I don't think people have grasped the concept of a RPG.

Played for a while = High SP ISK and Skill in general = Higher end gear

You shouldn't expect hitting a lot as a new player. In RPG terms, you can't just fly into the final battle expecting to beat that boss as a first starter. RPGs dont play that way

Inb4 Rocket Propelled Grenade

From what I've gathered, parts of this game aren't supposed to be fair. Hence the HTFU and whatnot.

Posting in an imp alt thread

PC is designed in such a way that it favours the defender. CCP has tried to balance it out so that the attacker has to attack multiple times but there is a serious flaw in this;- smaller corps will not be able to put up the dough for this.

On an average a player may put in 1-2 hours of gameplay everyday. If he/she is really good and doesn't die a single time they will net a max of 2 million in 2 hours. Consider a small 50 man corp having all active members that do this. They will net enough money to fight a battle on day 1. They can do so day 2 and win the district. However a large corporation;- say STB can put 10 times that money up in the same time. This leaves the smaller corp at a serious disadvantage. So essentially STB has enough ISK to attack the smaller guy 11 times in the same time the smaller guy can attack someone else.

Financially speaking this will be a nightmare for the smaller.

If we want this game to succeed you need to think about making it competitive. Having small corps compete with big corps/alliances on an uneven playing field will not make the game fun. The cost of the clones should be proportional to the corp size. Setting a base price for the clones and multiplying that with the member count or having some sort of algorithm to do that would help the smaller corps a lot.

Option 2 would be to make the returns from FW higher. If the ISK returns got from FW were higher it would be an incentive for smaller corps to do more FW and earn ISK faster.

If CCP truly wants balance they should figure out a way such that districts that are not under attack for a period of say 3 days should give more bonuses for attacks.

There are many pros and cons over here but the way PC is headed it looks like its going to the same issue CCP has with the Goons in space.

That's the thing... in life eve any time where something is at stake the larger horde will win...

It is not a bad thing really. I wish people would realize that they need to group up. More people means more funds means more attacks. Dust isn't aboug the little guy ***** smacking the big guy. Its about finding 100 people the big guy has alienated and recruiting them into your corp/alliance and bdcoming the big guy. You need others you aren't master chief you are the faceless marines who gets given the plasma pistol with 2 shots left while mc runs off with your bfg...

If we want this game to succeed you need to think about making it competitive. Having small corps compete with big corps/alliances on an uneven playing field will not make the game fun. The cost of the clones should be proportional to the corp size. Setting a base price for the clones and multiplying that with the member count or having some sort of algorithm to do that would help the smaller corps a lot.

Option 2 would be to make the returns from FW higher. If the ISK returns got from FW were higher it would be an incentive for smaller corps to do more FW and earn ISK faster.

Stop acting like you care about the smaller corps. IF you really gave a damn about complete player balance and small corps a complete WIPE would be best NEVER should BETA testers get advantage over brand new players. That just makes absolutely no sense when a game is released officially 5-14 makes no sense. Smaller corps can still play pubs and get isk if they keep dieing and losing ISK in matches nobody ever said this was a new player friendly game.

I don''t get why people think that because their corp aint huge or successful they feel they should be spoon fed.

PC is designed in such a way that it favours the defender. CCP has tried to balance it out so that the attacker has to attack multiple times but there is a serious flaw in this;- smaller corps will not be able to put up the dough for this.

On an average a player may put in 1-2 hours of gameplay everyday. If he/she is really good and doesn't die a single time they will net a max of 2 million in 2 hours. Consider a small 50 man corp having all active members that do this. They will net enough money to fight a battle on day 1. They can do so day 2 and win the district. However a large corporation;- say STB can put 10 times that money up in the same time. This leaves the smaller corp at a serious disadvantage. So essentially STB has enough ISK to attack the smaller guy 11 times in the same time the smaller guy can attack someone else.

Financially speaking this will be a nightmare for the smaller.

If we want this game to succeed you need to think about making it competitive. Having small corps compete with big corps/alliances on an uneven playing field will not make the game fun. The cost of the clones should be proportional to the corp size. Setting a base price for the clones and multiplying that with the member count or having some sort of algorithm to do that would help the smaller corps a lot.

Option 2 would be to make the returns from FW higher. If the ISK returns got from FW were higher it would be an incentive for smaller corps to do more FW and earn ISK faster.

If CCP truly wants balance they should figure out a way such that districts that are not under attack for a period of say 3 days should give more bonuses for attacks.

There are many pros and cons over here but the way PC is headed it looks like its going to the same issue CCP has with the Goons in space.

FPS gamers are not capsulers. They wont stay if either they are constantly pub stomped or their is no content to the game.

Right now PC is the only content this game has to offer. FW would have but the rewards are sub par at best. If PC cant keep people of this game;- nothing can.

