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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
6959
|
Posted - 2013.10.13 22:34:00 -
[61] - Quote
Needless Sacermendor wrote:If you didn't want to be a Heavy or a HAV driver or a dropship pilot or a logistics, then you made a wrong decision ... if you skilled something that's FOTM, OP or not working as intended and needs balancing/changing for the good of the game then tuff, save up for the next FOTM using the points you farmed with this one, or start using it how it was intended. I know right, it's not like vehicles are being removed, skills are being drastically altered or removed, manditory skills are being added, and AV is getting a complete "balance pass"
It's almost as if when our decisions were made, they had nothing to do with CCPs sweeping changes.
Wow, figure that. |
Rinzler XVII
Forsaken Immortals Top Men.
111
|
Posted - 2013.10.14 08:47:00 -
[62] - Quote
Needless Sacermendor wrote:NO to respecs ...
YES to Re-allocations !!
There that's confused you all ... basically when racial variants come out you are given the option to move ALL your invested sp in say Amarr Heavy dropsuits into one of the other racial Heavy dropsuits ... or move all your Caldari HAV skills points into Minmatar HAV.
No need for refunds or respecs ... just need a UI setup like the attribute remap in Eve with sliders to drop points off a Heavy skill and put onto a different Heavy skill or off an AR skill onto another AR skill as and when racial variants are released.
If you didn't want to be a Heavy or a HAV driver or a dropship pilot or a logistics, then you made a wrong decision ... if you skilled something that's FOTM, OP or not working as intended and needs balancing/changing for the good of the game then tuff, save up for the next FOTM using the points you farmed with this one, or start using it how it was intended.
That would be fine, I dont want a respec to switch to a diff suit/weapon i just want to be able to reallocate the sp i have invested into the only current AR variant into a caldari variant of the same weapon when it is introduced and im sure heavies feel the same, they have been forced to go down the amarr suit route because they havent had any other option since the game was 1st introduced and most heavies would like to reallocate the sp into the variant of suit they wanted in the 1st place .. this really goes for all current weapons suits vehicles .. the whole FoTM issue is one entirely derived from CCP nnot balancing everything properley .. I've played mmo's for over a decade and when things are balanced their isn;t ever an issue of FoTM .. it's only an issue here because certain weapons/suits etc are stronger than other suits/weapons |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
528
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 16:19:00 -
[63] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Needless Sacermendor wrote:If you didn't want to be a Heavy or a HAV driver or a dropship pilot or a logistics, then you made a wrong decision ... if you skilled something that's FOTM, OP or not working as intended and needs balancing/changing for the good of the game then tuff, save up for the next FOTM using the points you farmed with this one, or start using it how it was intended. I know right, it's not like vehicles are being removed, skills are being drastically altered or removed, manditory skills are being added, and AV is getting a complete "balance pass" It's almost as if when our decisions were made, they had nothing to do with CCPs sweeping changes. Wow, figure that. Sorry took a while to respond ... couldn't get on last night.
Vehicles are not being removed ... variants are being removed ... if you wanted to fly a dropship you still can, if you wanted to drive a HAV you still can ... it's like saying 'I want a full respec cos they're temporarily removing the tactical variant of the swarm launcher'.
Skills being 'drastically' altered is because they are not working as intended ... skills being removed will have those skill points reimbursed like they did when they removed skills in the past.
Mandatory skills being added ... I presume you mean there are some pre-requisites being added ... precedent in Eve has been that if you could fly it or use it before, then you will be able to after ... however if you want the bonuses from the new skills you'll have to train them. Not sure what skills you're talking about to be honest, so if you could clarify I could answer that part better.
AV is getting a balance pass because vehicles are being changed ... it would be counter-productive to rebuild all the vehicles and their variants based around the values of current AV ... especially since current AV is so out of balance with each other ... AV grenades offer too much potential without significant drawback to a frontline assault fitting, and there are imbalances between the 'proper' AV weapons since Plasma Cannon is useless, swarms and forges do very different damage bonuses to armour and shields and Forges sacrifice very little anti-infantry ability where swarms sacrifice all of it. So OF COURSE av is getting a balance pass at the same time, make the vehicles work properly, then make the AV work properly against them.
When MY decisions were made, they were made around the type of role I wanted to fill on the battlefield ... NOT by what everyone else was using and doing well with ... or by what was best on paper ... but by what I enjoyed doing.
