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DropKickSuicide
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
74
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Posted - 2013.01.31 05:26:00 -
[31] - Quote
I personnaly HATE using KB/M for anything thing but If I couldnt use my controller ( wich Iv been using since PS1 released ) I would not play this game. Im sure most people that are using KB/M are using it for the same reason not and "Advantage".
The Advantage in using a KB/M over a Controller is strictly personel preference. If I tried using KB/M id probly go 0-30 and thats if I could even get to the battle before it was over.
Also If this was PC only there would be alot of people not able to play the game ( myself includded ) and that is money lost for CCP.
In short the more choices there are to acustom different players the more players there will be. |
Kovak Therim
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
158
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Posted - 2013.01.31 10:16:00 -
[32] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:As a general rule, try something before you say its OP.
I just did. A crap K/M and no idea wtf I was doing. Using militia gear. I still got some kills in a match. It is OP. It wasn't nerfed nearly as much as I thought it was. You can turn pretty damn fast with the mouse. HTFU has nothing to do with it. A pro with a K/M will utterly destroy someone with a DS3 in this game. It shouldn't have been added. I don't care about what the OP says, I used it and saw for myself. It needs to be removed. IDGAF what you say to me, it won't change my stance on it. There is no balance as long as DS3 and K/M users get thrown into the same matches. I shudder to think what a pro can do with a mouse.
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cesar theone
D3LTA FORC3
Orion Empire
2
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Posted - 2013.01.31 10:32:00 -
[33] - Quote
I strongly disagree!! One of the things i find the most appealing about Dust 514, is the option to use a Mouse. I think the point is to APPEAL to hardcore gamer's, if you want to have a competitive environment. Please don't change this, i BEG you !!! |
CarloArmato2991
RED COLONIAL MARINES
Covert Intervention
20
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Posted - 2013.01.31 10:40:00 -
[34] - Quote
I've played on PS3 for this last 3 years, but I was a PC gamer before.
I've tryed KB/M combo on Dust 514, but I can't see too much advantages: there are some issues that prevents Mouse&keyboards from being better than the DS3.
So no, I don't think that Mouse and Keyboard combo should be removed anyways. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 10:43:00 -
[35] - Quote
Yeah, I can tell you from experience against the best guns in the game... you can kill and hold your own in any match-up. KBM v KBM, DS3 v DS3, and KBM v DS3 are all pretty much equal. The advantages, if any beyond comfort level, are small and situational. |
Breakin Stuff
Immobile Infantry
680
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Posted - 2013.01.31 11:02:00 -
[36] - Quote
Glockshna Twerk wrote:I dont want PC gamers to join in and add to the game unless they play the way I say they have to. If they can be competent by using a familiar interface it's clearly unfair! Blahblah take away their ability to use familiar control interfaces because they kill me because my DS3-fu is weak!
Thoughts?
I think you have lost your rabid-ass mind.
That thought good enough for you? |
Baal Omniscient
L.O.T.I.S.
Legacy Rising
248
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Posted - 2013.01.31 11:26:00 -
[37] - Quote
I stomp kb/m users all day every day with my ds3. I have no need for you to nerf my opposition! DON'T TAKE AWAY MY ONLY CHALLENGING TARGETS! ="(
Edit: Well, there are a FEW ds3 hard targets... |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
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Posted - 2013.01.31 12:38:00 -
[38] - Quote
Kovak Therim wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:As a general rule, try something before you say its OP. I just did. A crap K/M and no idea wtf I was doing. Using militia gear. I still got some kills in a match. It is OP. It wasn't nerfed nearly as much as I thought it was. You can turn pretty damn fast with the mouse. HTFU has nothing to do with it. A pro with a K/M will utterly destroy someone with a DS3 in this game. It shouldn't have been added. I don't care about what the OP says, I used it and saw for myself. It needs to be removed. IDGAF what you say to me, it won't change my stance on it. There is no balance as long as DS3 and K/M users get thrown into the same matches. I shudder to think what a pro can do with a mouse.
What I'm reading here is that you suck with the sixaxis controller, and not that KB+M is OP.
I've tried both too. Repeatedly. I almost exclusively stick to my sixaxis because it works better for me. |
Ragmesesis
The Lusitans
6
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Posted - 2013.01.31 12:53:00 -
[39] - Quote
Glockshna Twerk wrote:Simple as can be. There is a massive game balance issue here. If people are allowed to use a mouse and keyboard to stomp controller users people will not want to play this game.
