DUST Search - Heavy Swarm Launcher

Aeon Amadi wrote:

Shamarskii Simon wrote:

Aeon Amadi wrote:

Shamarskii Simon wrote:

CCP Rattati wrote:

Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit

No. I don't mean to burst your bubble but, no one ever shrugs off militia swarms. Well, in any game I'm in. Hell, only time they won't hit is if it's a ground vehicle. If a dropship it's an immediate evacuate the area because-

1: no way to dodge other than full speed away.
2: usually 3 people decide to switch to swarms by now, or a minmando is chilling near by (always always always is).

The air matters too. Not just the HAVs. And in a dropship sense, it's somewhat true.
Either you see swarmer, or you leave. Or you look for swarmer but lol we all know that's not the best thing to do. There isn't a way to dance around with swarms compared to FG/PLC/Rail-Inky.

I think that's what he was getting at.

I just think it's hilarious that anyone has an issue with it requiring three people to make anyone run away when it comes to AV. Even more so when that issue is in favor of the vehicle.

I don't have an issue with it, it's the fact that one can't stay to fight it out 1v1. 3 people is a definite dead situation anyways.

Even the most dangerous flying won't have a swarm "miss" the ship, is what i'm getting at.

You do realize that an ADV/Proto Small Missile Turret can 2/3 shot even a commando, right? There's ungodly 1-v-1 capability in favor of the ADS.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7184	Posted - 2015.01.22 11:32:00 - [1] - Quote Yes. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2710	Posted - 2015.01.22 11:55:00 - [2] - Quote 1: That is a heavy with a swarm launcher, not a heavy swarm launcher. 2: There's videos with heavies using other light weapons. Want a heavy LR or PR too? 3: That would end up being just a buffed Swarm, unless you're suguesting otherwise. If the former, hell no. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Megaman Trigger OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 195	Posted - 2015.01.22 11:58:00 - [3] - Quote Is that a Sentinel or a Commando? Purifier. First Class.
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6647	Posted - 2015.01.22 12:46:00 - [4] - Quote That's a hellmar sentinel with a swarm launcher VHCL
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1968	Posted - 2015.01.22 12:49:00 - [5] - Quote Swarm launchers used to be heavy wepons. That's why the immortal vid has heavies using swarms . Swarms also used to be dumb fire and actually were quite op against infantry . Proud Caldari purist . Rank 10 colonel omiwarrior. I fought and bled for the State on Caldari prime.
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 587	Posted - 2015.01.22 13:47:00 - [6] - Quote 1. No 2. No more weapons that require 0 skill 3. No more weapons that require 0 aim
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 646	Posted - 2015.01.22 14:03:00 - [7] - Quote If I had my way... Plasma cannons and swarms would be heavy weapons. A scout carrying av is just plain wrong. Put them on heavy suits, you wont want to try sprinting around to get close, you might actually have to aim... Also dedicated av might become a viable thing again, rather than "oh look a vehicle" whole team swaps to av & fires together "job done!" switch back. That and, bring back dumbfire swarms with 0 splash, increase lock time to 8 seconds... Now you have a weapon that takes skill.
Mortishai Belmont G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance 371	Posted - 2015.01.22 14:11:00 - [8] - Quote No, we need a particle cannon as a heavy weapon, some AV proficient against shield... As there is no such thing and I find that hilariously stupid. G.L.O.R.Y Soldier, I'm that Amarr heavy you warn your team about <3 -Heavy/Logi/Assault/Scout-
Alaika Arbosa Minmatar Republic 2407	Posted - 2015.01.22 15:03:00 - [9] - Quote Large Missile Turret---->Vehicle Mounted Swarm Launcher? I think that would be a better idea. Ad Space Available Here 1m Isk/day Mail me message after transferring Isk (sig updated upon transfer completion)
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 588	Posted - 2015.01.22 16:32:00 - [10] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Large Missile Turret---->Vehicle Mounted Swarm Launcher? I think that would be a better idea. 1. No 2. No more weapons that require 0 skill 3. No more weapons that require 0 aim

DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7186	Posted - 2015.01.22 19:51:00 - [11] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: 1: That is a heavy with a swarm launcher, not a heavy swarm launcher. 2: There's videos with heavies using other light weapons. Want a heavy LR or PR too? 3: That would end up being just a buffed Swarm, unless you're suguesting otherwise. If the former, hell no. 1: That's what I want it to look like 2: The LR, HMG and PC are already going to be made into heavy variants. 3: Basically semi auto (one missile per trigger pull), and you have to maintain the lock. The Magazine is twice as large. Missiles do 1.75x damage of regular swarm Missile. Missiles travel at only .80 speed of regular missiles. 4: Can we stop talking in lists? It makes everyone look special. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Striker 654	Posted - 2015.01.22 20:30:00 - [12] - Quote A swarm launcher that mirrors the plasma cannon but deals explosive damage would be reasonable. Fun, even. Dedicated Commando. CEO of Eridani Light Horse Strikers. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Godin Thekiller The Corporate Raiders 2711	Posted - 2015.01.22 20:58:00 - [13] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: 1: That is a heavy with a swarm launcher, not a heavy swarm launcher. 2: There's videos with heavies using other light weapons. Want a heavy LR or PR too? 3: That would end up being just a buffed Swarm, unless you're suguesting otherwise. If the former, hell no. 1: That's what I want it to look like 2: The LR, HMG and PC are already going to be made into heavy variants. 3: Basically semi auto (one missile per trigger pull), and you have to maintain the lock. The Magazine is twice as large. Missiles do 1.75x damage of regular swarm Missile. Missiles travel at only .80 speed of regular missiles. 4: Can we stop talking in lists? It makes everyone look special. Hell no. That thing would be OP as hell. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7189	Posted - 2015.01.22 22:16:00 - [14] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: 3: Basically semi auto (one missile per trigger pull), and you have to maintain the lock. The Magazine is twice as large. Missiles do 1.75x damage of regular swarm Missile. Missiles travel at only .80 speed of regular missiles. 4: Can we stop talking in lists? It makes everyone look special. Hell no. That thing would be OP as hell. How's that OP? It is semi auto and you need to maintain the lock I.E. not fire and forget. Plus the missiles travel slower. The only benefit is a larger mag and more damage. Though you wouldn't be able to pop out of cover and just fire then move position. You would have to wait till the missiles hit or you would miss. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15520	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:00:00 - [15] - Quote Lazer Fo Cused wrote: 1. No 2. No more weapons that require 0 skill 3. No more weapons that require 0 aim Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit, it obstructs your field of vision and you are very exposed while using it with only a sidearm as it has no AI capability, other than the forge and plasma cannon. I am understanding of many HAV issues, but I can assure you, there is noone listening to this in particular. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 9303	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:05:00 - [16] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Lazer Fo Cused wrote: 1. No 2. No more weapons that require 0 skill 3. No more weapons that require 0 aim Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit, it obstructs your field of vision and you are very exposed while using it with only a sidearm as it has no AI capability, other than the forge and plasma cannon. I am understanding of many HAV issues, but I can assure you, there is noone listening to this in particular. what is the problem is that the fire and forget Swarm does more damage than a PLC that actually requires aiming and timing. What's an even bigger problem is that I have no idea how you guys are going to balance shield and armor vehicles when all of the AV in this game, save for one, is anti-armor. What's an even bigger problem is that I think people will actually care that this deep rooted issue with vehicle balance. *Vote 'Keshava' for the new Gallente HAV name!* *~Democracy will win!*
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18451	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:10:00 - [17] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Swarm launchers used to be heavy wepons. That's why the immortal vid has heavies using swarms . Swarms also used to be dumb fire and actually were quite op against infantry . Amarr only had 1 suit back then; guess which!? CPM 1 Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 745	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:24:00 - [18] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit, it obstructs your field of vision and you are very exposed while using it with only a sidearm as it has no AI capability, other than the forge and plasma cannon. I am understanding of many HAV issues, but I can assure you, there is noone listening to this in particular. Commando It is classifed as a heavy suit (for the OP), the minmatar alone runs around with about 1000 ehp and can carry the light weapon of choice. The swarm launcher becomes a sidearm. Say a swarmer is under attack while waiting to lock on there is no weapon switch delay like a cloak does, as well as a near 1000 HP buffer to absorb a few alpha hits. sorry to bring this up again, but the swarms being "victimised" by infantry is a falsehood. Miltia swarms are going to have a tough time vs any tank, because tanks are fit to try and survive proto AV attacks. Its akin to having your only option fighting proto suits a militia AR. Personally i would remove the milita starter AV suit, its suicide vs everything, to try to protect yourself with a militia sidearm is suicide and give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15528	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:40:00 - [19] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit, it obstructs your field of vision and you are very exposed while using it with only a sidearm as it has no AI capability, other than the forge and plasma cannon. I am understanding of many HAV issues, but I can assure you, there is noone listening to this in particular. Commando It is classifed as a heavy suit (for the OP), the minmatar alone runs around with about 1000 ehp and can carry the light weapon of choice. The swarm launcher becomes a sidearm. Say a swarmer is under attack while waiting to lock on there is no weapon switch delay like a cloak does, as well as a near 1000 HP buffer to absorb a few alpha hits. sorry to bring this up again, but the swarms being "victimised" by infantry is a falsehood. Miltia swarms are going to have a tough time vs any tank, because tanks are fit to try and survive proto AV attacks. Its akin to having your only option fighting proto suits a militia AR. Personally i would remove the milita starter AV suit, its suicide vs everything, to try to protect yourself with a militia sidearm is suicide and give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. Sure, but the usual complaint is the "free swarm launcher that everyone gets" i.e. the starter fit, not a commando and swarm launcher that needs millions of SP to be truly effective "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"


CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 15528	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:42:00 - [20] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. new starter fit: "militia commando with faction assault rifle and militia plasma cannon" being planned as of three days ago "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"


Shamarskii Simon The Hundred Acre Hood RISE of LEGION 45	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:49:00 - [21] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit No. I don't mean to burst your bubble but, no one ever shrugs off militia swarms. Well, in any game I'm in. Hell, only time they won't hit is if it's a ground vehicle. If a dropship it's an immediate evacuate the area because- 1: no way to dodge other than full speed away. 2: usually 3 people decide to switch to swarms by now, or a minmando is chilling near by (always always always is). The air matters too. Not just the HAVs. And in a dropship sense, it's somewhat true. Either you see swarmer, or you leave. Or you look for swarmer but lol we all know that's not the best thing to do. There isn't a way to dance around with swarms compared to FG/PLC/Rail-Inky. I think that's what he (Lazer Fo Cused) was getting at. Entering the void and becoming wind with my repbus.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 7956	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:50:00 - [22] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. new starter fit: "militia commando with faction assault rifle and militia plasma cannon" being planned as of three days ago Hahahaha New players are going to hate you and they won't even know why xD Sniper range nerf did nothing but make it harder to counter-snipe redliners. That and open up for really stupid feedback
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 7956	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:52:00 - [23] - Quote Shamarskii Simon wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit No. I don't mean to burst your bubble but, no one ever shrugs off militia swarms. Well, in any game I'm in. Hell, only time they won't hit is if it's a ground vehicle. If a dropship it's an immediate evacuate the area because- 1: no way to dodge other than full speed away. 2: usually 3 people decide to switch to swarms by now, or a minmando is chilling near by (always always always is). The air matters too. Not just the HAVs. And in a dropship sense, it's somewhat true. Either you see swarmer, or you leave. Or you look for swarmer but lol we all know that's not the best thing to do. There isn't a way to dance around with swarms compared to FG/PLC/Rail-Inky. I think that's what he was getting at. I just think it's hilarious that anyone has an issue with it requiring three people to make anyone run away when it comes to AV. Even more so when that issue is in favor of the vehicle. Sniper range nerf did nothing but make it harder to counter-snipe redliners. That and open up for really stupid feedback
Shamarskii Simon The Hundred Acre Hood RISE of LEGION 45	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:57:00 - [24] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Shamarskii Simon wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit No. I don't mean to burst your bubble but, no one ever shrugs off militia swarms. Well, in any game I'm in. Hell, only time they won't hit is if it's a ground vehicle. If a dropship it's an immediate evacuate the area because- 1: no way to dodge other than full speed away. 2: usually 3 people decide to switch to swarms by now, or a minmando is chilling near by (always always always is). The air matters too. Not just the HAVs. And in a dropship sense, it's somewhat true. Either you see swarmer, or you leave. Or you look for swarmer but lol we all know that's not the best thing to do. There isn't a way to dance around with swarms compared to FG/PLC/Rail-Inky. I think that's what he was getting at. I just think it's hilarious that anyone has an issue with it requiring three people to make anyone run away when it comes to AV. Even more so when that issue is in favor of the vehicle. I don't have an issue with it, it's the fact that one can't stay to fight it out 1v1. 3 people is a definite dead situation anyways. Even the most dangerous flying won't have a swarm "miss" the ship, is what i'm getting at. Entering the void and becoming wind with my repbus.
Aeon Amadi Chimera Core 7956	Posted - 2015.01.23 09:02:00 - [25] - Quote Shamarskii Simon wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Shamarskii Simon wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit No. I don't mean to burst your bubble but, no one ever shrugs off militia swarms. Well, in any game I'm in. Hell, only time they won't hit is if it's a ground vehicle. If a dropship it's an immediate evacuate the area because- 1: no way to dodge other than full speed away. 2: usually 3 people decide to switch to swarms by now, or a minmando is chilling near by (always always always is). The air matters too. Not just the HAVs. And in a dropship sense, it's somewhat true. Either you see swarmer, or you leave. Or you look for swarmer but lol we all know that's not the best thing to do. There isn't a way to dance around with swarms compared to FG/PLC/Rail-Inky. I think that's what he was getting at. I just think it's hilarious that anyone has an issue with it requiring three people to make anyone run away when it comes to AV. Even more so when that issue is in favor of the vehicle. I don't have an issue with it, it's the fact that one can't stay to fight it out 1v1. 3 people is a definite dead situation anyways. Even the most dangerous flying won't have a swarm "miss" the ship, is what i'm getting at. You do realize that an ADV/Proto Small Missile Turret can 2/3 shot even a commando, right? There's ungodly 1-v-1 capability in favor of the ADS. Sniper range nerf did nothing but make it harder to counter-snipe redliners. That and open up for really stupid feedback
