So sick of these ******* mass drivers.

Most of my people have left the corp due to this. You fixed the failock, and miraculously everyone stopped using them. Now it seems that the lame weapon of choice is MD's.

If these aren't fixed on the next update I'm out.

Not that you give a ****, but just in case.

get good.. the MD has the longest time to kill out of any other weapon

So sick of these ******* mass drivers.

Most of my people have left the corp due to this. You fixed the failock, and miraculously everyone stopped using them. Now it seems that the lame weapon of choice is MD's.

If these aren't fixed on the next update I'm out.

Not that you give a ****, but just in case.

get good.. the MD has the longest time to kill out of any other weapon

but somehow it kills over every other weapon. Funny how that works

? well it hits everytime thats why every1 uses it, you dont always hit with the AR, but you do with the MD.

Honestly the Duvolle beats the Mass Driver any day. But I think if more then one person uses it because multiple shots hit, it could be OP. But not the weapon. It's teamwork. Like squads and crap. Who does that? organized or not if your on a team and more then 2 people are working together. It's pretty damn overpowered.

Anyway I realize now this should have gone in the feedback section. It probably would be passed over either way.

Most of my people have left the corp due to this.

Weird that this logic is used in your rant.

What does mass driver have to do with whether someone leaves your corp?

You're just a shitcorpleader, getgud

I almost never win a 1v1 vs a MD. Only when I am smart and use a Flux + SMG combo do I win. I think this is because I can miss, and its hard for them to miss. Any weapon, even the shot gun is outdone by the MD in CQC because it is hard to miss with it. I personally think its absolutely ridiculous that a grenade launcher is the best weapon to use in close quarters, it just seems... Wrong.

I almost never win a 1v1 vs a MD. Only when I am smart and use a Flux + SMG combo do I win. I think this is because I can miss, and its hard for them to miss. Any weapon, even the shot gun is outdone by the MD in CQC because it is hard to miss with it. I personally think its absolutely ridiculous that a grenade launcher is the best weapon to use in close quarters, it just seems... Wrong.

MD > Shotguns is a hit detection issue, not a balance issue.

My shotgun actually worked yesterday an my god!!!!
The difference was insane dude, btw I grabbed that scanner it's tha t!t$ for a scout!
I was rocking dudes with my knives again an after tonight I ll have proficiency 4 in both.
Giddy up bi%che$ OZZYS COMING!

get good.. the MD has the longest time to kill out of any other weapon

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

Is there any chance they might one day go back to 4/6 clips instead of 6/8, now that explosions register properly and what not?

Not to mention Mass Driver users that have to deal with armor players with increased health.

Then again, it's not like Assault Rifles don't take down players 10x faster from range -_-

We didn't have any plans to, I'll file that thought away in the possible nerfs draw until we see the impact of 1.4.

You fixed the failock, and miraculously everyone stopped using them.

We didn't have any plans to, I'll file that thought away in the possible nerfs draw until we see the impact of 1.4.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

MD > Shotguns is a hit detection issue, not a balance issue.

We didn't have any plans to, I'll file that thought away in the possible nerfs draw until we see the impact of 1.4.

The fact that the MD is even viable as a CQC weapon is a balance issue.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

How? Its far more balanced that that fact everyone is running around spamming 3 core locus grenades...

get good.. the MD has the longest time to kill out of any other weapon

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

The problem is everyone shield tanks - 1 flux and 1 std mass driver round kills most non heavies
itd be the same against armor tanker - 2 shots from a std scrambler and a std or adv locus grenade would kill most non heavies

Idk why everyone is scared of mass drivers after 1.4...

Can you imagine all the ARs (milita to proto) that with auto aim will be hitting you with every shot from 0 -75 meters range with anywhere between the minimum 467 dps to the averge max 690 dps?

I mean your average suit already dies fast to ARs, and they miss alot of shots. imagine when auto aim makes them a flipping aim bot?

you won't b ablr to use any gun other than ARs

Idk why everyone is scared of mass drivers after 1.4...

