DUST Search - Increase isk payout for pub matches

xLTShinySidesx wrote:

True Adamance wrote:

xLTShinySidesx wrote:

So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches.

5 battles at 20 mins =1 hr and 40 minutes of grinding to make a mil, which in turn buys 20 adv fittings, which will last the avg player 4 battles, yay!!

What I'm requesting will give you 1-2 more adv suits per battle, is it tht big a deal? I'm not asking for an 800k isk payout for one battle, just an increase of like 100k.

To those talking on the pub stomping proto players, this won't change that, these people have more money than they know what to do with as is.

You shouldn't even need to ask for this I'm sustainable sitting on 24 million ISK right now. I never lose ISk and I never gain it.... how can you be losing iSK?

I lose isk if I die more than 4-5 times, depending on if the game wants to pay me for my actions or not... I'm not a scrub, anyone who has played with me or against me can attest to that, I never run proto, I don't even have a proto suit..... The payouts are just strange, last night I went 19-3 with 2100 WP's and got 298k isk, the very next game I went 15-6 with 1500 WP's and got 302k isk, wtf?

If we actually got paid for our "work" it may not be so bad but the small payouts for a high amount of productivity is killing it, add in that afkers can take in nearly as much while doing nothing.

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xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 552	Posted - 2013.07.30 20:38:00 - [1] - Quote I hope I'm not the only one. If I die 5 times I lose money and that's running adv gear only... So basically if I die 3-4 times (which is very good for me) I make like 50-75k isk, this is not worth the fight... Sooner or later (sooner) I'm going to be broke (4mil left) and when that happens I'm gonna have a hard time playing this game. I understand the whole "run starters to make money" statement but this is a garbage excuse, wtf is the point of even skilling into stuff then? So I can run it 1/4 of the time? Please increase payouts to a reasonable level, do some math and figure in the death to cost ratio and adjust it accordingly... Not many people are in the 1-4 deaths per game arena (skirmish)... Most people are around 5-14 per game which means anyone running adv or above are losing money doing so. My math: 50k for a full fitted adv suit, 4 deaths is 200k isk, the average payout in a skirmish is 225-275k isk, I can get over 300k in a skirmish game where I have 1500 or more WP's but this still isn't enough compensation IMO. My request: (skirmish) add atleast 150k isk to the payout (325-375k avg), this would mean after 7 deaths using a 50k suit you're losing money but if you die between 1-5 times you're still making a decent amount of scratch for your efforts in a 20 min battle (or 5 min pubstomp)..... 5 deaths and you'd make 75-125k isk depending on how you did which means you could restock 1-2 suits for your efforts. Thoughts?
Oso Peresoso RisingSuns 417	Posted - 2013.07.30 20:51:00 - [2] - Quote die less or use cheaper stuff. Skill into skills that give you bonuses, not just ones that unlock expensive stuff, skills that give you nothing when you're not using that stuff. Yeah it sucks, if you die a lot and don't make isk, but uh, that's kind of the point.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 299	Posted - 2013.07.30 20:55:00 - [3] - Quote when i hit sp cap i run nothing but std gear unless its a good match like neck and neck
Aizen Intiki Ghost Wolf Industries Alpha Wolf Pack 296	Posted - 2013.07.30 21:06:00 - [4] - Quote No.
Malkai Inos Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 937	Posted - 2013.07.30 21:16:00 - [5] - Quote It's you who should change your fit based on your resources, not the game that should change the resources based your fit. By your logic we could argue that pubmatches need payouts around 800k-1m because protos could go negative otherwise. Hint: That's the point.
broonfondle majikthies P.O.N.A.G.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 66	Posted - 2013.07.30 21:25:00 - [6] - Quote My usual strategy is a throw away fast kit to start a match (purposely limited to 1 fit) Then when the battle gets going I switch to my Adv gear (limit of 5) If i get dumped in the middle of a match already under way I use a basic setup to get the lay of the land (max 5) All the fits share certain equipment that limits how many I can field in a match to limit the overall cost I have a few specific role suits as well but not really ready for deployment yet till I get the equipment needed to make them work better I almost always make a profit
Doshneil Antaro SVER True Blood 106	Posted - 2013.07.30 21:31:00 - [7] - Quote I understand the low payout system does combat protostomping to an extent, but afkers make almost as much isk as those fighting. The risk vs reward system needs an overhaul.
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 552	Posted - 2013.07.30 21:57:00 - [8] - Quote So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. 5 battles at 20 mins =1 hr and 40 minutes of grinding to make a mil, which in turn buys 20 adv fittings, which will last the avg player 4 battles, yay!! What I'm requesting will give you 1-2 more adv suits per battle, is it tht big a deal? I'm not asking for an 800k isk payout for one battle, just an increase of like 100k. To those talking on the pub stomping proto players, this won't change that, these people have more money than they know what to do with as is.
ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 157	Posted - 2013.07.30 22:48:00 - [9] - Quote key is working out exactly how many deaths you can afford on the assumption your going to earn 250k isk per fight. once you reach that mark you switch to the cheapest possible fit you can come up with which is less likely to be killed. i have full militia,basic,advanced and now just added proto setups. depending how the fight goes depends on which suit i use and how many deaths i can afford. did a pub the other day and got 800k isk,dont ask me how i have no idea. but i played that match with the assumption i was going to earn 250k. i didn't die allot so crept up my gear quality until i reached proto. when it goes sour i creep down my gear until i end up in militia gear. you can still have fun while not in adv/proto gear and while doing that make alot of isk. i do militia only every now and then, earn 10-20 mil then go back to playing normally.
Taeryn Frost Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 15	Posted - 2013.07.30 23:43:00 - [10] - Quote Doshneil Antaro wrote: I understand the low payout system does combat protostomping to an extent, but afkers make almost as much isk as those fighting. The risk vs reward system needs an overhaul. I've afk'd because I saw the team matchup and clearly know a stomp when I see one. Stupid thing is, I got paid more isk than if I had deployed and battled. And I didn't lose any suits or vehicles. I know they're working on lots of things over there in Shanghai, but for some of this stuff I hope they have their priorities straight. Even something as simple as lowering the deployment timer before getting kicked from a match would suffice. I'm a patient person and understand a bit about the development process, but someone should get their ass in gear for these simple fixes.

