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The (Very) Special Bond Between ARs and Aim Assist

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zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 57	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:20:00 - [1] - Quote I just got done playing a few games today and basically this 1:30 - 2:20 http://youtu.be/6QI4wmuzjmU I've played probably 10-15 games. I am going to make a (not so) very outrageous claim, get ready. ARs are OP currently. Now before the people who cry that the most used weapon gets the most kills in the killfeed start jacking off, let me tell you a little bit about myself. 11.7m SP, 6.7k kills (I know - not a lot), 2.06 k/d, 4 year EvE player, I've been watching Dust since it was first announced, I was accepted into the closed beta, I have recommended and gotten at least 5 people to play the game via word of mouth, and probably a dozen more online. I have been playing FPSs since I was in the womb. I exclusively played the AR in this game. I don't even know how any other weapon god damn functions. I only know what the reticles look like for other weapons because I watch gameplay, and let me tell you something, the AR is OP. I have skilled into ARs, I play medium, I am a tanky vanilla AR user and that's how I roll. Let me tell you why the AR is OP. With 100% accuracy, it destroys every weapon in its optimal. The fact that they semi-fixed (I say semi because evidently shotguns are still off) hit detection is lovely. However, coupled with the aimbot aim assist, this is game breaking. I beat people who used ARs by strafing better and by having better accuracy. That is called "skill". Everyone has 300% better accuracy. This equates to 300% more DPS with the AR. You lose if you have low health. Period. I don't lose 1v1s. I stack plates and damage mods and use an AR. GG, WP. I am probably 20x more effective in 1v1s. Yay. They picked my weapon as the FOTM, great for ME, right? Wrong. I can't kill 2 people at once with them both shooting me because of their homing missile bullets railing me in the face. I used to kill 6 people at once in a STANDARD suit with a STANDARD AR because of skill. I would play by myself so I would play aggressively and assault greater numbers of individuals and kill them all because they sucked and couldn't aim worth **. Now, I cannot play aggressively because I die, even with my 800 health, INSTANTLY, if I ever move in front of the enemy team. If they use ARs, or anything that gets aim assist, you CANNOT kite, you CANNOT escape your inevitable death. I can't play aggressively. Essentially, with this RIDICULOUS aim assist, this is CoD/Halo/BF3 with no health/shield regen. I can't continue fighting more than one person if they land EVERY shot. It's just not possible. How am I supposed to do ANYTHING if I can only kill one person at a time? How many skillpoints do I need for the capability to kill TWO cherries fresh out of the Academy using MLT ARs? Cause clearly 12m sp is not enough. I have to kill one, hide, wait for the regen of armor, and run back, when normally I'd WALK through them, reload, and I can continue because 99% of the players in this game ***** suck and can't hit the broadside of a barn without an aimbot holding their hand, which is why speed tank used to be viable. By not being able to play aggressively, this leads to stalemates. This leads to Skirmish being nothing but a TDM until an MCC explodes. I cannot change the tide of battle by myself because I am a cog in a machine thats existence is dedicated to zerg rushing as a mindless horde. This update punishes skill and effort. I have spent hours playing this game. Days. Weeks. Months. To die to two MLT scrubs using ARs. I might as well have 0 sp and use the free fits. What is even the POINT of getting skillpoints if they accomplish NOTHING? 20 more armor from my plates, GREAT, but with aimbot that's only .08 more seconds of life (60s/750 rpm). I can't use any of my expensive fittings, you know why? Because they die so easily to absolute TRASH players. I can't even maintain a 2.0 k/d anymore. This game used to be HTFU, now it's, "Don't worry, typical garbage AR user, we'll make sure you don't have to even worry about aiming anymore!" I used to be able to outskill multiple people at once who were using better gear than me, but now it's just who gets the first shot, who has more HP, who does more damage, who has more people shooting with them? Skill DOES NOT factor into the equation anymore. THIS DOES NOT FIT WITH THE ECONOMICS OF THIS GAME This aimbot does not fit with the economics of the game. Why? Because for the low, low price of 0 isk you can do 1360 damage with the clip of a MLT AR. Aimbot makes this feasible. The damage the clip from an AR does used to be negligible because of poor accuracy and the general minor skill level