There are two solutions I can see to this problem:
1: Limit matchmaking for people with a keyboard connected to only match with other people with a keyboard connected and either kick people who connect a keyboard or simply disallow it from working in controller matches.
2: (Easier and most preferred imo) remove it completely.
Let's face it, you made a console shooter. If you want people to be able to use a mouse and keyboard port it to PC (where this game should be anyway but that's another story)
Thoughts?
In someway i understand you dust is a console game so people should use the dualshock or psmove and clearly the analog stick is not balanced the sencitivity is a mess it should be a priority to fix but i dont see any changes BUT in the otherway there are a lot of people who hate FPS in a console because you use a controler and ps3 has oficial keyboad and the system lets you have a mouse so i dont understand that hate through the keyboard and mouse users i think the way to go is ccp to fix the sencitivity in all dualshock and psmove and also the mouse because people still say its far from perfect |
Johnny Starscream
DUST University
Ivy League
7
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Posted - 2013.02.01 12:55:00 -
[40] - Quote
Why is it that when someone is trying to provide feedback about balancing issues, it's whining? I think the OP has a great point. I've always been better on PC shooters due to the increased accuracy and speed of using a mouse. I did try the mouse and keyboard just now and it felt as sluggish as the DS3. However, I also just found out I can increase the mouse sensitivity not only in-game but in the PS3 system menu as well. I'm gonna try it out today to see if the OP's point about the critical issue of balance is valid and then report back. |
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Matobar
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
123
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Posted - 2013.02.01 13:58:00 -
[41] - Quote
Some people are better with a mouse and keyboard, some are better with a controller. Why does it matter which one people use. If CCP were to somehow let an Xbox controller or Wii-mote connect to the PS3 so we could use it in the game, would you suddenly want those to be removed too? |
addsta01
The Southern Legion
12
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Posted - 2013.02.01 15:52:00 -
[42] - Quote
Glockshna Twerk wrote:Simple as can be. There is a massive game balance issue here. If people are allowed to use a mouse and keyboard to stomp controller users people will not want to play this game.
There are two solutions I can see to this problem:
1: Limit matchmaking for people with a keyboard connected to only match with other people with a keyboard connected and either kick people who connect a keyboard or simply disallow it from working in controller matches.
2: (Easier and most preferred imo) remove it completely.
Let's face it, you made a console shooter. If you want people to be able to use a mouse and keyboard port it to PC (where this game should be anyway but that's another story)
Thoughts?
remove the ability i think NOT..if you dont like it quit.
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Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis
775
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Posted - 2013.02.01 16:10:00 -
[43] - Quote
Glockshna Twerk wrote:Simple as can be. There is a massive game balance issue here. If people are allowed to use a mouse and keyboard to stomp controller users people will not want to play this game.
There are two solutions I can see to this problem:
1: Limit matchmaking for people with a keyboard connected to only match with other people with a keyboard connected and either kick people who connect a keyboard or simply disallow it from working in controller matches.
2: (Easier and most preferred imo) remove it completely.
Let's face it, you made a console shooter. If you want people to be able to use a mouse and keyboard port it to PC (where this game should be anyway but that's another story)
Thoughts?
I do not, nor have I ever, used KBM with Dust. That having been said I give this idea a resounding -1 for the attempt to remove aspects of diversity, and even more importantly player choice from the game. That is 180 degrees the wrong direction to be headed.
0.02 ISK
Cross |
Round3y3
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2013.02.01 16:10:00 -
[44] - Quote
The mouse and keyboard feature isn't going anywhere. Think about it, the PS3 is all about features and integration and so are many of the titles made for it. There is no way that the first ever console-PC linked mmo shooter is going to "lose" a major popular feature because a few people get all fussy about it. |
Knarf Black
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
397
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Posted - 2013.02.01 16:22:00 -
[45] - Quote
I switch back and forth. Shockingly, using M&K does not feel like cheating. It's definitely better, though I feel like I am slightly worse at navigating laterally in complex envirornments.
