DUST Search - BPOs have ruined this game.

Proto Annihilator wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

JIMvc2 wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

Dust =/= Eve

The amount of crap we destroyed in our own isk rivals eve's entire economy just to give an idea.

Can you provide more information on that ? <--- Im serious lol
I like to go over data

You deserve that much.

The economy of eve and dust are two entirely seperate monsters.

Eve is an eeconomy based on item generation and destruction. The holy trinity of this is creation, possession, and destruction.

Remove or disportionate any of those and you destroy the eve economy.

This further evolves the game play into the realm of being highly efficent with what little equipment you may have. Some players can indeed lose 10-20-30 ships in a sitting but they generally do it for greater gains to buy 60 ships so to say.

Dust in spirit shares this but there is one massive major factor not accounted for.

Location.

Dust 514 magically teleports all of its items where capsuleeer have to manually ship them.

Without the means of location in dust 514 right now our economic model is somewhat too superior if we where to be placed in to the new eden soup as such.

This facilitates our ability to die as much as 30 times in a single 15 minute span where an eve player would struggle to keep up in a similar manner unless he's an idiot undocking from his home station in shuttles.

I'm pretty sure he wanted numbers.

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Proto Annihilator 16 Vandals 232	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:01:00 - [31] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected lol
Boundless Kin Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:03:00 - [32] - Quote What's really going on "tinfoil hat"
JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game RUST415 450	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:10:00 - [33] - Quote CCP should make them stronger, but add the resources to produce them, and add a salvage gamemode where these items usually drop, but not in great numbers the better the bpo the more resources it requires. The faction faction bpo's should be the best Kallakiota ect with the limited time bpo's like templar up there aswell. Caldari Loyalist Why should infrantry that don't own vehicles, that can't balance their own mechanics, balance vehicles
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 11040	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:13:00 - [34] - Quote The two economies are not likely to merge anyways unless CCP does change their mind (which they have before). If they change their mind, and the BPOs do get changed, then CCP will need to refund the AUR on all of them if they are removed from the inventory of players. If removed from inventory, a bunch of players, like me, who have spent just about 100 AUR per BPO back in the early days before the prices were jacked up, stand to gain a ridiculous amount of FREE AURUM which will be the equivalent of CCP hemorrhaging money and thus could hurt Dust development due to loss of revenue as a result. Even if the BPOs are just modified to Eve standards and never removed, they will likely have to be refunded anyways as there are many players who bought them specifically because of the ability to not spend ISK on them. They never spent them just because of the looks. Also, Templar suits would have to be refunded and those don't cost AUR. They cost actual real-world cash to get as you can only acquire them from the Eve: The Second Decade Collector's Edition box set from their Eve Online website. Not to mention that the codes for these Templar items were traded away for ISK with other players and thus they will be affected. So how will they be reimbursed if they didn't pay cash for it? Who gets reimbursed? The buyer or the seller? The alternative would be to just stop selling BPOs directly -- with the exception of the LP variant APEX suits and other BPOs that can be acquired through some in-game grinding -- while letting the current owners keep the BPOs they have 'AS IS' without any modifications. Boosters and other AUR consumables seem to be something of a stable revenue source since players will always have to replenish those. Especially boosters that are 7-30 days long. I have yet to see anyone salvage an LP booster at this stage. Rolling over the Daily Missions and the EOM instant boost seem to be another stable revenue source. Warbarge Components, not so much considering you can grind for the components as either salvage, Daily Missions, or in strongboxes so there is not much incentive to spend AUR on them unless you are really that impatient for something that is so passive. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game RUST415 450	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:16:00 - [35] - Quote JARREL THOMAS wrote: CCP should make them stronger, but add the resources to produce them, and add a salvage gamemode where these items usually drop, but not in great numbers the better the bpo the more resources it requires. The faction faction bpo's should be the best Kallakiota ect with the limited time bpo's like templar up there aswell. Oh and this should only occur after the game is balanced and making money off of it self and has a good average playerbase. Caldari Loyalist Why should infrantry that don't own vehicles, that can't balance their own mechanics, balance vehicles
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 1014	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:18:00 - [36] - Quote APEX suits help: -Players looking to grind ISK in pubs -CCP looking to increase revenue -This entire community through CCP having more development money I really don't see a downside to them. I don't mind seeing "standardized" racial fits in pubs and FW, with players still having every option in the world to make far better customized fits. They are good enough that a lot of players would want to use them, but not good enough that they are anywhere near OP. You really want to bankrupt newberries in pubs that bad that you think they should be removed? You want to hurt someones wallet then play a competitive game mode like PC where you'll never ever see a BPO of any type. Who cares what some sniper has to say. CCP, let's push for the license of Dust/Legion on both current Gen consoles!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17193	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:22:00 - [37] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected Dat IWS is low. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
TritusX PH4NT0M5 307	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:23:00 - [38] - Quote Eh. I need money, and don't feel like losing 500k a match just because a squad decides that they want to feel better that day. Killer of Grand Master Kubo by a shotgun, Gav by a BAR, and countless others
JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game RUST415 450	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:24:00 - [39] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected lol Caldari Loyalist Why should infrantry that don't own vehicles, that can't balance their own mechanics, balance vehicles