of the average AR user. Now people feel the full effect. It is OP. It is not functioning as it should. The fact that I can use a STD AR and out DPS and KILL any player provided they are within my optimal regardless of their gear or weapon, only taking into consideration how much health they're brick fitting, is not right. Not being awarded for skill neglects artificial skill (SP) and in turn, expensive gear. Increasing accuracy increases damage dealt, increasing DPS, increasing the effectiveness of ARs, increasing stopping power, effectively making it OP. The AR does not deserve the accuracy you are spoon feeding it. Why would I upgrade gear if I can kill everyone (including proto) easily with a std assault rifle thanks to aimbot? It used to be that I used mostly STD gear because my skill put me on par with someone in proto, with their artificial skill putting them at my level (artificial skill being SP invested into health/damage mods/utilities). Now, you're out of the academy and you're at the level of someone using proto because of aimbot. The ONLY way to counter it is to stack health. It is the only way to rebalance this toppled pyramid of skill. If the problem was that new players were getting wrecked, matchmaking could fix that instead of aimbot.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 57	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:21:00 - [2] - Quote You are not supposed to have 1,000,000% accuracy with an AR. That is broken. You are not supposed to be able to nail 80% of the shots and kill people in less than a second with a MLT weapon. I can honestly say, I died less than 5 times to a MLT AR over the past almost year of playing this game. I honestly believe that I had never died to a MLT AR before 1.4, because new players suck - AND THEY SHOULD. I died at least 5 times to a MLT AR last game. The whole point of the AR is that it gets better with skill. The better you aim it, the more shots land. For example, you start out and land 25% of your shots on a target. That's 408 DPS until you run out of ammo in your MLT AR. Pretty good. That's not incredible damage, it can kill but it's not INSANE. And I assure you very few people had 50% accuracy, if that, pre-1.4 so there was always room for improvement. Now we add in the ridiculous ***** aim assist. I'd say 75% accuracy. 1224 DPS with a MLT AR. That doesn't seem so balanced - but these aren't based off of raw, true research, so lets put the DPS aside for now. Do you honestly expect skill to get that 75% any higher? Maybe to 80%? 90%??? Unlikely. Getting 20% accuracy to 35% accuracy isn't, though. This is how you show SKILL**. You are able to pick up the AR and get kills, but if you become proficient with it, you get better and eventually you are a god with it, now you can not evade even the shittiest player. People are quitting this game for a reason, CCP. This aimbot is game killing. I don't care if I sound like a fascist when I say this, you literally are either a terrible player, a mindless drone of a fanboy, or just plain stupid if you think this aimbot is okay. I am quitting this game if it does not get fixed, and hundreds of others already have uninstalled and quit. YOU are contributing to the DEATH of this game if you are so ignorant as to say, "Well... I don't really notice it!! DURRR!" THe fixed hit detection and the reduced strafing should be enough. WE DO NOT NEED AIM ASSIST, at least not to the extent that is currently being implemented. I want it back to 1.3 or at least cut down by 50-75%. In an ideal world it is removed, but I know the average player on these forums doesn't even know what game I'm talking about right now and are also are the people who could barely maintain a .75 k/d pre-1.4. Please don't listen to any idiot on this forum who defends the aimbot, CCP. I am BEGGING you, please don't let this game fail. I have spent 4 years in anticipation of this game, it can't die this soon. As for those of you who still think that the AR is just inherently OP, you're an idiot and I most likely won't reply to you if you post in this thread because I will be able to tell you are a complete waste of time. I am fairly confident this thread will die and get no support, but at least I can say I tried before I quit the game.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 57	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:28:00 - [3] - Quote To summarize, YES, the AR is OP. It is OP because of Aim Assist. It makes it too high of a damage output for too low of an SP and actual skill (being able to point and shoot a gun in an fps) requirement/investment. If any of my points are flawed or not clear, I'd be more than willing to adjust, edit, and elaborate on them. Above all, I want this game to succeed, and attacking the very core of the game, like having powerful aim assist does, goes against that.
