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PARKOUR PRACTIONER
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2285
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Posted - 2014.11.28 19:30:00 -
[31] - Quote
Honestly i will find a way to use REs effectively cause who doesnt like REs? My gal heavy frame can tank a basic RE so im happy.
Its the other heavys i have to worry about.
Knowing when not to and to set them is more important now cause of the bug. Heavys are doing there job which is area denial
AKA Walking Turrent, id rather kill a logi than heavy (sorry Za'ki) a non logi heavy is a vulnerable heavy.
PSN Sil4ntChaozz
I am the Ninja that no one sees and if seen killed with ease
No mic scout. Fight me.
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KING CHECKMATE
Opus Arcana
Covert Intervention
5972
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Posted - 2014.11.28 19:50:00 -
[32] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The new remote nerf is very sneaky...in my speed tanked assault, its almost as bad as the cloak.
I personally am beginning to think that RE's are a bit too skilless, simply because of how easy it is to speed remote somewhere, and pop everyone, but if they are going to be nerfed, I think we need to look at heavies first, and how they are impossible to take out without a double or triple team of shotgunners or a remote explosive.
The remote explosive is a counter to heavies--its the only suit that is slow enough for the remote to work.
I like the idea of nerfing it, but if this occurs, heavies will need to be severely nerfed, so that gun game alone can kill them.
.
''I think we need to look at heavies first,''
You won me over with this. ^^^^
I already figures dust514 out. You cannot play just as a scout, just as a heavy,or assault or logi. You need to use them all in order to be the ultimate soldier. The ultimate do it all.
Where am i going with this? Well, i use both R/E and Sentinels and i agree with Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p. as Powerful as heavies are right now, a scout need to:
a/ have sG ready or decloak and wait the whole 4 secs it takes for it to change to the SG.
b/ Be close enough or GET close enough to the heavy
c/ Start shotgunning his butt and pray he will die in 3-4 shots
d/Survive the process (with all the HMG spray and pray and what not...)
This is all in the imaginary situation the heavy i ALONE, and not with a logi behind him and an assault or scout around too..
This is all in the case that scout is a SG scout.
Besides SG and Nova knife, Both CQ weapons, a scout really doesnt have many options against Sentinels.
Most of the people QQ for remote Explosive nerfs ARE indeed Specialized Sentinel players. But i see where Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p is coming from.
You nerf the R/E , SG, Nk, etc... then you NEED to nerf Sentinels. Sentinels are ALREADY quite broken to be quite honest. The sentinel is supposed to be the ultimate Fire powerhouse but its weakness was that it could be detected by pretty much any radar and they would need Ammo and Constant repair to be fully operational. Sentinels are SO powerful now they dont REALLY need a Logi behind them unless going against another heavy of similar Fit level and skill.
So yeah. Sentinels need to be checked first...
Amarrian Born. State Patriot.
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Thumb Green
Raymond James Corp
1868
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Posted - 2014.11.28 20:00:00 -
[33] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:
1v1. Unless you have a RR, ScR, and sometimes breach AR, and the heavy is stupid enough to try to cross open ground, you won't kill him.
If you run a CQC weapon, the heavy wins 9 times out of 10, simply because they can tank most of your clips worth of shots, if not the whole clip, and have much higher DPS than you as well.
There is a reason that sentinels are so prevalent in PC. *1
Thats also the reason why speedy assaults and scouts with remotes is the new counter-heavy meta.
Which I hate BTW, despite the fact that it benefits me more than most. Its stupid that the only way to kill a tanked heavy sitting on an objective is to use more than one person, or RE chuck all over the place and hope that a heavy is caught in the blast.
Your statement says that good gun game involves knowing when to engage an enemy sentinel. However, it is very VERY easy to make it so that there is no good time to engage an enemy sentinel. *2
1: Yeah that reason is because most objectives on the PC maps are in areas designed for Sentinels (at least they were when I was doing a bit of PC). You won't find very many Sentinels guarding an open objective.
2: The rest of your comment is addressed in this but I wanted to emphasize this part.This falls back on the part where I said most people engage Sentinels on their terms. Map design makes it easy for anyone in a Sentinel that isn't a complete dipshit to force encounters to be in their favor.
