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Sin3 DeusNomine
Doomheim
142
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 19:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
You ladies are objective players support!!!
What i am saying is that kdr is not more important then everything This is why.
You can not win a objective game sololy on kdr but you can get slaughtered and still win if you hold the objectives
you never take out vehicles cause thay would mean hurting your kdr. so you are willing to let the rest of your team get curb stomped if it means keeping a good kdr. a objective player will take out that vehicle so he can hack the point.
you will choose getting kills which leads you away from objectives so you either not defending it or capturing it when needed. objective player will secure capture and defend.
Yes you do make life easier for holding objectives. but really that is just a support role in objective games.
You increase the chances of winning. but without objective players you would never win.
so objective/support role players are actually the best. |
Ourors
Doomheim
130
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 19:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
the points distribution between objectives based play and "kill everyone, ignore objectives" based play is very nonsensical right now.
also, some kind of bonus for defending a point would be nice. i'm not sure why you don't get any points for stopping an enemy hack
of course, if SP was primarily passive gain, with only a little bit coming from active gain, we probably wouldn't have this problem since few people would be obsessed with getting SP |
Garma QUDA
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
468
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 19:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Why is it that the majority of people assume that players with great kdr arent playing the objectives ? |
Agnoeo
Jedi Knights.
35
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 19:55:00 -
[4] - Quote
I don't even care about people just going for a K/D ratio anymore. I'm not even that good and I somehow still maintain a positive K/D ratio, so I don't pay attention to it. That's what the death match maps are for anyways.
I've found my joy in life is harassing as many vehicles I can find, drawing their attention away from my team mates. Plus its such a joy destroying someone in a 300k+ tank. |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 19:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sin3 DeusNomine wrote:You ladies are objective players support!!!
What i am saying is that kdr is not more important then everything This is why.
You can not win a objective game sololy on kdr but you can get slaughtered and still win if you hold the objectives
you never take out vehicles cause thay would mean hurting your kdr. so you are willing to let the rest of your team get curb stomped if it means keeping a good kdr. a objective player will take out that vehicle so he can hack the point.
you will choose getting kills which leads you away from objectives so you either not defending it or capturing it when needed. objective player will secure capture and defend.
Yes you do make life easier for holding objectives. but really that is just a support role in objective games.
You increase the chances of winning. but without objective players you would never win.
so objective/support role players are actually the best. Wow.
This stereotype that killers can't hold an objective and kill everyone is so ******* dumb. You can't take an objective without killing people. fact
Killers with teamwork>circle holders with teamwork. Everyday all day. You can try and run as many different tactics as you want. When you are outplayed you are outplayed.
Killers are more important. A logi guy with a 5 kdr> A logi guy with a 1 kdr. I don't underestimate anyone but I have played enough FPS to now what works. Killers>cirlce holders. |
Quiverous
Dark Harlequin
37
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:02:00 -
[6] - Quote
+1
Unfortunately my kdr is poor, not because I go after objectives (because I do), but because I am terribad. Otherwise good advice by the OP. |
Ayures0
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
Crimson MoonV wrote:Wow.
This stereotype that killers can't hold an objective and kill everyone is so ******* dumb. You can't take an objective without killing people. fact
Killers with teamwork>circle holders with teamwork. Everyday all day. You can try and run as many different tactics as you want. When you are outplayed you are outplayed.
Killers are more important. A logi guy with a 5 kdr> A logi guy with a 1 kdr. I don't underestimate anyone but I have played enough FPS to now what works. Killers>cirlce holders. Yes, let's all run around like chickens with our heads cut off to try to get as many kills as possible and abandon our objectives so the enemy can flank us and take them. |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ayures0 wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote:Wow.
This stereotype that killers can't hold an objective and kill everyone is so ******* dumb. You can't take an objective without killing people. fact
Killers with teamwork>circle holders with teamwork. Everyday all day. You can try and run as many different tactics as you want. When you are outplayed you are outplayed.
Killers are more important. A logi guy with a 5 kdr> A logi guy with a 1 kdr. I don't underestimate anyone but I have played enough FPS to now what works. Killers>cirlce holders. Yes, let's all run around like chickens with our heads cut off to try to get as many kills as possible and abandon our objectives so the enemy can flank us and take them. Way to miss the point.
