DUST Search - Fused grenades: Can we do away with them now?

Baal Omniscient wrote:

I know they are only accessible via a merc pack (and if I understood the new post in the announcements section, for 15 AUR a piece in the marketplace), but they are not right for this game. They need to be replaced by something else.

Basically fused grenades make possible grenade spamming similar to that of a month ago, but on steroids. Panic grenades are insta-death if you've taken any damage at all, you cannot run from them, with a nanohive or supply depot you have what equates to a mass driver that does 400~600ish damage (don't recall the exact damage off hand), that doesn't have to be reloaded, is easier to aim, and doesn't even take up a weapon slot.

In addition, I think thukker grenades need to stay in the past for the same reasons.

In the case that they are not removed, the splash should be reduced to around .5 meters. You get almost a direct hit, fine, it auto explodes and auto-kills. But only if you are a REALLY good shot with it.

And while we are on the topic of grenades, I think the grenade indicator needs a LOT of work.

Lastly, no, I'm not some noob who got killed by one and is crying OP. I've been in this game for over 6 months now, and after seeing the announcement about fused grenades being AUR bought for the next week, I decided something needed to be said.

Link to Post

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 248	Posted - 2013.02.25 20:13:00 - [1] - Quote I know they are only accessible via a merc pack (and if I understood the new post in the announcements section, for 15 AUR a piece in the marketplace), but they are not right for this game. They need to be replaced by something else. Basically fused grenades make possible grenade spamming similar to that of a month ago, but on steroids. Panic grenades are insta-death if you've taken any damage at all, you cannot run from them, with a nanohive or supply depot you have what equates to a mass driver that does 400~600ish damage (don't recall the exact damage off hand), that doesn't have to be reloaded, is easier to aim, and doesn't even take up a weapon slot. In addition, I think thukker grenades need to stay in the past for the same reasons. In the case that they are not removed, the splash should be reduced to around .5 meters. You get almost a direct hit, fine, it auto explodes and auto-kills. But only if you are a REALLY good shot with it. And while we are on the topic of grenades, I think the grenade indicator needs a LOT of work. Lastly, no, I'm not some noob who got killed by one and is crying OP. I've been in this game for over 6 months now, and after seeing the announcement about fused grenades being AUR bought for the next week, I decided something needed to be said. Link to Post
calisk galern KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 9	Posted - 2013.02.25 20:16:00 - [2] - Quote or you could lose a couple proto suits to try hards. personally I'm for option 2, makes them feel good, and like the guys who bring tanks into pubs I like to see you lose them. If they cost AUR, then odds are they will never be spammed to any major degree. now if they offered a bpo....I'd be all over that and would be spamming them like crazy.
Belzeebub Santana SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 409	Posted - 2013.02.25 20:24:00 - [3] - Quote Maybe have fused grenades have only one equipped so it is one get out of **** free card? As far as spamming them from a supply depot or hive, make it take a while for them to comeback like 4-5 sec. I think all nades should take a long time to comeback.
