Thing is let's say a player calls in a Gunloggi but gets shot by a sniper. If only that player, or another player with the same skills, can operate it then what if he can't get back to it because he spawns on the other side of the map? Or gets pinned down? Then people have to guard the thing so the enemy doesn't hack it and their tank driver go on a rampage. Or everyone has to invest at least a little bit in to tanks. You can't blow the thing up so you just have to wait.

And then even if someone has the required skills what if they can't use that proto mod yet? So it wouldn't work but the rest would, that's a quick death. Or what if they only have Circuitry IV? Then nothing would work, or the tank explodes and kills everyone.

Or what if it's a corp battle and it's a proto tank. Everything is groovy but suddenly the only player on the team with the exact skills required to drive it gets disconnected? Now the tank can't move and has to be guarded so someone on the other team doesn't hack it, plus no one knows what exactly the fitting is so they don't know if they can actually drive it or not. Even if the other team manages to hack the tank then none of them can drive it and they would have to guard it so the other team doesn't take it back. Only think they can do is kill it and now you've completely removed hacking vehicles from the game.

Sure, there are ways to deal with these issues. That's not my point. I'm just saying that while the current system is a bit silly I think any other option would just be a complete PITA.

Yes, it does. But you still have to guard it so the enemy doesn't hack it and roll all over you with it.

Vehicles need to work the same way as ships in EVE, having a skill-call for the vehicle itself and every module fitted to it. If you don't have the skill, you shouldn't even be able to use it.

If it requires skills to drive then odds are the enemy hacking it wouldn't be a problem. They wouldn't be able to drive it either.

I really think that here should be a timer for how often you can spawn a vehicle in. Now only would it solve this problem but it would also solve all the tank spam in pub matches. It also should effect drop ships and LAVs although the default onikuma shouldn't be timed since it's a basic means of transportation and winout it the game would be won based on who had the most snipers.

Quick question. In eve do you generally own multiple ships and you move between them as needs demand? I am not referring to parasite ships but primary vessels.

Its as simple as this. If you dont have the SP, you shouldn't be able to drive it. People steal things like ships in EVE all the time, but that does not mean that they can fly it. How does it make sense that an infantry clone can jump into a multi million isk vehicle and simple "know" how to use it? it doesn't.

CCP should make it so that if you hack a vehicle, its considered yours and a special option comes up. At that point you should have a "re-call vehicle" option which just brings a bollus in to take the captured vehicle back to base. This way you can keep it until you have the skill set to drive it, or you sell it for good money. Either way its win win. This would also solve the problem of blue berries stealing tank drivers tanks as they simply wouldn't be able to jump into the drivers seat.

I like it - if you manage to steal an enemy vehicle, you get to keep it as salvage as long as you manage to call in the bolas to remove it safely from the battlefield.

I know how people love to shoot down real life analogies but try to see this logically - if you don't know how to fly a helicopter, you can't fly a helicopter, even if you find one empty and sitting around asking to be taken. If your enemy had a helicopter and died before he could get in it, you could well go over and claim it for yourself but if you don't know how to fly it, you can't fly it. How does this not make sense?

If you know how to fly a light civilian helicopter (equivalent to Militia gear that you can get WITHOUT skill training), you can get into a Black Hawk or an Apache and, while you're going to have issues, you'll understand enough about the basics to get yourself off the ground and wobble around for a while and get somewhere - even if it's not where you were TRYING to go. If you're lucky, you might even be able to work out enough to get the thing's controls to get it stable and head in the right direction.

If you know how to drive a car, you're probably going to crash a big-rig if you're doing anything more than moving down a straight road without someone helping you to understand the differences between it and your Honda Civic, but you CAN drive it.

And more importantly, I wouldn't know how to build a car, but after my Dad swapped the engine from my Nissan Bluebird into a similarly-sized Nissan Presea which had a damaged engine, I was able to drive the resulting vehicle just fine.

There should be negative modifiers when driving a vehicle that you aren't qualified for. I'm not against the idea that vehicle driver seats should be locked out for people without the relevant Operation skill for the vehicle, but I don't think the fitting requirements need to be met - although there should be penalties if you couldn't fit the vehicle yourself, because as much as I can be a safe driver in a car, my Dad's knowledge of the internal systems gives him a lot of advantages I don't have.

Once eve can inject ISK into dust you may fully realize this problem.

Currently only the vehicle owner is required to have the millions of SP invested in a Tank/Drop-ship and the SP for modules to unlock them or skills to reduce power grid and even fit those modules.

What this means is that a play with enough ISK could hypothetically call in 15 proto tanks, and roll a match when all brand new players that have not allocated a single skill point.

Surely there should be a few lines of code in the vehicle objects which when created initialize a variable for vehicleOwner. And this should be used to prevent anyone who is not the owner from driving/piloting the ship. Unless you want to check against the SP of every person trying to get inside the driver seat, I think this is a solid short hand solution which guarantees only the player with the appropriate skills can use the vehicle.

However if an enemy hacks the vehicle for all practical purposes this should go out the window or else there would be no point in hacking a vehicle.


Your thoughts?

I could get in a stealth bomber but even if I knew how to fly the thing, I wouldn't know how to activate the stealth modules.

Okay, I concede your logic Garrett - it all makes good sense, at least on the fittings side.

Someone else has fitted the vehicle and used their skills to get the correct PG and CPU levels and whatnot, so those can be taken out of this equation. Creating penalties but still allowing use would be pretty complex and I think unnecessary.

In order to pilot any vehicle, you should have at least 1 level in the relevant piloting skill (LAVs, HAVs, Marauders, Dropships).

If active modules are fitted that aren't totally skilled up to, those modules should be unable to be activated but passive ones should remain.

Hmm, I dunno actually... thinking about it, fitting a module to your own vehicle that you haven't skilled up to yet means you can't deploy that vehicle into the battlefield at all. Because of this I'm still tempted to say that to pilot a vehicle at all you need every required skill level for all modules and fittings (PG and CPU excluded).

To call the vehicle in, you need to have built it first. If you've DESIGNED it, but aren't capable of actually getting the design to work, you can't call it in because it only exists as an incomplete concept. Once you've put it together, it's reasonable to hand the keys to someone else... unless they're a terrible driver.

I like the idea of letting someone drive, but barring them from activating modules they aren't skilled into. That would be a good way to encourage someone to jump OUT of the driver's seat when they realise "but if I can't use that, I'm going to die!"

OK my suggestion for dropships would be the pilot and dropship actually drop from the warbarge rather than calling it in from the ground. I suppose you could do the same with tanks but I believe if you do then there should be ground turrets , in ambush as well as the other game modes, that players can use to knock the tanks out of the air before they can land.

"Ohhhh a shiney vehicle I've never driven, but oh no! I don't see access to any modules, I'd better hop out" ~ No one ever

You know damn well every blueberry in the world would neither get the hint, nor abide to exit the vehicle if asked directly. They'll just try to derp around in it and watch the funny explosion.

What if it was "Ohhh a shiny vehicle. Ooooh, modules.Why are they greyed out? Why can't I use this vehicle properly? It's stupid!" instead?

Being shown a toy and not given the option to play with it makes noobs move on surprisingly often. They may end up rage-quitting the tank instead of moving to a (slightly) more useful gunner position, but it's still an improvement.