Cosgar ParagonX 4833	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:43:00 - [4] - Quote I've been fighting this battle since Chromosome. I hope you have better luck than me. +1 for general principles. Godspeed.
Leovarian L Lavitz Better Academy. 675	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:44:00 - [5] - Quote I take on three people at once and kill them, open with three grenades on the ground, scrambler pistol each one to get attention and then melee the first, ar the second and the third dies to grenade.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 60	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:48:00 - [6] - Quote Leovarian L Lavitz wrote: I take on three people at once and kill them, open with three grenades on the ground, scrambler pistol each one to get attention and then melee the first, ar the second and the third dies to grenade. And how many times can you do that? I hope you're packing a lot of nanohives because that sure sounds like a lot of grenades, and a lot of work, in a game that's about shooting and killing. How far can you throw those grenades? Do you expect that tactic to work every time? Especially against a squad? I went 29/2 with an 'Exile'. I threw no grenades and I rarely used my secondary. I'd like to see you EVER get that kind of effectiveness out of that tactic, no matter how skilled you are. I will never go 29/2 again, not because I'm BAD now, but because it is simply not feasible anymore since skill is completely taken out of the equation.
Draco Cerberus Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 284	Posted - 2013.09.06 16:59:00 - [7] - Quote Welcome to New Eden sir, as an Eve player this is the type of thing that gets said (last alliance tourney) about good ships also ie T3 Cruisers. This aim assist feature works on many guns. The game has been broken for a while with excessive stacking of armor/shield mods creating high buffer fits that can't be taken down. Now it is my turn to use my squad to kill you like you have been killing me since closed beta. Welcome to battle earnings deficits and Isk loss instead of gain. Have some fun, Bpos don't run out. BTW my KDR as logi is somewhere around 0.5 and I have a lot of enjoyment in killing stacked suits by using tactics. This is a team play game. The name is not COD 514 it is Dust 514. Join a TEAM and learn how to win fights as a team.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 67	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:02:00 - [8] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: This is a team play game. The name is not COD 514 it is Dust 514. Join a TEAM and learn how to win fights as a team. Oh, a team game you say? Have you ever heard of the saying, a chain is only as strong as its weakest link? I really like that one. You know why? My team of GOOD players chokeslams your team of garbage zerg rushers. But now, our squads are completely even, even though yours is absolute trash and mine is comprised of incredibly skilled individuals. That's team play to you, though, isn't it? Just go away.
Cosgar ParagonX 4837	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:06:00 - [9] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: Welcome to New Eden sir, as an Eve player this is the type of thing that gets said (last alliance tourney) about good ships also ie T3 Cruisers. This aim assist feature works on many guns. The game has been broken for a while with excessive stacking of armor/shield mods creating high buffer fits that can't be taken down. Now it is my turn to use my squad to kill you like you have been killing me since closed beta. Welcome to battle earnings deficits and Isk loss instead of gain. Have some fun, Bpos don't run out. BTW my KDR as logi is somewhere around 0.5 and I have a lot of enjoyment in killing stacked suits by using tactics. This is a team play game. The name is not COD 514 it is Dust 514. Join a TEAM and learn how to win fights as a team. Unfortunately this game has degraded into CoD. TTK is extremely low no matter how you fit your suit and aim-assist replaces the need for skill. This isn't just about the AR, but core FPS mechanics and skill based gunplay suffering. I have a 250k logi suit meant for running support through prototype equipment, not front-line fighting and it dies as fast as my free BPO fit with diminished support. Guess what I'm going to be using until this mess gets fixed?
