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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
133679
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Posted - 2013.10.18 17:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
If you have not done so, please read the introduction post here.
Standings Standings, simply put, are your relationship to a specific corporation. The general idea is that as you gain standings to each side of factional contracts your rewards for that side go up as well. This gives you incentive to gain higher standings and to keep it high. We are not ready to give out exact numbers yet, but at each level of standings (1 through 10) the amount of loyalty points paid out at the end of a match would change. The higher the standings, the higher the reward.
Gaining and Losing Standings You gain standings when you win a factional contract match. At the same time however you lose some standings to the opposing side. So if you win a battle for the Gallente you will gain standings with the Federal Marines and lose standings towards the State Peacekeepers. If you play a match from beginning to end and win you will gain 50 points of standings toward the side you won for and you will lose 10 points of standing for the side you fought against. If you lose the match you do not gain or lose any standings period.
Fancy graph:
Faction Boosters Boosting Standings We will be adding 4 new boosters to the game that you can buy for Aurum from the market. The prices for these new faction boosters has not yet been decided. These boosters will do several things. Firstly, they will increase your standings reward by 50% for the appropriate faction. So if you buy the Gallente booster and play for Gallente in factional contracts and you would have gotten 50 standing points you would instead get 75 with the Gallente booster. Secondly, they will prevent you from losing standings to the selected side by fighting for the other side. So if you play for the Caldari side and have a Gallente booster you will not lose standings to the Gallente as you normally would. Game Designer // Team True Grit http://twitter.com/regnerba |
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Brush Master
HavoK Core RISE of LEGION
914
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 17:58:00 -
[2] - Quote
How will you encourage players to fight for the faction that has the least amount of districts? How about some big LP Bonuses to switch sides?
I am having a big negative thought to the 4 different boosters to the market. Why not make it just one booster and keep it simple? It seems you are encourage players to pick one side and stick with it but is that in the best interested for keeping wars going? players switching sides for the best rewards? Like PS2 for constant ongoing battle where if one side is losing, they are going to reward you better to come in and help them. |
Cyrius Li-Moody
The New Age Outlaws
1374
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
To make this clear, you will continue to lose standings as normal if you use a booster and continue to team kill, correct? I worry there will be an issue of people "paying to grief" depending the price of these boosters. If they're cheap then it'll be annoying if people just buy a booster for a side just to TK without getting removed. |
Heinz Doofenshertz
BetaMax.
522
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
I disagree with the booster preventing standings loss. but the rest of it looks decent |
Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2795
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:To make this clear, you will continue to lose standings as normal if you use a booster and continue to team kill, correct? I worry there will be an issue of people "paying to grief" depending the price of these boosters. If they're cheap then it'll be annoying if people just buy a booster for a side just to TK without getting removed.
That would indeed be disturbing...
Like paying real money for a "license to kill". |
Forlorn Destrier
Bullet Cluster
2076
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
In the introductory post, it stated if you lose enough standings with a faction you would no longer be able to join in the battle on that facion's side. How would a mercenary locked out of factional warfare regain standings with that corporation if they are unable to fight for them in the factional warfare battle? |
Forlorn Destrier
Bullet Cluster
2076
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
Heinz Doofenshertz wrote:I disagree with the booster preventing standings loss. but the rest of it looks decent
Maybe reduce standing loss by 50% as well? Instead of losing 10 points, you lose 5? |
Sanguine 27
ZionTCD
14
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:08:00 -
[8] - Quote
I think you should still earn and lose standings points whether you win or lose a fight. Too much grinding otherwise |
Forlorn Destrier
Bullet Cluster
2076
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:09:00 -
[9] - Quote
Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:To make this clear, you will continue to lose standings as normal if you use a booster and continue to team kill, correct? I worry there will be an issue of people "paying to grief" depending the price of these boosters. If they're cheap then it'll be annoying if people just buy a booster for a side just to TK without getting removed.
Perhaps he is only referring to the points awarded at the end of the match, and not for activity that happens during the match? |
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
1738
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:11:00 -
[10] - Quote
If you lose, how are standings effected?
If you happen to fight for a faction during a public contract that has standings toward you can you get standings from winning those matches? |
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CCP Logibro
C C P C C P Alliance
2909
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:13:00 -
[11] - Quote
Sanguine 27 wrote:I think you should still earn and lose standings points whether you win or lose a fight. Too much grinding otherwise
You do still gain loyalty points if you lose a match, so long as you remain in the match until it completes. You only don't receive a standings boost if you lose a match. CCP Logibro // EVE Universe Community Team // Distributor of Nanites // Patron Saint of Logistics
@CCP_Logibro |
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Heinz Doofenshertz
BetaMax.
522
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:17:00 -
[12] - Quote
Forlorn Destrier wrote:Heinz Doofenshertz wrote:I disagree with the booster preventing standings loss. but the rest of it looks decent Maybe reduce standing loss by 50% as well? Instead of losing 10 points, you lose 5?