Meeko Fent Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 432	Posted - 2013.07.31 00:10:00 - [11] - Quote Moral of the Story is, Use STD gear. Oh, and CCP needs to change the Skill Bonuses, cause three quarters of 'em are WORTHLESS. ADV gear is viable, if don't die 6+ times. I Understand your argument of "Why skill into the stuff if we cant afford to use it?" I wished Merc Matches had a higher payout so then the Proto/ADVbears would go there, Make money, and use Protogear, While us STD users can stay in Pubs with 100k Payouts and play, make money, not get ridiculously stomped, and use the gear we want to use. As Post #7 said, WP/Activity should count WAY more in the Payouts then they do now. TL;DR, Use STD gear my friend, Merc Matches need a bump in payout significantly so its worth playing them besides to RP, and WP/ Activity need to count more then they do now in payouts.
Sgt Buttscratch G I A N T EoN. 571	Posted - 2013.07.31 00:15:00 - [12] - Quote dragonfly, toxin AR, toxin SMG, M1 nades = money
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 927	Posted - 2013.07.31 00:19:00 - [13] - Quote xLTShinySidesx wrote: So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. 5 battles at 20 mins =1 hr and 40 minutes of grinding to make a mil, which in turn buys 20 adv fittings, which will last the avg player 4 battles, yay!! What I'm requesting will give you 1-2 more adv suits per battle, is it tht big a deal? I'm not asking for an 800k isk payout for one battle, just an increase of like 100k. To those talking on the pub stomping proto players, this won't change that, these people have more money than they know what to do with as is. You shouldn't even need to ask for this I'm sustainable sitting on 24 million ISK right now. I never lose ISk and I never gain it.... how can you be losing iSK?
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 553	Posted - 2013.07.31 16:07:00 - [14] - Quote True Adamance wrote: xLTShinySidesx wrote: So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. 5 battles at 20 mins =1 hr and 40 minutes of grinding to make a mil, which in turn buys 20 adv fittings, which will last the avg player 4 battles, yay!! What I'm requesting will give you 1-2 more adv suits per battle, is it tht big a deal? I'm not asking for an 800k isk payout for one battle, just an increase of like 100k. To those talking on the pub stomping proto players, this won't change that, these people have more money than they know what to do with as is. You shouldn't even need to ask for this I'm sustainable sitting on 24 million ISK right now. I never lose ISk and I never gain it.... how can you be losing iSK? I lose isk if I die more than 4-5 times, depending on if the game wants to pay me for my actions or not... I'm not a scrub, anyone who has played with me or against me can attest to that, I never run proto, I don't even have a proto suit..... The payouts are just strange, last night I went 19-3 with 2100 WP's and got 298k isk, the very next game I went 15-6 with 1500 WP's and got 302k isk, wtf? If we actually got paid for our "work" it may not be so bad but the small payouts for a high amount of productivity is killing it, add in that afkers can take in nearly as much while doing nothing.
noob 45 Syndicate of Gods 60	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:02:00 - [15] - Quote First off, I agree that ISK payout is way too low, but.... Just an FYI isk payout is low and gear cost are high to "encourage" you to buy aurum to afford using your proto suits. I still have 260mil isk from the launch of uprising and that is after giving away 100-200mil to people. I can rock my adv suits with proto mods until this game turns off its servers in a few months. There are a lot of other players who have a stacked bank account that dwarfs my own. The reality of the low ISK payout is that it is not new player friendly. Tankers have it the worst here though. Lose 1 tank and you lost 2-6 games of income. Since I drive a gunnlogi, I expect to lose my tank every time I call it in since I don't like to redline rail-snipe. Low-ISK payout and the SP cap are also to blame for the low player counts. I refuse to do skirmish and cringe away from Domination games simply because they are super long game modes that have the same payout as ambush games. Why would I play either game mode when I reach max SP for the match 1/3 of the way through it and have the potential to lose a ton of ISK? It is slowly getting to the point of "why bother log-in and play after cap at all?" You can play your good suits and lose money for a very limited payout or you can rock a cheap suit and be the player on the team that dies a lot because you are throwing your free suits at a squad of proto-suits.
Aikuchi Tomaru Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 148	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:12:00 - [16] - Quote They should increase it because you're not good enough yet? If you die this often and lose money, then maybe you should use cheaper gear until you can actually affort the better gear (meaning less dying).
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:16:00 - [17] - Quote Aikuchi Tomaru wrote: They should increase it because you're not good enough yet? If you die this often and lose money, then maybe you should use cheaper gear until you can actually affort the better gear (meaning less dying). It has nothing to do with how good I am, anybody who plays skirmish knows that you average 3-7 deaths, all I'm saying is the payout is too low for the length of the game and the amount you contribute to the team. Why does everybody automatically assume I'm a **** player because I think the isk payouts are too low? Does it make people feel better to act like they're better than you?
Oso Peresoso RisingSuns 454	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:28:00 - [18] - Quote xLTShinySidesx wrote: So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. No one said that. For lots of people ADV or proto gear is affordable because the die little or not at all in most matches.
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:35:00 - [19] - Quote Oso Peresoso wrote: xLTShinySidesx wrote: So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. No one said that. For lots of people ADV or proto gear is affordable because the die little or not at all in most matches. I rarely see a person with 0-1 death in a skirmish game and when I do it's generally a tank or a sniper... Most of the people it is affordable for because they have a crap ton of isk from uprising, more than they'll ever need. After reading some of the replies I will recant my request because there was some good points made.... Payout based on effort given, meaning 0Wp=0 isk payout and work it at a percentage beyond that like say 1WP=Xisk payout....also, skirmish/domination battles since they're so long should have an increased percentage of isk-WP payout due to the time spent in battle.
Electric Gray Taken Care of Buisness 7	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:36:00 - [20] - Quote I run with a suit that cost 4,145 ISK. I have been playing for one month. I have made over 65 mil for the corp and i have 103,000 Isk suit that ive built up to 80. Want to make cash make a cheap suit. save your big suits for Merc battles and P.C. battles. Not only will you make money, but you wont be pub stomping ether.