It's nobody elses fault but your own if you made your decisions based on what would kill people faster, then found out down the line that it needed to be balanced with everything else, yet you didn't like using it beyond the fact it was the fastest way to kill people ... tuff, you should have gone with what you enjoyed and been productive on the forums discussing how to bring it up to standard. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
6999
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 16:22:00 -
[64] - Quote
I went logistics dropship pilot for PC matches full bore with Uprising, then had a legitimate anxiety attack after two weeks of doing everything I possibly could to make them work and burning through nearly 100 million ISK from my year in the Beta
Don't ******* talk to me about skilling into **** because I want to kill things |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
528
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 16:24:00 -
[65] - Quote
Rinzler XVII wrote:Needless Sacermendor wrote:NO to respecs ...
YES to Re-allocations !!
There that's confused you all ... basically when racial variants come out you are given the option to move ALL your invested sp in say Amarr Heavy dropsuits into one of the other racial Heavy dropsuits ... or move all your Caldari HAV skills points into Minmatar HAV.
No need for refunds or respecs ... just need a UI setup like the attribute remap in Eve with sliders to drop points off a Heavy skill and put onto a different Heavy skill or off an AR skill onto another AR skill as and when racial variants are released.
If you didn't want to be a Heavy or a HAV driver or a dropship pilot or a logistics, then you made a wrong decision ... if you skilled something that's FOTM, OP or not working as intended and needs balancing/changing for the good of the game then tuff, save up for the next FOTM using the points you farmed with this one, or start using it how it was intended. That would be fine, I dont want a respec to switch to a diff suit/weapon i just want to be able to reallocate the sp i have invested into the only current AR variant into a caldari variant of the same weapon when it is introduced and im sure heavies feel the same, they have been forced to go down the amarr suit route because they havent had any other option since the game was 1st introduced and most heavies would like to reallocate the sp into the variant of suit they wanted in the 1st place .. this really goes for all current weapons suits vehicles .. the whole FoTM issue is one entirely derived from CCP nnot balancing everything properley .. I've played mmo's for over a decade and when things are balanced their isn;t ever an issue of FoTM .. it's only an issue here because certain weapons/suits etc are stronger than other suits/weapons Which is why I think it's the fairest way to go about it ... keeps everyone happy ... apart from the people that just skill the FOTM n they don't warrant any joy, they've already had their joy from pretending they were good ! |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
528
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 16:40:00 -
[66] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:I went logistics dropship pilot for PC matches full bore with Uprising, then had a legitimate anxiety attack after two weeks of doing everything I possibly could to make them work and burning through nearly 100 million ISK from my year in the Beta
Don't ******* talk to me about skilling into **** because I want to kill things Sorry the last paragraph wasn't specifically aimed at you, I ment generally people who use FOTM stuff.
I burned through 120 mil isk at the same time cos the Amarr Logistics suit didn't work at anything but proto level. But I brought it up on the forums n they fixed it ... people have brought up many problems with vehicles, so they're fixing them ... your logi dropship will do what it's supposed to do by the time they come back, until then you'll still have a dropship you can fly ... n if that's not what you wanted ... refer to my previous post ! |
Joel II X
AHPA
33
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 19:13:00 -
[67] - Quote
I think everyone should get only one respec. That way, nobody will QQ. I'm still with my first character I ever created and effed around with the skills. That means I have some skills allocated where I now know I won't ever use. I've never once had a respectable since I joined in June and, personally, I don't even care about getting one. If you want to ditch anything you already have, start from scratch to specialize in whatever it is you want. This way, new players will stand more if a chance. Maybe. Point is: it's just a game, so just spend more time on it paying to earn those new shiny things. It's not like you haven't done so already. Babies.
TL; DR: Stop being a baby and deal with not having a respec. One is enough. |
Tallen Ellecon
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
767
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 19:46:00 -
[68] - Quote
My only fear is that they will turn the TAC AR into the Rail Rifle and I'll be left with only the Standard AR. I don't need a respec, but it'd be kind of screwed up if I needed to skill into a new weapon because I specced into a "placeholder". Also I don't want to have to spec into a Caldari weapon to use the TAC. |
Tallen Ellecon
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
767
|
Posted - 2013.10.15 19:50:00 -
[69] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:I think everyone should get only one respec. That way, nobody will QQ. I'm still with my first character I ever created and effed around with the skills. That means I have some skills allocated where I now know I won't ever use. I've never once had a respectable since I joined in June and, personally, I don't even care about getting one. If you want to ditch anything you already have, start from scratch to specialize in whatever it is you want. This way, new players will stand more if a chance. Maybe. Point is: it's just a game, so just spend more time on it paying to earn those new shiny things. It's not like you haven't done so already. Babies.
TL; DR: Stop being a baby and deal with not having a respec. One is enough.
