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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 37 post(s) |
RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
627
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Posted - 2014.07.18 09:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
A PROPOSAL I know that CCP must have data or ideas that justify certain setups. I am also pleased that there has been a move to rectify many subjects to create an evolving game that achieves a greater balance and immersion.
My beef is with the MED Frame inequalities (LOGI and ASSAULT). There is a tension between the two because there is a lack of definition with the ASSAULT type MED frame. The LOGI is well defined and remains unique and is in a good place that will be better with the proper slot adjustments. The difficulty in CCPGÇÖs position is that it has yet to make the ASSAULT Frames the defining go to suits. IGÇÖm sure that if IGÇÖm not outright just stealing the idea by not crediting authors it is only that I agree with your positions and wanted to emphasize them again, but I offer this suggestion that I like.
Defining the MED Frames The SLOT ADJUSTMENT is a good start, but too little to move the ASSAULTS to where they will be a dominating force. It hardly seems logical that a LOGI is the same ASSAULT suit that sacrifices base stats (EHP, potential, speed, shield recharge, stamina and recharge, etc.) and their side arm (mostly) then gets to carry all this great equipment AND have more high(H) and low(L) slots.
The ASSAULT will only stand out when there is a defining difference between the two frames that makes the choice for a slayer obvious and the choice for a support role obvious.
Make the ASSAULTs mean. THE H/L SLOT LAYOUT of each MED FRAME equal to each other or higher for ASSAULTS. THE CPU/PG is EQUAL or higher for LOGIS but each can fit all Proto MODS and Proto GEAR (LOGI EQ and ASSAULT LW, SA) Keep the LOGI stats as they are now. ASSAULT stats as they are now, but more HP as planned.
First the LOGI A LOGIGÇÖs power in MODules and EQuipment Here the slot counts are all Equal to 8, 10, 12. BUT not all should be the same GÇô keeping a little flavor with the equipment bearers is cool. (and I support the Logi bonus changes)
UNIQUE Logis GÇô (3EQ, Side Arm, Module Focus) AMARR SIDE ARM (Best Choice GÇô Unique)ORMODULE Focused (IFF Bonuses Change) S- 2H/3L/2E + Side Arm S- 3H/3L/2E A- 2H/4L/3E + Side Arm A- 3H/4L/3E P- 3H/5L/3E + Side Arm P- 4H/5L/3E
CALDARI SIDE ARM (Equality - another SA option)ORMODULE Focused (Unique) S- 3H/2L/2E + Side Arm S- 3H/3L/2E A- 4H/2L/3E + Side Arm A- 4H/3L/3E P- 5H/3L/3E + Side Arm P- 5H/4L/3E
EQ SPECIFIC Logis GÇô (4EQ) GALLENTE S- 2H/3L/3E A- 2H/3L/3E P- 3H/5L/4E
MINMATAR S- 2H/2L/3E A- 3H/3L/3E P- 4H/4L/4E
Delivers Logis with equal slot counts (side arm = 1 EQ) Keeps them equal in tier movements.
ASSAULTS: Capable of being the most unique and powerful force out there. Lets make them that way. AMARR EQUAL to logi ORBETTER - Logi loses 1EQ for SA S- 2H/3L/1E + Side Arm S- 3H/3L/1E + Side Arm A- 2H/4L/1E + Side Arm A- 3H/4L/1E + Side Arm P- 3H/5L/1E + Side Arm P- 4H/5L/1E + Side Arm
CALDARI EQUAL to logi ORBETTER - Logi loses 1EQ for SA S- 3H/2L/1E + Side Arm S- 3H/3L/1E + Side Arm A- 4H/2L/1E + Side Arm A- 4H/3L/1E + Side Arm P- 5H/3L/1E + Side Arm P- 5H/4L/1E + Side Arm
GALLENTE EQUAL to logi ORBETTER - Logi loses 1H for 4thEQ S- 2H/3L/1E + Side Arm S- 3H/3L/1E + Side Arm A- 2H/4L/1E + Side Arm A- 3H/4L/1E + Side Arm P- 3H/5L/1E + Side Arm P- 4H/5L/1E + Side Arm
MINMATAR EQUAL to logi ORBETTER Focus - Logi loses 1H for 4thEQ S- 2H/2L/1E + Side Arm S- 3H/3L/1E + Side Arm A- 3H/3L/1E + Side Arm A- 4H/3L/1E + Side Arm P- 4H/4L/1E + Side Arm P- 5H/4L/1E + Side Arm
IN this way The COST of not being an ASSAULT is always less modules. Logis gain equipment but loses stat and 1 module. Scouts gain speed and equipment but lose stats and modules. Commandos gain HP and another LW but lose grenades and modules. Heavies gain HW and HP but lose modules.
