subscribe for normally purchased items. What do you think the price point should be for this... EVE subscription is about $15 per month in the US, correct? Were you looking at that or something a little less? I think $10-12 per month might work. I don't know how much the PSN Plus costs on the ps3 but that would need to eventually be factored in.
God Hates Lags Red Star. EoN. 426	Posted - 2013.11.23 21:07:00 - [3] - Quote I like this idea, it's like an all you can eat buffet of weapons. Doubles ISK
KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 5	Posted - 2013.11.23 21:43:00 - [4] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: I like it...flexible and gives options to casual and serious players. You can either pay as you go for accelerated SP and some items like now or subscribe for normally purchased items. What do you think the price point should be for this... EVE subscription is about $15 per month in the US, correct? Were you looking at that or something a little less? I think $10-12 per month might work. I don't know how much the PSN Plus costs on the ps3 but that would need to eventually be factored in. I am not sure, that would have to be worked out. For instance, someone just starting couldn't use "Proto" gear, so maybe that would be the lowest priced, and as you advanced, you could upgrade your subscription and thereby upgrade your equipment. Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 5	Posted - 2013.11.23 21:44:00 - [5] - Quote God Hates Lags wrote: I like this idea, it's like an all you can eat buffet of weapons. lol... didn't even think of it this way... very funny Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
calvin b Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 990	Posted - 2013.11.23 21:48:00 - [6] - Quote This would be the final nail in the coffin of this game. I have spent enough on this game and cannot justify spending anymore, so if it did go this way I would leave. Do not eat the yellow snow
ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 506	Posted - 2013.11.23 21:50:00 - [7] - Quote Officer weapon BPOs? You can't possibly be serious about this. "NO FULL RESPECS; ONLY FOR VEHICLE SKILLS CHANGED TREE!" Vehicle users : "lol gonna put it into infantry skills"
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 10567	Posted - 2013.11.23 22:01:00 - [8] - Quote CPM been in discussion about enabling a subscription program and what sort of offerings could be made in it, however it shouldn't be 'an exclusive' club to the point subscribers get things the light and freemium buyers cannot obtain. Either way talks are ongoing. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier Specialist Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
David Spd Caldari State 95	Posted - 2013.11.23 22:26:00 - [9] - Quote Nothing good can come from a subscription option. Basically you'll have all the EVE players paying for two monthly subs and think they're entitled to something similar to what EVE is offering. And IWS you can't honestly believe CCP will be able to "properly" implement such a thing, do you? Their track record on "premium" content for Dust is atrocious. Not to mention seemingly all decisions in the marketing area are just pants backwards batshit crazy. I've said it before & I'll say it again: the last thing we need is for two EVE Online MMOs. Maybe a subscription option would be feasible much MUCH later down the line (as in, years from now) when CCP finally has content to justify paying monthly, and has finally decided what balance should be like... But talking about and even considering such a thing now is just ludicrous. --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <-- "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1151	Posted - 2013.11.23 22:26:00 - [10] - Quote So another DCUO yaaay!!! We all know how they make their money. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein

Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 330	Posted - 2013.11.23 22:39:00 - [11] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: CPM been in discussion about enabling a subscription program and what sort of offerings could be made in it, however it shouldn't be 'an exclusive' club to the point subscribers get things the light and freemium buyers cannot obtain. Either way talks are ongoing. That's pretty much where my heads at...optimizing subscriptions for consistent players that essentially "fet their money's worth" anyway, HOWEVER, we must protect the free to play aspect so that you can be a viable player and not spend a dime if you wish. Might take you a steeper grind but there should be no direct items or skills that don't have ISK or AUR equivalent in reach of non-subscription players.