Seriously though, I hear about people speccing into a full Proto weapon or suit, not liking it, and wanting a respec. Basic doesn't require a huge SP invesment. If you can't be effective with or enjoy a weapon at standard, then you probably won't care for it at Proto either. |
KalOfTheRathi
Nec Tributis
824
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 01:28:00 -
[70] - Quote
Needless Sacermendor wrote: -- snip -- I burned through 120 mil isk at the same time cos the Amarr Logistics suit didn't work at anything but proto level. But I brought it up on the forums n they fixed it ... people have brought up many problems with vehicles, so they're fixing them ... your logi dropship will do what it's supposed to do by the time they come back, until then you'll still have a dropship you can fly ... n if that's not what you wanted ... refer to my previous post ! Have you read what the current plan is? I mean really read the entire post from the Devs?
They are fixing vehicles by removing all the ADV vehicles. They are gone. The STD vehicles will have significantly Less functionality than the current version. As in they are losing low and high slots. PG, CPU and HP. The tanks are being redesigned to be an 'empty husk' that will be very fragile until the super special new modules that last 1/3 the time compared to current while requiring significantly more time to recharge (2-3 times). So run in fast, push the modules, hammer away for 20 seconds and run like your life depends on it. Because it will. Then spend several minutes back at base recharging, restocking ammo and waiting for the very limited functionality that CCP/Shanghai believes Tanks should be restricted to will be available. And, no, we don't know what the significantly reduced roles that are supported by CCP/Shanghai because we have nothing to work with. Except a few google docs and they are what put the twist in vehicle owners knickers.
Now consider the DS pilots. Fragile bricks that are difficult to fly* and provide next to nothing for rewards for using them. The only ships worth using are being removed. They will, no doubt, suffer the very same fate as the Tanks. LLAVs are gone as well.
There is not only no time frame for this balancing act but there is no time frame as to when the functionality will be replaced. If ever as there is no guarantees with CCP. Decisions have consequences. And do they ever when CCP refuses to behave like a freaking grown up.
Thanks for the time you put in because we just destroyed your character. Start a different one because your SP is locked into something we destroyed. With a very special HTFU from CCP!
* Why would anybody make the DS such a piece of Kitten Excrement to fly? It is the worst possible method to use for flight controls and it absolutely inconsistent with the rest of New Eden. Recall that EVE is basically a spread sheet. And flying means click and point, but down in the DUST the DS uses horrible controls that make no sense. Plus a constantly changing camera view that is only changeable by the Devs, not the operator. Classic CCP/Shanghai, now that I think of it. |
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
1041
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 03:06:00 -
[71] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:Thurak1 wrote:CharCharOdell wrote:f**k no! only tankers get respecs! Ha! why are tankers so special? Dropsuits are in a very similar situation where a vast majority of the content they plan to release has not been released. So you feel it's not reasonable tankers should get a respec because every single thing about vehicles is going to be changed, but it is reasonable to want a respec to get a new suit when it's released? What i think its BS that ONLY tankers get a respec.I have Fully Proto AV and im pretty sure vehicle changes affect AV weaponry AND AV weaponry will get tweaked too. So Respec for EVERYONE, or for no one.This, no to respecs; but just tankers because we have a vehicle redo.Or : No Respecs ; unless my AR gets nerfed.ITS BULLS**tGive us ALL repecs options until CCP gets everything out and balaced. So what do you think is going to happen to AV? |
Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
1041
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 03:06:00 -
[72] - Quote
Jack McReady wrote:Master Jaraiya wrote:SgtDoughnut wrote:Kasote Denzara wrote:Urrrgh. There should only be refunds, not respecs. When they remove something, you get all the SP and ISK back. That's it and all there should ever be.