ASSAULTs will be the Maximum warriors even if their bonuses are not all that people may want. The modules and better stats make them awesome regardless.
It makes the ASSAULTs versatile for battle and they may even give every class a run for their money as they will be the new Logi Slayer or Brick Scout that can suddenly do everything better than every other class (with the right module)GǪ but isnGÇÖt that what the ASSAULTs were meant to do? WerenGÇÖt the other classes supposed to sacrifice to take on another role? Not all roles are equal, but balance does not mean equality.
IGÇÖll work on some CPU/PG Calculations tomorrow to try to find that sweet spot where the MED frames can have the same CPU/PG and what percentages their Bonuses need to be at in order to accommodate such a move.
ThatGÇÖs all I got for now.
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
632
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Posted - 2014.07.18 18:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
Or i guess we could keep the Logis as slot kings with lower base stats.... or same base stats as assaults but less modules... I don't know. Ther must be a price paid or the LOGI will just out Assault the Assault because it would be the same and have the equipment slots.
And from what CCP is saying about "not enough Assaults" that wouldn't fly i think.
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
634
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Posted - 2014.07.19 04:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
I like the slot layouts generally. Standardizing the slot count for each class and then having that fluctuate according to race is appropriate.
I am against removing the A-Logi side arm and standardizing it to be a logi like the Minmatar or Gallente. I am against standardizing the C-Logi as well. The Logi bonuses are so unappealing for these two, combined with previous poor slot layouts or lack of fitting power, just increasing the slot count to make them more similar (4EQ each) isn't fun. - while this is not the forum for that discussion I feel like it makes am impact here which is why I bring it up.
Personally I love the variability that comes with more modules. Modules make the suits. The class with the most modules would be the biggest hit IFF (if and only if) it was also for the best for most everything else. Great HP, speed, versatility, DPS potential.
I Really feel that as is the module changes will not bring the Assaults into the limelight that CCP desires. CCP wants more Assaults. They want the assaults to be the main, go-to, suit. For that to happen they need to be given a little push. The bonuses are unappealing (so I've heard - I'm logi not assault - but again not for this forum) but modules allow players to create their unique fighters.
Modules are the power that can move players into different classes. Thus, either moving the H/L slot count of the Assault to equal a logis would bring a new level of power to the class.
BUT Moving them one further, one more so that they would have the 9 possible of the highest potential every player would flock to that class because the masterpieces that a player could create would be a great amount of fun. It would be an overpowering class but perhaps there could be balance if other classes moved to higher slots as well. OR MAYBE THOSE are the suits we would find in JOVIAN Facilities in Legion??????
Either way the MED FRAMES should be equal in their H/L slot count to make the assaults viable again. My Thoughts anyway.
BUT later, please help my logi brethren one day.
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
636
|
Posted - 2014.07.19 19:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote: The new premise is a single matrix of racial high/low arrangements and then tactical choices of the other slots (EQ, SA, W, G). The proposed matrix is also intended to be more thematically in line with EVE Online racial slots.