PR DIABOLITO NY Devils Airborne Reapers Elite 0	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:37:00 - [21] - Quote I am a fairly new (playing 1 month) player. My KDR is waaayyy below 1.0!! Yet, in that time I have been able to make way over $60 mil. Not sure what you are running or how, but running smart fits and buying smart equals more money saved. And yes, I am currently running ADV Logi fits that are anywhere from 30K-60K per suit. Play smart, buy smart, and skill smart. Enough said. Diabolito
Sleepy Shadow L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION 45	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:40:00 - [22] - Quote xLTShinySidesx wrote: True Adamance wrote: xLTShinySidesx wrote: So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. 5 battles at 20 mins =1 hr and 40 minutes of grinding to make a mil, which in turn buys 20 adv fittings, which will last the avg player 4 battles, yay!! What I'm requesting will give you 1-2 more adv suits per battle, is it tht big a deal? I'm not asking for an 800k isk payout for one battle, just an increase of like 100k. To those talking on the pub stomping proto players, this won't change that, these people have more money than they know what to do with as is. You shouldn't even need to ask for this I'm sustainable sitting on 24 million ISK right now. I never lose ISk and I never gain it.... how can you be losing iSK? I lose isk if I die more than 4-5 times, depending on if the game wants to pay me for my actions or not... I'm not a scrub, anyone who has played with me or against me can attest to that, I never run proto, I don't even have a proto suit..... The payouts are just strange, last night I went 19-3 with 2100 WP's and got 298k isk, the very next game I went 15-6 with 1500 WP's and got 302k isk, wtf? If we actually got paid for our "work" it may not be so bad but the small payouts for a high amount of productivity is killing it, add in that afkers can take in nearly as much while doing nothing. Isn't the ISK payout tied to gear destroyed in battle? So if the enemy was fielding protosuits and your team destroyed a lot of them, then the ISK pool in the end is bigger. I think that's where the inconsistencies come from. You can go 30/0, but if the enemy only fielded MLT/STD gear, your reward is smaller.
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:41:00 - [23] - Quote Electric Gray wrote: I run with a suit that cost 4,145 ISK. I have been playing for one month. I have made over 65 mil for the corp and i have 103,000 Isk suit that ive built up to 80. Want to make cash make a cheap suit. save your big suits for Merc battles and P.C. battles. Not only will you make money, but you wont be pub stomping ether. This IMO is bad for business..... Hey guys, check out dust 514, the game where you have to play to get SP so you can get cooler gear and then not use it! What's the reward for having good gear you ask? Being able to play in crappy gear so you can afford to play the good gear!! Sounds fun
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 17:45:00 - [24] - Quote PR DIABOLITO NY wrote: I am a fairly new (playing 1 month) player. My KDR is waaayyy below 1.0!! Yet, in that time I have been able to make way over $60 mil. Not sure what you are running or how, but running smart fits and buying smart equals more money saved. And yes, I am currently running ADV Logi fits that are anywhere from 30K-60K per suit. Play smart, buy smart, and skill smart. Enough said. Diabolito To make this amount of money in a month of play you'd have to run nothing but starter fits for 8 battles a day and no other fits, that's assuming you made 250k isk per battle, I don't have that kind of time, I'm lucky to get 3 battles in a day and when I do, I prefer to play in something I worked hard to get but that's just me.