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1588	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:21:00 - [10] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: I exclusively played the AR in this game. I don't even know how any other weapon god damn functions. Sorry, I stopped right there. How on earth can you possibly know what's over powered if you don't even know how powerful other weapons are? For example, I used to use the AR a ton in Chromosome and now use the Scrambler Rifle and it easily outclasses the AR is several situations.

PEW JACKSON Intara Direct Action Caldari State 17	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:21:00 - [11] - Quote I'm buying a pack of rubber bands to rig my left joy stick. Need some?
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1588	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:23:00 - [12] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Unfortunately this game has degraded into CoD. TTK is extremely low no matter how you fit your suit and aim-assist replaces the need for skill. Gamers are so close minded. Honestly aiming is a very negligible portion of skill in a shooter, believe it or not. Whether you survive an engagement or not relies much more on your situational awareness, combat knowledge, and wit than your aiming.
Leovarian L Lavitz Better Academy. 675	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:24:00 - [13] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: Leovarian L Lavitz wrote: I take on three people at once and kill them, open with three grenades on the ground, scrambler pistol each one to get attention and then melee the first, ar the second and the third dies to grenade. And how many times can you do that? I hope you're packing a lot of nanohives because that sure sounds like a lot of grenades, and a lot of work, in a game that's about shooting and killing. How far can you throw those grenades? Do you expect that tactic to work every time? Especially against a squad? I went 29/2 with an 'Exile', playing solo, no less. I threw no grenades and I rarely used my secondary. I'd like to see you EVER get that kind of effectiveness out of that tactic, no matter how skilled you are. I will never go 29/2 again, not because I'm BAD now, but because it is simply not feasible anymore since skill is completely taken out of the equation. I do it, run to supply, do it, run to supply, do it, run to supply. It tends to net me about an 11 kdr when I do perform it. My favorite tactic is to use my HMG heavy in my limbus, run up on someone, hop out, blitz him, hop back in run to the next guy, blitz him, wash rinse repeat.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 69	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:25:00 - [14] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: zibathy numbertwo wrote: I exclusively played the AR in this game. I don't even know how any other weapon god damn functions. Sorry, I stopped right there. How on earth can you possibly know what's over powered if you don't even know how powerful other weapons are? For example, I used to use the AR a ton in Chromosome and now use the Scrambler Rifle and it easily outclasses the AR is several situations. That was an exaggeration. But let me explain. When I use the AR now, I feel no sense of accomplishment with it. I am very challenge oriented with videogames. I feel no challenge when I'm killing someone 1v1. The outcome is always the same. I never have someone outskill me, I simply have more health and do more damage and - wallah! I win. Essentially, I feel no challenge when using it, it is unstoppable 1v1, therefore I believe it to be OP. I would assume someone who knows nothing but a specific weapon would know the most about that specific weapon, especially its effectiveness against other weapons, no?
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 69	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:28:00 - [15] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Cosgar wrote: Unfortunately this game has degraded into CoD. TTK is extremely low no matter how you fit your suit and aim-assist replaces the need for skill. Gamers are so close minded. Honestly aiming is a very negligible portion of skill in a shooter, believe it or not. Whether you survive an engagement or not relies much more on your situational awareness, combat knowledge, and wit than your aiming. How do you use any of those to defeat a clump of people? Right now all you do is look at the enemy and they all aimbot onto you and blast you away. I can't draw them out, they just sit in their little huddle and never chase me. Currently, the best tactic is to blob with ARs and heavies and you win. If they all had negligible aiming, I could kill the whole lot of them and get myself a nice cold glass of lemonade while their corpses cook in the sun.
