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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
30060
|
Posted - 2016.06.09 11:14:00 -
[61] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Bright Cloud wrote:CCP LogicLoop wrote:Don't worry. I've been keeping my eye on this thread. =) And you probs gonna completely ignore the feedback regardless what people say. Shouldn't that have been a Dark Cloud post?
Isn't his TDC account permabanned?
Gentlemen. It has been a pleasure. o7
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13519
|
Posted - 2016.06.09 21:52:00 -
[62] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:
I think one of the biggest things that washes down CCP's socket system for you is the fact that it really didn't seem to have any tangible effect in most games. Most games had the main facility that would pretty much always be on the same terrain, and off in the outskirts of the map you had little outposts that would occasionally change. If CCP could find a better way to implement the socket idea. Make more maps 'more' modular, Kind of like what someone (maybe you) mentioned above with players having customizable ship map designs that would make it a bit more important for you.
[...]
OF COURSE performance should be the first thing to consider. CCP needs to make NOVA feel just as smooth and fluid as any of the AAA shooters today. Or at least as smooth as other shooters like CSGO, TF2, and PS2. Bugs need to be kept to a minimum and FPS needs to be a steady 30 FPS MINIMUM (30 is the absolute bottom out) with a 60 FPS optimal. They need to hammer that out because those issues were some of the biggest game breaking problems for so many of the new players back when the game was initially released.
That being said, Im happy to see logicloop being so active on the forums. Just the small amount of posts he's been making, I feel, has made a big impact on a lot of peoples mindsets for the new game!
I agree. That might be why it didn't matter to me. And it didn't help that the large, medium, and small sockets were static as well meaning they didn't have any moving parts. No cranes moving, no doors opening or closing, etc. There was just no way to effect the map other than to just blob the opponents and spam uplinks all over the place.
As for the stability of Project Nova, CCP Rattati and CCP Frame mentioned on at least one of the interviews that they are aiming for a consistent 60 CCP Frames per second. And that is just for starters. It is extremely likely that it's because most PC players expect at least 60 frames per second on the games they play especially competitive PC gamers who see that every little frame counts.
And finally, I'm also happy to see CCP Logicloop back in action.
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13519
|
Posted - 2016.06.09 22:13:00 -
[63] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:HOLY CRAP! I JUST HAD A GREAT IDEA FOR NOVA! AND FOR EVE ONLINE!
One of the biggest issues for EVE online is how much money is created vs how much money is lost in the game. Basically, prices have been inflating massively the last couple of years in EVE. This idea is, in my opinion, a potentially good and innovative way to create an isk sink in EVE while also providing a dynamic and tangible eve/nova link that (in theory) shouldn't be too hard to create.
Everyone who plays eve knows about concord and how they absolutely decimate anyone who breaks the rules in high sec. Depending on the local security level, Concord will show up in 30 seconds max, and immediately incapacitate your ship via EWAR, then one shot it a second later.
So, what if instead of destroying the eve player's ship, Concord just EWAR's it then forces it to warp off to some secret CCP wormhole or wherever and then promptly puts a contract up on EVE-Nova for Nova mercs to land on the ship and infiltrate/secure it. Who do the Nova Mercs fight against? Easy answer, one of two things, Either NPC Drones that can be "on board security" for these ships, OR other Nova Mercs that the NPC Pirate factions (like angel cartel or serpentis) contracted to also invade/secure the ship from Concord. Heck, EVE players could even create their own contracts to capture back their own ships.
So why would this benefit EVE players? If Concord is able to secure the ship from the onboard defenses/competing factions, they can then take that ship and re-sell it on the player market VIA an open bidding system/contract with the name of the old ship and its former owner being public information. This benefits eve players because pirates might be able to buy back their ships from Concord for sentimental reasons, or it might give unique trading opportunities to other players looking to make extra isk. All the while, CCP creates a giant isk sink because of how much money people would be paying into Concord or other NPC factions.
So why would Nova players benefit from this? It gives them a tangible effect on EVE. It could be used as a way to get loyalty points for NPC factions. It could also be used as a good social tool between EVE/Nova players. It also checks the box of Nova players boarding EVE ships and capturing them that so many people wanted WITHOUT the technical/game mechanic issues involved with having all of that done live during a space battle. If all of this occurs in the "safe" space of an non playable area where only CCP and NPC factions can see then it creates a much easier way to pull this off from a game development point of view.
THE ONLY drawback to this idea that I can see is that CCP would need to design a map for pretty much every ship. One way or another Im positive every type of ship in game has been destroyed (or hopefully one day captured) by Concord. So theres really not a lot of ways around that. Lore/mechanically Concord would just have to say "were not interested in aqcuiring these types of ships yet" to explain lore wise why there aren't any maps for most ships right away, but thats a completely different topic.