LOOKMOM NOHANDS Warpoint Sharx 28	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:26:00 - [40] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Says someone who is only told what CCP wants him to hear and is bound by NDA to not share any of that.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 11040	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:30:00 - [41] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected Damn, Darth Vader. There's not enough ice on Hoth to cool that burn. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 11040	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:34:00 - [42] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: APEX suits help: -Players looking to grind ISK in pubs -CCP looking to increase revenue -This entire community through CCP having more development money I really don't see a downside to them. I don't mind seeing "standardized" racial fits in pubs and FW, with players still having every option in the world to make far better customized fits. They are good enough that a lot of players would want to use them, but not good enough that they are anywhere near OP. You really want to bankrupt newberries in pubs that bad that you think they should be removed? You want to hurt someones wallet then play a competitive game mode like PC where you'll never ever see a BPO of any type. Now that you mention that, I don't recall ever using a BPO suit or module in a PC match. They just couldn't compete with full-proto players stomping each other. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Proto Annihilator 16 Vandals 234	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:34:00 - [43] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected Damn, Darth Vader. There's not enough ice on Hoth to cool that burn. Is it a burn? I thought he was insulting his own position as our representative. Maybe getting elected is the only way one can claim to know something but not actually have to prove it.
LOOKMOM NOHANDS Warpoint Sharx 29	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:34:00 - [44] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected Damn, Darth Vader. There's not enough ice on Hoth to cool that burn. This is why the CPM system was a bad idea for Dust. Players just trolling by holding information over peoples' heads is just cheered on. Absolutely zero accountability.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18706	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:40:00 - [45] - Quote LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Enlighten me Get Elected Damn, Darth Vader. There's not enough ice on Hoth to cool that burn. This is why the CPM system was a bad idea for Dust. Players just trolling by holding information over peoples' heads is just cheered on. Absolutely zero accountability. Or maybe I am saying that your unhealthy assumptions is making an ass out of you and me. CPM supposed to represent the player base Not CCP. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17195	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:42:00 - [46] - Quote LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Says someone who is only told what CCP wants him to hear and is bound by NDA to not share any of that. Yup that about summarised the nature of the job....oh and the unadulterated hatred of hundreds of people for a reason that is largely beyond their control.....doing a fair amount of work for 0 pay.\ Your point? "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
LOOKMOM NOHANDS Warpoint Sharx 29	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:43:00 - [47] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: This is why the CPM system was a bad idea for Dust. Players just trolling by holding information over peoples' heads is just cheered on. Absolutely zero accountability. Or maybe I am saying that your unhealthy assumptions is making an ass out of you and me. CPM supposed to represent the player base Not CCP. This is hardly the place to argue over representation but I will point out that I never said if I agreed or disagreed with OP or the quoted statement. The only assumption made here was by YOU.
Proto Annihilator 16 Vandals 234	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:45:00 - [48] - Quote True Adamance wrote: LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Says someone who is only told what CCP wants him to hear and is bound by NDA to not share any of that. Yup that about summarised the nature of the job....oh and the unadulterated hatred of hundreds of people for a reason that is largely beyond their control.....doing a fair amount of work for 0 pay.\ Your point? Why did you never make CPM? I'd have voted for you. You're kind of snobbish but it befits our race.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17195	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:48:00 - [49] - Quote Proto Annihilator wrote: True Adamance wrote: LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: BPOS are back precisely because the economies will never be merged. It's a way to keep the servers going while CCP fulfill their legal obligations. says someone who has no idea what is really going on. Says someone who is only told what CCP wants him to hear and is bound by NDA to not share any of that. Yup that about summarised the nature of the job....oh and the unadulterated hatred of hundreds of people for a reason that is largely beyond their control.....doing a fair amount of work for 0 pay.\ Your point? Why did you never make CPM? I'd have voted for you. You're kind of snobbish but it befits our race. Because you honestly DO NOT WANT ME on the CPM. All I am is a snarky, snobbish (as you said) tanker who can't quite seem to break away from the forums....not to mention I'd lobby to make this game... Dust 514: Empress Edition, Bow DOWN MINMATAR SLAVES CUZ AMARR ROCK SUPERLEET420BLAZINTANKSRPROUSCRUBZ ..beyond that I don't have time and there are people far better suited out there in plain sight. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 1563	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:48:00 - [50] - Quote LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: This is why the CPM system was a bad idea for Dust. Players just trolling by holding information over peoples' heads is just cheered on. Absolutely zero accountability. Or maybe I am saying that your unhealthy assumptions is making an ass out of you and me. CPM supposed to represent the player base Not CCP. This is hardly the place to argue over representation but I will point out that I never said if I agreed or disagreed with OP or the quoted statement. The only assumption made here was by YOU. I assume youre a pedantic little asswipe who feels butthurt because a privately owned corporation isn't sharing trivial details that have no immediate urgency towards it's product or services. Boy i sure did make am a.ss outta you and me. ..except i don't care. In favor of removing vehicles only so Spkr quits everything.