Any EVE pilot that has been around can agree with me on that. When they removed the learning skills, everyone was refunded not respeced. This guy is right I'm not sorry to inform you that he is completely wrong saying there should only be refunds. When EVE first began, was there a Frigate for every race? Did EVE start with a rookie ship for each race, 3 Racial Frigates, and 2 Racial Cruisers? The answer is an emphatic no! This is not true in DUST 514. All Racial Roles are not represented in the existing classes or weapon types. This forces some players to spec into a Racial Variant simply because they didn't have a choice. By not offering at least a partial respec for players in these situations, CCP would only adding insult to injury. Respecs should definitely be given with the filling in of Racial Variants for existing Dropsuit/Vehicile Classes/Roles and Weapon Types. Respecs should not be given with the addition of completely new Dropsuit/Vehicile Classes/Roles or Weapon Types, unless these new classes/roles/types are not initially added with all Racial Variants. In eve you can raise several accounts with full sp without even playing, or you just buy one from another player. In short yout point is null and void, beside that eve is an mmorpg with stable playerbase, dust is a f2p lobby shooter where playercount at primetime decreases by 500 per month. How many times do I have to say that Dust isn't a lobby shooter? |
Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
1042
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 03:11:00 -
[73] - Quote
Needless Sacermendor wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:I went logistics dropship pilot for PC matches full bore with Uprising, then had a legitimate anxiety attack after two weeks of doing everything I possibly could to make them work and burning through nearly 100 million ISK from my year in the Beta
Don't ******* talk to me about skilling into **** because I want to kill things Sorry the last paragraph wasn't specifically aimed at you, I ment generally people who use FOTM stuff. I burned through 120 mil isk at the same time cos the Amarr Logistics suit didn't work at anything but proto level. But I brought it up on the forums n they fixed it ... people have brought up many problems with vehicles, so they're fixing them ... your logi dropship will do what it's supposed to do by the time they come back, until then you'll still have a dropship you can fly ... n if that's not what you wanted ... refer to my previous post ! Lol... I'm actually surprised they fixed the large turret problem at all. With their history as it pertains to vehicles, I'm surprised CCP didn't say HTFU and have us deal with terrible turret angles. |
Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
1042
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 03:12:00 -
[74] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:I think everyone should get only one respec. That way, nobody will QQ. I'm still with my first character I ever created and effed around with the skills. That means I have some skills allocated where I now know I won't ever use. I've never once had a respectable since I joined in June and, personally, I don't even care about getting one. If you want to ditch anything you already have, start from scratch to specialize in whatever it is you want. This way, new players will stand more if a chance. Maybe. Point is: it's just a game, so just spend more time on it paying to earn those new shiny things. It's not like you haven't done so already. Babies.
TL; DR: Stop being a baby and deal with not having a respec. One is enough. That's because Uprising was deployed before June, and with it came an optional total respec, or account reset. |
Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
1042
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 03:13:00 -
[75] - Quote
KalOfTheRathi wrote:Needless Sacermendor wrote: -- snip -- I burned through 120 mil isk at the same time cos the Amarr Logistics suit didn't work at anything but proto level. But I brought it up on the forums n they fixed it ... people have brought up many problems with vehicles, so they're fixing them ... your logi dropship will do what it's supposed to do by the time they come back, until then you'll still have a dropship you can fly ... n if that's not what you wanted ... refer to my previous post ! Have you read what the current plan is? I mean really read the entire post from the Devs? They are fixing vehicles by removing all the ADV vehicles. They are gone. The STD vehicles will have significantly Less functionality than the current version. As in they are losing low and high slots. PG, CPU and HP. The tanks are being redesigned to be an 'empty husk' that will be very fragile until the super special new modules that last 1/3 the time compared to current while requiring significantly more time to recharge (2-3 times). So run in fast, push the modules, hammer away for 20 seconds and run like your life depends on it. Because it will. Then spend several minutes back at base recharging, restocking ammo and waiting for the very limited functionality that CCP/Shanghai believes Tanks should be restricted to will be available. And, no, we don't know what the significantly reduced roles that are supported by CCP/Shanghai because we have nothing to work with. Except a few google docs and they are what put the twist in vehicle owners knickers. Now consider the DS pilots. Fragile bricks that are difficult to fly* and provide next to nothing for rewards for using them. The only ships worth using are being removed. They will, no doubt, suffer the very same fate as the Tanks. LLAVs are gone as well. There is not only no time frame for this balancing act but there is no time frame as to when the functionality will be replaced. If ever as there is no guarantees with CCP. Decisions have consequences. And do they ever when CCP refuses to behave like a freaking grown up. Thanks for the time you put in because we just destroyed your character. Start a different one because your SP is locked into something we destroyed. With a very special HTFU from CCP! * Why would anybody make the DS such a piece of Kitten Excrement to fly? It is the worst possible method to use for flight controls and it absolutely inconsistent with the rest of New Eden. Recall that EVE is basically a spread sheet. And flying means click and point, but down in the DUST the DS uses horrible controls that make no sense. Plus a constantly changing camera view that is only changeable by the Devs, not the operator. Classic CCP/Shanghai, now that I think of it. We don't have ADV vehicles to begin with. |
Joel II X
AHPA
34
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 13:45:00 -
[76] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Joel II X wrote:I think everyone should get only one respec. That way, nobody will QQ. I'm still with my first character I ever created and effed around with the skills. That means I have some skills allocated where I now know I won't ever use. I've never once had a respec since I joined in June and, personally, I don't even care about getting one. If you want to ditch anything you already have, start from scratch to specialize in whatever it is you want. This way, new players will stand more if a chance. Maybe. Point is: it's just a game, so just spend more time on it paying to earn those new shiny things. It's not like you haven't done so already. Babies.
TL; DR: Stop being a baby and deal with not having a respec. One is enough. That's because Uprising was deployed before June, and with it came an optional total respec, or account reset. I know. But I also wrote that I didn't care whether I got one or not. People should just see if they like some gear by trying out the standards and THEN deciding whether to move on to proto or not.
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