Illuminaughty-696 Omega Risk Control Services 202	Posted - 2013.02.25 20:30:00 - [4] - Quote Thukkers are silly. Why can't we buy them with ISK? Now they are just AUR? Really? Lame CCP. Anyway, yeah, they either need to go or they need to be available in some format to everyone. I have plenty of AUR and thukkers are awesome. Then again, that's the problem.
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 248	Posted - 2013.02.25 21:13:00 - [5] - Quote Illuminaughty-696 wrote: Thukkers are silly. Why can't we buy them with ISK? Now they are just AUR? Really? Lame CCP. Anyway, yeah, they either need to go or they need to be available in some format to everyone. I have plenty of AUR and thukkers are awesome. Then again, that's the problem. lulz, yeah, that IS sort of the issue
KingBabar Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 441	Posted - 2013.02.25 21:14:00 - [6] - Quote 400 000 aur / 15 = 26 666
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 249	Posted - 2013.02.25 21:16:00 - [7] - Quote KingBabar wrote: 400 000 aur / 15 = 26 666 ikr?
Disturbingly Bored Universal Allies Inc. 93	Posted - 2013.02.25 21:22:00 - [8] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: lulz, yeah, that IS sort of the issue I didn't see such a huge problem with Locuses so long as they were only available from the merc pack. The Merc pack sets a reasonably high bar on acquiring more of them, so you don't really see them that often outside of high-stakes corp matches. If they're just generally available, yes, that's going to be quite a problem. And this is coming from someone who uses them often enough. It also creates another issue: it's literally a pay-to-win item then. It's something that's only available for AUR that no amount of SP or ISK can get you otherwise, and that fundamentally undermines this games concept.
N1ck Comeau REGULATORS OF VALOR Orion Empire 37	Posted - 2013.02.25 21:48:00 - [9] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: I know they are only accessible via a merc pack (and if I understood the new post in the announcements section, for 15 AUR a piece in the marketplace), but they are not right for this game. They need to be replaced by something else. Basically fused grenades make possible grenade spamming similar to that of a month ago, but on steroids. Panic grenades are insta-death if you've taken any damage at all, you cannot run from them, with a nanohive or supply depot you have what equates to a mass driver that does 400~600ish damage (don't recall the exact damage off hand), that doesn't have to be reloaded, is easier to aim, and doesn't even take up a weapon slot. In addition, I think thukker grenades need to stay in the past for the same reasons. In the case that they are not removed, the splash should be reduced to around .5 meters. You get almost a direct hit, fine, it auto explodes and auto-kills. But only if you are a REALLY good shot with it. And while we are on the topic of grenades, I think the grenade indicator needs a LOT of work. Lastly, no, I'm not some noob who got killed by one and is crying OP. I've been in this game for over 6 months now, and after seeing the announcement about fused grenades being AUR bought for the next week, I decided something needed to be said. Link to Post Well there only Aururm and most people don't pay for this game. I know i do but i am not buying those grenades i personnaly like the regular grenades because i can then cook them untill they explode.
Disturbingly Bored Universal Allies Inc. 93	Posted - 2013.02.25 22:01:00 - [10] - Quote N1ck Comeau wrote: Well there only Aururm and most people don't pay for this game. I know i do but i am not buying those grenades i personnaly like the regular grenades because i can then cook them untill they explode. ...you like to cook grenades for three seconds so that you can get the same effect that a Fused Locus can in one second? I'm not being sarcastic, I just want to make sure I understand that right.

