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Repair Tools are a little TOO dominant

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Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 108	Posted - 2014.05.30 12:33:00 - [1] - Quote I am not really a fan of how "popular" the rep tool is. It's basically a gimmick to farm WP, a copy paste from Eve space battle tactics that does NOT work the same way in an FPS. All it really does is enable a player to run around babysitting proto stompers, and tactically in PC it forces the heavy and logi into a symbiotic role that makes them useless in any other play style. In fact I would say this also forces heavies to use Light weapons to be independent of the Logi. In the words of a closed beta heavy who has given up Amarr for the Caldari Sentinel, "you're stuck with a logi and I have more freedom." I switched from the Minmatar Logi to the Amarr Sentinel in 1.8 to avoid being stuck with a rep tool, because honestly it is not my favorite play style. I would rather spend my time in an FPS shooting other players with a gun, not healing them constantly and basically being a slave on a leash. Then I decided once I was done skilling into the heavy to become a Gal Logi because Scouts are FOTM and I wanted to be their one weakness. But now I am realizing that I will be forced to skill into the Rep Tool no matter what I do, because no one wants to use a Logi in PC that doesn't "have reps." Wasn't the goal of changing the Logi bonuses in 1.8 to "reward specialization" into the racial equipment? I would say uplinks and repair tools are the ONLY thing people care about when hiring ringers or picking up players for PC battles. GûéGûäGûà /Gûî /Gûî /Gûî Gûî GûêGûêGûàGûâGûé IGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûê] GùÑGèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGùñn++
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1448	Posted - 2014.05.30 12:48:00 - [2] - Quote Reps are still a waste of time in PC. Logi's are much more usefull doing other things. Might I suggest watching videos of PC matches for examples. In pubs this playstyle is hardly dominant. You may see one or two repping logis per battle. That is only 1/8 of the team. Scouts on the other hand typically comprise 1/3 to 1/2 of the team and heavies are usually around 1/4. By comparison 1/8 is a pretty small proportion. Fun > Realism
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 108	Posted - 2014.05.30 12:55:00 - [3] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Reps are still a waste of time in PC. Logi's are much more usefull doing other things. Might I suggest watching videos of PC matches for examples. In pubs this playstyle is hardly dominant. You may see one or two repping logis per battle. That is only 1/8 of the team. Scouts on the other hand typically comprise 1/3 to 1/2 of the team and heavies are usually around 1/4. By comparison 1/8 is a pretty small proportion. So are you one of those guys who does surveys of every match he enters? Yeeeeah I dont care. Tell that to every ******* person in my corp, especially the ones in charge of things. Heavies always have a logi in the squad with them, and especially if there's more than one heavy in their squad they are told to be using their repair tool on those heavies. I really fail to see the validity of your point. Reps are always used in the PCs I am in, and how could they be a waste of time if they are the most effective way of earning Orbitals other than just throwing the donut on a Tank? In city maps the heavy on a logi's leash is REQUIRED. I don't care how many mass drivers or rail rifles you have running around circle jerking amongst themselves. Heavies with logis win battles. GûéGûäGûà /Gûî /Gûî /Gûî Gûî GûêGûêGûàGûâGûé IGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûê] GùÑGèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGùñn++
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 3452	Posted - 2014.05.30 17:37:00 - [4] - Quote I'm not sure I get your issue here. For one, you answered your own question. Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Heavies with logis win battles. Not for nothing, but if you are assembling lets say 2 squads, and you happen to have 2 logis and 2 heavies, would it make any sense to put the 2 logis in one squad and the 2 heavies in the other? Regardless of virtually any other factor? More to the point: If you don't want to use the rep tool because you only want to run around killing people, why exactly are you a "logi" again? You can currently do better with a cal scout than a gal logi if you want to hunt scouts. Assuming that gets "fixed" and scanners become very useful again, if your corp directors don't realize that, perhaps the problem lie there, and not with the game. (The godfather of tactical logistics) Quitting cold turkey was impossible. The forum patch is helping me kick the habit
