DUST Search - How to deal with "Proto Stomping"

Fire of Prometheus wrote:

Cosgar wrote:

Matticus Monk wrote:

Cosgar wrote:

You counter proto stomping by not pissing down your leg when you see a fully stacked corp (that isn't EoN) on the opposing side. I've seen way too many situations where someone in my squad will see the upcoming battle participants, losing morale when they see a situation like this. Grow a damn pair and fight. If it's EoN... just hope they get awoxed one day...

Staying and fighting isn't a counter dude, it's merely choosing to stay and fight because you're gonna take your chances or you have an actual "counter" plan (which I'd love to hear). In most cases it's suicide.

I don't leave matches, ever. But I sure as hell wouldn't feel bad about doing it given a stack up of a bunch of proto weenies. I don't like heading to the hills with a sniper rifle, or trying to stay in range with a laser but as a scout mostly lone wolfing it's rare I get into a good squad after coming into a battle solo.

So again, do you have any actual advice or shall I assume your counter is just stay and toss yourself into the fray and hope for the best - all the while assuming that anyone who doesn't do the same doesn't have any balls?

I've actually heard someone say, "Oh crap! It's Dust University!" Think about that for a second...

Honestly that's hilarious Lol

But perhaps they got caught in a "pub training" match with a bunch of our more advanced and proto wielding students