Put yourself into the mind of the leader of a factions militia. You have an implant that tracks Bunnies on the field and grant them bonuses for fighting for you. Why in the heck would you reward mercs with your implant for fighting against you by not knocking their standing.
Personally I think it should be a trade off. If you have a gal/minmatar implant and fight for them you get a boost, but if you fight against them you get a larger negative. instead of 10 you lose 15 or 20 for fighting against the faction you have an implant for. |
Gorra Snell
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
177
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sanguine 27 wrote:I think you should still earn and lose standings points whether you win or lose a fight. Too much grinding otherwise
I generally agree, particularly given how little effect you individually have on the outcome of a battle, but I like the incentive to win. So, I'd prefer a much-reduced standings gain for an FW loss...somewhere in the 10-20 range.
Scrubs need love too. |
General John Ripper
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
3741
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:25:00 -
[14] - Quote
approved |
Magnus Amadeuss
DUST University Ivy League
93
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
I agree with the lesser faction gains/loss even when you lose and here is my reasoning.
If you were to join lets say the gallente FW side, then continuously suicide yourself, you would loose no standings to caldari but in effect be helping them win with no consequence. |
Sanguine 27
ZionTCD
14
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:32:00 -
[16] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:Sanguine 27 wrote:I think you should still earn and lose standings points whether you win or lose a fight. Too much grinding otherwise You do still gain loyalty points if you lose a match, so long as you remain in the match until it completes. You only don't receive a standings boost if you lose a match.
I must have been editing my post for mixing Loyalty with Standing points as you were replying. Now my post makes more sense, hopefully :) |
Aikuchi Tomaru
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1070
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:33:00 -
[17] - Quote
Brush Master wrote:How will you encourage players to fight for the faction that has the least amount of districts? How about some big LP Bonuses to switch sides?
I am having a big negative thought to the 4 different boosters to the market. Why not make it just one booster and keep it simple? It seems you are encourage players to pick one side and stick with it but is that in the best interested for keeping wars going? players switching sides for the best rewards? Like PS2 for constant ongoing battle where if one side is losing, they are going to reward you better to come in and help them.
I agree. Also we are mercenaries. While many of us, especially those in Corps which have connection to Eve-FW-Corps, took sides, many blueberries just don't. They fight for the highest bidder. They are mercs after all. A normal booster would encourage that. So in the end you should have the corps who fight for their side, no matter that. But you would also have mercenaries who just fight for their own good. |
Heinz Doofenshertz
BetaMax.
524
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:33:00 -
[18] - Quote
Magnus Amadeuss wrote:I agree with the lesser faction gains/loss even when you lose and here is my reasoning.
If you were to join lets say the gallente FW side, then continuously suicide yourself, you would loose no standings to caldari but in effect be helping them win with no consequence.
I agree, Sand Bagging should not be encouraged. Between the Implant and no standings effect for losing, this is a sand baggers dream |
Magnus Amadeuss
DUST University Ivy League
93
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:33:00 -
[19] - Quote
Also will these standings have secondary effects?
In eve, gainign faction standings with the amarr also benefits the caldari standings, while hurting bith minmatar and gallente standings. Will this also be the case in dust? |
Vespasian Andendare
Subsonic Synthesis Alpha Wolf Pack
502
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:35:00 -
[20] - Quote
I think the boosters are probably a good idea, as it incentivizes playing for one faction as well as removing a penalty if you decide to fight for the others to gain standings, etc.
With respect to the boosters, will it be possible to have all 4 active at once? If not, how will you handle if someone has, say, a Caldari booster implanted and then wants to use a Gallente booster?
Also, have you guys ever considered adding in a booster that works on a per-fight basis? Then, I can buy a booster that's good for 10, 15, 20, etc. matches, and I don't necessarily have to worry if real life comes up and I'll lose my 1-day, 3-day, etc. booster. |
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Drix Friggson
DUST University Ivy League
2
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:37:00 -
[21] - Quote
Looks awesome here
Side thought / Potential idea
Team killing a higher level player in a faction hits harder than it would an irregular player.
i.e. Player 1 is a level 8 with the Gallente playing Faction Warfare Exclusively and Player 2 just trying out faction warfare is a level 1 with the Gallente.
Player 3 comes along killing Player 2 and receives a minor hit for team killing them. Player 3 sees player 1 and kills him next. Player 3 receives a slightly harder hit to their factional standing.