Can you imagine all the ARs (milita to proto) that with auto aim will be hitting you with every shot from 0 -75 meters range with anywhere between the minimum 467 dps to the averge max 690 dps?

I mean your average suit already dies fast to ARs, and they miss alot of shots. imagine when auto aim makes them a flipping aim bot?

you won't b ablr to use any gun other than ARs

Armor tanker here. Everything kills me. Any advantage armor has is negated by the fact that I'm very slow and easy to hit. My advance minmatar suit has better survivability than my proto gallente. Can't wait for 1.4 buffs.

Even still, I don't have much of a problem against MD's. They kill me sometimes but so does everything else.

So here's some tips: Either take them on at very close range where they risk hurting themselves or long range because most MD players can't hit a tank that's sitting still at long range but don't stand still, ffs, use that sprint-strafe action. Even better: flank. If you hear that unmistakable MD sound, act accordingly. Much like being too close to a heavy with a HMG, you try not to fight them where they're strongest.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

lol okay sure it does

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

We didn't have any plans to, I'll file that thought away in the possible nerfs draw until we see the impact of 1.4.

But there are still some problem with the MD especially in CQC I have recently charged a lot of MD user and get killed at point blank where as the MD user did not get any damage from his own splash there seems something weird with the splash damage regarding damage towards the MD user.

How bout you look into giving ARs some recoil. ARs since the range fix are a little pinpoint and OP. I run massdrivers now and last night I went back to my Toxin AR in one game and did just as good as I do using my proto massdriver. No gun should be able to shoot full auto with pinpoint accuracy.

After they nerf the mass driver, then maybe they could turn their attention to the assault rifle, I get killed by the ar more than anything else, most of my corp and others use the ar, maybe if you nerfed it players would stop using it and we could all get back to hitting each other to death......

oh wait that's op to....

Time to kill is such a non-sense statistic for mass drivers.

Even if both players directly engage each other, any other weapon is not going to hit every single shot. But what's more important is that mass drivers can make themselves extremely elusive. The best mass drivers strafe like mad men in close combat (they'd be silly not to) and still hit every single shot because it's practically impossible to miss with it. Especially combined with the disorienting elements of being hit by the grenades, this alone creates a major imbalance.

But even more significantly, a mass driver can stay behind cover for 90% of the time, either popping out for a split second to launch a round, or even hitting the target behind cover. The little targeting triangles are essentially a wall-hack which makes this tactic incredibly easy.

A rifle user has to stay within line of sight during 100% of their damage output, which makes it practically impossible to compete with mass drivers who really know what they are doing.

Yes, the mass driver has poor effective range (which is ridiculous considering it's a grenade launcher) and limited ammunition which may be keeping it at bay to some extend, but in close to mid range it really is an "I win" button and it's not that hard to get into this range.

It's not bad enough to make me quit the game, but it saddens me that CCP apparently has no opinion on it other than "let's wait for the statistics". Everything recently seems to be about statistics and metrics. You know, it is possible to analyse these things beforehand... That's what game designers should be paid for.

My prediction is that the situation is going to gradually escalate until we will get the inevitable correction in 1.5 or 1.6. Let's see if I'm wrong.

Personally I think it would be horrible to just nerf the mass driver as it is, because that would just make it a worse weapon without addressing the fundamental problem with it. There are many possible changes which would make the weapon more interesting and balanced without necessarily reducing it's potential efficiency at the hands of a skilled user. One such possibility would be the minimum flight time which has been brought up a few times. Another would be gradual damage fall-off for explosives, so higher accuracy is actually rewarded.

I would much rather see a change like that, than simply reduced clip size or damage properties. If you only tweak values as a response to metrics, you run the risk of losing sight of the bigger picture. This isn't an RPG after all.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

Also in pubs last night there was a player with AE who had 46 kills with an Exile. The massdriver doesn't get enough ammo or have a fast enough fire rate to down that many ppl if they stood in front of me. 20 kills is a good number for me in a domination. This guy shot me from 90 some meters in my proto suit and chewed through my 850 HP like a hot knife through butter. That's a distance no auto AR should be that effective from and now your saying it will get worse because of an aiming fix. More no aiming reds can shred suits with cheap ARs. Nice work.