Cosgar ParagonX 4839	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:28:00 - [16] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Cosgar wrote: Unfortunately this game has degraded into CoD. TTK is extremely low no matter how you fit your suit and aim-assist replaces the need for skill. Gamers are so close minded. Honestly aiming is a very negligible portion of skill in a shooter, believe it or not. Whether you survive an engagement or not relies much more on your situational awareness, combat knowledge, and wit than your aiming. You can have all the situational awareness in the world but when you're running around in a suit with equipment that costs more than a proto assault fit in a fraction of a second, what the hell are you supposed to do? There's no risk vs reward right now, just lots of dying because of broken game mechanics and lazy players defending it.
Lightning Bolt2 Binary Mercs Abandon PlayGrounds 165	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:36:00 - [17] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: zibathy numbertwo wrote: I exclusively played the AR in this game. I don't even know how any other weapon god damn functions. Sorry, I stopped right there. How on earth can you possibly know what's over powered if you don't even know how powerful other weapons are? For example, I used to use the AR a ton in Chromosome and now use the Scrambler Rifle and it easily outclasses the AR is several situations. Well, I dnt know about how he knows the AR is OP, but I do. I'm specced into at least the STD version of every light weapon, and gt the STD scram pistol and SMG with proto knives and the AR is what I can get the most kills and least deaths with now - WITH A NINJA PLAYSTYLE(!!!) It's able to do almost every job in the game! the aim assist helps make the AR OP, but just the stats alone are OP so the DMG on the AR needs toned down AND the Aim assist.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 69	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:38:00 - [18] - Quote Lightning Bolt2 wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: zibathy numbertwo wrote: blah blah. Well, I dnt know about how he knows the AR is OP, but I do. I'm specced into at least the STD version of every light weapon, and gt the STD scram pistol and SMG with proto knives and the AR is what I can get the most kills and least deaths with now - WITH A NINJA PLAYSTYLE(!!!) It's able to do almost every job in the game! the aim assist helps make the AR OP, but just the stats alone are OP so the DMG on the AR needs toned down AND the Aim assist. I agree for the most part, but I think we should change aim assist first and then go from there. A ninja playstyle that speedtanks should absolutely be viable.
Keri Starlight Psygod9 189	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:39:00 - [19] - Quote I'm sorry, but both you and the author of that video don't know exactly what Aim Assist is. That in the video is an awful combination of messed up hitboxes and lag latency. Aim Assist doesn not make your bullet curve. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaom3cdZv1c This is how Aim Assist actually works.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 70	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:40:00 - [20] - Quote Keri Starlight wrote: I'm sorry, but both you and the author of that video don't know exactly what Aim Assist is. That in the video is an awful combination of messed up hitboxes and lag latency. Aim Assist doesn not make your bullet curve. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaom3cdZv1c This is how Aim Assist actually works. I know exactly how it works, scrub. Aim assist magnetized your sights onto a target and tracks it. Don't act like I don't know what I'm talking about. If you're correct, and I have no idea what I'm talking about, I guess I've been shooting blind the past 9 months, huh? I just closed my eyes and pressed r1. You caught me. Good work.