People don't realize that their problem is usually with map design and not Sentinels themselves. Then of course there are people that realize that but also realize that new maps or redesigns aren't that likely so it's easier to nerf the Sentinel to where there's no point in using it.
Kills:21, Deaths:5, KDR: time for a smoke.
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SagaB
Krusual Covert Operators
Minmatar Republic
90
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Posted - 2014.11.28 20:17:00 -
[34] - Quote
Jakkal Shoobah wrote:SagaB that question is a thread in itself.
True, but the OP has two main points (that I see):
1. Their was a silent nerf to overall RE use (RE spammers can still toss REs consecutively without penalty afaik). I would rather have Rattati communicate to us all silent nerfs that occur. Not everyone likes surprises. I can only guess Rattati wanted to test our reactions to this change or if we even noticed.
2. Nerfing one of the viable weapons against heavy spam (including logi support), should result in nerfing the viability of heavies. My question deals with this point to an extent. Their are threads already wanting a fix of Sentinel use in CQC. I just want the OP to know their are better options than just straight up nerfing a class. |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2936
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Posted - 2014.11.28 20:40:00 -
[35] - Quote
Powerh8er wrote:If heavies are impossible to kill with gungame, then i must a beastly god because i kill em like flies in my min assault with acr.
You "dedicated" scouts need to adapt or skill into more suits.
1350 armor, 450 shield Am Sentinel
Thats not going down to one assault.
Unless he is AFK or has horrific aim, you will die.
ACR has 85 rounds, IIRC, and each does ~22 damage.
To break through the shield, you need 450/(22*.85)=24 bullets hitting
To break armor, at prof 5 CR, you need 1350/(22*1.15)=54 bullets hitting
Thats 78 rounds that must hit on target to kill the sentinel. Now, with the hit detection/aiming coefficient on the sentinel being about 90% of the shots hitting, you have 78*1.1 shots to unload, or 86 rounds being fired before the sentinel dies. At 1200 RPM, or 20 rounds per second, this requires that you are alive for 4.3 seconds, constantly hitting the target.
A typical minmitar assault layout has ~460 shields, and ~300 armor
Boundless HMG with one complex damage mod does 832 DPS.
To take out the shields, that is 460/(832*.85), or .65 seconds
To take out the armor, that is 300/(832*1.15), or .313 seconds
(The calculations are different because the HMG damage can't be counted in damage per shot, because it chunks several shots into one frame, or at least appears to function like that)
That is .963 seconds of survival you have if hit detection and aim works perfectly, which, of course, it does not. The aim and hit detection coefficient against the above suit is about .5, so you have .963/.5 seconds of survival time, or 1.927 seconds once he begins shooting at you.
So, if you shoot the Sentinel in the back, and it takes him (4.3-1.927), or 2.37 seconds for him to turn around and begin shooting at you, then yes, you will win.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Thumb Green
Raymond James Corp
1868
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Posted - 2014.11.28 20:50:00 -
[36] - Quote
The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that.
Kills:21, Deaths:5, KDR: time for a smoke.
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2936
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Posted - 2014.11.28 21:13:00 -
[37] - Quote
Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that.
What is a situation where I can use:
a.) non-damage modded shotgun
b.) ACR
c.) NV AR
Against a brick tanked sentinel, and win?
Please, id like to hear how to do it.
And don't say "Don't go toe to toe",as that is a very vague and non-descriptive statement.
Say, "shoot him in the back!"
Or, "engage him outside of his range!"
Or, "admit defeat, you can't kill a sentinel with a weapon, you need remote explosives!"
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Thumb Green
Raymond James Corp
1868
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Posted - 2014.11.28 21:25:00 -
[38] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that. What is a situation where I can use: a.) non-damage modded shotgun b.) ACR c.) NV AR Against a brick tanked sentinel, and win? Please, id like to hear how to do it. And don't say "Don't go toe to toe",as that is a very vague and non-descriptive statement. Say, "shoot him in the back!" Or, "engage him outside of his range!" Or, "admit defeat, you can't kill a sentinel with a weapon, you need remote explosives!"
Or, use your mobility & cover to your advantage.