Not enough to really make a difference, but at least the difference is there. Also it would allow people actually fighting on the behalf of the their faction as the awoxer is probably not a very high level in the faction they are team killing
Edit, just realized this might be more geared toward the Team Killing thread, but as it mostly related to standing I jumped on it here. |
shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon DARKSTAR ARMY
787
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
How will we gain standings if we fight for 2 neutral factions? For example: i play for minmatar and i fight against amarr, so i will gain standings for minmatar, but if i play with gallente what happens? Do i loose standings with minmatar? For what i understand we can choose 2 sides. |
RydogV
Shadow Company HQ
448
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:51:00 -
[23] - Quote
It seems like if you play the field you could still keep your standing relatively high across all Factions. That is a good feature and maintains the Mercenary based aspect of the game.
The boosters are a great idea too. Both from a Meta game perspective and a marketing tool. Players who choose to can 'support' their favorite faction by purchasing the appropriate booster but does not force them to pick a side in any permanent way.. Also creates a good source of income to help support development provided the cost is reasonable.
Obviously, you have provided a limited amount of information and I hope we will be clued into any enhancements to this rough sketch as they are fleshed out. My only major concern at this point is Faction balance contingencies. The limited number of Faction Warfare centric events we have had so far show that the four Factions are never equally represented. I hope the incentives will work to create more balance across the major powers. |
Earl Crushinator
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
161
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 18:59:00 -
[24] - Quote
Vespasian Andendare wrote: Also, have you guys ever considered adding in a booster that works on a per-fight basis? Then, I can buy a booster that's good for 10, 15, 20, etc. matches, and I don't necessarily have to worry if real life comes up and I'll lose my 1-day, 3-day, etc. booster.
Ah, I would really like something like this. Even just a single one of these one would be sufficient - you could just buy more as needed, no real need for variations.
While the standing loss is fairly minor for the opposing side, I don't think the boosters should negate this effect. Currently, you'd only have to play 1 match for every 5 on the otherside, to keep them happy. With a booster it's even less.
Seems fine to me. |
IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
227
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 19:19:00 -
[25] - Quote
Posted this in general thread but think it goes here as well.
Could also use a militia chat channels once we reach a specific reward level so we can coordinate or notify EVE pilots of needed OB support. |
Karl Koekwaus
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
194
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 19:19:00 -
[26] - Quote
What about recycling alts for griefing purposes? |
Goric Rumis
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
222
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 19:58:00 -
[27] - Quote
Overall, I like it. I question some of the mechanics of the boosters. I don't like the idea of boosters neutralizing standings loss while adding 50% to standings gain. If they instead boost standings gain and leave standings loss alone, you'll still be able to gain standings with all four factions a lot quicker than you would if you had no boosters. For instance:
I fight 50 matches for Caldari. My standings points are (boosted in parentheses): C: 2500 (3750) G: -500 (-500) A: 0 (0) T--I mean M: 0 (0)
Then I fight 50 matches for Gallente. Now my standings points are:
C: 2000 (3250) G: 2000 (3250) A: 0 (0) M: 0 (0)
So in total I get a 62.5% boost to my combined standings. Over the same 100 fights, the booster mechanism in the OP would give me an 87.5% boost to combined standings.
In other words, the default standings booster would be almost as effective as a hypothetical "Omega" version should be.
Vespasian Andendare wrote:Also, have you guys ever considered adding in a booster that works on a per-fight basis? Then, I can buy a booster that's good for 10, 15, 20, etc. matches, and I don't necessarily have to worry if real life comes up and I'll lose my 1-day, 3-day, etc. booster. This isn't a bad idea--it makes winning each match even more critical, since your booster will count down whether you win or lose.
One more thing: will there be any type of standings decay if I don't fight for a faction for a long time? Should there be? |
steadyhand amarr
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
1600
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 20:25:00 -
[28] - Quote
can we please please earn ranks like we do in EvE its a nice little thing to encourage people to stick around |
S Park Finner
DUST University Ivy League
336
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 20:54:00 -
[29] - Quote
Vespasian Andendare wrote:... Also, have you guys ever considered adding in a booster that works on a per-fight basis? Then, I can buy a booster that's good for 10, 15, 20, etc. matches, and I don't necessarily have to worry if real life comes up and I'll lose my 1-day, 3-day, etc. booster. This is an excellent idea. I hope it gets passed along to the Arum products folks. |
Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
1499
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 20:56:00 -
[30] - Quote
I think to solve the "I'm a mercenary,I fight for the highest bidder" thing, standings should be affected based on your 'loyalty'.
So maybe for the first 3 standings levels, you lose the same amount of standing with the faction you're opposed to as you gain, and LP rewards do not increase. Essentially this allows for those who wish to jump around for rewards they want not the rewards their faction gives, they can without ending up being forced to stick to one faction because their standing and rewards are so high it's pointless and a waste to grind in the opposing side.
But for those whose hearts are set on a faction, after progressing beyond level 3 standings LP rewards start getting much better.
