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MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
243
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Posted - 2013.10.11 15:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Kam Elto wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Kam Elto wrote:a forge gun on the ground can easily kill a forge gun high up. spec into one.
a gun that destroys vehicles/installations SHOULD be able to kill infantry also.
so no, it's not a problem. I didnt know a FG could shoot through buildings i wish it could, lol. but no, you just shoot them when they poke their heads over the edge to shoot down. you have to use the charged variant though, not the assault.
I never ever use a charged variant. Ever. Just not worth the extra charge up time. Anyone decent with the forge will know exactly when to start charging. I might miss the first time but usually the second time is the charm. |
MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
243
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Posted - 2013.10.11 15:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
Keri Starlight wrote:Last time I expressed my opinions about the Forge Gun it turned into a 12 pages discussion with the same 2 people impliedly offending my intelligence with poor arguments and quoting and liking each other's posts to no end.
So, this time, I will still express my opinion, but I will completely ignore any counter-post. This is my idea, if you like it, fine. If you don't, fine. End of story.
*Ahem*.
Yes, Forge Gun should be able to kill infantry, because it's not specifically an AV weapon, it's anti-material. And it's a heavy weapon, something you can equip only by using a restrictive dropsuit with massive exoskeleton and you need an advantage over the Swarm Launcher for this reason.
The problem is that it's too powerful, but not for Alpha Damage. It's the combination of the massive damage, accuracy, DPS, splash damage, splash radius and range. Speaking of "weapon VS infantry", it makes sniper rifles absolete and this is wrong.
How to balance it against both infantry and vehicles?
Damage falloff over distance.
No nerf to the raw damage, blast damage/radius and accuracy, you just need to MOVE if you want to control one area and you have to choose WHICH area you want to defend, without insta-poppong vehicles and infantry across the whole map. This is the problem with the Forge Gun.
Done.
I'm sorry, but you keep saying "it makes the sniper rifle obsolete" and everyone here knows damn well that's not true. Very rarely will i be in a match where if I get any sort of tactical height advantage in less than two minutes I'll have at the very least two snipers taking shots at me. Snipers can hit me from 200m behind the redline where the forge has a 300m range max. bullets in real life do less damage the farther they travel as well so if you want to implement damage fall-off on the forge might as well do it to every other weapon in the game... amirite?
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MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
243
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Posted - 2013.10.11 15:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
Awry Barux wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Its made as an AV weapon which it is fine for and i have no trouble with it
Big problem is that it is a superior weapon to use when killing infantry and requires free aim to do so
You can easily pull a 20-0 and use a milita FG if wanted granted it does require to be up high but once up high you are basically god and only a well placed OB will throw you off
But when this happened with swarms it was classed as broken and OP, that got fixed by being a lock on weapon and only for vehicles
So do you think the FG is OP against infantry?
Do you think the problem is the FG being up high?
Do you think its a combination of both problems?
Should the FG kill infantry?
Is it even a problem at all? If it is how would you fix it?
Also remember its basically a handheld version of a railgun except more damage and splash/radius so infantry would cry for the vehicle railgun to be also changed most likely because they are similiar so if a FG cant kill infantry then neither would the vehicle railgun for example
Thoughts?
The charge time makes it balanced. If you come around the corner at a FG, or really just anything other than letting them snipe at you from the rooftops, you have a solid 2-3.5 seconds (depending on FG Ops and AFG vs FG) to burn the heavy down with an AR/SMG, which is very, very easy to do. If the heavy gets up high, it's so, so easy to keep them down, with just a MLT sniper or a TSR/CSR if you're really feeling angry. If you're an idiot, a good forge will wreck you every time, but I'd say that overall they're fairly well balanced. If they're a little OP, it's balanced out by having to wear a fatsuit.
not to mention that a fully speced proto sniper rifle with damage mods can do well close to 1000 damage, I'd say it's pretty balanced. |
MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
243
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Posted - 2013.10.11 16:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
Chris F2112 wrote:Forge guns needs to have a much reduced anti infantry capacity. Sure, all the forge gun users can sit here and talk because they want to maintain their crutch, but right now it's the best antivehicle weapon as well as a good anti-infantry weapon. There's really no give and take with it.
I've advocated removing it's 100% perfect accuracy, making the shots skew a few degrees from where you aim. That would effectively make forge gun sniping infantry impossible, while allowing forge guns to still hit vehicles from long range.
lol. It's a solid mass of energy being expelled towards an object, why wouldn't it travel in a straight line? Sniper bullets don't curve to the left or right or drop off over distance, why should forge guns? A bullet is much more likely to stray of course than a ball of energy, wouldn't you think?
As it has been said before the problem with the forge gun is the infantry mentality. Stay close to cover, and I wont shoot you with my forge gun, how hard is that to understand? The range, splash damage, AND damage have all already been nerfed so why are people still crying. Just makes no sense. Sorry that your AR can't do 1300 damage at 300M but guess what, that's not what it was designed for, my forge gun was. I already have to run 2-4m slower than you a second, can't fit equipment slots, and I'm stuck with a sidearm at close range. I think you infantry want a medusa skill so all you have to do is look at me and I die.
The forge gun is the only decent weapon that heavy's have to use right now which is why you see so many of them. This problem would go away if CCP would actually give us SOMETHING different. The inbalance here is lack of choice for heavy's, it's one or the other there isn't an inbetween, sans light weapons. |
MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
244
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Posted - 2013.10.11 17:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
Paran Tadec wrote:MassiveNine wrote:
lol. It's a solid mass of energy
Lol physics.
lol inorite. sorry it was a goof on my part wasn't thinking straight. |
MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
244
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Posted - 2013.10.11 18:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
HyperionsThunder wrote:The lack of iron sights, the limited ammo capacity, and the decreased mobility of deploying the heavy suit all contribute to balancing this weapon. I understand that it can be frustrating dealing with a FG, but with the nerfed splash, you really have to stay out in the open to get clipped by it. I generally run an ADV FG, and it can take 2-3 shots of pure splash to kill someone in STD dropsuits. Not to mention that during the charge phase, the FG lights up, makes a loud noise, and slows your suit down even more.
Forge gunners are generally pretty easy to pick off (most of the time I end up long range dueling other heavies) with cheap forge guns, so I recommend building a militia fit to deal with them.
More like the complete lack of ADS
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