My point was killers with teamwork>circle holders with teamwork. The stereotype that killers don't ever take objectives is false. People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective. In competitive corp battle you will see what I mean. The team with the better killers/teamwork will win. If everyone in my corp has a 5.0 kdr then that means all my logi guys can kill and heal. They are not just useless cannon fodder that will run around healing people and dieing all the time.
I love how you people troll without even really understanding whats being said. Grow up.
Back in the day of the international mag champoinship, one squad of team USA beat 3 squads of PRO on defense. Sure they had tactics/teamwork and they were using it but we had the killers so we won.
No amount of teamwork will stop elite killers that are working together, if the other team can't match them in skill. |
Ayures0
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:27:00 -
[9] - Quote
Crimson MoonV wrote:Way to miss the point.
My point was killers with teamwork>circle holders with teamwork. The stereotype that killers don't ever take objectives is false. People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective. In competitive corp battle you will see what I mean. The team with the better killers/teamwork will win. If everyone in my corp has a 5.0 kdr then that means all my logi guys can kill and heal. They are not just useless cannon fodder that will run around healing people and dieing all the time.
I love how you people troll without even really understanding whats being said. Grow up.
Back in the day of the international mag champoinship, one squad of team USA beat 3 squads of PRO on defense. Sure they had tactics/teamwork and they were using it but we had the killers so we won.
No amount of teamwork will stop elite killers if the other team can't match them in skill. But we should never attempt to keep an objective when we take it? [edit] OK, I'm now assuming that you mean that logi players should be able to kill people as easily as an assault loadout and be able to stay alive as easily an assault dropsuit. It doesn't work that way. Filling those equipment slots takes a lot of CPU & PG. I haven't gotten to a proto logi suit yet, but with the Type A suit, there's no way in hell I can fit anything proto without going way over. You can have a fragile logi who can kill things and not support, or you can have a tanked logi who can't kill things or support, or you can have a logi who can support but you have to provide cover for and isn't going to get a lot of kills (ie the intended logistics role). We're not assault. We're not heavies. We're not recon. We're spacepriests. |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ayures0 wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote:Way to miss the point.
My point was killers with teamwork>circle holders with teamwork. The stereotype that killers don't ever take objectives is false. People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective. In competitive corp battle you will see what I mean. The team with the better killers/teamwork will win. If everyone in my corp has a 5.0 kdr then that means all my logi guys can kill and heal. They are not just useless cannon fodder that will run around healing people and dieing all the time.
I love how you people troll without even really understanding whats being said. Grow up.
Back in the day of the international mag champoinship, one squad of team USA beat 3 squads of PRO on defense. Sure they had tactics/teamwork and they were using it but we had the killers so we won.
No amount of teamwork will stop elite killers if the other team can't match them in skill. So we should never attempt to keep an objective when we take it? Not sure if stupid or trolling.
Let me rephrase it for the simple minded.
People try and justify being bad at fps by claiming support role. Support doesn't have to suck at fps. I want that 5.0 kdr logi guy watching my back and holding objectives rather then the logi guy that holds objectives and heals because he can't kill anyone.
I will be playing logi next build to prove to people that a great logi player can kill and heal. |
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Sin3 DeusNomine
Doomheim
142
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
Never said killers do not help or even do objectives. every once in awhile they will but if a killer might hurt his kdr he avoid them then. killers do not win games circle holders do. Unless your playing amnush. i do hold 3.5 kdr but when a circle holding oppertunity appears i go for it. And then get back to killing as i keep it secure. support build players are more likely capt that objective then pass it by.
Yes killers are important and make winning the game more possible but in the end circle holders are what win the game and are willing to get killed if they know it gets them there.
A good circle holder always clears objectives then capts or they are great at knowing when they can cap without the enemy noticing before it is to late.
So yes you are just support to the circle holder in the end. |
Garma QUDA
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
468
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
What about a circle holding killers? |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:42:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sin3 DeusNomine wrote:Never said killers do not help or even do objectives. every once in awhile they will but if a killer might hurt his kdr he avoid them then. killers do not win games circle holders do. Unless your playing amnush. i do hold 3.5 kdr but when a circle holding oppertunity appears i go for it. And then get back to killing as i keep it secure. support build players are more likely capt that objective then pass it by.
Yes killers are important and make winning the game more possible but in the end circle holders are what win the game and are willing to get killed if they know it gets them there.