I guess you have a readin disability so I will spell it out to you;- I have mentioned in my OP that there should be an alternate way to grind ISK and I recommend FW for that.

As far as a reset is concerned I dont care about it. But its not a part of the discussion now. We can discuss that in another topic. Would you mind creating one for it and I really don't care about resets?

I guess ZeroTheBigLoss should have been your name.

Anywho;- I am talking about smaller corps being able to grind ISK faster or have the clone pack cost proportional to the strength of the corp. There may be other ideas too.

The while post is too bring out discrepancies in PC.

What you have to realize is that many of the big corps got big by recruiting noobs. So while they may have a lot of money, they don't have a lot of skill. Take PRO for example.

Ya Dust is not gonna spoon feed you. Adapt or die.

its the same in eve with smaller corps not being able to fund owning space and the pos equipment and sov units and upgrades and all that like the big corps and alliances. there is just certain parts of both eve and dust that are not a viable option for smaller corps and that is just the way it is. as far as it goes its just a fact of life the the little guys dont get the chances and opportunities that the big guys get, yeah its not fair but that again is just the way it is

OK ZeroTheBigLoss! Point noted. But my mentality is not Adapt or Die;- Its Adapt and Kill.

Remember this when I teabag that big 0 which is your face!

I guess ZeroTheBigLoss should have been your name.

Once other regions open up for PC business, small corps will be able to establish their little cribs far from Molden Heath, where I assume the big corps and alliances will be battling it out. As large as a corporation is, it can't hold everything. Currently, there's only enough room for the big fish. If even one or two more regions become enabled for PC, bigger alliances will refrain from expanding too rapidly just to end up expending resources on districts they can't protect (not to mention creating ridiculously high clone transfer costs as the number of jumps increase), and will stick to what they have a slowly consolidate, leaving the fringes open for the small peeps to fight each other.

If battles weren't favoured towards the defender, we'd simply see districts being flipped left and right, with no one actually getting any benefits from the EVE-side PI bonuses and clone sales.

Alliances

/thread

Now that it's noted you won't get spoon fed this thread can be closed. GM let's get a lock on this.

Once a district is being attacked, it doesn't matter how many other districts a corp owns, how much ISK they have, or how many players they have. A district being attacked is "locked" and can't be reinforced. A small corp with enough cash to attack 3 or 4 times can and will take the district if they win their battles. After that, you own the district and the aforementioned advantage is yours.

If you think larger corps/alliances give an advantage, then either join one, or make one.

Inter-alliance clone transfers would be nice but since districts being attacked are locked, it won't help (unless that is rectified). This would encourage small corp alliances to become common practice.

So this is now a disadvantage for the defender. A bigger corp can keep attacking the same district over and over again till the clones deplete. How is this balanced again?

True dat. Its just that I want this game to succeed. However pushing the Eve mentality is a bit premature.

For example;- in Eve even though corps may dislike each other they say GF in the end. You don't see much smack talking. However is Dust its the other way round. More smack talking and less action.

If Dust becomes like Eve where the Zerg mentality wins and its more about throwing thousands of clones with no skill against a smaller corp with better skill, you will see people leaving.

Day 1: Throw 100 clones;- deplete 10. District cannot produce more clones
Day 2: Repeat day1
Day 3: Repeat day 2
....

By day 10 the defender is out of clones.

Unless I got it all wrong there is a serious flaw here.

Banned OP should fall on deaf ears. CCP don't listen to nerd.


Your few seconds of fame is officially over.

Define "balanced." As far as I'm concerned, it's balanced because everyone is given the same opportunity to create/join an alliance.

For example;- in Eve even though corps may dislike each other they say GF in the end. You don't see much smack talking. However is Dust its the other way round. More smack talking and less action.

I heard you were being paid 5 million ISK per ringer. And still you guys lost to Dust University and other corps.

I guess with ZeroTheBigLoss spearheading the ringing effort you couldn't expect anything more. Try as may you will never be better than Tryhard. Keep walking in his shadow. You will make a pretty bride.

Unfortunately no. The only way you can create an alliance is in Eve. Dust does not let you create alliances. An all dust corp cannot join an alliance unless they have an Eve CEO. So its flawed here.

Granted Dust and Eve need to mesh together but a lot of corps don't have Eve tie ups;- not because they cant but because they have no way of doing so.

So unfortunately Sir;- you are mistaken here.

You don't need the alliance tag to be a part of an alliance.

Lol! You really should get a better source I have never even fought Dust University I give you props for making up something as funny as this.

So how can you transfer clones between alliance members. Are you suggesting that one corp be able to sell their clones to another corp for ISK?

This can't be done in a formal alliance any more than in an informal one.

Lets talk about the lag

Inter-alliance monetary transfers are possible though, right?

no

Alliances

/thread

If we want this game to succeed you need to think about making it competitive. Having small corps compete with big corps/alliances on an uneven playing field will not make the game fun. The cost of the clones should be proportional to the corp size. Setting a base price for the clones and multiplying that with the member count or having some sort of algorithm to do that would help the smaller corps a lot.

