A post without proper capitalization and a misspelling in the first sentence is no doubt one the poster cares little about. If he or she truly cared about what they had to say, they would have spent slightly more time, effort, and care in making the post.

it is also an unequivocal fact, that based on the amount of stuff other companies have been capable of doing on the ps3 that ccp did not bring dust to its full potential, and probably more truthfully spoken, were not skilled enough too.

I would say its more of a lack of experience working on consoles, which I'm sure factored in to porting it to the PC, a system they have much more experience with. Though your conclusion does tie in nicely with the theme of your post.

This wont be nice.

The average gamer is too thick and has too little an attention span for such deep and complex games like eve. Even planetside 2 is too much for most and its a very simple fps lol.

Dust was continually dumbed down for console players and was probably another reason to stop making it on console. The players cant even handle the game so why bother?.

this is why companies churn out game after same shtty game with different graphics and a story, to keep the fishes happy in their bowl and milk the f out of that pathetic attention span and people may as well be as blind as a fish because they keep falling for rubbish like titanfool and lol destiny.

A lot of the new stuff in destiny has been featured in many games as well.

Keep drinking the console scrubaid.

This wont be nice.

The average gamer is too thick and has too little an attention span for such deep and complex games like eve. Even planetside 2 is too much for most and its a very simple fps lol.

Dust was continually dumbed down for console players and was probably another reason to stop making it on console. The players cant even handle the game so why bother?.

this is why companies churn out game after same shtty game with different graphics and a story, to keep the fishes happy in their bowl and milk the f out of that pathetic attention span and people may as well be as blind as a fish because they keep falling for rubbish like titanfool and lol destiny.

A lot of the new stuff in destiny has been featured in many games as well.

Keep drinking the console scrubaid.

god damned kids, remember naughty dog for their roots, PLAYSTATION ONE BITCHES
naughty dog have been in business for 30 years.

troll post is troll.

if ccp were smart they would have tried working with them, at least for consulting.... sigh at what could have been....

No im serious.

you can palm it off as that if you want though, im sure that will make you feel better.

really? are you cereal? so cereal?

/slow clap

and as far as palming goes, yes it does feel good... I palm it every night before I go to sleep sometimes I even let my wife palm it... but she doesn't have my technique...

thats better how?.

A man acting like a neckbeard.

a MAN bringing emotion into thinking when it comes to critical and logical thinking?.

slow clap brosephine.

i dont believe you.

Your thread is priceless.

Why wouldn't i keep it relevant?.

it is pure and simple fact that ps3 is last gen and its days are numbered

it is also fact that porting a game from ps3 to ps4 is NOT an easy thing to do, there's an article by naughty dog explaining how difficult it was to do it with the last of us; and this is a company that has had over 7 years experience on the ps3 ...plus more years on ps2...but they did do it...

it is also an unequivocal fact, that based on the amount of stuff other companies have been capable of doing on the ps3 that ccp did not bring dust to its full potential, and probably more truthfully spoken, were not skilled enough too.

it is also a fact that eve is the only successful game they have ever had, it is very niche, it has had TONS of problems over the years (incarna for one),and unlike most triple A titles it has never had millions of people who play it, the average amount on at any given time including dust players is about 35,000 WORLD WIDE that is nothing! the most eve ever had on at once was around 60,000 WORLD WIDE.

the bottom line is ccp has not done anything to inspire confidence that they can pull legion off... the ps3 wasn't the problem, their lack of ability and application has always been the issue.

if this wasn't true dust would have been better than it was because as we all know the ps3 has had lots of great games, and MMO's like ff14, DCUO, have also been done successfully.

there is no excuse for why they could not have had:

PVE

a player market ( not connected to eve)

32v32 matches

an efficient tutorial for beginners

better controls

better balance

etc etc etc

all other good ps3 games have these things. while dust may be a more in depth shooter experience its coding was not so much more complicated than every other triple A ps3 game that it had a disadvantage to compete....it was simply a failure to hire competent people which resulted in a skill deficit of the development team trying to complete the task... which is fact because most of the old devs are gone.

but instead of hiring competent people who could rework the ps3 version of dust and port it to ps4 they hired instead people to port it to PC with a nice new shiny name... and they haven't even ok'ed the game yet.

by the way they handled fan fest this new arm of ccp doesn't look any more prepared or capable of delivering the dream of legion anymore than the old team was capable of delivering the old dream of dust.

if legion fails, how many more dreams will you let ccp sell you?