Weapon choice makes a big difference, too. SMG run & gun is almost better with the dual shock while lasers, snipers, and especially scrambler pistols benefit greatly from a mouse's fine aiming. (Swarm Launchers obviously don't give a kitten either way.) |
Cade Orion
Tronhadar Free Guard
Minmatar Republic
27
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Posted - 2013.02.01 18:10:00 -
[46] - Quote
Let people play how they want to play. Dust 514 gives you the options to play with whatever controls you'd like to play with and that's advancement. Should there be matchmaking for controllers and keyboards - maybe, but that would depend on how much more of an advantage the mouse users have over the gaming controls. I have a mouse and keyboard I have bought just for use with this game, but haven't used it yet. Maybe I should plug it in and see how much difference there is. |
Gallus Sicarius
Isuuaya Tactical
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.02.01 19:01:00 -
[47] - Quote
Let people do what they want. As other have already said, M+KB doesn't really give anyone a big advantage, and if it did, you could just switch to M+KB yourself and everyone would be on an even playing field again. |
Jayquan18
The Southern Legion
42
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Posted - 2013.02.01 19:21:00 -
[48] - Quote
CarloArmato2991 wrote:I've played on PS3 for this last 3 years, but I was a PC gamer before.
I've tryed KB/M combo on Dust 514, but I can't see too much advantages: there are some issues that prevents Mouse&keyboards from being better than the DS3.
So no, I don't think that Mouse and Keyboard combo should be removed anyways.
I think CCP made a way were the KB/M won't be an advantage over the DS3. |
Johnny Starscream
DUST University
Ivy League
7
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Posted - 2013.02.01 19:21:00 -
[49] - Quote
I compared the two in battle. It takes roughly the same about of time (I measured 1.6 seconds) for me to do a full 360 with both KBM and DS3 (with sensitivity all the way up). I'm great with PC shooting games but they balanced the mouse sensitivity well enough so that I see no reason to ever use KBM over DS3. |
Jayquan18
The Southern Legion
42
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Posted - 2013.02.01 19:24:00 -
[50] - Quote
Johnny Starscream wrote:I compared the two in battle. It takes roughly the same about of time (I measured 1.6 seconds) for me to do a full 360 with both KBM and DS3 (with sensitivity all the way up). I'm great with PC shooting games but they balanced the mouse sensitivity well enough so that I see no reason to ever use KBM over DS3.
I'm glad CCP balanced it. |
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Aighun
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
666
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Posted - 2013.02.02 04:23:00 -
[51] - Quote
This thread is great fun. It is like when I first started playing the beta... but the opposite!
Water under the bridge. In the beginning I thought KBM implementation was a terrible idea.
Now, having played the game and gotten to know and like a number of KBM players I think it wasn't such a terrible idea after all.
I think CCP is doing a good enough job introducing such a wide variety of vehicles, weapons, and gear that no player is going to have a far reaching advantage in this game just because of their controller. If this game had a much narrower scope like COD then we would have a problem.
You can snipe more accurately with KBM. But you can tear it up much more easily in a drop ship or tank with controller. But that is just me.
I like to sit on a couch and use a controller. I think it is great that someone who likes to sit at a desk and use KBM can do so.
Edit* The OP makes a point that is empirically verifiable: it is just physically not possible to achieve the accuracy of pointing and clicking, I mean, aiming a reticle and shooting using a controller that you can using KBM. But misses something about Dust that is just much bigger than the controller wars. One player can't win this game. One weapon, or style of combat or dropsuit load out is not a game winner. There is already so much more to this game in teamwork and just getting a good balanced squad that works well together in your corp that controller becomes a side issue. Yeah, maybe if your only goal was to top the leader board in pub matches with the most kills while sniping, you could use KBM and get an advantage. And there is room in Dust for you to do that. Like I said before, there is enough stuff in this game that plays differently in enough ways to give any of the device options we can use the chance to be totally OP. Except maybe Move. Get to work on the Move! It looks fun. This is not only a console shooter, it is a PS 3 exclusive!
Dust is growing by the day and we can all play how we like. And I like that about this game. The more choices we give players, the more we can bring together players with different styles of gameplay and allow them all to kill each other using the toys they like best, the better. |
Olav Grey-Mane
The Exemplars
58
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Posted - 2013.02.02 04:26:00 -
[52] - Quote
Why? I enjoy using both. It sounds like you just don't like people who use keyboards and mice... there is really no difference, they may be better with them than you but that means your better with a controller.