Anyway, what do you guys think of that idea? I know I wrote a lot but the idea really is a simple one. It seems like a perfect way to have ship boardings/ captures while avoiding all of the giant gameplay implications having a ship boarding feature in a real EVE battle would create. Its also potentially a massive ISK sink for EVE as a whole which is always welcome in my opinion.
Interesting idea indeed. Although I think I will have to disagree on the part about too much ISK going into the Eve Online economy. CCP just recently posted their Monthly Economic Report for May 2016.
Source: https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/monthly-economic-report-may-2016/
Pay particular attention to this one graph. http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70343/1/9a_sinksfaucets.png
If I understand this graph correctly, the ISK sink is actually bigger than the faucet. Please correct me if I'm wrong about that. So I don't think Eve is suffer from inflation.
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TheD1CK
Dead Man's Game Preatoriani
3412
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Posted - 2016.06.10 11:51:00 -
[64] - Quote
The interior gameplay seen so far is cool... IF!
It is only a part of the package, such as smaller team public matches - added gamemodes but the real cheery on top would be if it directly affects Eve, and rather than have us running about pewpewing on a ship.. we are literally fighting to defend/destroy it via another Eve ship deploying the clones in attack.. The videos seens os far, have 2 uses.. TDM modes.. or Raiding.. as a side dish to the main course....
OPEN planet fighting.
If we had for example, defenders owning the entire map "Line Harvest" while the attackers spawn from "Manus peak" with a stretch of open land in between, maybe even outposts scattered in this area for added AA/AV turret defence.. WOW
Logicloop is the only one I'd trust to give opinions on what can be done here.. but at the end of the day, my concern is that we have more reasons to fight, more options on how to fight.. and move as far away from the bland lobby shooter we had and onto the immersive battles we all signed up for when Dust514 began....
*sigh* 4 years later, the dreams still haunt me
Pub chat "DeadMansGame"
Squads, rage, trolls, Qsyncs, CARNAGE.. and stuff.
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TheD1CK
Dead Man's Game Preatoriani
3412
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Posted - 2016.06.10 11:58:00 -
[65] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:Bright Cloud wrote:CCP LogicLoop wrote:Don't worry. I've been keeping my eye on this thread. =) And you probs gonna completely ignore the feedback regardless what people say. Shouldn't that have been a Dark Cloud post? Isn't his TDC account permabanned?
Surely
TDC makes a LOT of valid points.. Just lacks the required manner to get them across
It is a shame though, I relate to it, after this long giving anything other than bitter feedback is tough, because many of us have tried.. only to see the opposite take shape, so it has burnt out 90% of the dedicated players who have a say...
The walls listen more, so we just rant like the crazy people we are
Don't take it personally LL, some of the sh!tposting makes sense and depending how you see it, is justified. And some of the best posting.. Has been so far from the reality of what happens in game.. is madness
Good luck wading through it!
Pub chat "DeadMansGame"
Squads, rage, trolls, Qsyncs, CARNAGE.. and stuff.
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
22495
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Posted - 2016.06.10 13:23:00 -
[66] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:
EDIT: By the way, Eve Online still has that one feature where Faction Warfare systems can still be affected by Dust 514 battles. Obviously no one is playing Dust anymore but the feature is still there regardless. Considering the level of connectivity Dust had with Eve, I can see FW still being one of the first cross-game features if that were to ever happen.
Sadly you know as well as I do that the Dust 514 FW system was not a very good one at all and hardly representative of militia effort as a whole and merely of individual fights at 30 minute intervals on random planets in systems no sane eve player cared about.
Waves that dye the land gold.
Blessed breath to nurture life in a land of wheat.
A path the Sef descend drawn in ash.
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13520
|
Posted - 2016.06.10 21:12:00 -
[67] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:
EDIT: By the way, Eve Online still has that one feature where Faction Warfare systems can still be affected by Dust 514 battles. Obviously no one is playing Dust anymore but the feature is still there regardless. Considering the level of connectivity Dust had with Eve, I can see FW still being one of the first cross-game features if that were to ever happen.
Sadly you know as well as I do that the Dust 514 FW system was not a very good one at all and hardly representative of militia effort as a whole and merely of individual fights at 30 minute intervals on random planets in systems no sane eve player cared about.
Here is hoping Project Nova can improve upon that. At the very least later down the road after Nova has established its own foundation there needs to be tools in place that enable both Capsuleers and Mercenaries to better coordinate. Eve players should be able to know in advance which planet the next battle will take place while having, by default, a direct line of communication with the ground troops.