I agree completely.

thanks.

I cant wait to read your next post!

Thanks for coming here to tell us this. I, for one, had no idea.

You do nothing to discredit the neckbeard claims, especially as you have not taught her any technique and nor does she know any.

You can continue to behave like you enjoy getting ridiculed all you want, im not going anywhere.

so did you learn anything after what ccp has done?.

Actually, there are valid tech reasons for the lack of PvE, matches bigger than 16v16, hell maybe even dedicated tutorial maps - simply put, due to the unique nature of the game, Dust has a larger overhead than other games it might be compared to. The PS3 can't cope anything that would add any more.

Controls - the DS3 does not have enough buttons.

Player market / EVE market - overhead, plus network stuff and the whole "not breaking EVE" thing

Balance and NPE - both could and should have been done better. However, Dust is effing complicated, so neither are exactly exactly easy.

Actually, there are valid tech reasons for the lack of PvE, matches bigger than 16v16, hell maybe even dedicated tutorial maps - simply put, due to the unique nature of the game, Dust has a larger overhead than other games it might be compared to. The PS3 can't cope anything that would add any more.

Controls - the DS3 does not have enough buttons.

Player market / EVE market - overhead, plus network stuff and the whole "not breaking EVE" thing

Balance and NPE - both could and should have been done better. However, Dust is effing complicated, so neither are exactly exactly easy.

A post without proper capitalization and a misspelling in the first sentence is no doubt one the poster cares little about. If he or she truly cared about what they had to say, they would have spent slightly more time, effort, and care in making the post.

Dust is unnecessarily complicated. It's a schizophrenic mish-mash of front-end equation fiddling and results-based criticism. They could have easily simulated the ties to EvE, simplified the weapons load-outs, matchmade by K/D(r) and WP/D(r) and had something worth selling until Legion hit. They chose to do, um, this. Whatever that is.

Not really, not if they wanted it to still be Dust - although there are some decent efficiency gains to be made by reworking Catma in a similar manner to what the EVE guys are doing with Dogma (assuming the two's inner working are similar - which isn't unreasonable).

Matchmaking, yeah that's a whole thing...

the idea of dust is more complicated than the reality of it....

its all smoke and mirrors just like eve.... eve has almost no graphics when you think about it its just a lot of pretty looking space pictures on a 2-d plain that gives the illusion of a large open universe, when really (and I don't have the exact numbers) every X amount of distance just puts you in a new "room" every time you jump, it just puts you in a new "room" you didn't actualy travel all the distance youre made to believe you covered...

dust is the same kind of illusion. it's a lobby shooter... you go from your little room to a bigger room with 31 random people, the red line are the walls to that room... you don't actually travel through a universe to a planet... nothing but the text telling you that you are on xyz planet is done to put you there...

my point?

pve could be done the same way, incredibly easily... a single player or maybe 4 man "room" where you kill some drones or npc soldiers and such and then back to your little room when its done.

there is nothing complicated about doing something like this... there are many complicated ps3 games that do so much more than this... don't let ccp fool you... it was their lack of skill and not short comings on the ps3 that made dust the way it was/is

Not really, not if they wanted it to still be Dust - although there are some decent efficiency gains to be made by reworking Catma in a similar manner to what the EVE guys are doing with Dogma (assuming the two's inner working are similar - which isn't unreasonable).

Matchmaking, yeah that's a whole thing...

I'm not going to be CCP's pr team or try to explain what "I think" happened. last time I did that they royally shafted me, lesson learned fellas, the only thing you're laser focused on is my anus.

now everything I'm about to say is probably total bullshit, but I feel like it's important to add another perspective.

Hi, EVE player here, and as such very familiar with the concept of grids.

Dust's complexity doesn't solely come from the number of people on grid (and 16 v 16 is still pretty high by PS3 standards), but from the Items, skills etc - basically anything Catma (Dust's Dogma) touches.

PvE, I guess CCP could have done a crappy, very much on rails, version where a small squad has to clear out a series of small room / waves - but that would have been both a waste of resources and a slap in the face to the playerbase.

