a forge gun on the ground can easily kill a forge gun high up. spec into one.

a gun that destroys vehicles/installations SHOULD be able to kill infantry also.

so no, it's not a problem.

I didnt know a FG could shoot through buildings

i wish it could, lol. but no, you just shoot them when they poke their heads over the edge to shoot down. you have to use the charged variant though, not the assault.

Last time I expressed my opinions about the Forge Gun it turned into a 12 pages discussion with the same 2 people impliedly offending my intelligence with poor arguments and quoting and liking each other's posts to no end.

So, this time, I will still express my opinion, but I will completely ignore any counter-post. This is my idea, if you like it, fine. If you don't, fine. End of story.

*Ahem*.

Yes, Forge Gun should be able to kill infantry, because it's not specifically an AV weapon, it's anti-material. And it's a heavy weapon, something you can equip only by using a restrictive dropsuit with massive exoskeleton and you need an advantage over the Swarm Launcher for this reason.

The problem is that it's too powerful, but not for Alpha Damage. It's the combination of the massive damage, accuracy, DPS, splash damage, splash radius and range. Speaking of "weapon VS infantry", it makes sniper rifles absolete and this is wrong.

How to balance it against both infantry and vehicles?

Damage falloff over distance.

No nerf to the raw damage, blast damage/radius and accuracy, you just need to MOVE if you want to control one area and you have to choose WHICH area you want to defend, without insta-poppong vehicles and infantry across the whole map. This is the problem with the Forge Gun.

Done.

Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it

Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so

You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off

But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles

So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?

Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?

Do you think its a combination of both problems?

Should the FG kill infantry?

Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?


Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Thoughts?

The charge time makes it balanced. If you come around the corner at a FG, or really just anything other than letting them snipe at you from the rooftops, you have a solid 2-3.5 seconds (depending on FG Ops and AFG vs FG) to burn the heavy down with an AR/SMG, which is very, very easy to do.
If the heavy gets up high, it's so, so easy to keep them down, with just a MLT sniper or a TSR/CSR if you're really feeling angry.
If you're an idiot, a good forge will wreck you every time, but I'd say that overall they're fairly well balanced. If they're a little OP, it's balanced out by having to wear a fatsuit.

I never ever use a charged variant. Ever. Just not worth the extra charge up time. Anyone decent with the forge will know exactly when to start charging. I might miss the first time but usually the second time is the charm.

a forge gun on the ground can easily kill a forge gun high up. spec into one.

a gun that destroys vehicles/installations SHOULD be able to kill infantry also.

so no, it's not a problem.

I'm sorry, but you keep saying "it makes the sniper rifle obsolete" and everyone here knows damn well that's not true.

if you want to implement damage fall-off on the forge might as well do it to every other weapon in the game... amirite?

By that I don't want to say there is no application for snipers, but that a Forge Gun from an elevated position is at least as efficient at killing people (if not better), but you can damage vehicles too... I hope you agree with this, if you're a Forge Gunner. I have a Forge Gunner character as well, with the Ishukone FG and 2 complex dmg mods on an A/1 series and honestly it's a much better area-denial instrument than an annoying sniper.



I think (correct me if I'm wrong... it might be) that every weapon does have damage or bullet/shell fall-off (Mass Driver, Plasma Cannon) except Swarm Launchers (well, they are missiles...) and the Forge Gun. I believe Snipers have it too, but their range is that good that you can't even render your enemies in your *optimal* range.

forge gun actually has a very small falloff range it goes full damage to 300meters then has about 20 or 40 meters where you can still hit at reduced damage. I noticed it when shooting a redline instillation I wasn't hitting for full damage.

Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it

Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so

You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off

But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles

So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?

Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?

Do you think its a combination of both problems?

Should the FG kill infantry?

Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?


Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Thoughts?

Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it

Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so

You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off

But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles

So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?

Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?

Do you think its a combination of both problems?

Should the FG kill infantry?

Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?


Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Thoughts?

Forge guns needs to have a much reduced anti infantry capacity. Sure, all the forge gun users can sit here and talk because they want to maintain their crutch, but right now it's the best antivehicle weapon as well as a good anti-infantry weapon. There's really no give and take with it.

I've advocated removing it's 100% perfect accuracy, making the shots skew a few degrees from where you aim. That would effectively make forge gun sniping infantry impossible, while allowing forge guns to still hit vehicles from long range.

lol. It's a solid mass of energy being expelled towards an object, why wouldn't it travel in a straight line? Sniper bullets don't curve to the left or right or drop off over distance, why should forge guns? A bullet is much more likely to stray of course than a ball of energy, wouldn't you think?

As it has been said before the problem with the forge gun is the infantry mentality. Stay close to cover, and I wont shoot you with my forge gun, how hard is that to understand? The range, splash damage, AND damage have all already been nerfed so why are people still crying. Just makes no sense. Sorry that your AR can't do 1300 damage at 300M but guess what, that's not what it was designed for, my forge gun was. I already have to run 2-4m slower than you a second, can't fit equipment slots, and I'm stuck with a sidearm at close range. I think you infantry want a medusa skill so all you have to do is look at me and I die.

The forge gun is the only decent weapon that heavy's have to use right now which is why you see so many of them. This problem would go away if CCP would actually give us SOMETHING different. The inbalance here is lack of choice for heavy's, it's one or the other there isn't an inbetween, sans light weapons.

it also kills heavys btw. we fattys on the ground with HMGs despise you guys. we cant run from you and we cant fight you.

