I noticed this when I used them, you know what o did? Got good with a real gun; plasma cannon, won't touch nova knives till they get fixers.

i was thinking this too. its a rough reality, but i guess we have to.

If I recall correctly Wildman said there was going to be some fixes that improved nova knife hit detection in 1.5 maby it got pushed back?

You seem to have no problem with your grenades. Why would you need help with Nova Knives?

I agree with the OP. Until the nova knives get the love they deserve, my smg and exile assault rifle are my own two best friends for now. As for you, Patrick, we wouldn't resort to using grenades so much if the nova knives weren't so nerfed.

so you noticed? i heard that shotty gobang using grenades, so i skilled up to m1 to test how effective it was.

needless to say, its pretty effective, but i suck at aiming them
with nova knives how they ar

I felt kinda bad since he got me and left me with zero armor...

That's the thing isn't it? People like us got to you fair and square yet the system decides that we don't deserve any knifing kills and let's you get away unharmed.

with all due respect, if you don't use nova knives, then don't troll post in this thread. you can still post, but dont post crap like, "stop your QQing" or "get gud scrub."

anyway, as the title says, i'm a nova knifer looking for help. back before 1.4, i used to be so good with nova knives, but ever since, its just gone downhill...then i see awesome posts of people going like 35-2 with nova knives, which causes me to raise my head and think, "maybe nova knives still are useable."

the 2 biggest gripes for me are:

1. THE HIT DETECTION: seriously when it comes to any moving target its near impossible (at least for me) to get a hit that will actually register. its not that i'm missing, because i see the targets shields fluctuate, but no health goes down. this wasn't as much of a problem before, especially since you used to be able to sprint-charge. why they took that out is beyond me. i donnt have a problem with them removing that if THE HIT DETECTION WASN'T SO BAD. i swear, i used to love jumping into a crowd of reds with my knife bros and wreaking havoc then running for our lives (and actually being able to survive for more than a second.) can't do that anymore. earlier today i got killed by an assault rifle that did 600 damage to me in less than 2 seconds( i only have 300 health).

2. THE BACKPEDAL: again, how the hell do you deal with this now? they backpedal as fast as you walk forward, and when you finally get close enough to hit, the hit doesn't even ******* register. before, i used to jump behind them, while in mid air sprint-charge my knives, then run around a corner or something, then when they turn to kill me and try that backpedal BS, i hit them while i'm sprinting and they get good 900-1000 damage to their suit.

i've already lost nearly 10 mill isk trying to force myself to get good with them again. any help would be greatly appreciated, because i'm really losing hope for this game. i've been here since november and this is the first time i've said that. nova knives were the reason i played this game, and now i cant seem to use them anymore. i've tried the SG and i'm REALLY good with it, but i want to use nova knives. any advice, i mean ANY advice towards getting better with these is GREATLY appreciated.

I watched him undetected when he was using a scout suit. He ran behind the enemy team, put a nanohive on the ground, then started chucking grenades. The killfeed was spammed with core nade kills...

First... was I the one who killed you? I remember my last game before Downtime I killed someone who tried Nova Knifing me... I felt kinda bad since he got me and left me with zero armor... I kinda jumped back and shot him in the face after. I think he also had a Shotgun. Anyway I use my Nova Knives as a Sidearm for killing Hackers and Snipers so I can't give you any advice as a true Nova Knifer. Sorry. :3

Not really "unharmed" considering I got shot moments later. ;3 But I do see your point. Nova Knifing is hard enough without all the Hit Detection issues. They should bring back sprint charging. :P

I always think it's strange when people think Nova Knives are a direct combat weapon. Sure: you can charge at someone with NKs or jump into a flood of people and go happy hunting, but it's the same concept as using a Sniper as a direct combat weapon; you can do it, most of the time it doesn't work well and those who can use it as a combat weapon are simply masters of the art.

From my perspective, Nova Knives are a side-arm; not a light weapon, not a heavy weapon- a sidearm. Just like the Scrambler Pistol, Core Flaylock, and SMG, generally it's not the first choice when going into combat. Sidearms are situational weapons used to SUPPLEMENT the primary weapon, not be the primary weapon.

I actually haven't had hit detection problems with the Nova Knives. Why? Probably because I only use them to hit stationary targets.
Sniper? Nova Knives. Hacker? Nova Knives. Installation gunner? Nova Knives. Stationary enemy? Nova Knives.
Sprinting Assault in the middle of the road? NOT Nova Knives. Large group of enemies? NOT Nova Knives. Tank? NOT Nova Knives.