Amarr highest number of low slots Caldari highest number of high slots Gallente equal number of highs and lows, preferring lows Minmatar equal number of highs and lows, preferring highs
Moving forward with few changes without changing the whole layout of every dropsuit is certainly on the table as well. The logi sidearm f.ex. There are other "anomalies" that I would love to discuss, such as STD and ADV logi racial differences.
Of course if you see some errors, please let us know.
Have at it and keep it civil and constructive!
I like the Premise of the changes. I also like equalizing the slots among the races AND equalizing the steps in the tiers.
You asked specifically about the STD and ADV logi racial differences and I would like to speak to that.
LOGI TIER STEPS - CURRENT
AMARR Standard---2H/2L/2E + Side Arm Start with 9 slots (including LW/Grenade) Advanced--3H/3L/3E + Side Arm +2 slots Proto--------3H/4L/3E + Side Arm +1 slot = 12 slot (including LW/GR)
MINMATAR S- 2H/2L/3E 9 slots A- 3H/3L/3E +2 slots P- 4H/4L/4E +3 slots = 14 slot (LW/GR included)
The AMARR suit and the MINMATAR suit are the most acceptable in their current steps up the tier ladder, despite the disparity of slots, because they both start with enough slots to play with. There is adequate front loading of options at the STD level. 2H/2L allow for a decent beginning roll out and allows the player to begin to experiment, but the 2/2 is also not quite enough to feel the impact of a good build unless both slots are double stacked with the same mod, but then the fitting isn't as viable.
For example rolling out with 2 extenders and 1armor plate and one rep plate is a common logi build, not the best but it focuses on defense and being able to take care of yourself with repps, it is survivable but not focused. To get a feel for something having a bit more focus you either need to step up the module level or double up on it. And doing that at the STD level doesn't leave the suit with any other available modules to help balance it out, SO you have to move up to the next level, ADV, to experiment with a viable fit that has more variety. In order to try a CODE Breaker fit with a KINkat or 1plate and 2repps with dmg mods or shield energizers, or whatever.
BUT that only works because the step to ADV brings another 2 module slots. Here at the ADV build there is enough room to play and feel the effects of the changes and build more survivable suits. The isk cost is manageable as well. IF all the modules are ADV (different discussion as PG/CPU limits don't really allow it) I manage the loss by knowing I can die X number of times in battle before I have to drop down to the STD level or go ISK negative.
While I don't like that the two races end with a different slot count (looking forward to that remedy) they begin with enough slots to play, the ADV tier brings more playability with the room to experiment. The PRO tier and the difference in the jump between the two Suit types with one being 3 slots and the other only 1 slot increase is not good. - For the Amarr it is almost not worth it, but we do it for the PG/CPU. For the Minmatar it is GREAT! a whole new level of options!
On to our other outliers CALDARI S- 2H/1L/2E 7 Slots A- 3H/2L/3E +3 slots P- 5H/4L/3E +4 slots = 14 Slots
Finally balanced at Proto. But the STD level is not much to work with. It is a scout slot count but with terrible stats, no sidearm, and no grenade! Not a fun build, little survivability and little experimentation options. It is not an soldier logi with a side arm and yet it has a lower slot count, but it is not a pack mule logi either that can carry the equipment like the mimnatar. The STD level really has no place and is quite worthless. The jump to ADV level actually makes the suit viable. At this level it is like its MIN cousin at the STD level. It finally has some slots to experiment with, and enough EQ slots to do some decent Logi work. The ADV and PRO tiers are the only ones that are worth working with as the gimpy stats of the Logi need modules to pad a stat or two and have some survivability.
The jump from ADV to PRO at 4 slots is ridiculous - makes it worth the money for the slots - but ridiculous. This logi suffers because the STD is not enough and the tier progression so great that only higher tiers are viable - it makes the viable builds very expensive to run. ISK disparity in the risk/reward of just being able to run STD.