To complement this, their should be events for certain factions where LP cost for items go down, perhaps when the relevant corporation really needs a push in their FW. Casual, non-aligned mercs can freely switch to that faction to fight for the cheaper rewards, without being worried about screwing up their standings with the opposing faction too much.
Hell, it could even be linked to EVE in that there's a way for EVE players to pay ISK to lower the LP reward cost of a certain faction to encourage mercs to fight for that faction. |
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Aeon Amadi
A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S.
3361
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 21:42:00 -
[31] - Quote
Assuming each game is 20 minutes.
2000 (wins) multiplied by 20 minutes = 40,000 minutes divided by 60 minutes = 666 hours.
Conspiracy theories aside, the amount of matches required for these standing levels are a bit extreme. The longest time I've ever spent in any one game was Battlefield 2 and that was about 550 hours, I'm probably not going to spend nearly as much doing Faction Warfare, let alone winning consecutively.
Edit: Now if it were 1542 (wins) multiplied by 20 minutes = 30,840 minutes divided by 60 minutes = 514 hours........... |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
4503
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 22:00:00 -
[32] - Quote
So let me get this straight.
If I fit a Gallente booster, but join Minmatar militia against the Amarr, I still lose standings with the Amarr? |
Jadek Menaheim
WarRavens League of Infamy
153
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 22:15:00 -
[33] - Quote
Vespasian Andendare wrote:Also, have you guys ever considered adding in a booster that works on a per-fight basis? Then, I can buy a booster that's good for 10, 15, 20, etc. matches, and I don't necessarily have to worry if real life comes up and I'll lose my 1-day, 3-day, etc. booster.
That's a really solid idea! |
Thor McStrut
Reckoners
238
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 22:41:00 -
[34] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:So let me get this straight.
If I fit a Gallente booster, but join Minmatar militia against the Amarr, I still lose standings with the Amarr?
It would seem so, according to the wording above. Is there something wrong with that? Seems legit. |
sammus420
Goonfeet Top Men.
347
|
Posted - 2013.10.18 22:51:00 -
[35] - Quote
What's to stop me from jumping in front of as many team mates guns as I can, with the intention of purposefully damaging their standings? I'll be running around in a free scout suit, following heavies on my team, and when they least expect it, I'll be right in the way of their bullets. Over. And over. And over. |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1855
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 00:13:00 -
[36] - Quote
OH WOW! you guys did some great work here, I see how it all works now! Genius.
So once I've won more matches for my team I've given more and more team kill forgiveness. Sweet. The only thing I'd still suggest is always forgiving squad team kills. At least at 1st until you can add an option to turn it off, but leave it on by default. If we think there is someone in our squad team killing on purpose we already have the ability to kick him from the squad and then his team kills would be counted normally.
Pleeeease take my suggestion into consideration. |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1855
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 00:15:00 -
[37] - Quote
sammus420 wrote:What's to stop me from jumping in front of as many team mates guns as I can, with the intention of purposefully damaging their standings? I'll be running around in a free scout suit, following heavies on my team, and when they least expect it, I'll be right in the way of their bullets. Over. And over. And over.
Maybe militia gear should be banned from FW matches. Not that it solves the whole problem but it would get rid of free suits from FW. you bring up an interesting point I hope more people will discuss. |
Talos Vagheitan
King Slayers
96
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 01:30:00 -
[38] - Quote
I can't wait until this is implemented!
I don't agree with boosters that allow you to fight against your empire without consequence though. Seems like it would just take away from the 'realness' of the FW battles |
deepfried salad gilliam
Sanguine Knights
80
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 01:54:00 -
[39] - Quote
Sanguine 27 wrote:I think you should still earn and lose standings points whether you win or lose a fight. Too much grinding otherwise I think you should lose 10 to enemy regardless of win/loss, but only gain the 50 for wins. Just to encourage team work and play to win |
Denn Maell
PIanet Express
12
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 02:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
sammus420 wrote:What's to stop me from jumping in front of as many team mates guns as I can, with the intention of purposefully damaging their standings? I'll be running around in a free scout suit, following heavies on my team, and when they least expect it, I'll be right in the way of their bullets. Over. And over. And over.
As I understand it, the negative penalty should occur when a team mate successfully 'kills' a team mate. At first, it looks like CCP is going to not allow team killing for awhile, and when they do flip that switch, your 1 death will mean that much. However, this is New Eden...Corps getting betrayed by shady alt characters is sort of part and parcel in CCP's 'Player-Driven Experience' model.
So, yes. Expect griefing to be a viable past time in the future... |
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Ghural
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
160
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 03:26:00 -
[41] - Quote
I'm not liking the idea of the new boosters.
It seems like an idea to squeeze more money out of mercs.
Personally I think the existing active boosters should include a bonus to faction gain. |
SponkSponkSponk
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
409
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 03:44:00 -
[42] - Quote
Talos Vagheitan wrote: I don't agree with boosters that allow you to fight against your empire without consequence though. Seems like it would just take away from the 'realness' of the FW battles
Bonus for winning your faction's battle: okay.