I'm just tired of being sniped by a forge gun when I'm sniping.

Since when is a forge gun more accurate than a sniper?

Its made as an AV weapon .........

lol. It's a solid mass of energy

Really? Based on what exactly? the description says it's an 'anti-material' weapon.

as far as i know a clone is made of some sort of material too right? maybe i'm reading too much into that.

Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it

Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so

You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off

But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles

So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?

Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?

Do you think its a combination of both problems?

Should the FG kill infantry?

Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?


Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Thoughts?

Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Lol physics.

The lack of iron sights, the limited ammo capacity, and the decreased mobility of deploying the heavy suit all contribute to balancing this weapon. I understand that it can be frustrating dealing with a FG, but with the nerfed splash, you really have to stay out in the open to get clipped by it. I generally run an ADV FG, and it can take 2-3 shots of pure splash to kill someone in STD dropsuits. Not to mention that during the charge phase, the FG lights up, makes a loud noise, and slows your suit down even more.

Forge gunners are generally pretty easy to pick off (most of the time I end up long range dueling other heavies) with cheap forge guns, so I recommend building a militia fit to deal with them.

AntimateriEl

Materiel refers to military equipment, ie ammo dumps, vehicles, artillery, etc.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materiel

I'm just tired of being sniped by a forge gun when I'm sniping.

Since when is a forge gun more accurate than a sniper?

Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it
Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so
You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off
But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles
So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?
Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?
Do you think its a combination of both problems?
Should the FG kill infantry?
Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?

Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Thoughts?

good try, you almost got me there. but it actually says 'anti-materal' in the description i just saw. see:

" Adapted from Deep Core Mining Inc.'s proprietary technology, the DCMA S-1 subverts conventional expectations of what a man-portable anti-material weapons platform is capable of. Despite its excessive weight and extended recharge time, the GÇ£Forge GunGÇ¥ as it has become known, is regarded as the most devastating infantry weapon on the battlefield, and an invaluable tool for those capable of wielding it."

i highlighted the last part for the others to come to grips that it, though being a boss AV weapon, is still expected to be equally devastating against infantry, as designed.

i'm not commenting on if it's OP or not, i'll just say that if you can kill someone with this gun (other than tower stomping that is) i think you are deserving of that kill. just last night i found myself in a situation where 2 red berries were hiding from my squad in a distant corner, being protected by the edge of the building. there was no line of sight, but there was a wall behind them, two shots from the forge (with others providing supressive fire) and they were dead. why should situations like that be removed?

read the description here: http://dust514.wikia.com/wiki/Forge_Gun. If anything I'd say the FG is UP because a slug going 7Km PER SECOND (Mach 20.5ish) WOULD NOT have travel time or decide to just wink out of existence at 350ish meters... Just sayin'

good try, you almost got me there. but it actually says 'anti-materal' in the description i just saw. see:

" Adapted from Deep Core Mining Inc.'s proprietary technology, the DCMA S-1 subverts conventional expectations of what a man-portable anti-material weapons platform is capable of. Despite its excessive weight and extended recharge time, the GÇ£Forge GunGÇ¥ as it has become known, is regarded as the most devastating infantry weapon on the battlefield, and an invaluable tool for those capable of wielding it."

i highlighted the last part for the others to come to grips that it, though being a boss AV weapon, is still expected to be equally devastating against infantry, as designed.

i'm not commenting on if it's OP or not, i'll just say that if you can kill someone with this gun (other than tower stomping that is) i think you are deserving of that kill. just last night i found myself in a situation where 2 red berries were hiding from my squad in a distant corner, being protected by the edge of the building. there was no line of sight, but there was a wall behind them, two shots from the forge (with others providing supressive fire) and they were dead. why should situations like that be removed?

Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it

Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so

You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off

But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles

So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?

Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?

Do you think its a combination of both problems?

Should the FG kill infantry?

Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?


Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example

Thoughts?

AR scrubs will always say no nerf to their magical, fantasy weapon of lazy noobdom.

I say no. A magical, swiss army knife weapon that rewards laziness, particularly when paired with anything and everything, should always be nerfed.

a forge gun on the ground can easily kill a forge gun high up. spec into one.

a gun that destroys vehicles/installations SHOULD be able to kill infantry also.

so no, it's not a problem.

Then let me shoot my swarms at you as well as you can shoot your forge at me

THEN its not a problem...

Swarms is an AV weapon and i cant shoot swarms at infantry.
It should be the same with forge guns.

Forge gun has many draw backs, these are used to offset the damage dealt.

What other weapon even when full specialized takes at least 2 seconds before it even is capable of doing damage? What other weapon makes you slowed immobile without actively firing? Ever spawned and be killed before you can fire off one shot? (Not super infrequent when you have a squad rushing your spawn point, and there is nothing you can do about it.

In addition to being in a slow suit with a large hit box, you have a weapon that makes you even slower, and highlighted with a bright "shoot me aura" , and has such a low RoF that one miss is easily enough to determine the difference between victory and death.


Tl;dr get good, don't stand still, if you see a FG take him out ASAP or find cover. Also as it has been mentioned a couple times, snipers are always a great counter against FG, a shot or two can either halt their killing spree, unroot them from their position, or if they aren't smart enough to run/fire back then they die. As simple as that.