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
22495
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Posted - 2016.06.11 00:32:00 -
[68] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:True Adamance wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:
EDIT: By the way, Eve Online still has that one feature where Faction Warfare systems can still be affected by Dust 514 battles. Obviously no one is playing Dust anymore but the feature is still there regardless. Considering the level of connectivity Dust had with Eve, I can see FW still being one of the first cross-game features if that were to ever happen.
Sadly you know as well as I do that the Dust 514 FW system was not a very good one at all and hardly representative of militia effort as a whole and merely of individual fights at 30 minute intervals on random planets in systems no sane eve player cared about. Here is hoping Project Nova can improve upon that. At the very least later down the road after Nova has established its own foundation there needs to be tools in place that enable both Capsuleers and Mercenaries to better coordinate. Eve players should be able to know in advance which planet the next battle will take place while having, by default, a direct line of communication with the ground troops.
No. The option to choose specific systems to attack needs to make it into the game. We'll never have real value otherwise.
Waves that dye the land gold.
Blessed breath to nurture life in a land of wheat.
A path the Sef descend drawn in ash.
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ceb bou
WarRavens Imperium Eden
5
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Posted - 2016.06.11 00:53:00 -
[69] - Quote
A cool mode to add in (as a private match instead of public) would be 4v4 squad fights to show other squads who is boss. In Eve superiority is shown in your history of how good you do, so having a small map to demonstrate your skills against other squads would either make you look like a more desirable player to have in a Planetary Conquest or a less capable player. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13523
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 00:55:00 -
[70] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:
No. The option to choose specific systems to attack needs to make it into the game. We'll never have real value otherwise.
Why not couple your idea with mine? Let ground troops decide where to fight and then let the system send out a message to affected faction players in Eve of the incoming ground battle.
EDIT: Fixed a bad quote.
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Derpty Derp
Dead Man's Game
1432
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 01:21:00 -
[71] - Quote
True Adamance wrote: No. The option to choose specific systems to attack needs to make it into the game. We'll never have real value otherwise.
As much as I would love to see a game that has a real impact on the Eve Universe... That kind of connection can't be allowed in from the start, because they can't possibly risk screwing up the whole place with an untested game.
It's gotta start small and work its way up slowly... We all know what happens when CCP make a load of big changes in one go. |
Marston VC
SVER True Blood RUST415
1858
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 01:29:00 -
[72] - Quote
Another thing ccp needs to keep an eye on is player incentive on the eve side to participate, once we do go back to planetary conquest, nova corps that own a planet, or districts on a planet should be able to have a direct impact on eve players PI, be able to boost production but also set their own tax rates and have other tangible effects. Make it so that nova players can produce nova only items that have benefits to various eve things.
Of course, not huge impacts. Soft buffs like specialized modules that have slightly better stats then other items, or passive regional bonuses that reduce Corp/alliance members market broker fees if nova players own the planet a station is near. Small passive benefits that would get a lot of push from the filthy rich eve players that actually care about those small differences.
Dust didn't have these things. On top of that, eve didn't have any real connection to dust. You could have a 100 man fleet over a planet in dust, but only be able to launch 1 orbital every once in a while??? Come on! Instead of one big orbital, make it so that all those ships can shoot multiple small scale orbitals, and make it so that a commander in the MCC is in control of all of them rather then each squad leader! Also, give reasonable bounties to eve players who assist in orbital kills! These seem like soft features that wouldn't destroy any eve ecosystem but would instead create a positive atmosphere for cross game cooperation! Just my idea a though. I'm only posting this here because logic loop said he would be keeping an eye on this thread!
Marston VC, STB Director
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13523
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 01:34:00 -
[73] - Quote
Derpty Derp wrote:True Adamance wrote: No. The option to choose specific systems to attack needs to make it into the game. We'll never have real value otherwise.
As much as I would love to see a game that has a real impact on the Eve Universe... That kind of connection can't be allowed in from the start, because they can't possibly risk screwing up the whole place with an untested game. It's gotta start small and work its way up slowly... We all know what happens when CCP make a load of big changes in one go.
I'm pretty sure True and I understand that ideas involving this much connectivity are likely not going to be implemented for a very long time anyways given what we previously experienced with Dust 514 and where CCP wants to start off first with Nova.
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood RUST415
1858
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 01:40:00 -
[74] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Marston VC wrote:HOLY CRAP! I JUST HAD A GREAT IDEA FOR NOVA! AND FOR EVE ONLINE!