No standings loss if you fight against your faction: not okay.
Should only get a free pass if you lose against your home faction. |
Beyobi
Soldiers Of One Network Orion Empire
117
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 05:27:00 -
[43] - Quote
At 50 points per win with a 10 point loss you would have no problem maxing out loyalty for all 4 factions. Unless this is intended, I believe a larger point loss with the opposing faction may be needed. Maybe a loss across all 3 factions you didn't fight for? |
Talos Vagheitan
King Slayers
102
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Posted - 2013.10.19 06:05:00 -
[44] - Quote
Will it be easier to gain standing with your own race?
I would assume it would be harder for a Caldari to earn standing for the GF, than it would to earn standing in the CS. |
pseudosnipre
DUST University Ivy League
272
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 06:15:00 -
[45] - Quote
Any model that lets a player achieve level 10 in all factions is foolish. Player trading will give access to all faction gear anyways so why grind all four? To prevent this you could
Decrease heavily from opposing faction -100 Decrease minimally from other two factions -15 Gain moderately for a win +50 Lose minimally for a loss -15
Also, loyalty points could be reduced by 1% per week to encourage maintaining loyalty to one faction only as maintaining all four at level 10 would be rather time intensive.
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abarkrishna
The Elysian Knights
14
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Posted - 2013.10.19 08:08:00 -
[46] - Quote
I have one and only issue.
unless i am mistaken if you buy a booster for the faction you want to fight for say gallente you can farm LP for gallente to gain certian rewards and then switch to another faction (caldari in this example) you can effectively get rewards for both factions with little to no consequence to layalty to either faction.
You could even buy a booster for each faction and have no negative effects and gain rewards for all of them without losing standngs/ LP
That is what worries me. |
Flint Beastgood III
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
267
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 11:31:00 -
[47] - Quote
crazy space 1 wrote:OH WOW! you guys did some great work here, I see how it all works now! Genius.
So once I've won more matches for my team I've given more and more team kill forgiveness. Sweet. The only thing I'd still suggest is always forgiving squad team kills. At least at 1st until you can add an option to turn it off, but leave it on by default. If we think there is someone in our squad team killing on purpose we already have the ability to kick him from the squad and then his team kills would be counted normally.
Pleeeease take my suggestion into consideration.
+1 for auto-forgiving squad TKs for reason stated above |
Kevall Longstride
DUST University Ivy League
588
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 14:43:00 -
[48] - Quote
I'm completely against the boosters completely removing standing loss for fighting for the other side.
This should be a game of consequence. You choose to fight for the Gallante so expect to not be liked by Caldari. It isn't pay to win, it's pay to get out of jail. And its price gouging as well.
Drop that part. |
Aero Yassavi
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
2907
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 14:48:00 -
[49] - Quote
Kevall Longstride wrote:I'm completely against the boosters completely removing standing loss for fighting for the other side.
This should be a game of consequence. You choose to fight for the Gallante so expect to not be liked by Caldari. It isn't pay to win, it's pay to get out of jail. And its price gouging as well.
Drop that part. It's also pay to grief. If you aren't losing standing for fighting for the other team, then you still have that standing to "spend" on griefing. |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1863
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 17:58:00 -
[50] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:Kevall Longstride wrote:I'm completely against the boosters completely removing standing loss for fighting for the other side.
This should be a game of consequence. You choose to fight for the Gallante so expect to not be liked by Caldari. It isn't pay to win, it's pay to get out of jail. And its price gouging as well.
Drop that part. It's also pay to grief. If you aren't losing standing for fighting for the other team, then you still have that standing to "spend" on griefing. omg.... P2G... the whole game should move that direction... $$$$$ |
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crazy space
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
1969
|
Posted - 2013.10.19 17:58:00 -
[51] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:Kevall Longstride wrote:I'm completely against the boosters completely removing standing loss for fighting for the other side.
This should be a game of consequence. You choose to fight for the Gallante so expect to not be liked by Caldari. It isn't pay to win, it's pay to get out of jail. And its price gouging as well.
Drop that part. It's also pay to grief. If you aren't losing standing for fighting for the other team, then you still have that standing to "spend" on griefing. omg.... P2G... the whole game should move that direction... $$$$$ |
crazy space 2100046106
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
1969
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Posted - 2013.10.19 17:58:00 -
[52] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:Kevall Longstride wrote:I'm completely against the boosters completely removing standing loss for fighting for the other side.
This should be a game of consequence. You choose to fight for the Gallante so expect to not be liked by Caldari. It isn't pay to win, it's pay to get out of jail. And its price gouging as well.