Grief PK D3LTA FORC3 Inver Brass 46	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:42:00 - [21] - Quote +1 poster === truth
Keri Starlight Psygod9 191	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:48:00 - [22] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: Keri Starlight wrote: I'm sorry, but both you and the author of that video don't know exactly what Aim Assist is. That in the video is an awful combination of messed up hitboxes and lag latency. Aim Assist doesn not make your bullet curve. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaom3cdZv1c This is how Aim Assist actually works. I know exactly how it works, scrub. Aim assist magnetized your sights onto a target and tracks it. Don't act like I don't know what I'm talking about. If you're correct, and I have no idea what I'm talking about, I guess I've been shooting blind the past 9 months, huh? I just closed my eyes and pressed r1. You caught me. Good work. In that video you clearly see that bullets are NOT connecting. That's not aim assist, that's lag latency (HP drop even when hitscan is off) with hitbox issue, which is a currently increased problem in 1.4. This is why it did not happen in the past 9 months. On a side note, calling people scrubs don't give you extra power, it just makes you seem a complete jerk, unpolite and childish. This is a forum to discuss and as an adult and respectful person I expect you to swallow your own passive-aggressive stuff.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 70	Posted - 2013.09.06 17:56:00 - [23] - Quote Keri Starlight wrote: zibathy numbertwo wrote: Keri Starlight wrote: I'm sorry, but both you and the author of that video don't know exactly what Aim Assist is. That in the video is an awful combination of messed up hitboxes and lag latency. Aim Assist doesn not make your bullet curve. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaom3cdZv1c This is how Aim Assist actually works. I know exactly how it works, scrub. Aim assist magnetized your sights onto a target and tracks it. Don't act like I don't know what I'm talking about. If you're correct, and I have no idea what I'm talking about, I guess I've been shooting blind the past 9 months, huh? I just closed my eyes and pressed r1. You caught me. Good work. In that video you clearly see that bullets are NOT connecting. That's not aim assist, that's lag latency (HP drop even when hitscan is off) with hitbox issue, which is a currently increased problem in 1.4. This is why it did not happen in the past 9 months. On a side note, calling people scrubs don't give you extra power, it just makes you seem a complete jerk, unpolite and childish. This is a forum to discuss and as an adult and respectful person I expect you to swallow your own passive-aggressive stuff. I'm not being passive aggressive at all, I am directly being aggressive towards you. I did not cite anything from that video besides I generally agreed with it. That ONE case that he showed was indeed not aim assist. That's adorable that you think that's some kind of argument. "Yeah, well that one guy used one example and it was wrong so like yeah you're wrong dude shut up aim assist is perfect. Alright guys, I showed him, we can go home now." No. Your point was totally irrelevant and moot. Lag and latency aren't even something I discussed. Just because one case was incorrect does not mean there aren't 200,000 undocumented cases where aimbot was the issue.
Keri Starlight Psygod9 192	Posted - 2013.09.06 18:21:00 - [24] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: I'm not being passive aggressive at all, I am directly being aggressive towards you. I did not cite anything from that video besides I generally agreed with it. That ONE case that he showed was indeed not aim assist. That's adorable that you think that's some kind of argument. "Yeah, well that one guy used one example and it was wrong so like yeah you're wrong dude shut up aim assist is perfect. Alright guys, I showed him, we can go home now." No. Your point was totally irrelevant and moot. Lag and latency aren't even something I discussed. Just because one case was incorrect does not mean there aren't 200,000 undocumented cases where aimbot was the issue. I don't pretend to invalidate your post. Also I don't know why you should be aggressive at all, I don't know your age, but I believe you're not a 13 years old kid and we can discuss like civil people. You made this thread, so you opened a discussion. You must be open to the discussion yourself to express your point and listen to the other forumers, as long as they don't breake the forum rules. So... I know you didn't name latency and messed up hitboxes, that's why I'm bringing them in the discussion. They are part of the problem and I wanted you to notice that watching the video carefully. I do not mean to bust your thread by saying this. I believe we must chill for one second and give time to the DEV's to understand what's happening to the AR. Yes, something might be messed up with the AR now, but believe me, if this happens in your example, it happens more and more times. It's not just that one in particular. Now, you said you are a full-time AR user, that's ok, but listen to my feedback, because I have different experiences. I use the Scrambler Rifle a lot and I can assure you that thing does NOT happen with that weapon, at least not with the semi-auto version. I haven't tried the assault version yet after the update. Also, the Tactical Assault rifle, which is still an AR, is not "suffering" from this magic-bullets effect. Only the regular AR. So maybe yes, there's something strange with the AR, but it can't be just the Aim assist, since it's not causing that with different weapons. Does this make sense to you?