Talruum Tezztarozza Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 74	Posted - 2013.02.25 22:20:00 - [11] - Quote This is the first time in a long long while that I post before actually carefully read OP and all replies. I promise I will throughly read them all afterward. Let me say this one thing first. So you find new topic for your nerf thread ? How many had it been ? Are you try to kitten nerf the entire game ???? lol EDIT: ok after read all the posts. I don't have problem with fused nade in general. After read some of your replies, I'm not sure if you are either. So you want it to be removed from the game or you want it to be available in isk so everyone can happily spam it ?? You can only choose one here. those two are entirely different issue.
Disturbingly Bored Universal Allies Inc. 93	Posted - 2013.02.25 23:25:00 - [12] - Quote Talruum Tezztarozza wrote: EDIT: ok after read all the posts. I don't have problem with fused nade in general. After read some of your replies, I'm not sure if you are either. So you want it to be removed from the game or you want it to be available in isk so everyone can happily spam it ?? You can only choose one here. those two are entirely different issue. I prefer option 3) Leave it right where it is: In Merc pack only, so it makes its way into matches very infrequently. Is it still pay for power then? I suppose. But at a prohibitively high price. Failing that, there should be an ISK version. And then the only way I can think of from this devolving into grenade spam 2.0 is if locus let you carry only a single grenade, not two.
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 249	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:00:00 - [13] - Quote Allowing the auto explode grenades in this game in any form allows this game to devolve into a game where grenades are a win button. AUR users have the ability right now to own people with grenades alone. If we allow ISK variants, then auto explode grenades will take over as main primary weapons. Just as this game isn't tank wars where the battlefield is ruled by tanks, this game also shouldn't become a huge grenade war. Replace them or edit them in order to make them balanced within the limits of other grenades. Reduce the splash radius to a manageable level for such a weapon. I propose .5 meters but I'd be willing to accept any reasonable range change. They need to be reigned in if there are to eventually be ISK variants. .5 meters is a good baseline for an auto explode grenade, and then higher level variants can increase that range slightly with minor damage buffs. I don't want to toss the word "nerf" around, but they need to be balanced with the rest of the game. Allowing only AUR users to access them isn't right either since it then becomes pay-to-win. I think CCP allowed us to get them so cheaply this week is so that they can be tested for adjustment. I'm merely stating my opinion on how they should be adjusted.
Sir Meode Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 318	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:25:00 - [14] - Quote Who ever has the most ISK wins, that is the new Eden way is it not?
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:26:00 - [15] - Quote Wasn't the pack changed since last reset where it just gave you regular locus nades now? IMO a way to nerf it is to have it only go off if it directly hits someone :D
Tectonious Falcon The Southern Legion 395	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:31:00 - [16] - Quote Sir Meode wrote: Who ever has the most ISK wins, that is the new Eden way is it not? ISK =/= AUR Having AUR only easy mode weapons is pay to win. Having ISK versions that require longer to get isn't. Although I'd rather remove them entirely they have no place in dust.
Kelshaw Xu ZionTCD Legacy Rising 66	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:33:00 - [17] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Wasn't the pack changed since last reset where it just gave you regular locus nades now? IMO a way to nerf it is to have it only go off if it directly hits someone :D No Iron Wolf Saber, they are known as 'Core Locus' you get 50 of them and they are Thukkers just a different name and much lower CPU.PG needs.
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 369	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:41:00 - [18] - Quote I wouldn't mind having an ISK Fused Locus if the Grenades were reworked slightly to something like this: Militia: Locus - 300 damage, 2 capacity. No Fused. Standard: Locus - 300 damage, 3 capacity. Fused - 200 damage, 2 capacity. Advanced: Locus - 400 damage, 3 capacity. Fused - 300 damage, 2 capacity. Prototype: Locus - 500 damage, 3 capacity. Fused - 400 damage, 2 capacity. Possibly add a 3% increase in damage per level to the Grenadier skill as well. The Prototype Locus will then do 575 damage (they do 600 damage currently).
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:46:00 - [19] - Quote Kelshaw Xu wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Wasn't the pack changed since last reset where it just gave you regular locus nades now? IMO a way to nerf it is to have it only go off if it directly hits someone :D No Iron Wolf Saber, they are known as 'Core Locus' you get 50 of them and they are Thukkers just a different name and much lower CPU.PG needs. well I never got any I should have 150 of the damn things now. I also no longer see contacts sold in the store, only the long range one.
KingBabar Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 443	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:46:00 - [20] - Quote Just to clearify: Fused Locus nades : 400 damage - 6 m blast radius Tukker nades : 600 damage - 7,2 m blast radius. Both are direct hit nades, you get 2 fused and you got 3 Tukkers. I am not entirely sure I would call the Fused Locus nades for OP. Yes they are very good in certain situations, but also very limited. They don't leave your hand instantly when you press R2, there is about a second delay which make me cook them for about 1 second before throwing them. Then they will leave your hand instanly when releasing R2 so you don't have to throw them at where you yhink the enemy is going.... I normally use the M1 Locus nades that are superior in many ways. You get 3 instead of just 2. They do more damage and has a larrger blast radius. (500 damage, 6,6 m blast radius) I can also use them in many situations were the fused nades are completely useless. I can hit people behind cover, either let them bounce past said cover or time them so they'll explode over their heads mid air. I can toss them at my feet and run away for cover to slow persuers down while I regain my helath. I can bounce them of wall making them go around corners and the list goes on... The Fused are very good but only when you can hit directly and survive the exposure you have to put yourself in to toss one out. And off course, too close to stuuff or a bluedot walking infront of you most likely will get you killed....