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 18:00:00 - [25] - Quote Let me explain how the isk payout makes the casual gamer feel... I have to grind 5-10 battles per day in starter fits to afford the gear I grinded for to get in the first place, don't get me wrong, it wasn't so much grinding as it was fun to get the sp and unlock the gear, however, now that I have the gear, the grind isn't fun anymore... The people in here telling me you made 60-65 mil in a month are not the casual gamers, they play 240+ battles in a month, something I don't have time for.. The casual gamer enjoys playing from the bottom up and getting the sp to unlock stuff but unlocking stuff should make you able to sustainably play it but it's not like that, te cost to income ratio is off IMO and it needs to be changed. I'm gonna pistol whip the next mthrfckr that tells me to run starter fits or cheap suits, I'm not new, I know how the game works.
Malkai Inos Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 947	Posted - 2013.07.31 18:24:00 - [26] - Quote xLTShinySidesx wrote: Let me explain how the isk payout makes the casual gamer feel... I have to grind 5-10 battles per day in starter fits to afford the gear I grinded for to get in the first place, don't get me wrong, it wasn't so much grinding as it was fun to get the sp and unlock the gear, however, now that I have the gear, the grind isn't fun anymore... The people in here telling me you made 60-65 mil in a month are not the casual gamers, they play 240+ battles in a month, something I don't have time for.. The casual gamer enjoys playing from the bottom up and getting the sp to unlock stuff but unlocking stuff should make you able to sustainably play it but it's not like that, te cost to income ratio is off IMO and it needs to be changed. I'm gonna pistol whip the next mthrfckr that tells me to run starter fits or cheap suits, I'm not new, I know how the game works. Higher tier gear is not your typical endgame content that you unlock and use from there on just because you can. It's this horribly expensive extra in power that you pay because you have to. As others have said multiple times by now, running ADV is perfectly sustainable if you play half decently so the problem might not lie where you think it does. And no, with all due respect, your thread shows that you do not know how the game works. At least in that respect.
PR DIABOLITO NY Devils Airborne Reapers Elite 0	Posted - 2013.07.31 18:28:00 - [27] - Quote I think its funny that I am not considered a casual gamer. I work two jobs and am a single father. It just so happens that I run with good squads and teamwork is promoted. Also, we dont spend much time BS'ing between matches. BTW, being squad lead helps with the payouts!!! Diabolito
Prangstar RND Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 153	Posted - 2013.07.31 19:03:00 - [28] - Quote nope, you can earn up to 2 million in a pub match. http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/ii627/aqua-regia/2013-07-13-013830.jpg http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/ii627/aqua-regia/2013-07-13-013839.jpg http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/ii627/aqua-regia/2013-07-13-013917.jpg
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 19:07:00 - [29] - Quote Ok so im alone in thinking the payout needs a boost. I've been playing the game since January so I feel I have a good grasp and I'm not broke by any means, I just thought the payouts were too low for what you go through in a battle, call me crazy.
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 19:09:00 - [30] - Quote Prangstar RND wrote: nope, you can earn up to 2 million in a pub match. http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/ii627/aqua-regia/2013-07-13-013830.jpg http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/ii627/aqua-regia/2013-07-13-013839.jpg http://i1263.photobucket.com/albums/ii627/aqua-regia/2013-07-13-013917.jpg I went 35-4 with 3100 WP's and got 327k isk, how the fck did you get a 2mil payout?