I say keep the K&M for player choice. |
Erahk Manaan
Defiant Kelkoons
57
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Posted - 2013.02.02 04:28:00 -
[53] - Quote
M/KB does not provide any advantages that you yourself can not achieve. If you really think it is that much better go get a mouse and keyboard. |
Aighun
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
666
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 04:52:00 -
[54] - Quote
Poor sharp shooter/ move controller. Nobody loves you  |
Citrutex
The High and Mighty
64
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Posted - 2013.02.02 05:33:00 -
[55] - Quote
The only reason kb/m is not OP at this time is due to constantly low framerates.
Not trying to be condescending, and just kind of throwing it out there, but Quakelive does support mapping a console controller, I'm not very good, any vet can wipe the floor with me, and just about any modern computer/laptop can run it at acceptable framerates. I would love to see someone prove to me that a console controller can be just as competitive as a mouse and keyboard.
Doesn't even have to be a close match, just not a landslide would be acceptable proof. (not me, just some humorous videos i found, and to be fair, its hard to take someone with the name 'bongsmoker' seriously) |
Thrain Fireshield
BurgezzE.T.F
Orion Empire
2
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Posted - 2013.02.02 13:53:00 -
[56] - Quote
No.
Horrible idea. |
Axirts
Misfits of Mayhem
27
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Posted - 2013.02.02 15:19:00 -
[57] - Quote
I tried keyboard and mouse, couldn't do it. I still do way better than my friends who use keyboards and mice. And sniping is really easy if you set sensitivity right. I'm fine with how it is as long as the whole counterstrike community doesn't move here. |
Coleus Rattus
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
25
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Posted - 2013.02.02 16:27:00 -
[58] - Quote
Citrutex wrote:The only reason kb/m is not OP at this time is due to constantly low framerates. Not trying to be condescending, and just kind of throwing it out there, but Quakelive does support mapping a console controller, I'm not very good, any vet can wipe the floor with me, and just about any modern computer/laptop can run it at acceptable framerates. I would love to see someone prove to me that a console controller can be just as competitive as a mouse and keyboard. Doesn't even have to be a close match, just not a landslide would be acceptable proof. (not me, just some humorous videos i found, and to be fair, its hard to take someone with the name 'bongsmoker' seriously)
That comparison as a slight flaw: quakelive is a very fast paced game where you need to be very quick and very precise with your aim in addition to being very mobile to succeed.
Dust is much slower in comparison, and poitioning is much more important than speed. thus, while still at a disadvatage, it isn't as pronounced as in old tournament shooters like quake. |
Alexi Loken
Caldari Strategic Solutions
7
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Posted - 2013.02.02 17:57:00 -
[59] - Quote
This whole discussion has become a little silly and has gone a bit off topic in my opinion however I will throw my 2 ISK in.
The hardware should NOT dictate your skill level some people are good with DS3, M&K, or Move it just depends who you are and how much practice you put into your preferred control interface. I started Dust with DS3 and I got slaughtered because I was not good with it, then I switched over to my M&K then I was on par with others after that I did not become some gaming god. And I cannot speak for Move players because I do not have one.
The point being is that don't try to get things removed because those that use different hardware than you beat you because they are more experienced using it. |
Mars El'Theran
Red Rogue Squadron
Heart 0f Darkness
52
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Posted - 2013.02.02 19:17:00 -
[60] - Quote
Until keyboards can be remapped, I see the option of KbM as out of the question. Even with a mouse that responds properly, it still seems terribly awkward and I can seem to find certain things which are not listed in the controls menu. Can't recall which atm.
I still use controller, and feel the same way about Move as I do the KbM. It is terrible too. I'm a PC gamer mostly, but still find the KbM to be awkward in Dust, aside from that you can have a mouse and keyboard and more effectively communicate, plus use the mouse when you are sniping, (I don't do either), and still have the controller to use.
The fact that you need three peripherals to make this work is just a bit silly. Frankly, I don't think it is worth the bother, though I may pick up a keyboard later for typing. The other one is for my PC.
And, whatever the case, I see the implementation of all 3 of these control modes, including combinations of any of them, as acceptable. If they ever improve either or both of the KbM and Move alternatives, I may switch to one or the other, or at least test them out again.
Some players just work better with one or the other, and often that selection is not the controller, which it has honestly taken me months to even half get used too. |
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