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 71	Posted - 2013.09.06 18:33:00 - [25] - Quote Keri Starlight wrote: I don't pretend to invalidate your post. Also I don't know why you should be aggressive at all, I don't know your age, but I believe you're not a 13 years old kid and we can discuss like civil people. You made this thread, so you opened a discussion. You must be open to the discussion yourself to express your point and listen to the other forumers, as long as they don't break the forum rules. So... I know you didn't name latency and messed up hitboxes, that's why I'm bringing them in the discussion. They are part of the problem and I wanted you to notice that watching the video carefully. I do not mean to bust your thread by saying this. I believe we must chill for one second and give time to the DEV's to understand what's happening to the AR. Yes, something might be messed up with the AR now, but believe me, if this happens in your example, it happens more and more times. It's not just that one in particular. Now, you said you are a full-time AR user, that's ok, but listen to my feedback, because I have different experiences. I use the Scrambler Rifle a lot and I can assure you that thing does NOT happen with that weapon, at least not with the semi-auto version. I haven't tried the assault version yet after the update. Also, the Tactical Assault rifle, which is still an AR, is not "suffering" from this magic-bullets effect. Only the regular AR. So maybe yes, there's something strange with the AR, but it can't be just the Aim assist, since it's not causing that with different weapons. Does this make sense to you? I want the aim assist gone. I want it removed. It is a crutch for bad players. I'm not talking about magic bullets. That is latency. I am fairly certain it cannot be helped. Hitboxes are working as they should as far as I know. Latency will always be unavoidable and frankly I find it acceptable. It may not be optimal, but it is okay. Clearly you do not know what I am arguing. I am arguing aim assist. Not the magic bullet effect. I couldn't care LESS about hitboxes or latency right now. I want my crosshairs not to stick to my target like I superglued it to him. I can't say I notice the issue you're talking about at all. What I do notice is the aim assist. Clearly you are misunderstanding me. If that's an issue for you, you should make a thread. Aim assist needs to be removed. It might be the Unreal engine interpreting the projectile of the normal AR incorrectly, seeing as the Unreal engine is awful with projectiles. It probably creates extra latency based on how many AR projectiles are currently on field so it's not as noticeable with lower RPM ARs. Regardless, that is irrelevant to aim assist. If you don't notice it or you don't agree with me, then there's nothing to discuss in this thread in particular.
Keri Starlight Psygod9 193	Posted - 2013.09.06 19:08:00 - [26] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: It probably creates extra latency based on how many AR projectiles are currently on field so it's not as noticeable with lower RPM ARs. I think this is true, even though just my opinion. Because the improved Hit Detection obviously affects the higher RoF weapons and this burdens on the de-sync effect. But maybe I didn't make the point clear, I think this is part of the problem you're talking about. You are talking about Aim Assist AND Assault Rifles, connected. In particular, you're saying that the Aim Assist is making AR overpowered. I got this. When you shoot, your bullets hit the target but, thanks to the improved Hit Detection, you have more hitscan connections now. The server is working hard to register them and it seems like you're doing damage even when you're not actually hitting, because the game is still counting the damage and dropping your enemy's HP even after you stopped shooting. Don't get me wrong, but this makes seem the Aim Assist much stronger than what it really is. Try to do something I did. Turn off aim assist. The AR is still kicking butts. More than in 1.3. And this is because of hit detection. Don't underestimate the new hit detection. And if you're hating your crosshair sticking to the target and you don't want it at all, just disable Aim Assist. Why should you penalize yourself? Last but not least, I'm saying that the Aim Assist is NOT making some other weapons OP (I can't tell about all of them, because I do not use every single weapon in the game). So how is Aim Assist capable of making OP the AR and not (for example) the Scrambler Rifle? Pick a Scrambler Rifle and give it a try (with aim assist on), it doesn't feel that OP. Do you understand that something is fishy? You said it yourself, the special connection between AA and AR. So why AA does not make Scrambler rifle that OP as well? There are other factors to count, such as Hit detection and Lag. I understand you want the Aim Assit removed, but I believe it's gonna stay. A possible solution might involve tuning down the Aim Assist just a bit for the AR and other automatic weapons.