Toe-to-toe isn't vague, toe-to-toe is going up against your opponent as if you were equals. That's what everybody wants to do but that's just not how the game is meant to be.
Kills:21, Deaths:5, KDR: time for a smoke.
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2936
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 21:29:00 -
[39] - Quote
Thumb Green wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that. What is a situation where I can use: a.) non-damage modded shotgun b.) ACR c.) NV AR Against a brick tanked sentinel, and win? Please, id like to hear how to do it. And don't say "Don't go toe to toe",as that is a very vague and non-descriptive statement. Say, "shoot him in the back!" Or, "engage him outside of his range!" Or, "admit defeat, you can't kill a sentinel with a weapon, you need remote explosives!" Or, use your mobility & cover to your advantage. Toe-to-toe isn't vague, toe-to-toe is going up against your opponent as if you were equals. That's what everybody wants to do but that's just not how the game is meant to be.
That could be even more vague than "Don't go toe-to-toe!".
Try again.
Are you saying "Run away!"?
Are you saying "Strafe in front of the HMG and keep firing, you will win!"?
Are you saying "Play ring-around-the-crate, until one of the other players on either team comes in to either destroy you, or distract the heavy for long enough to run away!"?
I legitimately cannot tell.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Thumb Green
Raymond James Corp
1868
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Posted - 2014.11.28 21:43:00 -
[40] - Quote
If anyone thinks what I'm saying is vague then there is no hope for them and yes, just so you don't think I'm being vague yet again, I'm saying there's no hope for you.
Kills:21, Deaths:5, KDR: time for a smoke.
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poison Diego
Titans of Phoenix
502
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 22:24:00 -
[41] - Quote
The bullsh*t REs need to go for sure but I agree that spamming heavies on city maps gives assaults and scouts no chance. And there are to many city map districts(that is if we are talking PC). So either the maps need to change and have more variety or heavies nerfed.
Nerfing heavies will on the other hand severally damage pub matches where heavies can die just as much as anyone else.
is there a contradiction to jealousy?
.
if so, KingThunderBolt would know....
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2940
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Posted - 2014.11.28 22:43:00 -
[42] - Quote
Thumb Green wrote:If anyone thinks what I'm saying is vague then there is no hope for them and yes, just so you don't think I'm being vague yet again, I'm saying there's no hope for you.
So still no concrete statement?
Thats a shame.
You gave up without a fight, and resorted to ad hominems.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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poison Diego
Titans of Phoenix
503
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Posted - 2014.11.28 22:57:00 -
[43] - Quote
Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that.
I completely agree. You have to find a way to kill a heavy without confronting him directly. For that grenades, either flux or 2 core nades should weaken him sufficiently for you to confront him. Besides most heavies dont stack their sh*t up to top.
also either a charged ion pistol, bolt pistol headshot or a breach scrp headshot should weaken them enough to finish them off whith an allotek burst or a CR.
For this kind of combat it is good to have range amplifiers to follow the heavies movements as well as speed, that is as an assault. All this you would find in a scout but never would you have the same health as the assault.
is there a contradiction to jealousy?
.
if so, KingThunderBolt would know....
|
poison Diego
Titans of Phoenix
503
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 23:00:00 -
[44] - Quote
As well as that, heavies are meant as main slayers in the game. They have NO other role and are not meant to be killed be second class kind of slayers to easily.
is there a contradiction to jealousy?
.
if so, KingThunderBolt would know....
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2941
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 23:01:00 -
[45] - Quote
poison Diego wrote:Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that. I completely agree. You have to find a way to kill a heavy without confronting him directly. For that grenades, either flux or 2 core nades should weaken him sufficiently for you to confront him. Besides most heavies dont stack their sh*t up to top. also either a charged ion pistol, bolt pistol headshot or a breach scrp headshot should weaken them enough to finish them off whith an allotek burst or a CR. For this kind of combat it is good to have range amplifiers to follow the heavies movements as well as speed, that is as an assault. All this you would find in a scout but never would you have the same health as the assault.
Im talking about PC, where EVERY heavy stacks plates to the max.