GALLENTE S- 0H/2L/3E 7 slots A- 2H/3L/3E +3 slots P- 3H/5L/4E +4 slots = 14 slots
WORST STD EVER. Similar to the Caldari the builds only become a viable Logi build at the ADV level, 2 lows is too low for a slot count. AND WHAT A STEP! 3 slots. In fact it is exactly like the Caldari for all intents and purposes of discussion. The build differs in 1 more EQ slot to make it and the Minmatar the only two that can haul anything needed with 4EQ. The gap is too great between the tiers making crossing these tier canyons the only choice to play these races.
(Continues to next post)
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
636
|
Posted - 2014.07.19 19:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
SOLUTIONS What we see is that the tier steps are too great in some cases and smooth even steps in other examples.
What I would propose is: 1.All Logi slot counts equalized to 14 slots (despite how the layouts may end up).
2.All Logi suits start with the same slot count.
3.Slot counts should be front loaded . I suggest 8, 9, or 10 so that the builds can also be variable and the Logi can play with different fitting to see what matches their play style.
4. Each step should be equalized to give a clear sense of progression and advantage. Meaning that it is +2 slots from STD to ADV and a +2 to PRO or take the +2 then +3. These smaller steps give a clear advantage over the previous tier but are not so significant as to rule out using the tier before it. Yet the shift from STD to PRO, while great, is not so vast as to nullify all options except for PRO suits which is what happens with the Caldari and Gallente models.
Here are my suggestions that follow the above rules:
AMARR (Current) S- 2H/3L/2E + Side Arm 10 (LW/G) A- 2H/4L/3E + Side Arm +2 P- 3H/5L/3E + Side Arm +2 = 14 OR S- 2H/2L/2E + Side Arm 9 (LW/G) A- 2H/3L/3E + Side Arm +2 P- 3H/5L/3E + Side Arm +3 = 14
CALDARI (Current) S- 3H/3L/2E 10 (LW/G) A- 4H/3L/3E +2 P- 5H/4L/3E +2 = 14 OR S- 3H/2L/2E 9 (LW/G) A- 4H/2L/3E +2 P- 5H/4L/3E +3 = 14
GALLENTE S- 2H/3L/3E 10 (LW/G) A- 3H/4L/3E +2 P- 3H/5L/4E +2 = 14 OR S- 2H/2L/3E 9 (LW/G) A- 2H/4L/3E +2 P- 3H/5L/4E +3 = 14
MINMATAR S- 3H/2L/3E 10 (LW/G) A- 4H/3L/3E +2 P- 4H/4L/4E +2 = 14 OR S- 2H/2L/3E 9 (LW/G) A- 3H/3L/3E +2 P- 4H/4L/4E +3 = 14
Delivers Logis with equal slot counts and keeps them equal in tier movements. Personally, after looking at the progression it is difficult for me to decide which to take. The 10 slots starting out is more than what I am used to, but it also makes it a very choice suit. The extra open slots starting out would allow more variability and if PG/CPU stayed relatively the same the mods of the same nature (PG/CPU mods) will need to be used, and perhaps that is what the extra slots will be for. Plus the steps from STD to ADV and ADV to PRO suits offer even progression and have clear benefits for use. The canyon between STD and PRO is standardized, even, and is not as great as it was before for some fits.
The 9 slot suit starting out I am familiar with and the step to PRO is a big one but I also wonder if that is best, it may not be because while PRO equipment is the best it the gap in performance may be to large. The +3 from ADV to PRO may be more than what is healthy for balance. It is still not as bad as the +5 or +4 of the current version so at least it is better. But is it Best?
I donGÇÖt know. But this is where IGÇÖve placed my thoughts.
CCP Rattati, what are the anomalies you wanted to discuss?
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
637
|
Posted - 2014.07.19 22:03:00 -
[6] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:The variable slot count per tier for the logis specifically. I don't see a reason why we don't equalize slot count per tier this round. Any objections? :)
Thanks for the detailed feedback, it verifies my thoughts.
I would like to discuss having two passive logis that need to defend their placed equipment, AM and CA and two active logis, MM and GA. I.e. trading the CA low for a sidearm.
