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noob 45
Syndicate of Gods
13
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Posted - 2013.03.16 15:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
This really should go without saying or asking considering. By your design it is supposed to take us a week or 2 to train up a single skill. If you make ANY alterations to skills OR GEAR requiring a skill you should untrain those skills for everyone and refund us our SP spent on said skills. This will give us the option of chooosing whether or not we want to retain the skill after you guys screw with it. The current way you are going about this can leave people frustrated and pissed off when they find that 300-500k SP they spent is now a waste of time and effort.
If you don't give us this kind of option then pretty much what you are doing is a 'bait-n-switch' deal. Buying SP boosters is in essence buying SP (passive getting 300k sp a week instead of 200k) with real $, and we are spending that real money to buy these skills.
This isn't too much to ask. |
Alan-Ibn-Xuan Al-Alasabe
Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore
165
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Posted - 2013.03.16 16:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
You have a very appropriate handle. |
noob 45
Syndicate of Gods
14
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Posted - 2013.03.16 16:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alan-Ibn-Xuan Al-Alasabe wrote:You have a very appropriate handle.
Wow... someone from PRO called me a noob
While I appreciate the bump, I will ask that if you want to insult me then do it in the proper forums section. If you have nothing meaningful to add, not even an 'I agree' or 'I disagree', then please don't bother posting.
Vehicle Maneuvering skill cost x5 sp to train. If you got it to LVL 3 then you have spent 342,000 SP on something that is no longer worth buying. |
Talos Alomar
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
504
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Posted - 2013.03.16 16:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP has already stated that this is an option. This thread is pointless. |
noob 45
Syndicate of Gods
14
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Posted - 2013.03.16 17:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
Talos Alomar wrote:CCP has already stated that this is an option. This thread is pointless.
If it is an option then it is an option they are choosing not to implement yet while they are actively nerfing things. This thread would be useless if they were not nerfing skills or if they actually implemented it, but since a lot of us just took the ninja-nerf bat to the face again this thread still has value.
This will not be the last time they nerf skills and items. This thread will be just as relevant when it happens again. Although, I guess this thread could also be considered pointless if CCP doesn't read or pay attention to our feedback/request. |
Tyrin Tonious
Wraith Shadow Guards
7
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
noob 45 wrote:Talos Alomar wrote:CCP has already stated that this is an option. This thread is pointless. If it is an option then it is an option they are choosing not to implement yet while they are actively nerfing things. This thread would be useless if they were not nerfing skills or if they actually implemented it, but since a lot of us just took the ninja-nerf bat to the face again this thread still has value. This will not be the last time they nerf skills and items. This thread will be just as relevant when it happens again. Although, I guess this thread could also be considered pointless if CCP doesn't read or pay attention to our feedback/request.
Just out of curiosity, why has this skill become usless? What does the skill do? I would check is I were on my PS3, but I'm not. |
Django Quik
R.I.f.t
286
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:35:00 -
[7] - Quote
Nerfs have happened throughout the history of EvE and no SP has ever been refunded in the way you suggest. I wouldn't hold your breath.
It has been mentioned by a dev that a possible reallocation of SP upon introduction of racial variants has not been completely thrown out - saying CCP is considering it sounds a bit too strong a statement. Nothing has been stated about reallocation in the case of nerfs. |
noob 45
Syndicate of Gods
14
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:40:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tyrin Tonious wrote:noob 45 wrote:Talos Alomar wrote:CCP has already stated that this is an option. This thread is pointless. If it is an option then it is an option they are choosing not to implement yet while they are actively nerfing things. This thread would be useless if they were not nerfing skills or if they actually implemented it, but since a lot of us just took the ninja-nerf bat to the face again this thread still has value. This will not be the last time they nerf skills and items. This thread will be just as relevant when it happens again. Although, I guess this thread could also be considered pointless if CCP doesn't read or pay attention to our feedback/request. Just out of curiosity, why has this skill become usless? What does the skill do? I would check is I were on my PS3, but I'm not.
All the skill does itself is unlock the players ability to use afterburners. The effectiveness of afterburners has been drastically reduced similar to how the powerplants effectivness was cut in half.