One of the biggest issues for EVE online is how much money is created vs how much money is lost in the game. Basically, prices have been inflating massively the last couple of years in EVE. This idea is, in my opinion, a potentially good and innovative way to create an isk sink in EVE while also providing a dynamic and tangible eve/nova link that (in theory) shouldn't be too hard to create.
Everyone who plays eve knows about concord and how they absolutely decimate anyone who breaks the rules in high sec. Depending on the local security level, Concord will show up in 30 seconds max, and immediately incapacitate your ship via EWAR, then one shot it a second later.
So, what if instead of destroying the eve player's ship, Concord just EWAR's it then forces it to warp off to some secret CCP wormhole or wherever and then promptly puts a contract up on EVE-Nova for Nova mercs to land on the ship and infiltrate/secure it. Who do the Nova Mercs fight against? Easy answer, one of two things, Either NPC Drones that can be "on board security" for these ships, OR other Nova Mercs that the NPC Pirate factions (like angel cartel or serpentis) contracted to also invade/secure the ship from Concord. Heck, EVE players could even create their own contracts to capture back their own ships.
So why would this benefit EVE players? If Concord is able to secure the ship from the onboard defenses/competing factions, they can then take that ship and re-sell it on the player market VIA an open bidding system/contract with the name of the old ship and its former owner being public information. This benefits eve players because pirates might be able to buy back their ships from Concord for sentimental reasons, or it might give unique trading opportunities to other players looking to make extra isk. All the while, CCP creates a giant isk sink because of how much money people would be paying into Concord or other NPC factions.
So why would Nova players benefit from this? It gives them a tangible effect on EVE. It could be used as a way to get loyalty points for NPC factions. It could also be used as a good social tool between EVE/Nova players. It also checks the box of Nova players boarding EVE ships and capturing them that so many people wanted WITHOUT the technical/game mechanic issues involved with having all of that done live during a space battle. If all of this occurs in the "safe" space of an non playable area where only CCP and NPC factions can see then it creates a much easier way to pull this off from a game development point of view.
THE ONLY drawback to this idea that I can see is that CCP would need to design a map for pretty much every ship. One way or another Im positive every type of ship in game has been destroyed (or hopefully one day captured) by Concord. So theres really not a lot of ways around that. Lore/mechanically Concord would just have to say "were not interested in aqcuiring these types of ships yet" to explain lore wise why there aren't any maps for most ships right away, but thats a completely different topic.
Anyway, what do you guys think of that idea? I know I wrote a lot but the idea really is a simple one. It seems like a perfect way to have ship boardings/ captures while avoiding all of the giant gameplay implications having a ship boarding feature in a real EVE battle would create. Its also potentially a massive ISK sink for EVE as a whole which is always welcome in my opinion. Interesting idea indeed. Although I think I will have to disagree on the part about too much ISK going into the Eve Online economy. CCP just recently posted their Monthly Economic Report for May 2016. Source: https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/monthly-economic-report-may-2016/Pay particular attention to this one graph. http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70343/1/9a_sinksfaucets.pngIf I understand this graph correctly, the ISK sink is actually bigger than the faucet. Please correct me if I'm wrong about that. So I don't think Eve is suffer from inflation. EDIT: By the way, Eve Online still has that one feature where Faction Warfare systems can still be affected by Dust 514 battles. Obviously no one is playing Dust anymore but the feature is still there regardless. Considering the level of connectivity Dust had with Eve, I can see FW still being one of the first cross-game features if that were to ever happen.
Perhaps my isk sink theory is out of date, regardless it would still give ccp an excuse to have us take over ships and introduce the concept into the game! And yes, faction warfare is a great idea if they can find a way to link it stronger to dust. An idea I just came up with for that would be similar to the hard point game mode in call of duty with some small twists.
Make it so that faction warfare in eve, for whatever reason, has to follow along the path of nova players fighting battles on one specific planet/system of planets at a time.
How this works:
The computer drops all nova players in matches at a "neutral"/contested solar system in eve. The eve players, for an undecided game mechanic right now, have to/are encouraged to follow the solar system the nova players are concentrated. Depending on the outcomes of the nova players battles, the system for the next "hot spot" will change deeper into either factions space depending on who won the ground battle in nova.
This in my opinion would make faction warfare in eve a lot more lively AND give nova players a cool interaction too. Of course, make it so that if your faction owns space you have a lot more opportunity on the ground side too.
Basically the possibilities are endless!
Marston VC, STB Director
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13527
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 16:25:00 -
[75] - Quote
I just realized something. This whole time we were talking about Nova's connectivity with Nova while ignoring the fact that this thread is mainly about Nova Maps and PC gameplay. I think we should get back to that original topic.