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 109	Posted - 2014.05.30 20:43:00 - [5] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: You can also currently do better with a cal scout than a gal logi if you just want to hunt scouts. Assuming that gets "fixed" and scanners become very useful again, if your corp directors don't realize that, perhaps the problem lie there, and not with the game. You've got a point there. But they can't scan an uncloaked/unadequately dampened scout from 200 meters and make them flash really brightly. Quote: If you don't want to use the rep tool because you only want to run around killing people, why exactly are you a "logi" again? A good logi is not a one trick pony or killing oriented. Period. What about scans? Or needles? Nobody gives a ** if a Logi has those. Perhaps you missed the *** point of this thread just to be a and question how good I am at being a Logi even though I've been doing it for about 8 months and did fine without a Rep Tool. Look. If I was weighed down by walking a dog around the battlefield, I wouldn't be able to do the things I do. I pull off some pretty intense , that helps the team win the game more than just following around some heavy. Half the reason I became a Gal Logi was to run 3 scanners. You think I'll have time to rep you when I'm too busy pinpointing the location of the enemy? Get someone else to babysit your ass. I am just pissed off that people are so narrow minded they think my playstyle isn't as effective a use of a Logi as it would be if I had a rep tool. Sit on one of my triage hives that will be behind cover which you should be using to begin with instead of wanting to be an invincible perma-repped HP ***. GûéGûäGûà /Gûî /Gûî /Gûî Gûî GûêGûêGûàGûâGûé IGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûê] GùÑGèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGùñn++
Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 453	Posted - 2014.05.30 22:26:00 - [6] - Quote -5 Support Balancing scouts
THUNDERGROOVE The Last of DusT. 882	Posted - 2014.05.30 23:01:00 - [7] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Reps are still a waste of time in PC. Logi's are much more usefull doing other things. Might I suggest watching videos of PC matches for examples. This is only true if the other team has **** heavies. Otherwise he's wrong. >Team quota reached Darnit I have to wait for one of the blueberry shit LAVs to get blown up:(
Atiim Heaven's Lost Property 8962	Posted - 2014.05.30 23:16:00 - [8] - Quote So what is the point here? This doesn't offer any reason as to why the Repair Tools need to be nerfed again. Though of course the Repair Tool would (and should) be the most dominant, as it is the least situational. HvLP Spreadsheet Warrior Why Do Slayers Get All The Credit? :( -HAND
Martin0 Brancaleone Maphia Clan Corporation 542	Posted - 2014.05.31 07:47:00 - [9] - Quote Why other equipement isn't used much? Lets see: 1- Nanite injectors. For some reason about 2/3 of the dead people end up below the ground and can't be revived. The proto version gives as much WP as the militia one. 2- Scanners. For some reasons scanners give +15 "scan assists" only for you squad, you can light up the entire team, a blueberry can launch an orbital and kill 10 of them and you get 0 wp. And recharge time is soooooo long. 3- Drop uplinks. Good only on the amarr logi. Toooooo slow 4- Nanohives. Dries up almost immediately unless used on a caldari logi. Repair tool: still good on every Logi, awesome on the minmatar logi. It is the only piece of equipement that is reliable in giving WP. IMO the repair tool is fine but everything else was nerfed too much. Or doesen't work (see injectors).
Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 454	Posted - 2014.05.31 08:19:00 - [10] - Quote Since the scanner is now "snapshot" it should be displayed for all the players on the team, making it more usefull, and allowing a scanner logi to accumulate points. :p Stupid Idea #247 Support Balancing scouts

Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 454	Posted - 2014.05.31 08:30:00 - [11] - Quote Spartan MK420 wrote: Since the scanner is now "snapshot" it should be displayed for all the players on the team, making it more usefull, and allowing a scanner logi to accumulate points. :p Stupid Idea #247 Trolling myself, nothing to see here, move along. Support Balancing scouts
Vitoka79 from SVK ACME SPECIAL FORCES RISE of LEGION 88	Posted - 2014.05.31 12:52:00 - [12] - Quote Guardian WP is the problem.We should only get it when we actualy rep some armor. I don't need a pilot suit.I made my own without skill bonuses :( Crashing dropships since september 2012...
