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Why do people treat HMG's like they are supposed to be CQC?

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Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 207	Posted - 2013.04.29 09:50:00 - [1] - Quote I'm pretty sure they are supposed rip across the battlefield and terrify enemies from range, but be MORE difficult to adjust and turn in CQC making them weaker there. How did this "lol its cqc" garbage idea start up? And why were the devs convinced to start twisting its stats towards that role? An HMG is not a shotgun, and a ****** heavy does not have the mobility to force that kind of close range engagement on an intelligent opponent. Baddies.
Prius Vecht Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 74	Posted - 2013.04.29 09:55:00 - [2] - Quote I agree its not just a cqc weapon but the HMG breaks the game if it has the range of a laser. game balance is more importance than realism with HMG.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 691	Posted - 2013.04.29 09:59:00 - [3] - Quote With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range.
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION 562	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:02:00 - [4] - Quote Because the reticle is a circle, with the bullets spraying all within that circle, even when zooming. Hence, the more of the enemy's body in that circle, the more damage. Closer enemy: more body in circle.
DustMercsBlog Galactic News Network 48	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:04:00 - [5] - Quote ^what they said. higher DPS weapons often take a range or ROF penalty. look at the shotgun, SR and forge gun.
Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens 187	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:16:00 - [6] - Quote They say it's about game balance but a few of us know that's BS. Look at all the AR elitists that cry whenever they die to something that isn't another AR or thrown grenade. A few have even shed tears when they couldn't take out a tank with their AR. Weapons are the way they are because most FPS gamers don't like weapon functionality to make sense. If the weapons had range and functionality that made sense, the heavy with the HMG would be devastating to anyone careless, or unfortunate enough, to be caught out in the weapon's effective range of about 1000 meters. Never mind that heavies are the slowest, easiest to hit moving targets in the game short of HAVs. If Weapon functionality made sense, the shortest range projectile weapon would be the scrambler pistol at around 50 meters. The Forge Gun would top the range at around 10km. It would force the intelligent use of cover and tactics and players would have to think more about what they're going to do. Unfortunately, most people from the realms of the generic FPS call this "Scrub" game play.
The Robot Devil BetaMax. CRONOS. 138	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:18:00 - [7] - Quote It is a cqc weapon, it rides the line of area denial and cqc. HMG on the inside of the door means no one is coming in.
Rei Shepard Spectre II 165	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:30:00 - [8] - Quote Whenever your game account gets closed when you die, unable to re-subscribe as if your character realy dies, but so long people can dance inside rains of bullets & survive / dash at you without the fear of death guns needs to have a sense of balance to it. But whenever what i wrote above comes into play and you are quaking in your boots from fear, unable to move, then yeah apply real gun physics. In games ussually long range = less damage, close range = more damage, giving the more damage long range does not make sense in a game universe.
fred orpaul The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION 242	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:06:00 - [9] - Quote okay there is a lot of misconceptions here so lets fix that. The HMG is a damge by volume weapon like a shot gun or SMG, but the HMG does a lot less per shot then either of those, also even inside of smg ranges and while the HMG is at its best accuracy it misses a lot of its rounds. All this means that 1) yes it is a short-shortmid range weapon, and yes it always has been one(actualy its gained more range in this build then any other). Ever had an HMG stuck in your chest? it might as well be a shot gun. 2)While HMGs do have the best DPS, fully applying that DPS requires being in SG one hit range, and these guns can only be carried by the slowest suits in the game, if you allow a heavy to apply better then AR dps to you, he is either a god like heavy or you fail horribly. Now lets look at ARs they have almost the same DPS as a HMG, reload in a few seconds, can be carried by any suit, can apply their full DPS at any range short of LR and SR, have 3-4kills(1-2heavies) a clip even on the STD ARs. As some one that hates HMG heavies trust me they are UP as **, their only advantage is that they live long enough and spray easily enough that they have a small chance of back up saving their asses. One on one I can take most heavies with a std scout, where they shine is when they have company, but then so do SGs. As a side note the number of proto heavies Ive see get droped head on by proto gear is ****** nothing should beat a heavy head on in its optimal
CrotchGrab 360 Better Hide R Die 23	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:16:00 - [10] - Quote I like to melee heavies. Killed one guy twice in a row through melee and he quit trololololloo

KalOfTheRathi Talon Strike Force LTD Orion Empire 374	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:26:00 - [11] - Quote Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: -- snip of elitist gamer blather -- Okay Kitten, why don't you just go play Arma II? Everything will be realistic and super duper cool.
Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens 187	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:43:00 - [12] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: -- snip of elitist gamer blather -- Okay Kitten, why don't you just go play Arma II? Everything will be realistic and super duper cool. First of, I'm not an elitist gamer. Second I'm sorry you chose to get butt-hurt over what I believe is a truism in most FPS gaming. There's an ointment for that. I'm all for suspension of disbelief in many games but, the weapon functionality in most FPS games is on a steep level of mental deficiency. I know it's done for "Balance" so players can be on a more equal footing when playing a mindless arena shooter like many of the generics out there. From what I keep reading as the supposed vision for Dust, a deep tactical FPS that will have repercussions across all of new Eden, one should think that a more common sense approach to weapon functionality would be the order of the day. But then common sense has become rare these days. You little tirade proves that.
Tailss Prower 501st JFW Striker Unit 26	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:51:00 - [13] - Quote Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: -- snip of elitist gamer blather -- Okay Kitten, why don't you just go play Arma II? Everything will be realistic and super duper cool. First of, I'm not an elitist gamer. Second I'm sorry you chose to get butt-hurt over what I believe is a truism in most FPS gaming. There's an ointment for that. I'm all for suspension of disbelief in many games but, the weapon functionality in most FPS games is on a steep level of mental deficiency. I know it's done for "Balance" so players can be on a more equal footing when playing a mindless arena shooter like many of the generics out there. From what I keep reading as the supposed vision for Dust, a deep tactical FPS that will have repercussions across all of new Eden, one should think that a more common sense approach to weapon functionality would be the order of the day. But then common sense has become rare these days. You little tirade proves that. I don't care about the range of the HMG however I think the bullet spread should be looked at I've had it happen many times where a HMG it hitting me from 100M at least and it eating away at my hp in a matter of seconds the range is fine to me but it should be hitting alot less the father away the target is and I don't think it spreads out enough
trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 321	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:54:00 - [14] - Quote All weapons could theoretically have ranges of current snipers, with accuracy as the limitation as well as damage optimals. It might be easier to balance too, as max range would be out of equation.
Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 210	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:06:00 - [15] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. It takes time to spin up, which can be heard by anyone with half a brain and signals them to get to cover. Until it spins up, it has no range whatsoever. Thats why a good AR user will always beat it from range. So your argument has no ground. A laser on the other hand has more DPS and not an easily identifiable sound from range unless the user is stupid and is heating it right next to the targets head.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 554	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:11:00 - [16] - Quote fred orpaul wrote: (actualy its gained more range in this build then any other). I agree with much of your post, but you must not have been here in the really early builds. HMGs got nerfed hard after those builds. The HMG had more range than even lasers do now. Half the players just started specing into HMG or Swarm Launcher. (since back then you could dumb-fire them and they could easily kill infantry with splash dmg)
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 554	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:15:00 - [17] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. It takes time to spin up, which can be heard by anyone with half a brain and signals them to get to cover. Until it spins up, it has no range whatsoever. Thats why a good AR user will always beat it from range. So your argument has no ground. A laser on the other hand has more DPS and not an easily identifiable sound from range unless the user is stupid and is heating it right next to the targets head. trollsroyce wrote: All weapons could theoretically have ranges of current snipers, with accuracy as the limitation as well as damage optimals. It might be easier to balance too, as max range would be out of equation. Why the hell isn't this done? Oh wait, it is... in every other FPS except this one, for some ******** reason. By no means am i one of the HMGhaters, but dont act like the HMG takes an eternity to spool up...players dont have a chance to "get to cover"
GeneralButtNaked ZionTCD Unclaimed. 382	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:18:00 - [18] - Quote mikegunnz wrote: By no means am i one of the HMGhaters, but dont act like the HMG takes an eternity to spool up...players dont have a chance to "get to cover" There is a spool up before you are on target though. At more than 20m, that matters. Especially when the opponent has an AR which can produce a stream of accurate, potent fire.
Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 210	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:25:00 - [19] - Quote HMG DPS is backloaded, AR DPS is frontloaded. The farther away the target, the more backloaded the HMG becomes. Frontloaded DPS can kill a heavy before the backloaded DPS kicks in very easily. To make matters worse, the heavy has to stay completely stationary which guarantees he will take every shot, otherwise the backloaded DPS will never kick in. The AR user is free to strafe with minimal impact however.
Icy Tiger Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 1295	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:29:00 - [20] - Quote Relax. Ask ChicagoCubs for tips, he always manages to rip me apart from across the map with his Boundless HMG.

Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 210	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:37:00 - [21] - Quote Icy Tiger wrote: Relax. Ask ChicagoCubs for tips, he always manages to rip me apart from across the map with his Boundless HMG. I've yet to find a single other heavy (or player, for that matter) that intimidated me in the slightest. So I think I'll decline that offer for tips at the moment. I'm not having issues with playing my suit and weapon effectively. I'm having issues looking at this game and not laughing at it hysterically every time I see a stupid mechanic that shouldn't exist the way it does. A person doesn't need to be having trouble to call out some BS when he sees it.