jane stalin Ametat Security Amarr Empire 185	Posted - 2015.02.22 20:49:00 - [51] - Quote I think a better fix would be to have a game mode that gives a big reward if KDR is high and punishes suicidal play with longer spawn times, I can see how someone who can actually shoot would want that. I cannot shoot so without APEXs I would just buy cheap race packs instead which have 200 or 300 advanced suits and 200 or 300 proto suits and gear I would have much better suits that I could tailor for my gameplay and specific parts of specific maps, You can effectively buy suits considerably better than an APEX for about 3 cents and if you actually spend the ISK you win from each battle it is about 1.5 cents.
Byozuma Kegawa Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 411	Posted - 2015.02.22 21:08:00 - [52] - Quote BPOs don't make you suicidal, being a bad player does. Though being a logistics doesn't help. I run a BPO suit with BPO weapons (Templar logistics, Templar scrambler rifle and pistol respectively) with complex mods and advanced tools. Saving isk is part of why I run them because being a big yellow target tends to get one killed. Alot. Am I suicidal? Hell no, but when I'm sitting in the back of a squad dropping the heals, who do you think is going to get shot at first? Now, when in Faction I will run Faction suits because it's Faction, but even then I measure my life in seconds than minutes because, still, I'm a big yellow target. If I can save some isk in random matches, I will.
LOOKMOM NOHANDS Warpoint Sharx 29	Posted - 2015.02.22 21:36:00 - [53] - Quote Soldner VonKuechle wrote: LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: This is why the CPM system was a bad idea for Dust. Players just trolling by holding information over peoples' heads is just cheered on. Absolutely zero accountability. Or maybe I am saying that your unhealthy assumptions is making an ass out of you and me. CPM supposed to represent the player base Not CCP. This is hardly the place to argue over representation but I will point out that I never said if I agreed or disagreed with OP or the quoted statement. The only assumption made here was by YOU. I assume youre a pedantic little asswipe who feels butthurt because a privately owned corporation isn't sharing trivial details that have no immediate urgency towards it's product or services. Boy i sure did make am a.ss outta you and me. ..except i don't care. Aww running to the troll's defense that is cute. I could not give less of a ** what CCP shares. I only care to point out broken being broken **. I will give credit to the current CPM of actually making progress but I still argue that the system which they are part of should not exist as it does.
Edau Skir2 Nefantar Raiders 572	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:05:00 - [54] - Quote Soldner VonKuechle wrote: Edau Skir2 wrote: Makuta Miserix wrote: Just wanted to chime in and say that BPO's add the equivalent ISK to their BPC counterparts to the ISK pool, last I heard. So no, BPO's are not effecting payouts in the way they think. But what do I know. Right? I don't know where you heard that, but it's horribly incorrect. Coming top with 2000+wp, at 25+ kills usually nets around 300-400k isk, unless there are a lot of BPO's on the enemy team, then you're looking at less than 200k. It's a very noticeable difference, how people don't notice it is beyond me. The word you're looking for is MILITIA not BPO. Wolfman told us this literally years ago when this argument was first made. Unless THAT formula has been changed in the numerous tweaks to match payouts, makuta is correct. Er, nope. The word I was looking for, was BPO. That handy little thing called a "Killed by" screen, and the pretty paint jobs give it away, JUST A TAD. Wolfman said something years ago did he? Must still be true. Just like ****** said that Aryans were surpreme years ago. Must clearly be true.... Logistics mk.0 / Logibro's Modified Logistics mk.0
JIMvc2 Consolidated Dust 724	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:11:00 - [55] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Dust =/= Eve The amount of crap we destroyed in our own isk rivals eve's entire economy just to give an idea. Can you provide more information on that ? <--- Im serious lol I like to go over data MAG Raven vet 7 times. Favorite weapon F90 and Highest Kills 78 and 23 deaths.
Luther Mandrix WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 436	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:14:00 - [56] - Quote KILL3R H3LLH0UND wrote: New Eden, a place where Mega-corporations clash for power, a place where bloody and brutal never ending way always continues on. A place with no limits, a place, where one shot can change the course of history. Aka CCP, remove all BPOs (or modify them) to it's like EVE. Aka you BUILD them, and my kaalakiota c-1 would just be a skin, not something truly unlimited. Nothing should ever be free. There is no such thing as a free lunch. The only things that should be unlimited is our starter fits. Just like rookie ships in EVE. APEX. I say just remove them. It was a aggressive monetization technique, but they need to be removed and refunded aurum, ISK and LP. Sigh time to go hop back the car, gotta 8 hour drive ahead of me, ILL BE BACK. Till we can make our manufacture like Eve leave it alone