Anarchide Greedy Bastards 1533	Posted - 2013.11.23 22:48:00 - [12] - Quote Please don't Seriously Greedy Bastards' Hate Lord
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 1918	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:03:00 - [13] - Quote $15 per month gets you active and passive skill boosts for the duration. That's close to buying the boosters now but less of a hassle. Handing out officer gear or other special gear is both unfair and the subscriber will probably end up with a stack of gear they can't use. Plus, could probably be sold for far too much. // Logistics / Scout / Dropship Pilot Trainee // https://twitter.com/reesnoturana
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 10569	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:07:00 - [14] - Quote David Spd wrote: Nothing good can come from a subscription option. Basically you'll have all the EVE players paying for two monthly subs and think they're entitled to something similar to what EVE is offering. And IWS you can't honestly believe CCP will be able to "properly" implement such a thing, do you? Their track record on "premium" content for Dust is atrocious. Not to mention seemingly all decisions in the marketing area are just pants backwards batshit crazy. I've said it before & I'll say it again: the last thing we need is two EVE Online MMOs. Maybe a subscription option would be feasible much MUCH later down the line (as in, years from now) when CCP finally has content to justify paying monthly, and has finally decided what balance should be like... But talking about and even considering such a thing now is just ludicrous. You have to consider that the CPM just recently managed to secure marketing's ear, turnaround will take some time. I can't change the past but influencing the future is something the CPM is doing. We're just slightly upset there is no racial parity yet or full lineup of roles for most of the races. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier Specialist Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
David Spd Caldari State 95	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:15:00 - [15] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: Might take you a steeper grind but there should be no direct items or skills that don't have ISK or AUR equivalent in reach of non-subscription players. That is the exactly the reason why subscription option is a bad idea. That's one of the "most viable" options when considering a "premium" service for Dust. increasing SP gains in one way or another. Gaps between newbies and vets is all ready the worst part of experiencing Dust. Casuals might pay for consistent SP gains tied to a monthly "premium" option but Hardcore elitists that live, breathe, eat and ** Dust will be the primary sales of such a thing. People with more SP get even further ahead from the rest and just because they can afford to pay for it. It might not be "pay to win" but it certainly doesn't create any appeal for someone that's getting six-man proto stomped in every game he plays. Locking content behind a pay wall will doubtingly cause Dust to die a slow, painful death with nothing but bitter newbies and vets alike spitting venom at the paying players that get better rewards for doing the same thing that others are doing, so that's not even an option. People all ready fight like cats & dogs on these forums and doing anything that even slightly smells of "pay to win" will cause a never ending feud that will likely last until the end of time. In my opinion (and experience with free to play) the most viable options to offer with subscriptions with least backlash is: A. Increased gains (with free having no "penalties") B. Early access to gameplay content (with no permanent exclusive game impacting items) C. "Free" bought currency monthly just for having a subscription These ideas are still incredibly bad due to the unique nature of Dust for the following reasons: A. Creating an even larger SP gap (and awarding more SP for doing nothing) contradicts all the efforts CCP is putting into lessening the "SP sinks" B. Paywall limits players taking part in content. Game went into release with bare minimum and forcing people to pay to get things they want in a reasonable timeframe is hard to justify or excuse C. Getting "free" aurum each month might be nice for newbies but "vets" don't have need for most Proto. consumables. It also creates a similar issue CCP recently address by BPO removal: free ISK without risk to the player. --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <--** "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
xLuca Brasi DUST University Ivy League 64	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:15:00 - [16] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: David Spd wrote: Nothing good can come from a subscription option. Basically you'll have all the EVE players paying for two monthly subs and think they're entitled to something similar to what EVE is offering. And IWS you can't honestly believe CCP will be able to "properly" implement such a thing, do you? Their track record on "premium" content for Dust is atrocious. Not to mention seemingly all decisions in the marketing area are just pants backwards batshit crazy. I've said it before & I'll say it again: the last thing we need is two EVE Online MMOs. Maybe a subscription option would be feasible much MUCH later down the line (as in, years from now) when CCP finally has content to justify paying monthly, and has finally decided what balance should be like... But talking about and even considering such a thing now is just ludicrous. You have to consider that the CPM just recently managed to secure marketing's ear, turnaround will take some time. I can't change the past but influencing the future is something the CPM is doing. We're just slightly upset there is no racial parity yet or full lineup of roles for most of the races. maybe they are waiting to add this until they can tie it in to a good excuse to remove all our bpo's. SAY NO TO BPO REMOVALS!