Vermaak Doe SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 711	Posted - 2013.04.29 12:50:00 - [22] - Quote I'm pretty sure the op doesn't understand the concept of balance.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 694	Posted - 2013.04.29 14:11:00 - [23] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. It takes time to spin up, which can be heard by anyone with half a brain and signals them to get to cover. Until it spins up, it has no range whatsoever. Thats why a good AR user will always beat it from range. So your argument has no ground. A laser on the other hand has more DPS and not an easily identifiable sound from range unless the user is stupid and is heating it right next to the targets head. It barely takes less than a second, I have used the first heavy machine gun with zero skills into heavy weapons. A laser gives you away by the fact that there is a glowing beam of ***** light moving around with the source being the user. Also, a laser can't do jack ** at close range and takes time to get to full DPS.
Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 211	Posted - 2013.04.29 14:47:00 - [24] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. It takes time to spin up, which can be heard by anyone with half a brain and signals them to get to cover. Until it spins up, it has no range whatsoever. Thats why a good AR user will always beat it from range. So your argument has no ground. A laser on the other hand has more DPS and not an easily identifiable sound from range unless the user is stupid and is heating it right next to the targets head. It barely takes less than a second, I have used the first heavy machine gun with zero skills into heavy weapons. A laser gives you away by the fact that there is a glowing beam of ***** light moving around with the source being the user. Also, a laser can't do jack ** at close range and takes time to get to full DPS. You know what else takes less than a second? Half a clip.
Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 211	Posted - 2013.04.29 14:50:00 - [25] - Quote Vermaak Doe wrote: I'm pretty sure the op doesn't understand the concept of balance. Balance? Oh, you mean that thing every incompetent developer strives to achieve by making every weapon worthless instead of every weapon good? No, I'm fairly familiar with balance in the sense you are talking about. Your sense of balance is bad, and you should feel bad.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 696	Posted - 2013.04.29 14:54:00 - [26] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. It takes time to spin up, which can be heard by anyone with half a brain and signals them to get to cover. Until it spins up, it has no range whatsoever. Thats why a good AR user will always beat it from range. So your argument has no ground. A laser on the other hand has more DPS and not an easily identifiable sound from range unless the user is stupid and is heating it right next to the targets head. It barely takes less than a second, I have used the first heavy machine gun with zero skills into heavy weapons. A laser gives you away by the fact that there is a glowing beam of ***** light moving around with the source being the user. Also, a laser can't do jack ** at close range and takes time to get to full DPS. You know what else takes less than a second? Half a clip. 750 RPM/ 60 = 12.5 Rounds per second 60 Clip size/ 12.5 RPS... Exile AR clip unload speed: 4.8 seconds. Your argument is invalid. Also, a more accurate saying would be: Less than half a second. The HMG has almost no delay, don't be blind.
P14GU3 The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION 21	Posted - 2013.04.29 17:10:00 - [27] - Quote If you want to be realistic, look at what an hmg is used for IRL. Usually mounted on LAV or attack helicopter. Yes they have a long range, but are as about as accurate as trolls on this forum. Now stick it on a fat suit. What is its purpose? Suppression. This guy isn't meant to be a solo killing machine. He is shock and awe. That's the reason it sounds and looks so menacing. Theoretically it should hit at any range but beyond 15-20m good luck.
Lord-of-the-Dreadfort The Lions Guard 84	Posted - 2013.04.29 17:16:00 - [28] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: I'm pretty sure they are supposed rip across the battlefield and terrify enemies from range, but be MORE difficult to adjust and turn in CQC making them weaker there. How did this "lol its cqc" garbage idea start up? And why were the devs convinced to start twisting its stats towards that role? An HMG is not a shotgun, and a ****** heavy does not have the mobility to force that kind of close range engagement on an intelligent opponent. Baddies. +1 assaults have been whinning for a year now, and sadly, CCO has been listening for a year. when the maps open up to their 5x5KM range, we are going to be USELESS!!!
Lord-of-the-Dreadfort The Lions Guard 84	Posted - 2013.04.29 17:18:00 - [29] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. what DPS? 75% of the bloody rounds don't hit
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 703	Posted - 2013.04.29 17:18:00 - [30] - Quote Lord-of-the-Dreadfort wrote: Cat Merc wrote: With that kind of DPS, it shouldn't have range. what DPS? 75% of the bloody rounds don't hit That's hit detection for ya. When connection is on your side I'm scared of it. When connection is on my side I dance around laughing.



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