John Psi Vacuum Cleaner. LLC Steel Balls Alliance 1305	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:33:00 - [57] - Quote KILL3R H3LLH0UND wrote: APEX. I say just remove them. 10/10 Please support fair play!
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18707	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:50:00 - [58] - Quote JIMvc2 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Dust =/= Eve The amount of crap we destroyed in our own isk rivals eve's entire economy just to give an idea. Can you provide more information on that ? <--- Im serious lol I like to go over data You deserve that much. The economy of eve and dust are two entirely seperate monsters. Eve is an eeconomy based on item generation and destruction. The holy trinity of this is creation, possession, and destruction. Remove or disportionate any of those and you destroy the eve economy. This further evolves the game play into the realm of being highly efficent with what little equipment you may have. Some players can indeed lose 10-20-30 ships in a sitting but they generally do it for greater gains to buy 60 ships so to say. Dust in spirit shares this but there is one massive major factor not accounted for. Location. Dust 514 magically teleports all of its items where capsuleeer have to manually ship them. Without the means of location in dust 514 right now our economic model is somewhat too superior if we where to be placed in to the new eden soup as such. This facilitates our ability to die as much as 30 times in a single 15 minute span where an eve player would struggle to keep up in a similar manner unless he's an idiot undocking from his home station in shuttles. This is why our item destruction vastly outpaces item destruction in eve. CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Proto Annihilator 16 Vandals 243	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:53:00 - [59] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: JIMvc2 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Dust =/= Eve The amount of crap we destroyed in our own isk rivals eve's entire economy just to give an idea. Can you provide more information on that ? <--- Im serious lol I like to go over data You deserve that much. The economy of eve and dust are two entirely seperate monsters. Eve is an eeconomy based on item generation and destruction. The holy trinity of this is creation, possession, and destruction. Remove or disportionate any of those and you destroy the eve economy. This further evolves the game play into the realm of being highly efficent with what little equipment you may have. Some players can indeed lose 10-20-30 ships in a sitting but they generally do it for greater gains to buy 60 ships so to say. Dust in spirit shares this but there is one massive major factor not accounted for. Location. Dust 514 magically teleports all of its items where capsuleeer have to manually ship them. Without the means of location in dust 514 right now our economic model is somewhat too superior if we where to be placed in to the new eden soup as such. This facilitates our ability to die as much as 30 times in a single 15 minute span where an eve player would struggle to keep up in a similar manner unless he's an idiot undocking from his home station in shuttles. I'm pretty sure he wanted numbers.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18707	Posted - 2015.02.22 23:57:00 - [60] - Quote Proto Annihilator wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: JIMvc2 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Dust =/= Eve The amount of crap we destroyed in our own isk rivals eve's entire economy just to give an idea. Can you provide more information on that ? <--- Im serious lol I like to go over data You deserve that much. The economy of eve and dust are two entirely seperate monsters. Eve is an eeconomy based on item generation and destruction. The holy trinity of this is creation, possession, and destruction. Remove or disportionate any of those and you destroy the eve economy. This further evolves the game play into the realm of being highly efficent with what little equipment you may have. Some players can indeed lose 10-20-30 ships in a sitting but they generally do it for greater gains to buy 60 ships so to say. Dust in spirit shares this but there is one massive major factor not accounted for. Location. Dust 514 magically teleports all of its items where capsuleeer have to manually ship them. Without the means of location in dust 514 right now our economic model is somewhat too superior if we where to be placed in to the new eden soup as such. This facilitates our ability to die as much as 30 times in a single 15 minute span where an eve player would struggle to keep up in a similar manner unless he's an idiot undocking from his home station in shuttles. I'm pretty sure he wanted numbers. That the entire eve economy is like 7 trillion in assets and dust 514 destroys that much ever 3 months? unadjusted that is. (imagine it being adjusted for the 10 to 1 ratio) CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked



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