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MUDFLAPS McGILLICUTTY Local Tankers 514 11	Posted - 2013.09.28 05:51:00 - [1] - Quote TL/DR: Make it unprofitable to Proto Stomp. Instead of just Academy and Public, split all contracts based on value. Cap all public contracts on minimum and maximum skill levels (Public contractors wouldn't want to hire out clones in expensive suits if the contract is of low value) --- If you HAVE proto gear, that's fine, but you can't wear them in low-level contracts, because the corporate sponsors refuse to pay for it. High-value contracts come with much more lucrative payouts, but also come with stronger minimum requirements for participation. This would accomplish multiple things: 1) It offers an incentive for new players to reach the next level of dropsuits (offer a 40-75% corporate reimbursement of base suit value - reimbursed as corporate insurance for those who die in combat.) New players in militia only have to deal with advanced gear --- This also prepares them to don that advanced gear, and start fighting prototypes. Training as a part of the game - rather than hoping new players learn something from getting massacred. 2) It offers multiple levels of financial rationale for experienced players to not stomp newbs. The strongest being they can't actually bring their best gear to the field because the public companies won't pay for it. Additionally, if the contracts of higher value come with a stronger end-of-game reward, it will naturally draw players of higher skill to the game. This combination of active & passive motivations could send the "proto stompers" against each other to fight for high value contracts, while letting the newer players (and experienced players in lower-level gear) duke it out on relatively even terms. Example under the current version: Split all public contracts into two categories: Low Value High Value Low Value Contract Minumum Gear-Level: Militia Maximum Gear-Level: Advanced 1st Place Skirmish Reward: 150,000-250,000 ISK Dropsuit/Vehicle Hull Insurance: Miltia: 90% / STD: 60% / ADV: 30% High Value Contract Minimum Gear-Level: Advanced Maximum Gear-Level: Prototype 1st Place Skirmish Reward: 300,000-800,000 ISK Dropsuit/Vehicle Hull Insurance: ADV 30% / PRO: 10% Ditch the academy, it achieves nothing other than setting new players up for failure. Some kind of gentle passage from low-middle to middle-high, encouraged by financial reward for players to self-stratify, would greatly increase the game-play for new players, while still allowing advanced players to fight against them at a significant handicap. It's a win/win.
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. 236	Posted - 2013.09.28 05:58:00 - [2] - Quote Leave Battle. I've long ago stopped caring whether its honorable or not, I don't have time to die 10-15 times in a match because the enemy has better stuff.
Tectonic Fusion The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 249	Posted - 2013.09.28 05:59:00 - [3] - Quote Or DESTROY THEM WITH LASERS!!! BZZZZZZZZWUBWUBWUBBZZZZZZZZWUBWUB +50
Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz Public Disorder. 425	Posted - 2013.09.28 06:00:00 - [4] - Quote Lol at people complaining about protosuits. Take a good look at standard Gallente Logisuit and tell me that trash is worth using. Even Advanced isn't much better.
JL3Eleven PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 903	Posted - 2013.09.28 06:02:00 - [5] - Quote Yes! That's it! Make others run only what I can afford to run even thought they might have the SP and ISK for it. Brilliant!
MUDFLAPS McGILLICUTTY Local Tankers 514 11	Posted - 2013.09.28 06:03:00 - [6] - Quote Leaving the battle is what makes the entire process a joke. Not only are new players dealing with the proto-stomp itself, but their team is quitting out as well.
MUDFLAPS McGILLICUTTY Local Tankers 514 11	Posted - 2013.09.28 06:04:00 - [7] - Quote JL3Eleven wrote: Yes! That's it! Make others run only what I can afford to run even thought they might have the SP and ISK for it. Brilliant! Take a High Value contract or go play PC where there are no restrictions. Oh, right, that would require CCP to fix PC... But hey, who was I kidding taking the time to write a detailed suggestion. Should have just drawn some shiny colors on a scout suit model and submitted it as the new Pilot Suit!
jerrmy12 kahoalii Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 47	Posted - 2013.09.28 07:10:00 - [8] - Quote MUDFLAPS McGILLICUTTY wrote: TL/DR: Make it unprofitable to Proto Stomp. Instead of just Academy and Public, split all contracts based on value. Cap all public contracts on minimum and maximum skill levels (Public contractors wouldn't want to hire out clones in expensive suits if the contract is of low value) --- If you HAVE proto gear, that's fine, but you can't wear them in low-level contracts, because the corporate sponsors refuse to pay for it. High-value contracts come with much more lucrative payouts, but also come with stronger minimum requirements for participation. This would accomplish multiple things: 1) It offers an incentive for new players to reach the next level of dropsuits (offer a 40-75% corporate reimbursement of base suit value - reimbursed as corporate insurance for those who die in combat.) New players in militia only have to deal with advanced gear --- This also prepares them t all proto stompers have endless money basically, doesnt help randoms