A good circle holder always clears objectives then capts or they are great at knowing when they can cap without the enemy noticing before it is to late.
So yes you are just support to the circle holder in the end. Do you play logi? If not then you shouldn't be talking. You have a 3.5 kdr? Then you are a killer that holds the objective as well. You just proved my point.
circle holders that can't kill are cannon fodder. Killers that hold circle are good players. Killers that don't take objectives are tryhards.
Its not killers vs circle holders. Its good players vs tryhards.
Killers that do not tryhard and go for objectives>circle holders that can't kill anyone.
Not every killer is a tryhard.
Not every logi/circle holder is a terrible killer.
Break the mold people. |
Xocoyol Zaraoul
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Oh another silly troll thread about "This playstyle is the best and yours is the worst or the wrong way to play."
Just as you need snipers to clear the roofs, swarmers to keep vehicles at bay, and the circle holders to take objectives, you still need the mass-murderers to keep the enemy team from overwhelming the circle holders.
Every Dropsuit the "killers" take out is one less person competing and delaying the team, which is just as critical of a role as the dropship pilot who never fires off a shot but inserts a team to take an objective. |
Silax Minour
Doomheim
29
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:44:00 -
[15] - Quote
Sin3 DeusNomine wrote:You ladies are objective players support!!!
What i am saying is that kdr is not more important then everything This is why.
You can not win a objective game sololy on kdr but you can get slaughtered and still win if you hold the objectives
you never take out vehicles cause thay would mean hurting your kdr. so you are willing to let the rest of your team get curb stomped if it means keeping a good kdr. a objective player will take out that vehicle so he can hack the point.
you will choose getting kills which leads you away from objectives so you either not defending it or capturing it when needed. objective player will secure capture and defend.
Yes you do make life easier for holding objectives. but really that is just a support role in objective games.
You increase the chances of winning. but without objective players you would never win.
so objective/support role players are actually the best.
+1 I believe is the parlance used around here. |
Lurchasaurus
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
808
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:46:00 -
[16] - Quote
Just because someone has a high K/D doesnt mean they dont play the objective dude. It can be many reasons, such as the player is a pilot, or good with an assault rifle, or consistently plays with his friends. Either way, some people will have better ratios simply because their role is a more offensive role(i.e. my role, ima tank driver. i clear an area so my team can cap). Like i have said before, this game doesnt operate on the individual level. Corporations win battles, not mr. leet skillz |
Silax Minour
Doomheim
29
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
Agnoeo wrote:I don't even care about people just going for a K/D ratio anymore. I'm not even that good and I somehow still maintain a positive K/D ratio, so I don't pay attention to it. That's what the death match maps are for anyways.
I've found my joy in life is harassing as many vehicles I can find, drawing their attention away from my team mates. Plus its such a joy destroying someone in a 300k+ tank.
OH MAN am I with you on that! NOTHING feels as awesome to me as tossing a few well aimed MILITIA grenades and getting the +100 tank kill points and then icing the driver as he flees in terror... Dust kicks ass.
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Ayures0
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:53:00 -
[18] - Quote
Crimson MoonV wrote:Not every logi/circle holder is a terrible killer. If a logi player wants to be able to give good support, he's going to be a terrible killer. We can't have a strong enough weapon as well as a strong enough tank to go head-to-head with the enemy while still being able to give good support. We stay behind cover, throw nanohives/uplinks, rep, and revive (well, we will once we get the injector fix). Claiming that we're not as good at our role as you are at yours because maybe we go 3/5 instead of 22/0 is bullshit. Hell, some of my deaths are just because I'm distracting a tank or a turret so someone can get a good shot at it. I play to win the battle, not to pad my stats. |
Belzeebub Santana
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
409
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 20:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
Garma QUDA wrote:What about a circle holding killers?
What about a killer holding circle? Or A killer, holding circle? Or A holding circle killer? Or A circle killer, holding? |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:00:00 -
[20] - Quote
Ayures0 wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote:Not every logi/circle holder is a terrible killer. If a logi player wants to be able to give good support, he's going to be a terrible killer. We can't have a strong enough weapon as well as a strong enough tank to go head-to-head with the enemy while still being able to give good support. We stay behind cover, throw nanohives/uplinks, rep, and revive (well, we will once we get the injector fix). Claiming that we're not as good at our role as you are at yours because maybe we go 3/5 instead of 22/0 is bullshit. Hell, some of my deaths are just because I'm distracting a tank or a turret so someone can get a good shot at it. Exuses ftw
I have seen a logi guys get 7.0 kdr while still running around dropping nanohives and healing me after gun fights.