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood RUST415
1858
|
Posted - 2016.06.11 17:27:00 -
[76] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:I just realized something. This whole time we were talking about Nova's connectivity with Nova while ignoring the fact that this thread is mainly about Nova Maps and PC gameplay. I think we should get back to that original topic.
The topic of nova/eve connectivity is very important as far as map design and setting selection goes in my opinion ;)
But yeah, I love the idea of ships in eve if they can make them dynamic with opening and closing corridors and such. Perhaps control panels that teammates can activate would open and close different doors. My only warning to logic loop here is to take special care that these ship maps have a balanced amount of CQC and long range combat spaces. According to the demo there will be at least minmatar snipers. So it's important to have at least some level of map balance to accommodate these different play styles.
Dust was actually pretty decent with map balance. (With some noted exceptions) so I expect it to be more or less the same with nova. Hopefully with unreal engine 4 and being on PC, having a more dynamic/changing map will be possible.
One idea I have would be to have planetary shields. Basically the shields would stop any attacker from being able to use orbitals until the ground troops can take over the "shield control room". This type of map design/features would be perfect for a game mode like skirmish 1.0. It would also make a clear difference between being on attack and on defense
Marston VC, STB Director
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13528
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Posted - 2016.06.11 17:40:00 -
[77] - Quote
What about Warbarges? Every Dust merc had one and there use to be plans for corporations to have one. Those warbarges are so large that you can fit 2-3 MCCs in its hangar. Imagine the fights in that for control of each other's barges.
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Mobius Wyvern
Night Theifs Curatores Veritatis Alliance
8213
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Posted - 2016.06.11 22:35:00 -
[78] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:What about Warbarges? Every Dust merc had one and there use to be plans for corporations to have one. Those warbarges are so large that you can fit 2-3 MCCs in its hangar. Imagine the fights in that for control of each other's barges. Personally I think there's no question as far as those being in the game. I would consider Warbarge raids to be an essential feature.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood RUST415
1858
|
Posted - 2016.06.12 18:09:00 -
[79] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:What about Warbarges? Every Dust merc had one and there use to be plans for corporations to have one. Those warbarges are so large that you can fit 2-3 MCCs in its hangar. Imagine the fights in that for control of each other's barges.
Speaking of MCC's wouldn't it be cool if they had something like battlefields 2142 Titan mode? Where the game ends when one team takes control of the map then invades the opposing MCC and captures it? That feature alone would have made dust seem a lot more cool
Marston VC, STB Director
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13531
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Posted - 2016.06.12 19:31:00 -
[80] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:What about Warbarges? Every Dust merc had one and there use to be plans for corporations to have one. Those warbarges are so large that you can fit 2-3 MCCs in its hangar. Imagine the fights in that for control of each other's barges. Speaking of MCC's wouldn't it be cool if they had something like battlefields 2142 Titan mode? Where the game ends when one team takes control of the map then invades the opposing MCC and captures it? That feature alone would have made dust seem a lot more cool
I can imagine Project Nova becoming an ode or tribute to the previous games that people enjoyed like BF 2142 and MAG. Especially MAG.
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Mobius Wyvern
Night Theifs Curatores Veritatis Alliance
8216
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Posted - 2016.06.14 16:06:00 -
[81] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Marston VC wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:What about Warbarges? Every Dust merc had one and there use to be plans for corporations to have one. Those warbarges are so large that you can fit 2-3 MCCs in its hangar. Imagine the fights in that for control of each other's barges. Speaking of MCC's wouldn't it be cool if they had something like battlefields 2142 Titan mode? Where the game ends when one team takes control of the map then invades the opposing MCC and captures it? That feature alone would have made dust seem a lot more cool I can imagine Project Nova becoming an ode or tribute to the previous games that people enjoyed like BF 2142 and MAG. Especially MAG. I would say especially BF2142, but I never actually played M.A.G.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
13544
|
Posted - 2016.06.14 21:22:00 -
[82] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:I would say especially BF2142, but I never actually played M.A.G.
I recall a lot of M.A.G. players came over from that game to enjoy Dust for two reasons.
1. M.A.G. was shutting down at the time. 2. Dust 514 was hyped by CCP at the time (again, no promises made) saying that they hoped to one day have about 128 players fighting against each other in a single battle. Probably to try to emulate Eve Online's epic battles.
EDIT: I forgot there was a third reason. M.A.G. Tribute dropsuits which came later on. SVR, Raven, and I forgot what the third one was.
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