Dropships had only 1 type of afterburner available and that was at lvl 1 at least. The afterburner is pretty much the only real defense a dropship could use to avoid fire. I don't fly dropships, but I do enjoy popping them. I agree 100% with what the pilots are complaining about as the afterburner is the only thing that would slow my efforts in popping dropships with a forge gun.
Tank pilots also feel that the extra propulsion is important for survivability and the smart ones would have invested in it. My 5'10 175lb body in RL can accelerate my 2 ton car in neutral faster than this futuristic tank can move itself despite the fact that we have mastered interstellar space travel.... |
Tyrin Tonious
Wraith Shadow Guards
7
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Nerfs have happened throughout the history of EvE and no SP has ever been refunded in the way you suggest. I wouldn't hold your breath.
It has been mentioned by a dev that a possible reallocation of SP upon introduction of racial variants has not been completely thrown out - saying CCP is considering it sounds a bit too strong a statement. Nothing has been stated about reallocation in the case of nerfs.
This isn't true, I have had SP refunded on a few occasions. Just after being away for almost a year on EVE, I logged in and had almost a Million SP just waiting for me. I knew that wasn't there before. And when they did away with the learning books, they also refunded the SP from those.
I can see a possible refund when all the racial stuff is released however I can't see any other reasons for them to refund us.
Maybe an Aur transaction to reset your SP, who knows, maybe SP Tiered Resets sold through Aur, such as 1M being refunded cost 10,000 Aur, 2 being maybe 15,000, ect. Obviously those numbers aren't real but just an example, an idea of something they could implement that I would approve of cause as we all know, CCP, like any developer, needs to make money off their IP to pay their bills, staff, and building maintenance, and where Dust is F2P (no QQ about P2W cause it isn't), this is a viable option.
In EVE, I could see them doing some kind of Clone Alteration Maintenance thing that costs some serious isk to refund some SP, but since that isn't in there, I doubt it ever would. |
Tyrin Tonious
Wraith Shadow Guards
7
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:54:00 -
[10] - Quote
noob 45 wrote:Tyrin Tonious wrote:noob 45 wrote:Talos Alomar wrote:CCP has already stated that this is an option. This thread is pointless. If it is an option then it is an option they are choosing not to implement yet while they are actively nerfing things. This thread would be useless if they were not nerfing skills or if they actually implemented it, but since a lot of us just took the ninja-nerf bat to the face again this thread still has value. This will not be the last time they nerf skills and items. This thread will be just as relevant when it happens again. Although, I guess this thread could also be considered pointless if CCP doesn't read or pay attention to our feedback/request. Just out of curiosity, why has this skill become usless? What does the skill do? I would check is I were on my PS3, but I'm not. All the skill does itself is unlock the players ability to use afterburners. The effectiveness of afterburners has been drastically reduced similar to how the powerplants effectivness was cut in half. Dropships had only 1 type of afterburner available and that was at lvl 1 at least. The afterburner is pretty much the only real defense a dropship could use to avoid fire. I don't fly dropships, but I do enjoy popping them. I agree 100% with what the pilots are complaining about as the afterburner is the only thing that would slow my efforts in popping dropships with a forge gun. Tank pilots also feel that the extra propulsion is important for survivability and the smart ones would have invested in it. My 5'10 175lb body in RL can accelerate my 2 ton car in neutral faster than this futuristic tank can move itself despite the fact that we have mastered interstellar space travel....
Hm, that does suck, however maybe the nerfing of the TR 1 Afterburner is in part of preparation for the introduction of higher Tiered Afterburners.
Is there only a TR 1 Fuel Injector? How does the higher Tiered Injectors compare to the lower ones? |
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noob 45
Syndicate of Gods
14
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Nerfs have happened throughout the history of EvE and no SP has ever been refunded in the way you suggest. I wouldn't hold your breath.
It has been mentioned by a dev that a possible reallocation of SP upon introduction of racial variants has not been completely thrown out - saying CCP is considering it sounds a bit too strong a statement. Nothing has been stated about reallocation in the case of nerfs.
Thank you for your meaningful post.