RogueTrooper 2000AD RoyaLBanKof 64	Posted - 2014.05.31 12:59:00 - [13] - Quote Op is either mad, a newb or both. I'm not even going to shoot down this ridiculous short sighted thread but I will say that some people enjoy a change from just shooting people in the face. A decent logi controls the ebb and flow of battle. Iv had hate mail for being so efficient, some people actually want to die. Service with a smile
ANON Cerberus Tiny Toons 794	Posted - 2014.05.31 15:21:00 - [14] - Quote I have to concur that the OP is certianly not speaking for most people. A rep logi is effectively DPS lost at the price of increased repair. Also you cannot compare the head to head survive time of a caldari sentinel vs an armor sentinel with repair support. The Caldari sentinel is more hit and run style, able to take medium amounts of damage and then getting to cover to recharge that shield. Right now I feel the Caldari heavy needs a slightly increased base shield recharge. On the other hand armour sentinels tend to be HP monsters that when coupled with logi support can take a beating. Its mostly fine as it is. Also, like others have said, in PC battles - logis usually have much more important jobs to do than repair babysitting.
MoonEagle A Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 199	Posted - 2014.05.31 16:21:00 - [15] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: I'm not sure I get your issue here. For one, you answered your own question. Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Heavies with logis win battles. Not for nothing, but if you are assembling lets say 2 squads, and you happen to have 2 logis and 2 heavies, would it make any sense to put the 2 logis in one squad and the 2 heavies in the other? Regardless of virtually any other factor? More to the point: If you don't want to use the rep tool because you only want to run around killing people, why exactly are you a "logi" again? A good logi is not a one trick pony or killing oriented. Period. He/she also doesn't just run around following the heavy like the beam is one of those leash backpacks parents put on hyper little kids so they don't run off by themselves in a crowded place (tho it's otherwise a good analogy, lol). It's not as easy as you think to follow around a rampaging beast without getting killed all the time whilst simultaneously keeping your lock and relaying tactical information to him. (All of my chubby chaser suits have scanners on them, btw. I also play pretty well drunk. Maybe you can't handle your booze?) You can also currently do better with a cal scout than a gal logi if you just want to hunt scouts. Assuming that gets "fixed" and scanners become very useful again, if your corp directors don't realize that, perhaps the problem lie there, and not with the game. Agree! As a dedicated logi, I can say that I loathe following just one person. I don't care if people disagree. I get bored. I am too busy running around looking for people who need healing, ammo, reviving and good spawn places. If I get to kill someone in the process, hooray!
TechMechMeds Inner.Hell 3465	Posted - 2014.05.31 17:09:00 - [16] - Quote MoonEagle A wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: I'm not sure I get your issue here. For one, you answered your own question. Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Heavies with logis win battles. Not for nothing, but if you are assembling lets say 2 squads, and you happen to have 2 logis and 2 heavies, would it make any sense to put the 2 logis in one squad and the 2 heavies in the other? Regardless of virtually any other factor? More to the point: If you don't want to use the rep tool because you only want to run around killing people, why exactly are you a "logi" again? A good logi is not a one trick pony or killing oriented. Period. He/she also doesn't just run around following the heavy like the beam is one of those leash backpacks parents put on hyper little kids so they don't run off by themselves in a crowded place (tho it's otherwise a good analogy, lol). It's not as easy as you think to follow around a rampaging beast without getting killed all the time whilst simultaneously keeping your lock and relaying tactical information to him. (All of my chubby chaser suits have scanners on them, btw. I also play pretty well drunk. Maybe you can't handle your booze?) You can also currently do better with a cal scout than a gal logi if you just want to hunt scouts. Assuming that gets "fixed" and scanners become very useful again, if your corp directors don't realize that, perhaps the problem lie there, and not with the game. Agree! As a dedicated logi, I can say that I loathe following just one person. I don't care if people disagree. I get bored. I am too busy running around looking for people who need healing, ammo, reviving and good spawn places. If I get to kill someone in the process, hooray! If you have nothing to do as a logi then you need to re supply. Edit: Or you are trapped in a corner with 50 armour left lol. If you stop moving You die Dance with me