46 kills? I reckon that guy was so out of sync with the server it literally gave him kills and nobody could get a single hit marker.

You can't run around destroying like that unless people literally cannot hit you.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

get good.. the MD has the longest time to kill out of any other weapon

The MD is not being used the way that kind of weapon is intended. Players are taking advantage of the lack of permadeath and virtual danger that is a video game to use it like a ******* handheld 50 cal.

MDs are fine, unless someone is camping on a roof with one. That's when I just leave the game.
Let them kill someone else, isn't going to be me.

I wonder, would people be more annoyed at Mass Driver users if they also used Kin Cats?
Wondering what to spec into on my alt, I'm not that good but if I run fast perhaps that will bring the QQ
to the table where I shall devour it.

"whatever I see, I devour, snarrffhfhrfh".

Locked for ranting. Please try to be constructive with your feedback.

range... trust me its hard to hit anything over 40m away. height really helps to but range helps as well and if you see him first you should win every time but if they start launching shoots your down that time but your lower time to kill can still win over.

Hahaha youve gotta see this ****

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=105769

The exact same topic post but about ARs, locked for ranting about 30 seconds in.

I love CCP sometimes. This time I dont.

Let me quote this little gem:

The MD is not being used the way that kind of weapon is intended. Players are taking advantage of the lack of permadeath and virtual danger that is a video game to use it like a ******* handheld 50 cal.

We didn't have any plans to, I'll file that thought away in the possible nerfs draw until we see the impact of 1.4.

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

Hahaha youve gotta see this ****

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=105769

The exact same topic post but about ARs, locked for ranting about 30 seconds in.

I love CCP sometimes. This time I dont.

Let me quote this little gem:

I think with the aiming updates in 1.4 we are going to see massholes getting dropped a lot faster. We need to see the full impact of these changes before we make any nerfs/buffs.

That's such bull ****. Don't say anything about Caldari assault, you might get IP banned for it.

This is what I keep telling people. Once aiming is fixed, the assault rifles will be king again. I use a mass driver now because its the only thing I can do damage with. If I was able to aim properly, I'd probably use my scrambler rifle instead and rip shields off all of the Caldari Logis...

Heavy complaining about MDs

It's a grenade launcher, no one likes grenade launchers in FPSs.

Just got 2 topics locked in a row for pointing out that this **** doesnt fly.
2nd time it was due to "discussing moderation action".
Because surely my point was that the AR thread was locked, and TOTALLY NOT because this thread wasnt.

Same goes for the FG that at 1m distance I get instakilled and the damn guy walks away safely. You just shot a heavy energetic round at your feet and you aren't hurt?

I'm already saving up SP to spec into Caldari assault with an AR. That seems to be the only way they want us to play.

FG splash is very tight, killing with a FG in CQC is fairly hard. You'd have to give them more splash which is certainly the wrong direction.

This is how you go againts a MD and succeed:

- Take out SMG
- Ram (get on point blank distance) the offender with your spray-and-pray bullets of death.
- ???

= Profit.

MDs can barely defend themselves point blank and for the most part they'll either end up killing themselves or damage themselves. Either way it works 90% of the time.

MDs are fine, unless someone is camping on a roof with one. That's when I just leave the game.
Let them kill someone else, isn't going to be me.

I wonder, would people be more annoyed at Mass Driver users if they also used Kin Cats?
Wondering what to spec into on my alt, I'm not that good but if I run fast perhaps that will bring the QQ
to the table where I shall devour it.

"whatever I see, I devour, snarrffhfhrfh".

I beat Mas driver users with my Six kin SMG.
I dont find them OP.
They sure ''FEEL'' OP when you are getting shot by full squad and when you are about to get away the blast radius of the MD gets you. BUT thats team work, not the MD 1 on 1....

MD are fine.

''Save your typing fanboys. I will not read your responses. Especially since you all probably use MD's, Militia ones at that.''