And you say a headshot is easy to get with these weapons...by the time that you line up the shot and fire, the heavy has already done 500 damage to you. With the sheer number of bullets hitting you, its difficult to see as well, due to shield flare and what not.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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KING CHECKMATE
Opus Arcana
Covert Intervention
5982
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Posted - 2014.11.28 23:02:00 -
[46] - Quote
Quote:For that grenades, either flux or 2 core nades should weaken him sufficiently for you to confront him. Besides most heavies dont stack their sh*t up to top.
You know who stack their s*** all the way to the top? The REALLY SCARY HEAVIES.
YEAH!
The ones with Leeches? I mean Logis behind them and 1700 EHP? XD
And they want to nerf R/E's...heh...
Amarrian Born. State Patriot.
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Thumb Green
Raymond James Corp
1869
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Posted - 2014.11.28 23:08:00 -
[47] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Thumb Green wrote:If anyone thinks what I'm saying is vague then there is no hope for them and yes, just so you don't think I'm being vague yet again, I'm saying there's no hope for you. So still no concrete statement? Thats a shame. You gave up without a fight, and resorted to ad hominems.
I gave a concrete statement, you're just being obtuse. Also I'm not attacking you, I'm just giving up on you so it's not an ad hominem
Kills:21, Deaths:5, KDR: time for a smoke.
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poison Diego
Titans of Phoenix
503
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 23:08:00 -
[48] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:poison Diego wrote:Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that. I completely agree. You have to find a way to kill a heavy without confronting him directly. For that grenades, either flux or 2 core nades should weaken him sufficiently for you to confront him. Besides most heavies dont stack their sh*t up to top. also either a charged ion pistol, bolt pistol headshot or a breach scrp headshot should weaken them enough to finish them off whith an allotek burst or a CR. For this kind of combat it is good to have range amplifiers to follow the heavies movements as well as speed, that is as an assault. All this you would find in a scout but never would you have the same health as the assault. Im talking about PC, where EVERY heavy stacks plates to the max. And you say a headshot is easy to get with these weapons...by the time that you line up the shot and fire, the heavy has already done 500 damage to you. With the sheer number of bullets hitting you, its difficult to see as well, due to shield flare and what not.
In PC a lot of heavies stack feroscales and shield. And you made my point to. Its not supposed to be easy to kill a proto sentinel, you are supposed to feel accomplishment, not another frisbee practice with the buds..
And again you go to the part where you are looking at a heavy straight in front of you. Let me give you an advice, if you see a heavy looking your way you RUN AWAY!! and try again later.
is there a contradiction to jealousy?
.
if so, KingThunderBolt would know....
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2941
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 23:09:00 -
[49] - Quote
Thumb Green wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Thumb Green wrote:If anyone thinks what I'm saying is vague then there is no hope for them and yes, just so you don't think I'm being vague yet again, I'm saying there's no hope for you. So still no concrete statement? Thats a shame. You gave up without a fight, and resorted to ad hominems. I gave a concrete statement, you're just being obtuse. Also I'm not attacking you, I'm just giving up on you so it's not an ad hominem
"Use cover and mobility to your advantage!" is not a concrete statement. Not even close.
Saying something like "Run away, regen your HP and come back to kill him from behind when he is engaging someone else!" is a concrete statement, and was similar to the one I was looking for.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
17857
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Posted - 2014.11.28 23:11:00 -
[50] - Quote
Please remember the condition that forces equipment to animate fully before allowing another action is a trait used on both the cloak and remote explosives.
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2941
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Posted - 2014.11.28 23:11:00 -
[51] - Quote
poison Diego wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:poison Diego wrote:Thumb Green wrote:The problem with the situations you keep describing, Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p, is that they all involve going toe-to-toe with the Sentinel. You just don't do that and it was designed for people to not do that. I completely agree. You have to find a way to kill a heavy without confronting him directly. For that grenades, either flux or 2 core nades should weaken him sufficiently for you to confront him. Besides most heavies dont stack their sh*t up to top. also either a charged ion pistol, bolt pistol headshot or a breach scrp headshot should weaken them enough to finish them off whith an allotek burst or a CR. For this kind of combat it is good to have range amplifiers to follow the heavies movements as well as speed, that is as an assault. All this you would find in a scout but never would you have the same health as the assault. Im talking about PC, where EVERY heavy stacks plates to the max. And you say a headshot is easy to get with these weapons...by the time that you line up the shot and fire, the heavy has already done 500 damage to you. With the sheer number of bullets hitting you, its difficult to see as well, due to shield flare and what not. In PC a lot of heavies stack feroscales and shield. And you made my point to. Its not supposed to be easy to kill a proto sentinel, you are supposed to feel accomplishment, not another frisbee practice with the buds.. And again you go to the part where you are looking at a heavy straight in front of you. Let me give you an advice, if you see a heavy looking your way you RUN AWAY!! and try again later.