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 71	Posted - 2013.09.06 19:19:00 - [27] - Quote I wasn't sure exactly what you meant so I wanted you to clarify, thanks. Disabling it for myself would make me do worse, why would I handicap myself for no reason? Everyone needs to be on equal footing. And I think if the magic bullet effect is behind every shot hitting me 100% of the time, I obviously want that fixed too, but that's not even a known bug with 1.4 - the devs haven't acknowledged it as one (https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=106848). So, everything you're saying is not backed up by solid evidence. And it's not making other weapons OP because of unique reasons, for example, the semi-auto Scrambler Rifle inherently has better accuracy. Semi-auto weapons reset the spread in between shots. With ARs, if you semi-auto it, it will have 100% accuracy. Other weapons naturally have higher accuracy, thus aim assist has less of an effect on them. Also they were either underpowered in the first place or naturally have a low maximum dps but give sustained damage for a longer period. Again, the AR is unique despite everyone wanting to believe it's not. In summary, I haven't seen any posts made arguing your point, and each weapon gets affected uniquely by AA. The most grossly affected weapon is the AR, even though it is a "precision" weapon, it is hardly precise at all normally. Which makes sense.
RydogV Shadow Company HQ 284	Posted - 2013.09.06 19:29:00 - [28] - Quote Yeah well claims of 'easy mode' aim assist are exaggerated. An improvement in aiming mechanics generally should result in a player actually hitting their target with more rounds making contact, no? More rounds making contact will result in you dying quicker in an engagement. I am an AR user and my gameplay results have not changed one bit since the update hit. I don't generally get any more kills than normal and I don't generally die any more often either. What I have noticed is a bit more diversity on the battlefield now in terms of what weapons are being used. And that is a good thing. "I used to be able to kill 6 players at the same time and now I can only kill one." Gimmie a friggin' break.
Keri Starlight Psygod9 194	Posted - 2013.09.06 19:39:00 - [29] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: I wasn't sure exactly what you meant so I wanted you to clarify, thanks. Disabling it for myself would make me do worse, why would I handicap myself for no reason? Everyone needs to be on equal footing. And I think if the magic bullet effect is behind every shot hitting me 100% of the time, I obviously want that fixed too, but that's not even a known bug with 1.4 - the devs haven't acknowledged it as one (https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=106848). So, everything you're saying is not backed up by solid evidence. And it's not making other weapons OP because of unique reasons, for example, the semi-auto Scrambler Rifle inherently has better accuracy. Semi-auto weapons reset the spread in between shots. With ARs, if you semi-auto it, it will have 100% accuracy. Other weapons naturally have higher accuracy, thus aim assist has less of an effect on them. Also they were either underpowered in the first place or naturally have a low maximum dps but give sustained damage for a longer period. Again, the AR is unique despite everyone wanting to believe it's not. In summary, I haven't seen any posts made arguing your point, and each weapon gets affected uniquely by AA. The most grossly affected weapon is the AR, even though it is a "precision" weapon, it is hardly precise at all normally. Which makes sense. Yes, my point is not validated, though I'm pretty sure this is not among the "1.4" known issues" because it's a combination of several factors and not actual bugs. Lag has always been there and it might be more noticeable now because of the hit detection improvement. So what if automatic weapons (or just the AR?) would get a slight Aim Assist decrease? I know it wouldn't make you happy, because you don't want aim assist at all, but... ... would that help in your opinion? Would that bring a better weapon balance across the board? Since aim assist is most likely to stay (I actually like it because the whole aiming mechanic feels smoother now, but I can't pretend everyone likes it), do you think that may be a possible solution to at least fix the exaggerated impact it has on AR?
Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz Public Disorder. 373	Posted - 2013.09.06 19:41:00 - [30] - Quote ARs out-DPS turrets, have a range of 40 meters before the weapon gets any effectiveness nerf, and they lose absolutely nothing in any situation within that range. At least the standard weapon should not have Aim Assist, there should be a cost to having these advantages.



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