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1082	Posted - 2013.09.28 07:29:00 - [9] - Quote Proto bears tend to swap out to malitia if you kill them a couple of times. Get up high and whip out the good ol forge gun . Itll 1 shot any suit proto or not.
Mregomies The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 49	Posted - 2013.09.28 07:34:00 - [10] - Quote Enemy proto stomp = I drop 10000 uplinks over the map = profit Team dies and spawns in my sponsored pizzaboxes. after that I pickup my medic fit and run around reviving teammates or go sniping. That's how it's done. Hater's gona hate
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 999	Posted - 2013.09.28 07:35:00 - [11] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1050070#post1050070
Thurak1 Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 212	Posted - 2013.09.28 09:35:00 - [12] - Quote Make a FG fitting and start blasting them from afar. If you score a direct hit you just cost them like 100k or so :)
Vin Vicious Capital Acquisitions LLC Public Disorder. 522	Posted - 2013.09.28 09:46:00 - [13] - Quote Proto suits are not the problem, 6 man squads are the problem Or better yet, two full premade squads on one side.... None on the other I'm surprised I'm the only one noticing the massive number of times squads are getting stacked on one side
Spaceman-Rob Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 166	Posted - 2013.09.28 09:46:00 - [14] - Quote Well I think it's a very good idea OP. I hope they implement something similar.
R F Gyro Clones 4u 553	Posted - 2013.09.28 10:07:00 - [15] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1050070#post1050070 That is the way it should be done - allow players to choose the level they play at, using sec status as the basis. I posted a somewhat similar suggestion back in January.
Ryme Intrinseca Seraphim Auxiliaries 73	Posted - 2013.09.28 11:18:00 - [16] - Quote R F Gyro wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1050070#post1050070 That is the way it should be done - allow players to choose the level they play at, using sec status as the basis. I posted a somewhat similar suggestion back in January. Splitting the playerbase by skill/SP=unbearable waiting times and even more underfilled, grossly unbalanced battles (10 versus 4, 6 versus 0, etc). Do you remember day one of 1.4? Basically, that. Try again.
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 517	Posted - 2013.09.28 11:37:00 - [17] - Quote Justin Tymes wrote: Lol at people complaining about protosuits. Take a good look at standard Gallente Logisuit and tell me that trash is worth using. Even Advanced isn't much better. Bro, compared to my Gallente scout the STD Logi suit with it's 2 low slots and 0 high slots is like sitting inside fort ***** knox. And the ADV is definitely way, WAY better with it's 2 high and 3 low. I run STD Gal Logi frequently (almost exclusively an my 6M sp alt using a basic level AR) and do just fine. By 'fine' I mean 5/0, 10/3, 8/2.... not 'beast' but CERTAINLY not trash. As scout...... the scores are reversed. That's trash dude. Back on topic - I agree w/ leaving match. F-Honor.... the other side doesn't have it, why should I. Another tactic I like is the Laser rifle or sniper rifle.... if you're gonna annoy me with your no-skill proto crutches, you're gonna feel the sting of Mr. Laser, or the bite of Mr. Ishukone. ** YOU. Edit: I didn't really mean to insult the posted quote author, just a generic F-You to the proto bears in proto squads with the proto weapons..... you know, I'm ranting a bit.
Cosgar ParagonX 5534	Posted - 2013.09.28 12:17:00 - [18] - Quote You counter proto stomping by not pissing down your leg when you see a fully stacked corp (that isn't EoN) on the opposing side. I've seen way too many situations where someone in my squad will see the upcoming battle participants, losing morale when they see a situation like this. Grow a damn pair and fight. If it's EoN... just hope they get awoxed one day...
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 517	Posted - 2013.09.28 12:30:00 - [19] - Quote Cosgar wrote: You counter proto stomping by not pissing down your leg when you see a fully stacked corp (that isn't EoN) on the opposing side. I've seen way too many situations where someone in my squad will see the upcoming battle participants, losing morale when they see a situation like this. Grow a damn pair and fight. If it's EoN... just hope they get awoxed one day... Staying and fighting isn't a counter dude, it's merely choosing to stay and fight because you're gonna take your chances or you have an actual "counter" plan (which I'd love to hear). In most cases it's suicide. I don't leave matches. But I sure as hell wouldn't feel bad about doing it given a stack up of a bunch of proto weenies. I don't like heading to the hills with a sniper rifle, or trying to stay in range with a laser but as a scout mostly lone wolfing it's rare I get into a good squad after coming into a battle solo. So again, do you have any actual advice or shall I assume your counter is just stay and toss yourself into the fray and hope for the best - all the while assuming that anyone who doesn't do the same doesn't have any balls?