Medical Crash Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 353	Posted - 2014.05.31 19:16:00 - [17] - Quote I was 100% certain no one would ever complain about "Repair Tools", well I was wrong. The hell is wrong with OP? Nerf the already nerfed Rep tools? You crazy bra? You mirin? Oh lawd jenkins OH LAWD JENKINS
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 112	Posted - 2014.06.01 04:17:00 - [18] - Quote Seriously, fck you guys. Oh yeah. Reps on heavies are totally useless. Especially in that Cargo Hub city map we just lost a PC battle in because of all the heavies with logis on them, and of course my squad's logis were nowhere to be found and I never got reps. I hope you people realize that this game starts to get boring after a while. And just seeing all these logis and heavies thinking they're OP as *** is really sad. All they're doing is exploiting a mechanic in the game that makes them near-invincible. F*ck all of you I'm gonna go play Tomb Raider. Much better game than Dust. By the way I wasn't saying "nerf the rep tool lol" that's just what you idiots thought I said because you have the attention span of cheese sandwiches. GûéGûäGûà /Gûî /Gûî /Gûî Gûî GûêGûêGûàGûâGûé IGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûê] GùÑGèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGùñn++
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries 10074	Posted - 2014.06.01 04:37:00 - [19] - Quote Look at how much a proto repair tool repairs. Look at how much DPS an unskilled STD rifle does. So where would the logi be more useful in battle, with a repair tool out or with a gun out? Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
Meee One BATTLE SURVEY GROUP Dark Taboo 810	Posted - 2014.06.01 05:40:00 - [20] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Seriously, fck you guys. Oh yeah. Reps on heavies are totally useless. Especially in that Cargo Hub city map we just lost a PC battle in because of all the heavies with logis on them, and of course my squad's logis were nowhere to be found and I never got reps. I hope you people realize that this game starts to get boring after a while. And just seeing all these logis and heavies thinking they're OP as *** is really sad. All they're doing is exploiting a mechanic in the game that makes them near-invincible. F*ck all of you I'm gonna go play Tomb Raider. Much better game than Dust. By the way I wasn't saying "nerf the rep tool lol" that's just what you idiots thought I said because you have the attention span of cheese sandwiches. Sounds like either: -You charged in by yourself like an idiot or -You need better logis I'm a decent logi,and if you want i'll show you how a true support logi should behave. Mail meee in-game and i'll squad up with you.

Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 113	Posted - 2014.06.01 06:44:00 - [21] - Quote Meee One wrote: Sounds like either: -You charged in by yourself like an idiot or -You need better logis I'm a decent logi,and if you want i'll show you how a true support logi should behave. Mail meee in-game and i'll squad up with you. Both. But I didn't really have a choice but to charge in because yeah, my corp were being a bunch of incompetent fcks. Problem is I think a lot of us switched roles in 1.8 with the respec and aren't really used to doing it right. Plus our corp is ***** up right now because one of the better people in charge left the game. GûéGûäGûà /Gûî /Gûî /Gûî Gûî GûêGûêGûàGûâGûé IGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûê] GùÑGèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGùñn++
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 113	Posted - 2014.06.01 06:47:00 - [22] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Look at how much a proto repair tool repairs. Look at how much DPS an unskilled STD rifle does. So where would the logi be more useful in battle, with a repair tool out or with a gun out? Exactly. Take the PC battle I'm talking about for example. We would've been better off if someone was hitting them with mass drivers and ****. GûéGûäGûà /Gûî /Gûî /Gûî Gûî GûêGûêGûàGûâGûé IGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûêGûê] GùÑGèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGû¦GèÖGùñn++
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1454	Posted - 2014.06.01 06:51:00 - [23] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Look at how much a proto repair tool repairs. Look at how much DPS an unskilled STD rifle does. So where would the logi be more useful in battle, with a repair tool out or with a gun out? Exactly. Take the PC battle I'm talking about for example. We would've been better off if someone was hitting them with mass drivers and ****. Wait...so you are agreeing with me. Logos have better things to do in PC than run rep tools. The DPS they can put out is much more important than the minimal tank they can provide. Fun > Realism
Grimmiers 571	Posted - 2014.06.01 13:17:00 - [24] - Quote If you're a gal logi in pc just use a multiscanner setup. Having a repper might not even work with shotgun scouts around, but if you can scan them frequently you'll probably be better off. Also I feel like the Brick tank heavies are too effective without a repper, but that might be the hmg doing nuke damage before you can even break shields up.