How are you supposed to headshot from behind...?
And while that is true, thats more of an exception, and less of a rule.
Heavies should be difficult to kill, yes, but not impossible. The HP is fine, but the death ray is not.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2941
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Posted - 2014.11.28 23:12:00 -
[52] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Please remember the condition that forces equipment to animate fully before allowing another action is a trait used on both the cloak and remote explosives.
And no other equipment at all....
Though if you want to make this a scout nerf, Id recommend adding it to links as well, as that is really what our main role is.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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poison Diego
Titans of Phoenix
503
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Posted - 2014.11.28 23:24:00 -
[53] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Please remember the condition that forces equipment to animate fully before allowing another action is a trait used on both the cloak and remote explosives. And no other equipment at all.... Though if you want to make this a scout nerf, Id recommend adding it to links as well, as that is really what our main role is.
That actually makes sense. Since scouts are usually made run to city they most often drop uplinks on the way. Itd mean that he would have to choose from being first at the objective or dropping safeti uplinks on the way. It would also by that force more roles to be created. more than just 1 or 2 would have to run to the city to secure the teams position. Also this would fix the easy uplink spam and it would take more than 5 sec to fx clear the pockets and place 3 links.
good idea, would like it enforced
is there a contradiction to jealousy?
.
if so, KingThunderBolt would know....
|
Imp Smash
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
441
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Posted - 2014.11.29 01:00:00 -
[54] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Powerh8er wrote:If heavies are impossible to kill with gungame, then i must a beastly god because i kill em like flies in my min assault with acr.
You "dedicated" scouts need to adapt or skill into more suits. 1350 armor, 450 shield Am Sentinel Thats not going down to one assault. Unless he is AFK or has horrific aim, you will die. ACR has 85 rounds, IIRC, and each does ~22 damage. To break through the shield, you need 450/(22*.85)=24 bullets hitting To break armor, at prof 5 CR, you need 1350/(22*1.15)=54 bullets hitting Thats 78 rounds that must hit on target to kill the sentinel. Now, with the hit detection/aiming coefficient on the sentinel being about 90% of the shots hitting, you have 78*1.1 shots to unload, or 86 rounds being fired before the sentinel dies. At 1200 RPM, or 20 rounds per second, this requires that you are alive for 4.3 seconds, constantly hitting the target. A typical minmitar assault layout has ~460 shields, and ~300 armor Boundless HMG with one complex damage mod does 832 DPS. To take out the shields, that is 460/(832*.85), or .65 seconds To take out the armor, that is 300/(832*1.15), or .313 seconds (The calculations are different because the HMG damage can't be counted in damage per shot, because it chunks several shots into one frame, or at least appears to function like that) That is .963 seconds of survival you have if hit detection and aim works perfectly, which, of course, it does not. The aim and hit detection coefficient against the above suit is about .5, so you have .963/.5 seconds of survival time, or 1.927 seconds once he begins shooting at you. So, if you shoot the Sentinel in the back, and it takes him (4.3-1.927), or 2.37 seconds for him to turn around and begin shooting at you, then yes, you will win.
I like the math. I dislike how you completely ignored all context. HMGs are no where near 800+ DPS. HMGs can apply relatively little of that DPS to the head, where as all the rifles can apply pretty much ALL of it to the head (of a heavy) Your analysis completely ignores hit detection issues with faster smaller suits that heavies simply don't have.