Ya Dust is not gonna spoon feed you. Adapt or die.

Im not talking about RPG mechanics. I am talking about balance. I have over 14 million SP. It has nothing to do with what I am talking about.

I am talking about smaller corps vs larger corps.

PS: How long do you think it will before Uncliamed or Cronos or RofL or EoN takes your districts?

I don''t get why people think that because their corp aint huge or successful they feel they should be spoon fed.

"The cost of the clones should be proportional to the corp size."

This is the funniest line I've heard in this whole thread.

Why not? CCP already made it so that the size of your corp in EVE effects the cost of the wardec.

When EVE players are allowed to transfer ISK then small corps will not have a problem supplying mercs for PC.

All you push for doing that is making sure that corp members pull their weight rather than just be inactive.

FPS gamers are not capsulers. They wont stay if either they are constantly pub stomped or their is no content to the game.

Right now PC is the only content this game has to offer. FW would have but the rewards are sub par at best. If PC cant keep people of this game;- nothing can.

My biggest problem with PC is, assuming my understanding of the mechanics are correct, a sufficiently funded organization can lose every battle while attacking a district yet still conquer it by preventing it from ever reinforcing. Sure it could take many days, weeks even depending on individual battle results, but still that's kind of crap. So am I missing something or misunderstanding something or is this really the case?

Money trumps skill, in real life as in DUST.

PC is designed in such a way that it favours the defender. CCP has tried to balance it out so that the attacker has to attack multiple times but there is a serious flaw in this;- smaller corps will not be able to put up the dough for this.

On an average a player may put in 1-2 hours of gameplay everyday. If he/she is really good and doesn't die a single time they will net a max of 2 million in 2 hours. Consider a small 50 man corp having all active members that do this. They will net enough money to fight a battle on day 1. They can do so day 2 and win the district. However a large corporation;- say STB can put 10 times that money up in the same time. This leaves the smaller corp at a serious disadvantage. So essentially STB has enough ISK to attack the smaller guy 11 times in the same time the smaller guy can attack someone else.

Financially speaking this will be a nightmare for the smaller.

If we want this game to succeed you need to think about making it competitive. Having small corps compete with big corps/alliances on an uneven playing field will not make the game fun. The cost of the clones should be proportional to the corp size. Setting a base price for the clones and multiplying that with the member count or having some sort of algorithm to do that would help the smaller corps a lot.

Option 2 would be to make the returns from FW higher. If the ISK returns got from FW were higher it would be an incentive for smaller corps to do more FW and earn ISK faster.

If CCP truly wants balance they should figure out a way such that districts that are not under attack for a period of say 3 days should give more bonuses for attacks.

There are many pros and cons over here but the way PC is headed it looks like its going to the same issue CCP has with the Goons in space.

I can confirm PC is no where near done. There will be more district SIs in the future, other things other than clone gerating and making money. Numbers to be tweaked timers to be set, more districts to be added.

You don't out a fire by adding more fuel to it. How does adding more districts help us if we don't generate enough ISk to hold them.

WE NEED ANOTHER MECHANISM TO GENERATE ISK!

In eve I donthave to be in 0.0 all the time. I can mine, I can do rat runs, I can do missions, I can plex etc etc etc.

Give us more options to make ISK in Dust. Is that too hard to understand?

Beam down to earth IWS. Dock that ship of yours in a hanger. Its been in space too long.

You are obviously not in the group camping me in space right now.

Also 8 million a day per district is plenty enough.

Passive Income is bad because it encourages land grabbing and sitting.

So if passive income is bad why be able to sell clones to Gen? That is passive income. Make it such that the extra clones have to used to fight someone else. Don't associate an ISk value to it!

PS: I am not trying to get at you bro. Atleast you are saying something. The other CPMs are just sitting back and watching the fun. There is a problem out here and it needs fixing.

Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this.........

Planetside 2

Coming to PS4 this year

That's the thing... in life eve any time where something is at stake the larger horde will win...

It is not a bad thing really. I wish people would realize that they need to group up. More people means more funds means more attacks. Dust isn't aboug the little guy ***** smacking the big guy. Its about finding 100 people the big guy has alienated and recruiting them into your corp/alliance and bdcoming the big guy. You need others you aren't master chief you are the faceless marines who gets given the plasma pistol with 2 shots left while mc runs off with your bfg...

*Cough* Test Alliance *Cough* Goonswarm Federation *Cough*

If you get stomped in pubmatches, you are in for a world of hurt if you go to PC. So I am not sure what you are suggesting should happen. If you suck expected to get stomped.

It's TEST and allies , particularly N3 and PL against the CFC...

all examples of lots of people vs few people