While true that nerfs have happened throughout the history of EVE and all games. History doesn't have to set a precedent for the future just because that is the way it has been. I have played many types of games from many developers that go about doing nerfs differently. From my experience there is ALWAYS some kind of negative backlash that occurs, but it is also my experience that when developers do what they can to mitigate the indirect effects of a nerf their playerbase, aka customers, generally are much happier and you see far less people drop out.
For example: Everquest was one of the first MMORPGs and was huge. Their expansion Planes of Power required guilds to complete raids to get "keys" to unlock and access upper zones. Eventually they felt that this idea was too difficult for the casual players and simply opened up the upper end zones to everyone once they reached a certain level. This pissed off all the hardcore players that spent hours/days/weeks/months grinding and raiding with their guilds for their "keys". They at the very least tried to compensate the already "flagged" players by rewarding them with extra AA skillpoints... While this didn't appease every "flagged" player, it did mitigate a lot of the negative feedback and slow the flow of hardcore players bailing from the game to WoW. |
Delirium Inferno
Chernova Industries
78
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Posted - 2013.03.16 18:59:00 -
[12] - Quote
Give it up already, you have to be HARDCORE and accept that everything you do in a BETA is permanent
But seriously CCP said it is possible they will do a reallocation, I'd even say it is more likely than not. |
Django Quik
R.I.f.t
287
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Posted - 2013.03.16 19:37:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tyrin Tonious wrote:Django Quik wrote:Nerfs have happened throughout the history of EvE and no SP has ever been refunded in the way you suggest. I wouldn't hold your breath.
It has been mentioned by a dev that a possible reallocation of SP upon introduction of racial variants has not been completely thrown out - saying CCP is considering it sounds a bit too strong a statement. Nothing has been stated about reallocation in the case of nerfs. This isn't true, I have had SP refunded on a few occasions. Just after being away for almost a year on EVE, I logged in and had almost a Million SP just waiting for me. I knew that wasn't there before. And when they did away with the learning books, they also refunded the SP from those. I can see a possible refund when all the racial stuff is released however I can't see any other reasons for them to refund us. Maybe an Aur transaction to reset your SP, who knows, maybe SP Tiered Resets sold through Aur, such as 1M being refunded cost 10,000 Aur, 2 being maybe 15,000, ect. Obviously those numbers aren't real but just an example, an idea of something they could implement that I would approve of cause as we all know, CCP, like any developer, needs to make money off their IP to pay their bills, staff, and building maintenance, and where Dust is F2P (no QQ about P2W cause it isn't), this is a viable option. In EVE, I could see them doing some kind of Clone Alteration Maintenance thing that costs some serious isk to refund some SP, but since that isn't in there, I doubt it ever would.
SP was refunded when what it was spent into was completely removed from the game, not just nerfed.
When you went away from EvE did you have any plex left? This could explain any extra SP you had earned when you returned. Maybe you got a special super helpful bug or something but if it wasn't left over from before, that situation is definitely not common or standard.
Making any kind of respec an Aur transaction only would send the P2W crowd off the deep end, and rightly so. Anything that can be bought with Aurum must have an isk equivalent or be earnable by other means, otherwise it is the definition of P2W. (I know boosters are aurum only but the SP you get through them can be earned through playing, it just takes longer).
I don't see there ever being anything of this kind in EvE - after nearly 10 years and no cases of being refunded SP because something got nerfed or something slightly different came out (i.e. racial variants), that pretty much sets a precedent for CCP and since Dust is part of this EvE universe, the same principles will most likely apply. |
Django Quik
R.I.f.t
287
|
Posted - 2013.03.16 19:41:00 -
[14] - Quote
Delirium Inferno wrote: But seriously CCP said it is possible they will do a reallocation, I'd even say it is more likely than not.
I'd have to extremely strongly disagree with you on that one - check my original post above for my explanation of why.
As for racial variants, I'd imagine a better way to do it would be to have the new suits covered by the current skill sets but we will have to wait and see what the racial variants are and how CCP chooses to implement this. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
476
|
Posted - 2013.03.16 20:45:00 -
[15] - Quote
No, if you abused ir will it was Op you should suffer noe that it's nerfed |
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