Nova Knives aren't supposed to be a weapon meant for mass murder; get an HMG if you want that. The first step to getting good with the NKs is to know the place and the appropriate time to use the NKs (and sidearms in general).

That is true but only to a certain extent.

If someone like me likes to ditch the guns completely and wants all targets (including those that move) to be killed with just the knives, then I should be able to do that. But only after I have mastered the art.

That's the thing about nova knives that sets them apart from the rest of the weapons. Sure, they are sidearms. But the nova knives are more than that. They are in a league of their own even when compared to the SMG, Flaylock and Scrambler pistols. At least with those weapons you have the advantage of distance. But with the nova knives, you don't have that advantage.

You have to be up close and personal. In their face and surprise them.

What makes them be in a league of their own is the fact that their use is an art. Like an musician playing an instrument for a symphony, the true potential of the instrument is not realized until it's in the hands of a master. Of course, a regular musician can still play, but not as good as the master. Unfortunately, right now that instrument is like a violin that has a string that is out of tune. Like a dented flute, the air in the woodwind is not moving correctly as it should. And the reed in the obo is not vibrating right. Those defects will need to be addressed first before the instrument can be able to play the most beautiful music in the world.

Those defects have already been discussed in another thread:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1360569#post1360569

We're not saying that the nova knives should enable an average player to kill whole hordes on their own. On the contrary, almost all of us ninjas want the knives to still be somewhat useful to an average player just like how you used them as you described. But they should also have the ability to truly shine in the hands of a professional who is more than willing to suffer heavy losses just for the sake of the challenge and the thrill it brings to them.

And that is the ultimate challenge for us ninjas. To be able to run into a dark room filled with enemy mercs and kill everyone in it yet still walk out alive with but a sliver of armor left but only after months of dedicated training. Constantly losing expensive suits day and night perfecting our techniques and learning from our mistakes. Only then can the challenge truly be satisfying when complete.

Hell, back in 1.3, almost no one complained. There was one guy who QQ'ed about it but even those who were victims of the knives put him down like a dog. For a long time I waiting for someone to send me hate mail accusing me of being a cheater. But instead I saw something amazing. Every one of our victims saluted us. They saluted those who killed with the knives because to those victims it was super rare to see a knifer kill effectively with just that one weapon throughout the whole match. All other knifers who failed and died didn't know what they were doing and thus were just easy pickings for the gun.

But now, in 1.4 and still in 1.5, even the masters feel powerless.

There is no challenge in killing a stationary target. No fun camping a few installations and maybe an objective throughout the whole match waiting for an unsuspecting target. No thrill in killing a stupid sniper who doesn't realize that he has to move after every shot. The real challenge, fun, and thrill is from taking on the horde and surviving. I miss those days already.

That is true but only to a certain extent.

If someone like me likes to ditch the guns completely and wants all targets (including those that move) to be killed with just the knives, then I should be able to do that. But only after I have mastered the art.

[...]

But now, in 1.4 and still in 1.5, even the masters feel powerless.

There is no challenge in killing a stationary target. No fun camping a few installations and maybe an objective throughout the whole match waiting for an unsuspecting target. No thrill in killing a stupid sniper who doesn't realize that he has to move after every shot. The real challenge, fun, and thrill is from taking on the horde and surviving. I miss those days already.

OK; I understand your points and your reasoning.

I agree my statement is true to only a certain extent, like many other generalizations.

My response to the post was meant to act as a starting point for the OP. I'm not saying this is the only way to use the NKs, just tailoring the information presented to the request of the OP.

I have not experienced the detection issues, so I cannot really comment in that regard; however, I hope the bugs will be fixed so that my NK brethren may thrive once again.

I cannot completely agree with your final statement. I find it challenging to weave between enemy fire to assassinate a key target. Sure, I don't get everyone along the way, but removing the prime target (such as a hacker) and making it out alive is challenging, especially when there is a heavy around. Because of the frequency I use my NKs, I find every kill fun and thrilling; this is just a difference in preference and play style, though.

Best of luck and I appreciate the response; happy hunting! ^.^

In uprising I was killing it with knives an no gun, then they got worse an so did the way the game could be played with them.
Leaving the house now without, armor or armor reps is foolish. Now it's better to be sneakier an slower as long as you have full health reps built into ur suit. Using a two low slot suit is the problem now.
You need reps
Damps
Red an green
Shield reg

For a mini shields drop too fast, but gallente is too clunky to me to NK but awesome to sg.
Awareness has increased in the game because of paranoid skannerfrainia!
So it's not like before when you could bust 30 kill strictly knive games.