I never said I knew anything about coding btw.... I'[b]m simply an intuitive person with some critical thinking skills, so I'm able to see what has been done with the ps3 and then look at dust and see how far below that bar the game is and for no reason that I can see or for that matter any reason ccp ever detailed....

okay, let's step back for a second and look at this from a different perspective...



dust on PS3 was going to fail, that was a given, they optimized it as far as they could and then came to a jucture. do they stay the course and start PS4 development or do they move to a different system?

benefits of PC
existing fanbase
10 yrs development experience
no need to worry about console lifecycles
existing code for nonessential systems (IE the market)
a test server

benefits of PS4
small existing hardcore fanbase
some code will transfer up with less modification

as a business decision, leaving out your own feelings, the PC has more to offer the company.
that sucks but damned if it isn't true. and in the same situation I'd be hard pressed not to make the same decision.

okay, let's step back for a second and look at this from a different perspective...



dust on PS3 was going to fail, that was a given, they optimized it as far as they could and then came to a jucture. do they stay the course and start PS4 development or do they move to a different system?

benefits of PC
existing fanbase
10 yrs development experience
no need to worry about console lifecycles
existing code for nonessential systems (IE the market)
a test server

benefits of PS4
small existing hardcore fanbase
some code will transfer up with less modification

So in other words, you assumed everything - well we all know what happens when you assume things...

...You make an ASS out of U and ME You miss some really important stuff that is admittedly not immediately obvious.

more bs propaganda from the ccp anal sniffing canine sycophants...

10years of fumbling and bumbling... still have not met most of their promises in eve development... lets not forget what happened to WOD in that 10 years of experience either... just another ccp fail...

console lifecycles are getting longer and longer... whats ps3 going on now? 8 years ish...still making content like DS2 and stick of truth.... how long did the ps2 stay relevant after ps3 release? about 3 or 4 years?..... ps3 will still be relevant for at least 1/2 of that time...

how does ff14 or dcuo test content? they are on ps3... what about when destiny and the division come out for ps4? what about eso online? seems to be going fine... test server is a lame copout exuse there are obviously work arounds.

small existing hardcore fanbase... like eve... and those are the ones who spend the most $$$ and ccp shite on a whole bunch of them.....all because they still cant be honest and admit they are just bad at this thing, and to stuck up to listen to people who know better, or even to hire some...

No im serious.

you can palm it off as that if you want though, im sure that will make you feel better.

10years of fumbling and bumbling... still have not met most of their promises in eve development... lets not forget what happened to WOD in that 10 years of experience either... just another ccp fail...

and for all your pomp, you still haven't said anything relevant... you just regurgitate vague statements that have been vomited over and over since this debacle began...

back your shite up... tell us from a "coders" perspective what makes dust more complicated than call of duty, and FF14....or mag... or dcuo... or battlefield... or darksouls 2....

tell us why the ps4 which can handle eso and will be supporting destiny, cant handle complicated dust....

be specific since you act like you know this stuff....

why cant dust have a player market not connected to eve?
why cant dust have pve like a battlefield style campaign or a horde mode?

why cant dust have a more in depth tutorial?
or cosmetic items?
etc etc...

spell this shite out for me oh wise one.....

Iv gotten so bored trying to make people see it from that perspective.

In game as well.



I don't like what they have done but its the right decision.

Dust showcases CCP's lack of talent to program for the PS3.
By switching to a PC platform CCP is hoping that they can overcome their coding shortcomings with raw computing power.
What they really are doing is switching from a mature console with millions of gamers and fixed hardware to a market that has great variations of hardware and significantly lower numbers.
Personally I suspect that legion will be a very short lived game assuming it ever even makes it into production.
CCP has alienated a great deal of the current player base.

Sure the PS3 might be limited when compaired to modern consoles or a modern PC. However if you look at other games on the PS3 you can easily see that there was a lot of room DUST could have improved on IF CCP had the talent.

Also FWIW CCP is using the unreal 3 engine for Legion which i think is just going to doom the project to failure and shows CCP's unwillingness to actually LEARN anything at all.

Well it's flawed logic.

They are using the same heavily modified UE3 that they used for dust. They gained that experience working on dust, not eve. So no they do not have 10 years of experience to contribute to legion. They have simply developed a PC game for 10 years on an entirely different engine. Not to mention the development team for Legion is CCP Shanghai, the same exact people that made dust. It's not like the devs of EVE are now making Legion.

Also there are test servers available for games on a ps3. CCP screwed the pooch on that when they melted their In house ps3's trying to use the carbon engine. As a result Sony said no test servers for you, ever, for liability reasons. That has nothing to do with the pc or console.