I have even met logi guys that have gave me a hard time in my full proto gear.
Any more exuses?
LOL 3/5 |
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Benjamin Hellios
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:06:00 -
[21] - Quote
Crimson MoonV wrote: People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective.
Pfff, I know right, what loser would try to win an objective based game by holding an objective? |
Ayures0
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:06:00 -
[22] - Quote
Crimson MoonV wrote:Exuses ftw
I have seen a logi guys get 7.0 kdr while still running around dropping nanohives and healing me after gun fights.
I have even met logi guys that have gave me a hard time in my full proto gear.
Any more exuses? I'm not in proto gear, and I'm guessing they are and are still using baseline logi equipment with a proto weapon. I will admit, though, that I'm not great at fighting a controller and auto-aim at the same time. I'm sure I'll get more kills once we get KB&M support. The 3/5 was an exaggeration, though; I usually have at least a 1.0 KDR and I'm often toward the top of the war point ranking (mostly due to support points), though not always. I'm guessing this will be more often once nanite injectors and suicides are fixed, though. |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:08:00 -
[23] - Quote
Benjamin Hellios wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote: People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective. Pfff, I know right, what loser would try to win an objective based game by holding an objective? I already rephrased that for the simple minded. Read before you post. Thx
Ayures, just wait until you get K/BM and a prototype logi suit. Its a beast. |
Ayures0
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
I'd still like to know what your problem with defending objectives is, though. What do you do? Run to an objective, hack it, and run to the next one to hack it? Do you just make a big circle as the enemy repeatedly retakes undefended objectives?
[edit] I'll take your word on the proto logi suit. I'm thinking a lot of my problem does stem from the fact that I'm not all proto'd out. A lot of my gear is a step or two below it (and ofc KB&M since this is the first console FPS I've actually played on a regular basis since Goldeneye). I still think you should recognize defensive tactics, though. =p |
Benjamin Hellios
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:13:00 -
[25] - Quote
Crimson MoonV wrote:Benjamin Hellios wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote: People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective. Pfff, I know right, what loser would try to win an objective based game by holding an objective? I already rephrased that for the simple minded. Read before you post. Thx Ayures, just wait until you get K/BM and a prototype logi suit. Its a beast.
I did, you said exactly the same thing; "If you don't have a high kdr, you suck at fps". And I'm saying there's more to this game than that. |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:23:00 -
[26] - Quote
Benjamin Hellios wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote:Benjamin Hellios wrote:Crimson MoonV wrote: People just try to justify being bad at fps by holding an objective. Pfff, I know right, what loser would try to win an objective based game by holding an objective? I already rephrased that for the simple minded. Read before you post. Thx Ayures, just wait until you get K/BM and a prototype logi suit. Its a beast. I did, you said exactly the same thing; "If you don't have a high kdr, you suck at fps". And I'm saying there's more to this game than that. If you can't kill anyone its gonna be really hard to take any objective. I'm sorry if I came off as an elitist *******. That wasn't my intentions.
Getting a good KDR as a logi player does show how good you are at the game. Getting a bad KD but helping out the team is cool and all. You did your job. You would be much more effective as a logi player that knows how to kill well though.
Nothing against people with low KDRs. |
Ayures0
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:25:00 -
[27] - Quote
What just happened to this thread. |
Crimson MoonV
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
658
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:28:00 -
[28] - Quote
Just because we have difference in opinion doesn't mean I don't <3 you. |
Benjamin Hellios
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:30:00 -
[29] - Quote
Good stuff |
Johnny Guilt
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
50
|
Posted - 2012.07.30 21:37:00 -
[30] - Quote
The high KDR players are indirectly playing objectives by killing players,that goes for anyone in a troops,tanks or dropships just wasting players, however direct objective capping would be anyone that would get off there ass to hack a CRU,ABC etc. kDR is just a small peace of the puzzle and high KDR may give the illusion of a actual good player,but what defines a good player aim,skill, intelligence, leadership,? |
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