Juno Tristan Obscure Reference 288	Posted - 2015.01.23 09:08:00 - [26] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. new starter fit: "militia commando with faction assault rifle and militia plasma cannon" being planned as of three days ago give noobs a mlt tank
Shamarskii Simon The Hundred Acre Hood RISE of LEGION 45	Posted - 2015.01.23 09:23:00 - [27] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Shamarskii Simon wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Shamarskii Simon wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor, you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit No. I don't mean to burst your bubble but, no one ever shrugs off militia swarms. Well, in any game I'm in. Hell, only time they won't hit is if it's a ground vehicle. If a dropship it's an immediate evacuate the area because- 1: no way to dodge other than full speed away. 2: usually 3 people decide to switch to swarms by now, or a minmando is chilling near by (always always always is). The air matters too. Not just the HAVs. And in a dropship sense, it's somewhat true. Either you see swarmer, or you leave. Or you look for swarmer but lol we all know that's not the best thing to do. There isn't a way to dance around with swarms compared to FG/PLC/Rail-Inky. I think that's what he was getting at. I just think it's hilarious that anyone has an issue with it requiring three people to make anyone run away when it comes to AV. Even more so when that issue is in favor of the vehicle. I don't have an issue with it, it's the fact that one can't stay to fight it out 1v1. 3 people is a definite dead situation anyways. Even the most dangerous flying won't have a swarm "miss" the ship, is what i'm getting at. You do realize that an ADV/Proto Small Missile Turret can 2/3 shot even a commando, right? There's ungodly 1-v-1 capability in favor of the ADS. Sigh, not everyone uses a missile firstly(me, i AV with a rail incubus) to engage AV is hard because most of the time swarms have first mover advantage, especially before one enters the combat area. Then, swarms move the dropship also, making it harder to aim. After that, there is cover on the ground. It's not ungodly unless you get the jump on them. Anyways, that's not what i'm getting at, what i'm saying there needs to be a way to dodge w/o relying on AB away. Skillful dropship piloting doesn't matter currently (unless it's against a vehicle) Entering the void and becoming wind with my repbus.
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 747	Posted - 2015.01.23 11:39:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. new starter fit: "militia commando with faction assault rifle and militia plasma cannon" being planned as of three days ago This is very good news, though I actually would not mind keeping swarms on a MLT commando, as long as they don't get the racial bonus. Partly because Swarms are the simplest weapon to use, and it would be tough for a brand new player in dust to get the hang of the Plasma Cannon. Most Vets have a hard time getting used to it, its the only light weapon i left at level 1. Once racial AV weapon parity sets it, you can re assign the starter commando fits with the racial AV weapon. Untill then we can leave the swarms on all of the commando starter fits. Before the lynch mob settles in with pitchforks, I'm not really arguing for more swarms, just for the basic swarms that everybody has access to now to be on a survivable suit. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 595	Posted - 2015.01.23 12:13:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: give noobs a mlt starter forge gun suit. or a mlt starter commando suit. new starter fit: "militia commando with faction assault rifle and militia plasma cannon" being planned as of three days ago Will this mean militia specializations for everything? Or at least a proper Logi entry suit? Because otherwise I imagine a few very confused newberries. ...Hell, you could just as well scrap basic suits altogether if you get specializations at militia. The basics already have no purpose, aside from being the stepping stone to specializations Well, unless you intend to make basic suits generalists, best used by solo players, while specialized suits get heavy flaws to offset their strengths, making them good team players.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 648	Posted - 2015.01.23 13:01:00 - [30] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Whatever, you know full well that a militia swarm is shrugged off by most armor That's only because most vehicles go full proto, because most av goes full proto and if you aren't full proto in a vehicle you're dead before you can shout 'afterburner!' Yet if I'm on the ground, I can run a starter fit and stay alive in the middle of a fight, with people running full proto suits (maybe not for long, but long enough to plan an escape strategy.) CCP Rattati wrote: you also know that it needs to be very carefully aimed to get all missiles to hit, it obstructs your field of vision and you are very exposed while using it with only a sidearm as it has no AI capability I've chased off vehicles with the starter fit swarms, vs militia vehicles it does enough to destroy them if you get your positioning right (as in, don't alert them to your presence before you're close enough to land 3 shots.) The only aiming required is to point it away from anything between you and the target, not exactly rocket science.



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