Now it's combinations of sneakiness .
Shotty
Bombs
Knives
Nades
An always a armor rep so you can continuously be at full health when you hide, remember lots of other suits have ewar now an ours is hardly better than theirs, then add hit detection an it's close to impossible if the hit doesn't land.
If you miss, SHOOT, don't be stubborn .
90% of the time if I have enough health I can win a face on attack only if we don't lose each other by them jumping.
If I'm close enough from the moment I'm spotted I sprint an quick slash, or I sg them or, I place a r/e, run to cut, if I miss I turn an run past my re, then I turn to shoot at them an walk them to my remote then BOOM

Armor is king now which means speed means nothing.
Your better off with a shield reg an arm rep on a mini, sg bombs , nades, knives, shields an a precision mod.
An knife in cities, leave knifing as a main weapon an bring a ranged gun on the big open maps
An attacking on a 45 angle works good

I don't have any way to be sure, but I'm told that the underlining problem is overlapping hit boxes. The best you can do right now is get the right range and angle so your not too close but still try to guarantee a hit - It's worked ok for me so far but not perfect.

I believe one solution offered was to add a lunge to the animation (thereby allowing to work outside the hitboxes) which should be interesting. I also hear there is a possibility for the distant future to have takedown animations.

Hope that helps, I know it isn't much

thanks for the help. i re ently had a match where i went 24-5 in a 10k dragonfly fit. i was using a SG, SMG, and M1 nades. ive been practicing cooking my nades to get insta boom and as of late, iv been doing REALLY good with this combo. i also keep a k-2 nanohive to stay full on nades and a basic plate and enhanced rep.

with all due respect, if you don't use nova knives, then don't troll post in this thread. you can still post, but dont post crap like, "stop your QQing" or "get gud scrub."

anyway, as the title says, i'm a nova knifer looking for help. back before 1.4, i used to be so good with nova knives, but ever since, its just gone downhill...then i see awesome posts of people going like 35-2 with nova knives, which causes me to raise my head and think, "maybe nova knives still are useable."

the 2 biggest gripes for me are:

1. THE HIT DETECTION: seriously when it comes to any moving target its near impossible (at least for me) to get a hit that will actually register. its not that i'm missing, because i see the targets shields fluctuate, but no health goes down. this wasn't as much of a problem before, especially since you used to be able to sprint-charge. why they took that out is beyond me. i donnt have a problem with them removing that if THE HIT DETECTION WASN'T SO BAD. i swear, i used to love jumping into a crowd of reds with my knife bros and wreaking havoc then running for our lives (and actually being able to survive for more than a second.) can't do that anymore. earlier today i got killed by an assault rifle that did 600 damage to me in less than 2 seconds( i only have 300 health).

2. THE BACKPEDAL: again, how the hell do you deal with this now? they backpedal as fast as you walk forward, and when you finally get close enough to hit, the hit doesn't even ******* register. before, i used to jump behind them, while in mid air sprint-charge my knives, then run around a corner or something, then when they turn to kill me and try that backpedal BS, i hit them while i'm sprinting and they get good 900-1000 damage to their suit.

i've already lost nearly 10 mill isk trying to force myself to get good with them again. any help would be greatly appreciated, because i'm really losing hope for this game. i've been here since november and this is the first time i've said that. nova knives were the reason i played this game, and now i cant seem to use them anymore. i've tried the SG and i'm REALLY good with it, but i want to use nova knives. any advice, i mean ANY advice towards getting better with these is GREATLY appreciated.

I use them and they are quite the hassle to use. Hit them hard with dmg mods, and try to hp tank so you can survive the bad mechanics. that's how I've been doin it. yup I die too much. I can't wait til tehy get it right! I got a badass sidearm I just need a new light weapon because what we have right now is embarrassing.

You have the Scout suit MK0 and Knifs Novas Ishukones?

What fitting?

You have the Scout suit MK0 and Knifs Novas Ishukones?

I speak Spanish and i was looking for solution for this problem, I'm really knifer and I think the solution is that it can run with loaded knives and to put more speed scanners, plus you lower the emissions profile .... please some love for explorers like us c:
I used the google translator.

I speak Spanish and i was looking for solution for this problem, I'm really knifer and I think the solution is that it can run with loaded knives and to put more speed scanners, plus you lower the emissions profile .... please some love for explorers like us c:
I used the google translator.

well stop trying to use a sidearm as main weapon and you won't get killed as much

hablo ingles, pero estoy aprendiendo hablar espanol. ese es un idea bueno.

he dicho que la mayoria de ese correcto?

See Maken Tosch, Doubletap, Radar, or Travi Zyg.

what now?