manboar thunder fist SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 37	Posted - 2014.06.01 13:50:00 - [25] - Quote Wow OP is a rage nub... Git gud, every time I see a rep logi heavy combo I do one of three things: Shotgun the logi in the back and then harass the heavy with melee Shoot the logi from afar with my light rifle then lol at the heavy Get in a forge gun suit and blow the heavy away leaving a depressed useless logi behind 1.8 will shoot my amarr logi in the face with an ion pistol then bury it under a caldari heavy. No, not alive thankfully
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 3471	Posted - 2014.06.01 19:11:00 - [26] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Both. But I didn't really have a choice but to charge in because yeah, my corp were being a bunch of incompetent fcks. Problem is I think a lot of us switched roles in 1.8 with the respec and aren't really used to doing it right. Plus our corp is ***** up right now because one of the better people in charge left the game. I think we may have found our answer, OP.... (The godfather of tactical logistics) Quitting cold turkey was impossible. The forum patch is helping me kick the habit
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 128	Posted - 2014.06.02 00:01:00 - [27] - Quote Grimmiers wrote: If you're a gal logi in pc just use a multiscanner setup. Having a repper might not even work with shotgun scouts around, but if you can scan them frequently you'll probably be better off. Also I feel like the Brick tank heavies are too effective without a repper, but that might be the hmg doing nuke damage before you can even break shields up. one of the only constructive posts in this thread unfortunately like i said... when I x up for PC with "heavy or scanner logi" no one wants the scanner logi. No one. dinosaurs for legion, oh wait i won't be playing it
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 128	Posted - 2014.06.02 00:03:00 - [28] - Quote manboar thunder fist wrote: Wow OP is a rage nub... Git gud, every time I see a rep logi heavy combo I do one of three things: Shotgun the logi in the back and then harass the heavy with melee Shoot the logi from afar with my light rifle then lol at the heavy Get in a forge gun suit and blow the heavy away leaving a depressed useless logi behind Yeah, it's a little hard when you're a heavy with no logi on you, and the heavy and the logi see you and come after you. At that point it's either: Kill the Logi, or kill the Heavy before you die. dinosaurs for legion, oh wait i won't be playing it
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3176	Posted - 2014.06.02 00:55:00 - [29] - Quote Logis with reptools are useless for PC matches. I would rather have 2 caldari heavys tearing stuff up then 1 heavy that has a logi behind him trying to rep. In the end you get more firepower and thats all what matters. And for PC matches you should have all your slots filled with uplinks and maybe 1 nanohive.
Defy Gravity 421	Posted - 2014.06.02 05:40:00 - [30] - Quote Spartan MK420 wrote: Since the scanner is now "snapshot" it should be displayed for all the players on the team, making it more usefull, and allowing a scanner logi to accumulate points. :p Stupid Idea #247 what was stupid idea 246? If I kill you in game, look for a confirmation that says "I Just Killed You"

John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 3473	Posted - 2014.06.02 12:02:00 - [31] - Quote Defy Gravity wrote: Spartan MK420 wrote: Since the scanner is now "snapshot" it should be displayed for all the players on the team, making it more usefull, and allowing a scanner logi to accumulate points. :p Stupid Idea #247 what was stupid idea 246? Keep playing Dust (The godfather of tactical logistics) Quitting cold turkey was impossible. The forum patch is helping me kick the habit
Atiim Heaven's Lost Property 9038	Posted - 2014.06.02 13:07:00 - [32] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: Defy Gravity wrote: Spartan MK420 wrote: Since the scanner is now "snapshot" it should be displayed for all the players on the team, making it more usefull, and allowing a scanner logi to accumulate points. :p Stupid Idea #247 what was stupid idea 246? Keep playing Dust No that's stupid idea #514. #216 is trusting CCP. HvLP Spreadsheet Warrior Why Do Slayers Get All The Credit? :( -HAND
I-Shayz-I I-----I 3566	Posted - 2014.06.04 04:15:00 - [33] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Look at how much a proto repair tool repairs. Look at how much DPS an unskilled STD rifle does. So where would the logi be more useful in battle, with a repair tool out or with a gun out? This is assuming all bullets hit the target, and the heavy stands still and never uses cover. -_- Such an annoying and stupid argument. Either way, I usually try to help apply DPS then rep the heavy as he runs back to cover, or rep the heavy after he kills things. Those guardian points though when you have a good heavy...I'd keep my core focused on him all day long :3 What sucks is when I'm the only good heavy on the team :/ 7162 wp with a Repair Tool! List of Legion Feedback Threads!