Drop that part. It's also pay to grief. If you aren't losing standing for fighting for the other team, then you still have that standing to "spend" on griefing. omg.... P2G... the whole game should move that direction... $$$$$ |
Evicer
THE HECATONCHIRES
18
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Posted - 2013.10.19 18:32:00 -
[53] - Quote
Heinz Doofenshertz wrote:I disagree with the booster preventing standings loss. but the rest of it looks decent Hienz in this case is right>fight against your Faction loose LP
EDIT:also these Boosters should only effect Fw and not pubs. |
Evicer
THE HECATONCHIRES
18
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Posted - 2013.10.19 19:50:00 -
[54] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote: Standings Standings, simply put, are your relationship to a specific corporation. The general idea is that as you gain standings to each side of factional contracts your rewards for that side go up as well. This gives you incentive to gain higher standings and to keep it high. We are not ready to give out exact numbers yet, but at each level of standings (1 through 10) the amount of loyalty points paid out at the end of a match would change. The higher the standings, the higher the reward.
Gaining and Losing Standings You gain standings when you win a factional contract match. At the same time however you lose some standings to the opposing side. So if you win a battle for the Gallente you will gain standings with the Federal Marines and lose standings towards the State Peacekeepers. If you play a match from beginning to end and win you will gain 50 points of standings toward the side you won for and you will lose 10 points of standing for the side you fought against. If you lose the match you do not gain or lose any standings period.
I think most people are kind of concerned about Awocsing and afking. So we have to ask our selves how do we keep another player from doing this? Example: Player 1 Minmatar loyalist sitting back in the redline sniping and generally not concerned if the Amarr win or loose.So hes simply in the match to farm kills and by not actively taking objectives he is forcing Player 2 Amarr loyalist to work that much harder to get player 1 a victory who is not contributing at all.Player 2 tried hard and lost alot of suits.He gains no LP.Player 1 losses no standings toward the Minmatar faction .Player 1 comes out ahead.Why?He didnt loose any gear, hes sniping.
More to come
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Absolute Idiom II
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
817
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Posted - 2013.10.19 23:19:00 -
[55] - Quote
So: Friendly Fire. It'll be great to introduce this to FW as it forces people to play better and stop merely relying on the lack of FF to spam grenades, OBs, etc and decimate only the enemy.
However there are 4 associated aspects to consider: 1) Griefing by intentional TKing 2) Griefing by partial damage to allies (e.g. via EMP grenades) leaving them vulnerable to enemy kills 3) Griefing by suiciding yourself (e.g. in front of an HMG or tank) 4) Collateral damage (i.e. accidental TKing)
The CCP proposed method on punishing TKing directly deals with 1) however allows an exploit/workaround via 2) and 3) and leads to harse punishment for inevitable accidental TKs via 4).
I have an idea for how to deal with FF incidents that I feel would be an improvement on the current offering.
a) all FF results in a milita standing decrease b) the standing decrease is immediate and = to the rank of the char who died * 10 c) TK 'assists' are counted at a 50% rate (as per the WP reward for kill assists) d) reaching 0 standing results in instant kick from match and 24hr ban
This results in a standing penalty equivalent to the importance [to the NPC militia] of the person who has been killed. You'll still have to deal with intentional TKing, but griefers will quickly burn through their standings, whilst also having a low impact when suiciding too.
Supplemental: Team Kick Vote
Separately there should be a Team Kick Vote functionality, in order to kick known griefers. 6 votes and you're kicked from the match. You can add also players to a permakick/dislike/block list in order to reduce being put into the same match as them. Likelihood decreases further as more players [in that team] have that individual 'blocked'. |
Master Jaraiya
Ultramarine Corp
1130
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Posted - 2013.10.20 07:00:00 -
[56] - Quote
I disagree with the point of standings not being raised for losses.
If I choose to fight for a particular Faction, my standings should go up for at least trying. If I win for my Faction of choice, my standings should go up even more.
Win or loss, my standings should go up.
Not rewarding an increase in standings for losses will cause the noob stomping proto bears to take complete control of FW, with little to no hope of this control ever getting challenged. They already have the advantage of being able to run better gear nonstop in every match because of the ridiculous amount of ISK they earn in PC.
They will use this advantage to stomp out any opposition in FW, max their Standings for their Faction, and ensure their place at the top of the pile of bloody, beaten noobs who will NEVER be able to afford the gear required to compete against these players.
Before anyone tries to say some dumb **** like "gear doesn't win" tell me, Have you ever seen anyone go into a PC match in anything less than the absolute best gear the game has to offer?
Most corps I'm aware of have a Prototype Requirement to even be considered for participation in PC. So, yes, gear DOES matter that much.
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Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1605
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Posted - 2013.10.20 14:14:00 -
[57] - Quote
Think I missed something here - how do these standings actually affect our rewards? How much more LP will we get at each level?