Dominus Fatali Nox Aeterna Security 88	Posted - 2013.07.31 19:49:00 - [31] - Quote BPOs. Bought mine back when they weren't ridiculously priced. Very rarely is there a match where I lose ISK. Plus, using inferior gear (and doing well, mind you) lets you do even better when using better gear.
Bhavesh Prajapat Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 25	Posted - 2013.07.31 20:19:00 - [32] - Quote I loved the beta isk payout. It was Lovely. You could get about 700k isk if you tried and it was fine. Would love to have the old days back.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic Top Men. 187	Posted - 2013.07.31 21:07:00 - [33] - Quote xLTShinySidesx wrote: Oso Peresoso wrote: xLTShinySidesx wrote: So what's the point of adv and proto gear then? It's not for pubs according to you guys so what's it for? And before you say PC, 90% of people in this game don't even play in PC matches. No one said that. For lots of people ADV or proto gear is affordable because the die little or not at all in most matches. I rarely see a person with 0-1 death in a skirmish game and when I do it's generally a tank or a sniper... Most of the people it is affordable for because they have a crap ton of isk from uprising, more than they'll ever need. After reading some of the replies I will recant my request because there was some good points made.... Payout based on effort given, meaning 0Wp=0 isk payout and work it at a percentage beyond that like say 1WP=Xisk payout....also, skirmish/domination battles since they're so long should have an increased percentage of isk-WP payout due to the time spent in battle. Really? You think they've only earned their money from the uprising payoff? You think they are still only relying on that? Try going ISK positive by using a cheap suit or get a good squad and die less. If you're making 50-75k a match how in the world are you losing money? And just because you skilled into something doesn't mean you MUST use it every match, if that's what you think it's best just stick with passive skills.
xLTShinySidesx Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.07.31 21:13:00 - [34] - Quote I'm done reading/replying to this topic... For fcks sake all I was saying was increase the payout a bit in the skirmish matches, I didn't once ask "how do I make money" but apparently reading comprehension isn't a big thing in this community. I understand how to make money, what I don't understand is the isk payout to gear acquisition ratio, it's not good enough IMO, agree with me or not, just stop with the run cheap/starter suit BS, I'm not a noob.
Sgt Buttscratch G I A N T EoN. 576	Posted - 2013.07.31 21:14:00 - [35] - Quote xLTShinySidesx wrote: Electric Gray wrote: I run with a suit that cost 4,145 ISK. I have been playing for one month. I have made over 65 mil for the corp and i have 103,000 Isk suit that ive built up to 80. Want to make cash make a cheap suit. save your big suits for Merc battles and P.C. battles. Not only will you make money, but you wont be pub stomping ether. This IMO is bad for business..... Hey guys, check out dust 514, the game where you have to play to get SP so you can get cooler gear and then not use it! What's the reward for having good gear you ask? Being able to play in crappy gear so you can afford to play the good gear!! Sounds fun I kinda agree with this theory. Until PC is in full flight, and lots of corps can be involved, then why should players be building for great gear, just to wardrobe it and run around in militia, against people who already have millions, and don't mind loosing money. but it would also spoil the game if, nothing was valuble, almost a catch 22. Due to the fact for Dust 514 to work, we need to keep player base incomming and growing, with out losing the the hard edge, that is new eden. Where your actions can cost you.


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