David Spd Caldari State 95	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:21:00 - [17] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: David Spd wrote: Nothing good can come from a subscription option. Basically you'll have all the EVE players paying for two monthly subs and think they're entitled to something similar to what EVE is offering. And IWS you can't honestly believe CCP will be able to "properly" implement such a thing, do you? Their track record on "premium" content for Dust is atrocious. Not to mention seemingly all decisions in the marketing area are just pants backwards batshit crazy. I've said it before & I'll say it again: the last thing we need is two EVE Online MMOs. Maybe a subscription option would be feasible much MUCH later down the line (as in, years from now) when CCP finally has content to justify paying monthly, and has finally decided what balance should be like... But talking about and even considering such a thing now is just ludicrous. You have to consider that the CPM just recently managed to secure marketing's ear, turnaround will take some time. I can't change the past but influencing the future is something the CPM is doing. We're just slightly upset there is no racial parity yet or full lineup of roles for most of the races. I'm all for discussing options, but please don't press CCP for monthly subscriptions. The risk vs. reward (at least in my opinion) is just too heavily favoring risk right now and the last thing CCP needs is more ammunition from their all ready bitter playerbase. --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <-- "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
Suanar Daranaus Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 62	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:27:00 - [18] - Quote Don't think it's a good idea. This game started free and lets keep it that way. If you have the money for a subsription then you have the money for AUR. Don't ruin a good thing.
KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 5	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:39:00 - [19] - Quote calvin b wrote: This would be the final nail in the coffin of this game. I have spent enough on this game and cannot justify spending anymore, so if it did go this way I would leave. Now this I really do not understand, as you would still be able to play the way you have been playing and it would be those that are willing to pay a subscription that would be providing the "free" to other players. Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 272	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:41:00 - [20] - Quote Sorry, but this is a bad idea. BPOs are bad for the economy. Period. CCP will not do this. Long Live Freedom; Long Live the Federation.

KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 5	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:42:00 - [21] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: CPM been in discussion about enabling a subscription program and what sort of offerings could be made in it, however it shouldn't be 'an exclusive' club to the point subscribers get things the light and freemium buyers cannot obtain. Either way talks are ongoing. This wouldn't either, as of right now people do get "free" officers weapons. This was a suggestion to include an incentive for possibly a premium subscription. Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 1919	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:46:00 - [22] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: We're just slightly upset there is no racial parity yet or full lineup of roles for most of the races. I've looked at the credits and the DUST team doesn't seem that small. Why is it taking so long to deliver these assets? I'm not a game dev but I'd think they could ship a whole class of weapons across racial lines every two to three months. // Logistics / Scout / Dropship Pilot Trainee // https://twitter.com/reesnoturana
David Spd Caldari State 95	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:48:00 - [23] - Quote KayDidYue wrote: calvin b wrote: This would be the final nail in the coffin of this game. I have spent enough on this game and cannot justify spending anymore, so if it did go this way I would leave. Now this I really do not understand, as you would still be able to play the way you have been playing and it would be those that are willing to pay a subscription that would be providing the "free" to other players. Despite "goodwill" free players are an integral part of free to play success. Free & paying players share a symbiotic relationship Paying players' numbers are typically lower than free players in any free to play title. Free players are CONTENT for paying players. Free players are fickle and easily upset. Paying players usually less so. If you anger the free players they leave (yes, "i'm leaving" threads are normally just attention whoring, but players do actually leave without saying anything). Leaving less content for paying players. People playing monthly for a free to play title are typically in it until the end, so as free players leave due to unhappiness the amount of people in a game slowly falls off until there's only a couple hundred (oftentimes less) people playing at any given time. Dust may have solid numbers now but the general happiness level seems quite low right now. There is no guarantee numbers will go up, nor is there guarantee they will go down but the amount of hostility also influences player retention. All of the games I've seen die haven't done it overnight and it sometimes takes years for a game to finally shut down, but if free players (or "one time customers) are constantly disgruntled then it's just a matter of time. --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <-- "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
mollerz Minja Scouts 938	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:51:00 - [24] - Quote I couldn't see someone who wanted to play a scout or a heavy subscribing. And once you have 20 mil plus SPs, why bother subscribing?
KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 9	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:54:00 - [25] - Quote David Spd wrote: KayDidYue wrote: calvin b wrote: This would be the final nail in the coffin of this game. I have spent enough on this game and cannot justify spending anymore, so if it did go this way I would leave. Now this I really do not understand, as you would still be able to play the way you have been playing and it would be those that are willing to pay a subscription that would be providing the "free" to other players. Despite "goodwill" free players are an integral part of free to play success. Free & paying players share a symbiotic relationship Paying players' numbers are typically lower than free players in any free to play title. Free players are CONTENT for paying players. Free players are fickle and easily upset. Paying players usually less so. If you anger the free players they leave (yes, "i'm leaving" threads are normally just attention whoring, but players do actually leave without saying anything). Leaving less content for paying players. People paying monthly for a free to play title are typically in it until the end, so as free players leave due to unhappiness the amount of people in a game slowly falls off until there's only a couple hundred (oftentimes less) people playing at any given time. Dust may have solid numbers now but the general happiness level seems quite low right now. There is no guarantee numbers will go up, nor is there guarantee they will go down but the amount of hostility also influences player retention. All of the games I've seen die haven't done it overnight and it sometimes takes years for a game to finally shut down, but if free players (or "one time customers) are constantly disgruntled then it's just a matter of time. Actually, the numbers aren't solid right now. Eve players are agitated that the numbers are so low, and also that the quality of the players (which include their attitude) are very low compared to what they where told the numbers would be. If you are looking at the numbers when you are logging in, don't think that that is the number of DUST players, because that is not the number of dust only players. Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
David Spd Caldari State 98	Posted - 2013.11.23 23:55:00 - [26] - Quote KayDidYue wrote: David Spd wrote: KayDidYue wrote: calvin b wrote: This would be the final nail in the coffin of this game. I have spent enough on this game and cannot justify spending anymore, so if it did go this way I would leave. Now this I really do not understand, as you would still be able to play the way you have been playing and it would be those that are willing to pay a subscription that would be providing the "free" to other players. Despite "goodwill" free players are an integral part of free to play success. Free & paying players share a symbiotic relationship Paying players' numbers are typically lower than free players in any free to play title. Free players are CONTENT for paying players. Free players are fickle and easily upset. Paying players usually less so. If you anger the free players they leave (yes, "i'm leaving" threads are normally just attention whoring, but players do actually leave without saying anything). Leaving less content for paying players. People paying monthly for a free to play title are typically in it until the end, so as free players leave due to unhappiness the amount of people in a game slowly falls off until there's only a couple hundred (oftentimes less) people playing at any given time. Dust may have solid numbers now but the general happiness level seems quite low right now. There is no guarantee numbers will go up, nor is there guarantee they will go down but the amount of hostility also influences player retention. All of the games I've seen die haven't done it overnight and it sometimes takes years for a game to finally shut down, but if free players (or "one time customers) are constantly disgruntled then it's just a matter of time. Actually, the numbers aren't solid right now. Eve players are agitated that the numbers are so low, and also that the quality of the players (which include their attitude) are very low compared to what they where told the numbers would be. If you are looking at the numbers when you are logging in, don't think that that is the number of DUST players, because that is not the number of dust only players. Even more reason for CCP to tread VERY lightly then. --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <-- "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
KayDidYue Mercenaries On Duty 9	Posted - 2013.11.24 00:03:00 - [27] - Quote David Spd wrote: Even more reason for CCP to tread VERY lightly then. Oh I do agree with this, as it should be well discussed; which IMHO the discussion should be include the entire community as I believe that if left to them alone, it could be the straw that breaks... Male or female, noob or pro, my SR is steady, and my trigger ready. Walk or run, if you're in my scope, you will die!
David Spd Caldari State 98	Posted - 2013.11.24 00:16:00 - [28] - Quote KayDidYue wrote: David Spd wrote: Even more reason for CCP to tread VERY lightly then. Oh I do agree with this, as it should be well discussed; which IMHO the discussion should be include the entire community as I believe that if left to them alone, it could be the straw that breaks... Agreed but it doesn't seem like CCP's style, unfortunately... --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <-- "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 10576	Posted - 2013.11.24 00:19:00 - [29] - Quote KayDidYue wrote: David Spd wrote: Even more reason for CCP to tread VERY lightly then. Oh I do agree with this, as it should be well discussed; which IMHO the discussion should be include the entire community as I believe that if left to them alone, it could be the straw that breaks... Well if you want to talk about what you think a subscription program would look like I am all ears. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier Specialist Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 1358	Posted - 2013.11.24 03:05:00 - [30] - Quote Double the current content and a tangible Eve/Dust connection and then, maybe you can sell subscriptions. This is another year out, minimum. Again, something probably not to even begin to consider until the PS4 port is ready to roll. Cheeseburgers.



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