TL;DR: The situation of any suit going toe to toe with a heavy is NEVER as lopsided as you just framed it even in the most heavy friendly situation. The proof is in the fact that people are killing heavies toe to toe in a variety of fits with reasonable success unless the heavy has a logi train. |
Powerh8er
The Rainbow Effect
561
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Posted - 2014.11.29 01:30:00 -
[55] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Powerh8er wrote:If heavies are impossible to kill with gungame, then i must a beastly god because i kill em like flies in my min assault with acr.
You "dedicated" scouts need to adapt or skill into more suits. 1350 armor, 450 shield Am Sentinel Thats not going down to one assault. Unless he is AFK or has horrific aim, you will die. ACR has 85 rounds, IIRC, and each does ~22 damage. To break through the shield, you need 450/(22*.85)=24 bullets hitting To break armor, at prof 5 CR, you need 1350/(22*1.15)=54 bullets hitting Thats 78 rounds that must hit on target to kill the sentinel. Now, with the hit detection/aiming coefficient on the sentinel being about 90% of the shots hitting, you have 78*1.1 shots to unload, or 86 rounds being fired before the sentinel dies. At 1200 RPM, or 20 rounds per second, this requires that you are alive for 4.3 seconds, constantly hitting the target. A typical minmitar assault layout has ~460 shields, and ~300 armor Boundless HMG with one complex damage mod does 832 DPS. To take out the shields, that is 460/(832*.85), or .65 seconds To take out the armor, that is 300/(832*1.15), or .313 seconds (The calculations are different because the HMG damage can't be counted in damage per shot, because it chunks several shots into one frame, or at least appears to function like that) That is .963 seconds of survival you have if hit detection and aim works perfectly, which, of course, it does not. The aim and hit detection coefficient against the above suit is about .5, so you have .963/.5 seconds of survival time, or 1.927 seconds once he begins shooting at you. So, if you shoot the Sentinel in the back, and it takes him (4.3-1.927), or 2.37 seconds for him to turn around and begin shooting at you, then yes, you will win.
I dont know where your getting these numbers from, (nerd-alert!),
but i was a dedicated heavy for a long time and i would never stack that much armor
because that would mean a very slow and painfull gaming experience leading to a sure death.
Anyway the HMG are far from a idiot proof weapon now and i usally just dance or strafe away from the HMG fire.
One time i even killed 4 heavies in a row with the min assault in 1 vs 1`s. Any other weapon, especially rail rifles just tear heavies apart from range.
And yes most of the combat rifle bullets must hit the heavy which is not hard.
Edit: Grammar. |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2945
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Posted - 2014.11.29 18:55:00 -
[56] - Quote
Powerh8er wrote:
I dont know where your getting these numbers from, (nerd-alert!),
but i was a dedicated heavy for a long time and i would never stack that much armor
because that would mean a very slow and painfull gaming experience leading to a sure death.
Anyway the HMG are far from a idiot proof weapon now and i usally just dance or strafe away from the HMG fire.
One time i even killed 4 heavies in a row with the min assault in 1 vs 1`s. Any other weapon, especially rail rifles just tear heavies apart from range.
And yes most of the combat rifle bullets must hit the heavy which is not hard.
Edit: Grammar.
protofits.com
You might not, but that is the norm in a PC. 4x complex plates on an amarr sentinel.
It doesn't matter if its slow and lacks regen if everyone is forced to attack you in your optimal, and you have a logi sticking his love stick in your ass.
Congrats, I can too against terribad pub-scrubs. However, when people can aim, its a little harder to do.
Wow, you are amazing. However, against good sentinels, and not pub-scrub heavy frames, thats a little harder to do.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Zindorak
G0DS AM0NG MEN
General Tso's Alliance
1379
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 20:31:00 -
[57] - Quote
What happened to my RE's?
Pokemon master and Tekken Lord
Give me da iskiez
Gk0 Scout yay :)
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
2945
|
Posted - 2014.11.29 22:03:00 -
[58] - Quote
Zindorak wrote:What happened to my RE's?
They now suffer from the same clunky animation as the cloak does.
As in, after pulling them up, you have 4 seconds before you can use your weapon, and if you sprint or do anything while switching to your weapon, it cancels the switch.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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