No objections to the slot count equalization here. :)
Concerning the AM and CA logis as Passive Logis and the GA and MM logis as Active Logis:
ON PASSIVE LOGIS - their need to defend placed equipment. Ultimately I do like the term Passive Logi. It categorizes their specialties in a way that I didn't really consider before. I had always just considered every Logi as an active logi and that doesn't fit the AM and CA bonuses which is why I have always disliked them. I have always seen a logi with a repair tool, nano, and sick stick (injector) - see my guide The Logi Code. Many logis came together and helped me build that resource that is still used and updated today. We keep trying to make it better and better for the new users. There we have always viewed each Logi as an active Logi and any that could not perform like a Logibro fell out of favor with our group.
The bonuses have been the real divider for the logistics group (relevant because this is what has killed the use of the CAL logi and lessened the use of the AM logi in the Logibro group). The bonuses' first introduction was better received than the latter as with the Logibro crowd we focus on Rep/Rez/Resupply with Rally/Reinforce being lower on the list; and the Minmatar got the best one for what we do, that plus the equipment nerf and CPU nerf really did in the CA Logi. - Sorry for the segway but a reanalysis of the Logi Bonuses is justified because the logistics is not just an EQuipment hauler but more the focused Logibro that supports his team mates. Anyway, moving on.
AMARR The Amarr Logi as a Passive Logi can work well. It classifies them and announces that they are simply better at placing equipment and adding some firepower to the team. Dropping an uplink here and there, repping, rezzing after a small skirmish makes sense because they can't active Logi as well. It may also mean that they are more of the AV logi and Ammo Logi - not as relied upon for repair or scanning. I love this Logi - I love the challenge, but I try to play him as an Active Logi and that is when I dislike the bonuses. But He is my "go to" for running without a squad. If he can keep his sidearm I'm all in.
If he/she were to receive the extra low that has been lacking that turns him into more of the armor laden defender and 'last man standing' to defend and support the group. I like it.
CALDARI I can see this working. Due to the nature of the CA bonus and defining it as a Passive Logi it would make it specialized as the AMARR is in being able to handle a bit more combat. The High Slots combined with the side arm would make for a great AV Logi that relies upon a side arm for combat but can save the team when an LAV or Dropship rolls in. - those highs for damage mods are useful when it comes to AV. He would be thin in the EHP department and would still need to run with the team. His Nano bonus demands it.
The slot adjustment would make it so that its current CPU might actually work for a sidearm rather than another module and having a consistent tier progression would be awesome to make STD and ADV suits a valid choice for battle.
SIDE NOTE: Like I said earlier the CA logi has had the short end of the stick as far as deals go. This relates to its bonus and history. Its bonus may need to be looked at or a resupply option found for Nano-Hives. They disappear so fast that another look at making them able to be restocked at a Resupply just by standing there, adding another 1 to the count a CA can carry, or increasing their nano count would be justified later on to bring it into the logi fold. THIS is not a deal breaker, bonuses are not on the table, but if/when we get back around to looking at logis and bonuses an adjustments conversation would be great.
ACTIVE LOGIs The 4 Equipment mules see little in the way of change that comes with their definition. BUT the slot change for the Gallente would be tremendous. Having any sort of balanced progression may affect beginners more than veterans who have already leveled up to PRO, but having this change makes other setups in the Gallente tiers, besides just PRO viable - so it makes a second option for support rather than just saying that the MIN is the only balanced logi and pushing all new players that direction if they want to go the active Logi route.
I would like to take these changes to my guide. And be better able to define the roles and advise new players.
SUPPORTED Equalizing the logis it so we don't have these two outliers (one with a sidearm and one with a module bonus) in the Logi lineup but rather Two ACTIVEs and two PASSIVEs is an acceptable and ingenious compromise to pushing them all to fit the active role - a great solution, thank you for bringing it up.