I don't know that they know, but they're the best I know.
If I were seeking help with NKs, these would be the folks I'd consult.
o7

Quick Response: Don't get spotted, use stealth and attack lone wolves from behind while avoiding being spotted.

Long more detailed response:

I'm not a Nova Knifer. But I will offer you some wisdom I've learned from playing. If I see the nova knifer coming at me, he's a dead man/women. If that Knifer sneaks up on me, a backstab really hurts..hurts me to death.

So what I'm saying is, don't hope to be able to run around like all the rest. Bringing a Knife to a gun fight head on will only lead to the same conclusion, no matter how many times you charged at someone head on, that is the definition of Insanity right there, repeating the same thing and expecting differn't results. Best bet is to play as stealthy as possible, stick to in doors when possible, hide and keep, admittidly scanners have made life for Assassins hard, but not impossible. Don't aim for more than 10 kills a game at most. Pick your fights and targets, go for the lone wolves not the herds. Use a scanner, if you see one person nearby, use your intel to get behind him. If you see multiple people, either keep low or relocate, Remember, you don't want to be spotted, think of it as playing MGS on Foxhound agent mode, spotted, game over.

Even tho yes the Minja gets knife and melee bonus, I would go for Ginja if I wanted to try out nova knives, the scan bonus's do help give you that extra advantage over other suits and in helping keeping one step ahead. Yes scouts are weak and squishy, but their speed and mobilty is what your after, not their abilty to take bullets when spotted. Since your weapon choice puts you at a harsh disadvantage in a head on battle anyway, you don't really need HP since even if you run assault, you get spotted, your dead. At least scouts have the speed to make that get away to keep you alive in the times you are spotted, your abilty to move through terrain also helps alot. With a scanner you can know the enemy positions AND the way their facing. With the scouts speed and mobilty you can use that infomation to either single a target out and move to attack from behind or make the decision to fall back if needed.

if a target is moving you CAN'T hit them, because the hit detection is so bad. you see their shields fluctuate, but NO health goes down.

i'm not just blindly running at people. i've been scouting for months, so i know how to avoid confrontation.

before 1.4, nova knives were amazing in skilled hands. it was inly when i mastered NKs that i got my KDR positive. as in i was going 20+/0-3 EVERY match. but none of that matters anymore because ccp managed to break the knives even more than they already were. it seems like everything WILL face the nerf hammer except for the AR.

Don't worry I got a feeling AR's will be nerfed last so the people who rely on it as a crutch will think their actually good and then when the AR is balanced those players will fall so hard from grace all the pain, suffering and strife the rest of us have felt will be washed away by the flood of their tears.

I always think it's strange when people think Nova Knives are a direct combat weapon. Sure: you can charge at someone with NKs or jump into a flood of people and go happy hunting, but it's the same concept as using a Sniper as a direct combat weapon; you can do it, most of the time it doesn't work well and those who can use it as a combat weapon are simply masters of the art.

From my perspective, Nova Knives are a side-arm; not a light weapon, not a heavy weapon- a sidearm. Just like the Scrambler Pistol, Core Flaylock, and SMG, generally it's not the first choice when going into combat. Sidearms are situational weapons used to SUPPLEMENT the primary weapon, not be the primary weapon.

I actually haven't had hit detection problems with the Nova Knives. Why? Probably because I only use them to hit stationary targets.
Sniper? Nova Knives. Hacker? Nova Knives. Installation gunner? Nova Knives. Stationary enemy? Nova Knives.
Sprinting Assault in the middle of the road? NOT Nova Knives. Large group of enemies? NOT Nova Knives. Tank? NOT Nova Knives.

Nova Knives aren't supposed to be a weapon meant for mass murder; get an HMG if you want that. The first step to getting good with the NKs is to know the place and the appropriate time to use the NKs (and sidearms in general).

with all due respect, if you don't use nova knives, then don't troll post in this thread. you can still post, but dont post crap like, "stop your QQing" or "get gud scrub."

anyway, as the title says, i'm a nova knifer looking for help. back before 1.4, i used to be so good with nova knives, but ever since, its just gone downhill...then i see awesome posts of people going like 35-2 with nova knives, which causes me to raise my head and think, "maybe nova knives still are useable."

the 2 biggest gripes for me are:

1. THE HIT DETECTION: seriously when it comes to any moving target its near impossible (at least for me) to get a hit that will actually register. its not that i'm missing, because i see the targets shields fluctuate, but no health goes down. this wasn't as much of a problem before, especially since you used to be able to sprint-charge. why they took that out is beyond me. i donnt have a problem with them removing that if THE HIT DETECTION WASN'T SO BAD. i swear, i used to love jumping into a crowd of reds with my knife bros and wreaking havoc then running for our lives (and actually being able to survive for more than a second.) can't do that anymore. earlier today i got killed by an assault rifle that did 600 damage to me in less than 2 seconds( i only have 300 health).