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 24	Posted - 2014.06.04 18:30:00 - [34] - Quote Remote repairers are useless unless your babying a bricked heavy. most of the time i use adv or higher injector, uplink and hive for much more WPs.. last match i was at 2050 points and i didnt realise till end of the match and i sooo could have called an orbital T_T Nanite Injectors! Nanite Injectors Everywhere! Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone?
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 141	Posted - 2014.06.04 23:10:00 - [35] - Quote Well after being babied by a logi all night last night I have decided ** it, I'm skilling into the rep tool. But I still feel like this thread is valid. Think about it. Even if a Gallente Logi has reps, he is less valuable to those people who want you to have constant reps on heavies in PC. The way old four-eyes has to do it now is pause to make a scan, rep a little, pause to make another scan and/or drop equipment, rep some more. The Gal Logi with reps will be a less effective scanner. By a lot. Apothecary Za'ki wrote:** Remote repairers are useless unless your babying a bricked heavy. most of the time i use adv or higher injector, uplink and hive for much more WPs.. last match i was at 2050 points and i didnt realise till end of the match and i sooo could have called an orbital T_T People in your squad will be pissed if you have a needle with no reps. Especially if they start taking fire right after you revive them. dinosaurs for legion, oh wait i won't be playing it
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 25	Posted - 2014.06.05 10:27:00 - [36] - Quote Martin0 Brancaleone wrote: Why other equipement isn't used much? Lets see: 1- Nanite injectors. For some reason about 2/3 of the dead people end up below the ground and can't be revived. The proto version gives as much WP as the militia one. 2- Scanners. For some reasons scanners give +15 "scan assists" only for you squad, you can light up the entire team, a blueberry can launch an orbital and kill 10 of them and you get 0 wp. And recharge time is soooooo long. 3- Drop uplinks. Good only on the amarr logi. Toooooo slow 4- Nanohives. Dries up almost immediately unless used on a caldari logi. Repair tool: still good on every Logi, awesome on the minmatar logi. It is the only piece of equipement that is reliable in giving WP. IMO the repair tool is fine but everything else was nerfed too much. Or doesen't work (see injectors). 1. i think its fair as your only doing the same thing only with a bigger needle. 2. yes it only applies for squad kill assists and not sure if it shows them up for your entire side or just your squad. needs to be changed to showing the enemy to the WHOLE TEAM and getting points for for the kills the TEAM gets on tagged targets. 3. advanced drop uplinks seem ok-ish.. 4. they only dry up fast when replenishing nades.. nades need to be "balanced" so they take a little less of the nanites from the hive. Nanite Injectors! Nanite Injectors Everywhere! Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone?
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 25	Posted - 2014.06.05 10:29:00 - [37] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Well after being babied by a logi all night last night I have decided ** it, I'm skilling into the rep tool. But I still feel like this thread is valid. Think about it. Even if a Gallente Logi has reps, he is less valuable to those people who want you to have constant reps on heavies in PC. The way old four-eyes has to do it now is pause to make a scan, rep a little, pause to make another scan and/or drop equipment, rep some more. The Gal Logi with reps will be a less effective scanner. By a lot. Apothecary Za'ki wrote:** Remote repairers are useless unless your babying a bricked heavy. most of the time i use adv or higher injector, uplink and hive for much more WPs.. last match i was at 2050 points and i didnt realise till end of the match and i sooo could have called an orbital T_T People in your squad will be pissed if you have a needle with no reps. Especially if they start taking fire right after you revive them. depends on which loadout im useing but if they are not smart enough to fall back to cover when revived then Darwin to them. rule #1 of injectors. dont revive people who are in the line of fire or in anyway goign to be insta killed soon as they are revived. Nanite Injectors! Nanite Injectors Everywhere! Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone?