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
637
|
Posted - 2014.07.19 23:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:I don't understand the confusion, I originally said I don't like the complete irregularity that the Amarr logi sidearm is, because it obfuscates all true comparisons between the logis.
Now, if Caldari logis have a sidearm, and the same number of slots as the Amarr, then there is no singular discrepancy, then there is a reason and we can balance the two combat logis against each other.
TRUE
CCP Rattati wrote: Just as if we would remove the Amarr sidearm and the CA low, and equalize all the logis at all tiers.
I maintain that the dropsuit is such a fundamental item in the dust balance, that slot layouts should be very consistent, logical and not have inherent discrepancies, because those layouts translate into PG/CPU. ... The differences should be at the role/racial and module/weapon level and that's where our choices become truly meaningful.
AGREED
CCP Rattati wrote: In the end, none of these changes are necessary, they have been this way for a long time and maybe they shouldn't be touched. I am sure we can find other things to balance.
Wait! I will beg for this. But first let us discuss it a bit more if you need convincing.
This is a great thing to happen. As mentioned by the Horned Wolf the CA's Module slots may be too much. This may have been the large contributor to the SLAYER LOGI era of the CA Logi with its Shield bonus and monster amount of modules. What slayer wouldn't want 5/4 and all the CPU/PG in the world?. But the bonus was changed, CPU nerfed, and people moved on. But like a cancer maybe we missed something, maybe the root was removed but the contributory activities were not pursued. The CPU nerf didn't come until later. After the suit was still great for the Killer Bees. The CPU hit hurt the suit so much that only a crazy logi would use it... or so we thought.
A Cal Logi staking DMG mods (5possible) would skew the data and influence the change in stacking penalties and maybe even the DMG module nerf. But we solved that right?...
And it is still used! The Rail Rifle is sooo easy to fit the that limited CPU makes little difference to a 5/4 slayer that could stun lock (sorry I know you don't like that term) a player and with DMG mods it was easier than ever.
So, maybe our culprit is the 9 H/L that is throwing it off and not the classic 8 of the other suits.
I'm just saying that maybe this is a better move than we think. Ifi it is the wrong move we would know in a few months or perhaps that is something that the amazing CCP computer and economic personnel can forecast and tell us. OR maybe this is the right decision and balancing should come from standardizing the suits first and follow the data after.
I will try metaphors. The Rifle:If the barrel of a gun is curved (a result of storing it incorrectly) we can adjust the sights to match and still hit our target, until the gun is bent further. We can continue to adjust our sights and essentially solve the issue that we are dealing with at the time but if we took further action and found out that the fashion in which we where storing the gun was causing the barrel to curve we could solve that issue and future sight adjustments become less needed and ultimately less frequent. - True Story
The Tower - there was once a group of people who decided to build their facility on top of unstable ground. After laying the foundation and building the tower the people were happy. Time passed and the tower began to lean to one side. Fearing its collapse the people spent great fortunes to solidify the tower. Making sure that no brick would fall no column crumble form the shift in the building. Yet the tower leaned further. The happy people erected great machines and lines to pull the tower and stop its continuing but fated decent. Finally, someone decided to see if something could be done about the earth it was standing on rather than just continuing to fix the structure. The earth all around the structure was dug away; concrete poured around the foundation and out beyond the base of the tower; reinforcing and fixing the tower firmly in place. To remind themselves to search for the root of the problem and not just throw money at a falling building they left the Leaning Tower of Pisa, in Italy , still tilting to one side. - True Story
-- It feels great to solve a problems but perhaps we did not deal with the underlying issue. I am not blaming the Cal-Logi for everything, just showing that its module influence may be playing a larger role than we think and trying to highlight that maybe the problems we need to fix is this one here. Bringing it in line with the other logis fixes a broken suit. ---
POINT: Matching the slot counts across classes allows their small racial variables like stamina or shield recharge to be further contributors to dropsuit choice rather than, "this has the most modules - its better." IFF they are equalized it is the playstyle desired that is built from the components of race, dropsuits, modules, weapons, and equipment. If there is always a clear winner for any specific role then balance is lost. But if most everything is equal then it is skill, module choice, and chance that make the better players not just FOTM of adjusting a structure. Lets address the foundation.