2. THE BACKPEDAL: again, how the hell do you deal with this now? they backpedal as fast as you walk forward, and when you finally get close enough to hit, the hit doesn't even ******* register. before, i used to jump behind them, while in mid air sprint-charge my knives, then run around a corner or something, then when they turn to kill me and try that backpedal BS, i hit them while i'm sprinting and they get good 900-1000 damage to their suit.

i've already lost nearly 10 mill isk trying to force myself to get good with them again. any help would be greatly appreciated, because i'm really losing hope for this game. i've been here since november and this is the first time i've said that. nova knives were the reason i played this game, and now i cant seem to use them anymore. i've tried the SG and i'm REALLY good with it, but i want to use nova knives. any advice, i mean ANY advice towards getting better with these is GREATLY appreciated.

Hit detection issues seem to happen more often for me when I use the Advance level knives, not sure why but it happens more with them. When I use the Ishukone knives kills are more consistent and the knives don't go straight through people as much. When they start to back pedal your best bet is to immediately break off and find cover if you are running just knives. You want them to lose line of sight of you so you get the opening to immediately flank them again while they are searching for you. Rarely do I attempt to keep running at someone that can just step backwards and hip fire, at that point you are at a disadvantage and are playing their game instead of forcing them to play yours. If they have scanners do not attempt to charge them, your tactical advantage is gone, get distance between them and wait until it stops and choose another route. Another thing you can try in tight corridors is charging your knife before you step around the corner if you see someone nearby and immediately swipe as they come around. Timing is important, you want them to see you at the very last second as they turn. Its a very useful tactic and normally catches people off guard, but only do this if your proficiency is at least a couple levels into it. You gotta be more patient with them, stay around corners or in shadows unseen and wait for them to turn their backs then sneak up on them, pick off organized squads by attacking the look out first and picking off stragglers bringing up the rear then make your way to the front. After every kill I dart off around a corner to see if anyone reacts to see if they are communicating with each other. You can use downed enemies as bait for people trying to revive them and flank them as well. The best thing to do is move and strike fast and vanish from sight, never stay out in the open for more than necessary. Use squads as a diversion, while they engage the enemy that is your chance to slip out of sight and approach from the rear, many people get tunnel vision and this is your chance to get closer.

I guess the knife is supposed to tickle when you stab someone in the back with it? Its a weapon, if someone gets shanked in the back it WILL do either 2 things: kill them or severely weaken them depending on the knife proficiency lv. It says in the description that it carves through even the thickest armor, sounds like a murder weapon to me lol. I one shot heavies with it using the Minmatar suit of course. Even in Battlefield and other shooter games if you get someone with a knife they don't walk away giggling. I have fittings using just the knife and manage to get plenty of kills with them, when the hit detection works. Seems to happen more often with the Advance level knives for me.

I'll assume this is the line to which you referring with your "murder" comment.

I never stated the weapon wasn't meant for murder; I said the weapon wasn't meant for mass murder. Yes, if you knife someone it's going to do something. Slashing someone with a butcher's cleaver will also cripple/kill, but that doesn't mean the cleaver is for mass murder. Sure, you can use it for mass murder, but that doesn't mean it's the intended purpose.

I experienced the bad hit detection the other day for the first time.

I don't understand if you're trying to make a point or just making a statement.

that's the thing. those of us who mastered them COULD use them for "mass murder" but because of the hit detection we can no longer do that. all of our months of practice go out the window when our hits dont even register.

OK. I recognize those facts and I agree; they could be used for mass murder, even though that's not the intended purpose, and the possibility they could be used for "mass murder" isn't valid due to faulty hit detection.

As already stated hit detection is too broken to use the NKs. I could deal with the fix to sprint/charge, but when they changed aiming mechanics.......AGAIN, it broke the hit detection.

We just need to wait until CCP fixes the HD, in the mean time I would suggest not worrying about hitting moving targets with charged blades. Instead work on getting uncharged blades to do more damage with sidearm dmg mods and carry an assault SMG. Thats usually what I have stuck to and its working a little better. But AR514 is king at this point. Even shotgun has poor hit detection issues that have seemed to come back after the "hot fix"

Sadly, scouts are at the bottom end of the totem behind heavys. While medium assault suits with 1000hp seem to continue to get buffs. Facts of life on hard mode.