Cosgar ParagonX 5534	Posted - 2013.09.28 12:31:00 - [20] - Quote Matticus Monk wrote: Cosgar wrote: You counter proto stomping by not pissing down your leg when you see a fully stacked corp (that isn't EoN) on the opposing side. I've seen way too many situations where someone in my squad will see the upcoming battle participants, losing morale when they see a situation like this. Grow a damn pair and fight. If it's EoN... just hope they get awoxed one day... Staying and fighting isn't a counter dude, it's merely choosing to stay and fight because you're gonna take your chances or you have an actual "counter" plan (which I'd love to hear). In most cases it's suicide. I don't leave matches, ever. But I sure as hell wouldn't feel bad about doing it given a stack up of a bunch of proto weenies. I don't like heading to the hills with a sniper rifle, or trying to stay in range with a laser but as a scout mostly lone wolfing it's rare I get into a good squad after coming into a battle solo. So again, do you have any actual advice or shall I assume your counter is just stay and toss yourself into the fray and hope for the best - all the while assuming that anyone who doesn't do the same doesn't have any balls? I've actually heard someone say, "Oh crap! It's Dust University!" Think about that for a second...
Smooth Assassin Stardust incorporation 200	Posted - 2013.09.28 12:35:00 - [21] - Quote Shotgun works best on beating proto's
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 517	Posted - 2013.09.28 12:35:00 - [22] - Quote Cosgar wrote: I've actually heard someone say, "Oh crap! It's Dust University!" Think about that for a second... Yeah - that's pretty ironic, running from the corp that is known to be a training ground for new players. It speaks to your point about making morale worse (and maybe about the merc making the statement looking for an easy fight), but it does absolutely nothing for countering (pun intended) my point. That's cool though, if you don't want to reply. Peace.
Kasote Denzara A Vulture 370	Posted - 2013.09.28 12:59:00 - [23] - Quote When I see groups of proto users in pubs, I always say hello with a FG. My getup I use for that is 5,450 ISK a suit. I make 300-400+ for using it, depending on how mentally challenged the proto users are. (They are often pretty damn dumb, causing me to think of Call of Duty stupid, so it makes my job a lot easier.) Hey, if you're going to crutch, might as well put more money in my pocket. It's regrettable that newcomers do not share my mentality. This game will rot if we are unable to retain any new players. I pity proto users. It must be nice being subpar and having to use such gear against militia/standards. Kind of makes me think of the bullies at a playground, sobbing inside because they cannot cope in another way other than trying to afflict others. Noobs.
Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 473	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:12:00 - [24] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Matticus Monk wrote: Cosgar wrote: You counter proto stomping by not pissing down your leg when you see a fully stacked corp (that isn't EoN) on the opposing side. I've seen way too many situations where someone in my squad will see the upcoming battle participants, losing morale when they see a situation like this. Grow a damn pair and fight. If it's EoN... just hope they get awoxed one day... Staying and fighting isn't a counter dude, it's merely choosing to stay and fight because you're gonna take your chances or you have an actual "counter" plan (which I'd love to hear). In most cases it's suicide. I don't leave matches, ever. But I sure as hell wouldn't feel bad about doing it given a stack up of a bunch of proto weenies. I don't like heading to the hills with a sniper rifle, or trying to stay in range with a laser but as a scout mostly lone wolfing it's rare I get into a good squad after coming into a battle solo. So again, do you have any actual advice or shall I assume your counter is just stay and toss yourself into the fray and hope for the best - all the while assuming that anyone who doesn't do the same doesn't have any balls? I've actually heard someone say, "Oh crap! It's Dust University!" Think about that for a second... Honestly that's hilarious But perhaps they got caught in a "pub training" match with a bunch of our more advanced and proto wielding students
Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 473	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:13:00 - [25] - Quote Anyways at the OP: does this mean I can't use my kaalakiota sniper even though it's on an advanced suit?
JL3Eleven PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 912	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:21:00 - [26] - Quote Let's all be honest here. Proto suits are no better than advanced suits currently. The advancements to hit detection have changed the game in regards to what it was a month ago, let alone anything longer than that. Everyone needs to remember they also will have proto one day so any changes they are asking for will affect them in the future and for a longer time than being without it. Also if you can afford it why use anything else?