Also, is there a thread telling us what is available for LP? |
Vell0cet
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
430
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Posted - 2013.10.20 22:20:00 -
[58] - Quote
I'd like to see standings work like EVE where if I'm fighting for Amarr, I get (as an arbitrary example) +10 for Amarr, +5 for Caldari, -5 for Gallente, and -10 for Minmatar. This reinforces the two allying sides to FW. I also don't like the idea of boosters preventing standing loss; standing gains are fine. |
hgghyujh
expert intervention Caldari State
133
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Posted - 2013.10.23 09:15:00 -
[59] - Quote
hmmm I would like to see neg standings implemented with a separate way to gain back standings, instead of the 24 counter just not enough of a penalty. I mean in eve we have low level missions but that really can't be done here. I am excited to see what else standings get tied to eventually. |
Dirks Macker
Enlightened Infantries
93
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Posted - 2013.10.23 13:12:00 -
[60] - Quote
Is the negative standing just for team-killing or do you get it for team-damaging? |
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Medic 1879
Forsaken Immortals Top Men.
1155
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Posted - 2013.10.25 01:03:00 -
[61] - Quote
2000 games to get to level 10 seems totally excessive especially if your standing can be reset to 0 for some TK's (one dodgy OB and your done kind of thing.) Also having a booster that negates losing standings is wrong in my opinion this is new eden aren't you supposed to live with your actions. Also I could win one match with Gallente gain 50 for them and lose 10 for Caldari and then win with C gain 50 and lose 10 for G giving me a net 40 profit on each race, it should be gain 50 for one lose 50 for the other otherwise people will be able to have high standings in two empires at war which is silly in my opinion.
I also like the idea of gaining lesser standings with your allied nation G/M and A/C and losing a lesser amount for the other empire. |
Vinsarrow
New Eden Blades Of The Azure
44
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Posted - 2013.11.01 18:33:00 -
[62] - Quote
No offence I still think Dust 514 is awesome & going the right path but I just must say something to be honest. I like the booster idea in & of itself, but I just don't like how it's being implamented per say. Team Kills get added, followed by you Team Kill too much & your stance goes low enough to no more FW for you (that 1 in particular is wtf to me), then boosters are added? Seems alot leading up for RL $$$ to be made.... |
Jadd Hatchen
Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
13
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Posted - 2013.11.06 22:54:00 -
[63] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:If you have not done so, please read the introduction post here. StandingsStandings, simply put, are your relationship to a specific corporation. The general idea is that as you gain standings to each side of factional contracts your rewards for that side go up as well. This gives you incentive to gain higher standings and to keep it high. We are not ready to give out exact numbers yet, but at each level of standings (1 through 10) the amount of loyalty points paid out at the end of a match would change. The higher the standings, the higher the reward.
To be absolutely clear on this... These standings are only for your personal ones. You will not be implementing CORPORATION standings. Ie. if I play only for the Minmatar, but all my corp mates like to play for the Amarr, then their FW standings won't be detrimental to mine and vice versa?
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CAMille DANIELz
planetary retaliation organisation
0
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Posted - 2013.11.08 00:19:00 -
[64] - Quote
Gorra Snell wrote:Sanguine 27 wrote:I think you should still earn and lose standings points whether you win or lose a fight. Too much grinding otherwise I generally agree, particularly given how little effect you individually have on the outcome of a battle, but I like the incentive to win. So, I'd prefer a much-reduced standings gain for an FW loss...somewhere in the 10-20 range. Scrubs need love too.
This is largely untrue. The idea that "i can't make a difference" is endemic to this game. Aside from rubber-banding, I think that it is one of the reasons i've seen so many newberries running in circles on the MCC. You can't win at ANY skill level like this, and going into a game with this mindset is wrong. You might as well not play at all. |
Adun Red
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
57
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Posted - 2013.11.09 17:39:00 -
[65] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:If you have not done so, please read the introduction post here. StandingsStandings, simply put, are your relationship to a specific corporation. The general idea is that as you gain standings to each side of factional contracts your rewards for that side go up as well. This gives you incentive to gain higher standings and to keep it high. We are not ready to give out exact numbers yet, but at each level of standings (1 through 10) the amount of loyalty points paid out at the end of a match would change. The higher the standings, the higher the reward. Gaining and Losing StandingsYou gain standings when you win a factional contract match. At the same time however you lose some standings to the opposing side. So if you win a battle for the Gallente you will gain standings with the Federal Marines and lose standings towards the State Peacekeepers. If you play a match from beginning to end and win you will gain 50 points of standings toward the side you won for and you will lose 10 points of standing for the side you fought against. If you lose the match you do not gain or lose any standings period. Fancy graph: [img]http://i.imgur.com/qrKC9qq.png[/img] Faction Boosters Boosting StandingsWe will be adding 4 new boosters to the game that you can buy for Aurum from the market. The prices for these new faction boosters has not yet been decided. These boosters will do several things. Firstly, they will increase your standings reward by 50% for the appropriate faction. So if you buy the Gallente booster and play for Gallente in factional contracts and you would have gotten 50 standing points you would instead get 75 with the Gallente booster. Secondly, they will prevent you from losing standings to the selected side by fighting for the other side. So if you play for the Caldari side and have a Gallente booster you will not lose standings to the Gallente as you normally would.