Will this solve all balance issues? No. Does it help? Yes. Just because it is not identified as a major contributor to an issue does not make its adjustment any less valid. We can be flawed in our reasoning, research, and analysis. What if this change does create more balance? It will certainly make data analysis of the Logi class easier because the outliers will be removed and stop swaying the data.
All reasons to do this.
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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RedBleach LeSanglant
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
642
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Posted - 2014.07.23 05:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:And we are back.
TLDR; Charlie: New slot layout adopted for Sentinels and Assaults, with corresponding PG/CPU adaptations plus PG/CPU buff for Assaults and reduction for Sentinels. Universal slot layout matrix for Caldari changed from 4-1 to 3-2.
Now, based on your consolidated feedback,
The standardized slot layout matrix was pretty well received, yet overall there were the following worries:
...
3)Logistics, Amarr side arm and Caldari low slot at PRO a.Our proposal is to give both the sidearm at the cost of a single slot, not two as in the case of the Amarr. The Caldari will trade a low slot for the sidearm and the Amarr will trade an equipment slot for the sidearm. Not until Delta though.
4)Logistics, Gallente and Caldari STD and ADV to have equal total slot count as other Logistics a. These are scheduled for Delta as well as PG/CPU revisions if necessary.
3. Solid. Very excited and I can hardly wait for Delta. I may be understanding this incorrectly, but it is an interesting choice to have the Amarr sacrifice and EQ and Caldari sacrifice a low. Working it out I believe the bonuses will still need to be reworked to allow the 4EQ CAL to actually use those slots, but it makes more sense as well. Nanohives burst so quickly even with a bonus that having an extra EQ to stay with the party makes sense. The Amarr with 4EQ would be a sad logi, and its bonus would not work very well for that kind of setup. Sounds great
4. Awesome work! Finally they will have standardized base to operate from. The jump was just so aggravating I couldn't push myself to go that route and suffer for so long to get to the next tier, only to play ADV all the time to be at the STD level of other logis - it was just weird to envision and calculate. This is great for the Logi community. Thank you.
CCP Rattati wrote:6)Assault a.Very few grievances, if at all, with the new the new Assault suit layout, so will be adopted fully in Charlie b.Assault will move to a 4-6-8 layout of slots, gaining one high/low slot at both ADV and PRO. This standardizes Mediums and gives Assault a huge boost towards being a viable options in competitive surroundings. c.Assault will also get the same fitting bonus to Grenades. d.Assault will be getting a considerable buff to PG/CPU, shield tanking will be addressed but we are also looking at bringing energizers and rechargers down and trading for a small PG increase in Delta e. Assault will gain 150 ehp.
Please give us feedback on this, and this time please stay on topic. Thanks.
IT almost makes me laugh thinking about an Assault complaining about this shift. Who would complain about getting more slots, more EHP, better bonus, and more PG/CPU? HA! It is just to great - maybe even to OP. But, if this move satisfies the outlined goals for player counts and roles for the CCP Hive Mind then I believe I will be making myself and assault suit too. The bait is set, I can't wait to see how our assaults will test - I can imagine quite a few fittings being dusted off. Well done.
The standardized layouts, general buff, and all the work that has gone into this makes me kinda happy - just seeing it all come together :..| I am always so busy with work I've never had the time to jump in and participate like this and gotta tell you I was kinda hyped up to see some of these changes, be heard, and feel like I was helping. Oh, I'm sure I'll be cursing assaults when they are shooting me in the face, but for now I can be happy for the class - I really hope it becomes the slayers' go to choice for the game.
GOOD JORB CCP.
Long live the MEDium frames and Long live the Empress. Long life to us all and to the EVE Universe.
The Logi Code. Cross Atu for CPM1 - A logical choice
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