There are no militia Mass drivers >..>

So sick of these ******* mass drivers.

Most of my people have left the corp due to this. You fixed the failock, and miraculously everyone stopped using them. Now it seems that the lame weapon of choice is MD's.

If these aren't fixed on the next update I'm out.

Not that you give a ****, but just in case.

Off topic but, any idea when Plasma Cannon re-balancing is going to come in?

Yes,. this needs to be looked at. Considering that it's a chore to use, aim, and kill with; it's only got one round per shot; the aiming mechanics on it are questionable; etc. This really ought to operate like a rocket launcher, considering all the drawbacks it has.

but somehow it kills over every other weapon. Funny how that works

Direct dum fire would make more sense, but consider if you upped the splash damge to much wouldn't be a littke op??

We didn't have any plans to, I'll file that thought away in the possible nerfs draw until we see the impact of 1.4.

Save your typing fanboys. I will not read your responses. Especially since you all probably use MD's, Militia ones at that.

I was playing this game for the first time in a week.

Within a minute I was reminded of why It seems like a chore, than a game.

MD's

It takes too long to level up to get the duvolle, Brand new players to the game probably see this same **** and move on. I cant tell you how many people I have talked into this game that have left.

Look at the server numbers people. They don' seem to be going up do they?

Lets keep it real. When the 17th gets here, its going to be REAL hard to load up dust.

I keep playing this game for what is supposed to become, not for what it is. I know several people who feel the same way.

Maybe Ill just come back in a year or so and drop millions of free sp and see whats up then.

Anyway I realize now this should have gone in the feedback section. It probably would be passed over either way.

Yeah..... what he says would make sense if you took a firing row of mercs each with a different weapon and had them shoot at one stationary target starting at the same time. Sure..... But if you add strafing its a bit different. Unless your a mass driver because splash damage doesn't care much about strafing.

So sure, shot for shot, RoF for RoF, the mass driver might "technically" take the longest, but it has by far the most consistent "kill time" out of all the other weapons and that is because it requires minimal aim to make it do damage. Honestly.... in my opinion. Mass drivers should be all about area suppression. Faster rate of fire, bigger splash radius, But MUCH lower damage. As it stands right now, it only takes about five mass driver rounds to kill my proto logistics suit, and sure that might be "a lot" to some people, but when you think about it..... shooting five rounds into the ground really isn't that difficult.

CCP:

Do what you will with the mass driver.

I've used it since the closed beta, well before it was the "flavor of the month," and I plan to continue using it. Just know this GÇö the moment you nerf it (again), you'll see folks hopping to the next FotM weapon, and the long-time users of those weapons will end up getting nerfed, too, because of the FotM crowd.

So, to the folks yipping for a nerf, beware what you wish for. You might wind up regretting when the FotM crowd comes your way.

So sick of these ******* mass drivers.

Most of my people have left the corp due to this. You fixed the failock, and miraculously everyone stopped using them. Now it seems that the lame weapon of choice is MD's.

If these aren't fixed on the next update I'm out.

Not that you give a ****, but just in case.

Please stop caving in to garbage players who place the blame for their failures on weapons and game mechanics when it's their reckless and incompetent style of play that gets them killed.

You overly aggressive AR guys with your paper thin suits absolutely deserve to die against mass drivers. Instead of learning your lesson by taking advantage of your range and playing in more competitive gear, you instead keep doing the same thing over and over and over again. Your stupidity is not my problem, it's yours!

Some dev logic.

Thinking+Testing BEFORE listening to whiners.

I like that +1

"Mass driver = Op" is equivenlent to " I can't
Play good...."

And not a single math was given this thread...

It's nice to have such an established, well known and reputable person as bane r3Ap to make insightful coments about the game. it sure would be a huge loss when he goes.

masshole? you sir......i dont know how you keep doing it but you are beating everyone on the forums this week.

Wolfman wins Forum514 for now lol

= I canot play good so ill use mass drivers to get easy kills. you should have finished the sentence.