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 25	Posted - 2014.06.05 10:30:00 - [38] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Look at how much a proto repair tool repairs. Look at how much DPS an unskilled STD rifle does. So where would the logi be more useful in battle, with a repair tool out or with a gun out? This is assuming all bullets hit the target, and the heavy stands still and never uses cover. -_- Such an annoying and stupid argument. Either way, I usually try to help apply DPS then rep the heavy as he runs back to cover, or rep the heavy after he kills things. Those guardian points though when you have a good heavy...I'd keep my core focused on him all day long :3 What sucks is when I'm the only good heavy on the team :/ a heavy will die FAST even with reps if 2+ people focus him/her Nanite Injectors! Nanite Injectors Everywhere! Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone?
Yin Lon Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2014.06.05 18:50:00 - [39] - Quote Hmm. A question to be had, To nerf or not to nerf that is the question... The highest repair tool is 160 dmg / sec, I assume that's a high end repair set. The little assault rifle i have deals about 20 dmg / round and fires a clip in 20 secs. if two people are mending that's 320 dmg / sec versus a clip of 60 rounds of 20 damage each is 1200 dmg... Tough one... I do think the healing per sec should be dropped a tad. But not to an extreme where they don't want to heal any more. here's what I think... Low end repair tools should start low. say 5 - 10 / sec. A significant decrease from 40 I can assure you. Tier 1's should be more towards the same though say 15 to 30 damage per second. Tier 3's should also be modified to 30 to 45 damage per second. And finally Tier 5's should be modified to 50 to 80 damage per second. But to also factor in, that they have unlimited ammo. That also makes them extremely powerful. So, have like a recharge rate... A recharge tool could keep it's stats if it had 100 energy, and used about 5 energy per second of use, (which would get about 20 second of 80 damage times 2 users is a total of 3200 total repaired damage before both users had to recharge. We could also have recharge rates be for Low Ends like 3.0 Energy per Sec Tier 1's @ 2.5 Energy / Sec Tier 3's @ 2.0 Energy / Sec Tier 5's @ 1.5 Energy / Sec Maybe the exact solution is somewhere between. but that's to the developers to figure out.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 2244	Posted - 2014.06.05 19:14:00 - [40] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: I am not really a fan of how "popular" the rep tool is. It's basically a gimmick to farm WP, a copy paste from Eve space battle tactics that does NOT work the same way in an FPS. All it really does is enable a player to run around babysitting proto stompers, and tactically in PC it forces the heavy and logi into a symbiotic role that makes them useless in any other play style. In fact I would say this also forces heavies to use Light weapons to be independent of the Logi. In the words of a closed beta heavy who has given up Amarr for the Caldari Sentinel, "you're stuck with a logi and I have more freedom." I switched from the Minmatar Logi to the Amarr Sentinel in 1.8 to avoid being stuck with a rep tool, because honestly it is not my favorite play style. I would rather spend my time in an FPS shooting other players with a gun, not healing them constantly and basically being a slave on a leash. Then I decided once I was done skilling into the heavy to become a Gal Logi because Scouts are FOTM and I wanted to be their one weakness. But now I am realizing that I will be forced to skill into the Rep Tool no matter what I do, because no one wants to use a Logi in PC that doesn't "have reps." Wasn't the goal of changing the Logi bonuses in 1.8 to "reward specialization" into the racial equipment? I would say uplinks and repair tools are the ONLY thing people care about when hiring ringers or picking up players for PC battles. Support Logi in the current meta are deeply broken and largely ineffective. It's a shame, I've been support logi since closed beta, I have all 4 races logi suits proto, and frankly one of the only pseudo-viable builds for a logi in competitive play is the "killer bee". There's a lot which goes into this problem, but a major factor is that the scaling of the equipment line is broken when it comes to earnings, and less than polished with regards to other aspects of utility/parity. The whole support role/meta needs an overhaul and some love. It's been quite a long time that dedicated support players are in a bad spot while overlap roles or outright abuses of equipment (Cal-"SlayerLogi" with extender bonus) are far more viable on the field. Some of these issues have been persistent since closed beta with no specific eta on a fix. TL;DR - The Rep Tool isn't the problem, it's merely a symptom of a much larger issue. 0.02 ISK Cross Cross Atu for CPM1- An emergent candidate



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