Takahiro Kashuken Intara Direct Action Caldari State 102	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:49:00 - [21] - Quote Fused dont cook they blow up on impact with whatever they hit
KingBabar Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 443	Posted - 2013.02.26 12:51:00 - [22] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Fused dont cook they blow up on impact with whatever they hit You can still cook them, they will leave your hand instantly when cooked, not like normal when you have about a 1 sec delay...
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 249	Posted - 2013.02.26 13:20:00 - [23] - Quote My issue with them isn't their versatility. It's the same thing you were ranting about a month ago, panic grenades. And just because they cost AUR atm doesn't mean that they always will. Obviously those panic grenades from before were a little more versatile, but they also didn't IMMEDIATELY explode when tossed at your feet.
Beren Hurin OMNI Endeavors 183	Posted - 2013.02.26 13:26:00 - [24] - Quote Thermal grenades- moderate bonus against shields, contact explosion, can kills, but reduced armor damage. Pulse flux- half the radius of normal flux, 25% damage, but pulses 3-4 times over 6 seconds.
Vaerana Myshtana Bojo's School of the Trades 206	Posted - 2013.02.26 13:44:00 - [25] - Quote QQ about grenades... Again. MOAR DEATH! I'm sick of seeing a /0 after anyone's name on the end game screen. The point of "easy mode" devices like Fused Grenades is that noobs remain a threat to the guy in a Proto suit with 6M SP and a 7.2 KDR. Working As Intended.
Vrain Matari ZionTCD Legacy Rising 404	Posted - 2013.02.26 13:44:00 - [26] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: I know they are only accessible via a merc pack (and if I understood the new post in the announcements section, for 15 AUR a piece in the marketplace), but they are not right for this game. They need to be replaced by something else. Basically fused grenades make possible grenade spamming similar to that of a month ago, but on steroids. Panic grenades are insta-death if you've taken any damage at all, you cannot run from them, with a nanohive or supply depot you have what equates to a mass driver that does 400~600ish damage (don't recall the exact damage off hand), that doesn't have to be reloaded, is easier to aim, and doesn't even take up a weapon slot. In addition, I think thukker grenades need to stay in the past for the same reasons. In the case that they are not removed, the splash should be reduced to around .5 meters. You get almost a direct hit, fine, it auto explodes and auto-kills. But only if you are a REALLY good shot with it. And while we are on the topic of grenades, I think the grenade indicator needs a LOT of work. Lastly, no, I'm not some noob who got killed by one and is crying OP. I've been in this game for over 6 months now, and after seeing the announcement about fused grenades being AUR bought for the next week, I decided something needed to be said. Link to Post I agree Baal, imo they don't add anything of value to the game. In fact they detract from the gameplay. They are the perfect partner to broken spawn mechanics and will harvest many noob tears. What is the gameplay design goal you're aiming for here, CCP?
lowratehitman Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 293	Posted - 2013.02.26 13:50:00 - [27] - Quote If anyone has bought a merc pack and recieved the fused grenades,and used them to their enjoyment, those people have no gripes in my opinion. I have bought 2 merc packs and have used 0 of them.
Rei Shepard Spectre II 72	Posted - 2013.02.26 14:19:00 - [28] - Quote lowratehitman wrote: If anyone has bought a merc pack and recieved the fused grenades,and used them to their enjoyment, those people have no gripes in my opinion. I have bought 2 merc packs and have used 0 of them. I havent used mine either until i read this thread and also bought 2 merc packs (value can't be beat really). Took a suit, dropped down a gauged hive and went to town ....normally i get 5-8 pm's about being a hacker on PC shooters a day and i get to harvest some tears, so far on Dust i got 2 mails total or so. 1 game with Fused nade spam nets me 2 mails lol :p Been a while since i harvested some tears. I really have no issue with the Fused nade itself, but being able to spam em ontop a of a Nano hive or depot is a bit OP, coupled with a Proto Suit so i did not die at all and it lets me keep my nade. Maybe they should change nades & hives and any deployable as expended the moment you throw/use them instead of only losing them on death. Makes sense afterall.
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 251	Posted - 2013.02.26 14:32:00 - [29] - Quote Vaerana Myshtana wrote: QQ about grenades... Again. MOAR DEATH! I'm sick of seeing a /0 after anyone's name on the end game screen. The point of "easy mode" devices like Fused Grenades is that noobs remain a threat to the guy in a Proto suit with 6M SP and a 7.2 KDR. Working As Intended. Or the guy in the proto suit can run them and further grief noobs. Just saying this needs to be looked into, especially since they are now 15 AUR a piece
Vaerana Myshtana Bojo's School of the Trades 206	Posted - 2013.02.26 14:36:00 - [30] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: Vaerana Myshtana wrote: The point of "easy mode" devices like Fused Grenades is that noobs remain a threat to the guy in a Proto suit with 6M SP and a 7.2 KDR. Working As Intended. Or the guy in the proto suit can run them and further grief noobs. Just saying this needs to be looked into, especially since they are now 15 AUR a piece The guy in the Proto suit has more efficient ways of killing noobs that 15 AUR grenades that come in a two pack. Just about everybody with a KDR over 2.0 has better ways to grief than 15 AUR grenades. I don't see a lot of "rookie" players complaining about grenades, I see a lot of "elite" players.



Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page