I believe you should gain standings with who you fight for and lose some who you are against regardless if you win or lose. Please do not make us waste our time if we lose a match. Are you telling me the faction we fight for is not happy we are fighting for them unless we win? I understand the gain and loss will be much less. We should get something for our time and not just LP in my opinion.
Faction Boosters Boosting Standings , I do not think anything should stop us from losing standing for who we fight against. |
Keri Starlight
0uter.Heaven Proficiency V.
2026
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Posted - 2013.11.14 16:15:00 -
[66] - Quote
I would like some kind of particular reward for people playing FW to bring balance among the four races instead of fighting just for one or two of them.
This is somehow the idea behind CONCORD and, if you want to have better immersion, you should keep in mind that some bloodlines occupy particular positions and some Corporations are actually chasing an ideal of balance and equality, trying to preserve all the different cultures.
The Intaki are one example of a "difficult" position, as the Intaki Syndacate doesn't get any help from the Federation and some Intaki have no interest in fighting for the Gallente or the Caldari (since some of the Intaki joined the Caldari, but it didn't end well). Many Intaki are actually interested in peace and balance and the Syndacate has members of all the races.
Another example, indeed, the CONCORD members and the most Liberal Corporations. Many people in CONCORD come from the Ishukone Corporation, which actively helped the Minmatar. Even people who didn't play EVE know that they build weapons for the Minmatar (Ishukone Nova Knives, Ishukone SMG). Even if Caldari, they are actually looking forward to some sort of preservation and free exchange. In particular, the Achura are particularly interested in this kind of ideologies, especially the Stargazers (this is what I though for my character, but it has no relevance until DUST gets some real depth. No one even know I'm Achura :( ...).
I really hope this will be considered. I want some depth in DUST. I really do.
-1.7 ranges: AR 42m -> 48m, TAR 65m -> 60m
-Goodbye my love, Tac AR
"I load my gun with love instead of bullets"
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501st Headstrong
Svartur Bjorn
42
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Posted - 2013.11.14 21:18:00 -
[67] - Quote
Forlorn Destrier wrote:In the introductory post, it stated if you lose enough standings with a faction you would no longer be able to join in the battle on that facion's side. How would a mercenary locked out of factional warfare regain standings with that corporation if they are unable to fight for them in the factional warfare battle?
I believe you are only locked out for 24 hours before your standings reset to Level One
The things I would do with a Proto Minmatar Assault Suit...Checks SP Hello Panda Bear!!!
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Baltazar Pontain
Phantom Universe Task Force Die Fremdenlegion
34
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Posted - 2013.11.21 17:38:00 -
[68] - Quote
And another booster for aurum. You really need money do you?
I loose more and more motivation to play this game with all that micro transactions...
I do not know how other feel, but I will not support that grinding. |
Samantha Hunyz
Clones Of The Damned Zero-Day
22
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Posted - 2013.11.22 17:46:00 -
[69] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Faction Boosters Boosting Standings We will be adding 4 new boosters to the game that you can buy for Aurum from the market. The prices for these new faction boosters has not yet been decided. These boosters will do several things. Firstly, they will increase your standings reward by 50% for the appropriate faction. So if you buy the Gallente booster and play for Gallente in factional contracts and you would have gotten 50 standing points you would instead get 75 with the Gallente booster. Secondly, they will prevent you from losing standings to the selected side by fighting for the other side. So if you play for the Caldari side and have a Gallente booster you will not lose standings to the Gallente as you normally would. Sorry but these boosters are too powerful. By the time that we have a player market, those that use the boosters will be able to have a hefty stock of LP items stocked for use as well as plenty of extra to sell. Those that they sell will make them extremely rich. Now they with be able to proto stomp forever with better factional gear equipped as well. Those without boosters will have enough LP items to either sell, or keep, but probably not both. The isk drained for obtaining these items will make selling all of their LP items the better idea. Now those players have plenty of isk but now must waste it again grinding fw again to stock up on LP items again for personal use. For those that can't or won't pay for boosters, it will be better to play with cheap suits in public matches to make isk, and just buy the items of those that do buy them.
When I look down my scope, all I see are dead people.
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Broonfondle Majikthies
Bannana Boat Corp Relentless Heroes Alliance
496
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Posted - 2013.11.26 17:59:00 -
[70] - Quote
My only problem is that your rewarding players that stick around for the game. Very fair and rewarding, but what about the AFKers?
"...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
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