JL3Eleven PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 912	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:27:00 - [27] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Cosgar wrote: Matticus Monk wrote: Cosgar wrote: You counter proto stomping by not pissing down your leg when you see a fully stacked corp (that isn't EoN) on the opposing side. I've seen way too many situations where someone in my squad will see the upcoming battle participants, losing morale when they see a situation like this. Grow a damn pair and fight. If it's EoN... just hope they get awoxed one day... Staying and fighting isn't a counter dude, it's merely choosing to stay and fight because you're gonna take your chances or you have an actual "counter" plan (which I'd love to hear). In most cases it's suicide. I don't leave matches, ever. But I sure as hell wouldn't feel bad about doing it given a stack up of a bunch of proto weenies. I don't like heading to the hills with a sniper rifle, or trying to stay in range with a laser but as a scout mostly lone wolfing it's rare I get into a good squad after coming into a battle solo. So again, do you have any actual advice or shall I assume your counter is just stay and toss yourself into the fray and hope for the best - all the while assuming that anyone who doesn't do the same doesn't have any balls? I've actually heard someone say, "Oh crap! It's Dust University!" Think about that for a second... Honestly that's hilarious But perhaps they got caught in a "pub training" match with a bunch of our more advanced and proto wielding students So if you think about it, the early zerg corps(#'s > everything) will over time have thousands of proto noobs. Did I mention... o]o]...
Kasote Denzara A Vulture 370	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:38:00 - [28] - Quote JL3Eleven wrote: Let's all be honest here. Proto suits are no better than advanced suits currently. The advancements to hit detection have changed the game in regards to what it was a month ago, let alone anything longer than that. Everyone needs to remember they also will have proto one day so any changes they are asking for will affect them in the future and for a longer time than being without it. Also if you can afford it why use anything else? I bolded a key sentence. You may think I'm going to ridicule or try to argue with it- I won't. It's true. It's been true for a while now, since before even Uprising. This is not directed to you, but I'm putting it here anyways. Suits, themselves, are extremely little in varying stat-wise. What causes them to be hated so much though? The power. Not the power of the suit. Suits are worthless. Slots. CPU. PG. With an increase of these three things, you can equip more modules. Modules are power. More modules, more power. Three complex damage mods will always crush out anything less, for example. So far, this is natural climbing of power. Here's the problem. People are running three high end damage modifiers with a weapon that does 37.4 damage per bullet at base against people that, if lucky, have at least two damage modifiers and a weapon that does 34 or 35.7 damage per bullet. I'm, of course, am using ARs as the weapon of example here. They all shoot at the same speed. They have the same range. Is the problem clear yet? I have always spoken down to the usage of proto-type gear in public games, as I have done to tanks in Ambush. If you really need to crutch that hard against militia and standard users, people that have not even played a week, I pity you. You are filth.
Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 474	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:40:00 - [29] - Quote Lol JL, most of our students move on to other corps once they feel they have the skills to do so....so we will most likely not have a proto stomping corp
JL3Eleven PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 915	Posted - 2013.09.28 13:48:00 - [30] - Quote Kasote Denzara wrote: [quote=JL3Eleven]Let's all be honest here. Proto suits are no better than advanced suits currently. The advancements to hit detection have changed the game in regards to what it was a month ago, let alone anything longer than that. Everyone needs to remember they also will have proto one day so any changes they are asking for will affect them in the future and for a longer time than being without it. Also if you can afford it why use anything else? I bolded a key sentence. You may think I'm going to ridicule or try to argue with it- I won't. It's true. It's been true for a while now, since before even Uprising. This is not directed to you, but I'm putting it here anyways. Suits, themselves, are extremely little in varying stat-wise. What causes them to be hated so much though? The power. Not the power of the suit. Suits are worthless. Slots. CPU. PG. With an increase of these three things, you can equip more modules. Modules are power. More modules, more power. Three complex damage mods will always crush out anything less, for example. So far, this is natural climbing of power. Here's the problem. People are running three high end damage modifiers with a weapon that does 37.4 damage per bullet at base against people that, if lucky, have at least two damage modifiers and a weapon that does 34 or 35.7 damage per bullet. I'm, of course, am using ARs as the weapon of example here. They all shoot at the same speed. They have the same range. Is the problem clear yet? I have always spoken down to the usage of proto-type gear in public games, as I have done to tanks in Ambush. If you really need to crutch that hard against militia and standard users, people that have not even played a week, I pity you. You are filth.[/quote] I agree 100000000% people have no clue to what the other merc is running gear wise. All they see is the suit and weapon and the tears start to flow. As to the bolded part why talk ****? If you can afford to why gimp yourself?

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