There's also a reason they are sticking with the UE3, to salvage code from dust so they don't have to start from scratch. They aren't magically having code available to them by just switching to PC.

The code for the market on dust exists as well. They never implemented it because they had no idea how to regulate the two existing economies. Again It had nothing to do with consoles or the pc, so that argument is entirely moot point.

I'm gonna need you to source those assertions.

A quick google search tells me nothing about ps3 test servers (can't prove a negative and all that, of course), and there is, to the best of my knowledge a significant difference between the market DUST has and the market you allege exists; the fact that we don't have player to player trading does not support that assertion either.

RE: OP.

I was going to respond to your post directly, but your attitude is such that I actually cannot see a way to convince you of our side. There is literally no set of evidence I might supply that could change your mind, whether that evidence be actual or falsified.

Consequently, all I can say to you, based on the attitude expressed in your posts, is this.
Grow up.

Great, you don't want to support CCP with your money anymore. I get that. Approaching it in such a juvenile and pathetic manner? Poor show, IMO.

RE: OP.

I was going to respond to your post directly, but your attitude is such that I actually cannot see a way to convince you of our side. There is literally no set of evidence I might supply that could change your mind, whether that evidence be actual or falsified.

Consequently, all I can say to you, based on the attitude expressed in your posts, is this.
Grow up.

Great, you don't want to support CCP with your money anymore. I get that. Approaching it in such a juvenile and pathetic manner? Poor show, IMO.

lol so let me get this straight... because you feel that you cant sway me to your position I need to grow up? that's too funny...

I need to grow up but you cant even put forth a few bullet points on why you are still loyal to ccp...

if your only goal is to convince people of your side of things instead of having an engaging and adult conversation on why or why not ccp still deserves our respect and loyalty

if you are of the mind set "if you don't see it my way you're wrong and a child"

if you have to resort to petty insult instead of either ignoring the thread all together or providing a relevant reply (perhaps due to lacking one?)

then I think you may need to take another look at who's maturity level has some catching up.

but please feel free to tell me why you think my OP is misguided if you have a valid argument and are also not afraid and mature enough for a rebuttal...or just throw more insults at me... your choice,


/throws lorhak the ball

Based on the sheer amount of vitriol you've spewed, I don't feel it's a worthwhile use of my time. If you'd like me to start working through some arguments, I will.

Expect them in a few hours; I start work in eleven minutes :)

Based on the sheer amount of vitriol you've spewed, I don't feel it's a worthwhile use of my time. If you'd like me to start working through some arguments, I will.

Expect them in a few hours; I start work in eleven minutes :)

DCUO, have also been done successfully.

Only one argument no supporter of CCP or Legion can seem to provide and answer for: what does the PS3 in therealm of this known universe have to do with the inability to address simple core mechanics just surrounding functionality and ability to play? Because ANY and ALL excused also presuppose the logic that CCP can create cloaks in this game, make new weapons since beta from nova knives to railguns to equipment that didn't exist on day one like active scanners BUT they CANNOT do anything as simple creating a game that focuses on the issues with core mechanics and player retention for whatever reason.

This also significantly PRESUPPOSES that stuff like cloaks, active scanners, rail guns, mag sec smg's were SO important to allocate resources to that even doing something like making a better matchmaking AI were just tedious to investigate.

Seriously feel free to reply with an honestly legitimate answer to all of this because it's makes no sense to do all CCP did. If my kitchen sink is leaking I don't make an addition to my place and make that additional room a kitchen with a new sink that isn't leaking. No, YOU FIX THE BROKEN SINK THEN ADD STUFF AFTER THE FACT!!! Is this such a crazy concept?

This is why a lot of us feel we get ignored because it seems so obvious: fix stuff, get your basic foundation for the game set and THEN add content. Makes sense? well not to CCP duh! And this is far from a trashing because it's based solely on logic of how hundreds and thousands of ppl act everyday. Car has a broken tire? You replace it and fix the broken tire not add a 5th wheel. That's why tons of us are steaming mad and pissed because instead of fixing stuff and allocating resources, we're getting resources allocated to add game content atop of an already semi broken game WHICH MAKES NO LOGICAL SENSE WHATSOEVER. Yea defend that point white knights because in all of my rants NO ONE SEEMS TO EVER REPLY TO IT. Caps to emphasize for the excessively filled vitrol of a rant because someone is going to say "but the pc is better blah blah blah. Yes that "really" helps as a rebuttal now...