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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
237
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Posted - 2014.04.26 03:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
Please bring me up to speed, since I haven't played since 1.6.
Back then I eventually settled on Caldari Assault. Ultimately, the "run and gun" style is what I do best, especially at close and medium range (aiming, situational awareness, reflexes). I like flanking with speed, but if I'm surrounded by a bunch of enemies I also want to have a fighting chance to deal with that situation. A shield tanked Caldari Assault with an assault rifle used to fit that bill perfectly.
So now I'm back to square one thanks to the re-spec for dropsuits. I still got proto AR so I will stick to that for now. Between the re-spec and passive SP I got 5 mil SP to spend, so I need to make some choices. My questions are simple:
Is there currently a rough loadout which is considered ideal for the run and gun style like the Caldari Assault used to be?
I am very tempted to run a scout since it sounds like they do well now, which of the scouts would you say is most focused on plain and simple gun game? My gut feeling says Gallente. Staying hidden sounds rather useful for this style, and armor tanking a scout sounds like it could be a good compromise between speed and survivability. Or is Caldari Assault still the best suit for this after all (FOTM aside)?
Also, which weapon would you recommend? I still got my SP in assault rifles so I will stick with it for now and I will try out the new weapons before I make a choice, but I'd still like to hear some opinions. I like versatility and range isn't a huge concern for me (usually I find it easier to outflank somebody on a distance than to go into a long-range shootout) so I expect that I will stick with the assault rifle.
Any other important things I need to be aware of (loadout related)?
I'll appreciate all serious replies, thank you! :) |
Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad.
401
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Posted - 2014.04.26 03:09:00 -
[2] - Quote
Csikszent Mihalyi wrote:Please bring me up to speed, since I haven't played since 1.6.
Back then I eventually settled on Caldari Assault. Ultimately, the "run and gun" style is what I do best, especially at close and medium range (aiming, situational awareness, reflexes). I like flanking with speed, but if I'm surrounded by a bunch of enemies I also want to have a fighting chance to deal with that situation. A shield tanked Caldari Assault with an assault rifle used to fit that bill perfectly.
So now I'm back to square one thanks to the re-spec for dropsuits. I still got proto AR so I will stick to that for now. Between the re-spec and passive SP I got 5 mil SP to spend, so I need to make some choices. My questions are simple:
Is there currently a rough loadout which is considered ideal for the run and gun style like the Caldari Assault used to be?
I am very tempted to run a scout since it sounds like they do well now, which of the scouts would you say is most focused on plain and simple gun game? My gut feeling says Gallente. Staying hidden sounds rather useful for this style, and armor tanking a scout sounds like it could be a good compromise between speed and survivability. Or is Caldari Assault still the best suit for this after all (FOTM aside)?
Also, which weapon would you recommend? I still got my SP in assault rifles so I will stick with it for now and I will try out the new weapons before I make a choice, but I'd still like to hear some opinions. I like versatility and range isn't a huge concern for me (usually I find it easier to outflank somebody on a distance than to go into a long-range shootout) so I expect that I will stick with the assault rifle.
Any other important things I need to be aware of (loadout related)?
I'll appreciate all serious replies, thank you! :)
AR sucks, CR is pretty good, cloaks have only 1 bug that needs to be fixed, racial scouts are pretty cool, HMGs are OP, Heavies by themselves are cool and balanced, it's just the HMG that was supposed to be nerfed, but wasn't. So yea, welcome back.
"One does not simply" run 11.12 m/s.
Oh wait, mk.0 Scouts do it... Oops.
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PARKOUR PRACTIONER
R 0 N 1 N
1266
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Posted - 2014.04.26 03:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
Both. Cal Assault is a classic, besides anyone having the guts too use a medium suit especially assault is cool. But scouts are good for hit and run tactics.
Sidearm and Light Weapon Scout, I use 'em all.
SCP and IP user, watch out for that +60
1mil SP and counting
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Michael Arck
Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Lokun Listamenn
4036
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Posted - 2014.04.26 03:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
Just a thought here, you are welcomed to challenge it, but would you say the lowered TTK has had an effect on the run and gun game?
But yea...welcome back to the war...
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Are you OUKH?
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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
237
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 03:24:00 -
[5] - Quote
Thanks! :)
Ok lowered TTK, that's some good intel. I actually like that... probably. That also makes me even more tempted to run a scout, since getting the first shot in may be more crucial.
I just watched this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oRUSBrWsAk
I really enjoy that style of playing, so Gallente Scout is growing on me. I don't see why that shouldn't work well with an assault rifle, but I guess AR isn't doing so well right now? What would be the next best alternative then for a similar run and gun style with tracking based aim? Is the proto AR really outclassed by comparable combat or rail rifles though, or do they just have the edge on long range encounters?
Also, what's that cloak bug you mentioned? |
Rygharr Sturmeister
DUST University Ivy League
27
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Posted - 2014.04.26 04:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:Just a thought here, you are welcomed to challenge it, but would you say the lowered TTK has had an effect on the run and gun game?
But yea...welcome back to the war...
I don't know about 1.6, but TTK was increased from 1.7 to 1.8. |
Michael Arck
Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Lokun Listamenn
4041
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Posted - 2014.04.26 04:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Rygharr Sturmeister wrote:Michael Arck wrote:Just a thought here, you are welcomed to challenge it, but would you say the lowered TTK has had an effect on the run and gun game?
But yea...welcome back to the war... I don't know about 1.6, but TTK was increased from 1.7 to 1.8.
Oh excuse me, I say lowered, I should have said increased. It was that EA guy who wanted shorter TTKs. I don't think he works at CCP anymore...
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Are you OUKH?
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Tectonic Fusion
1584
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Posted - 2014.04.26 04:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
You derp. Didn't you read the forums? The Cal Scout is the new Cal Assault! (For the record I don't believe this, the cal assault just needs a better bonus).
Solo Player
Squad status: Locked
Ehem...OBVIOUSER troll is OBVIOUSER
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Vell0cet
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1444
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Posted - 2014.04.26 05:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Rygharr Sturmeister wrote:Michael Arck wrote:Just a thought here, you are welcomed to challenge it, but would you say the lowered TTK has had an effect on the run and gun game?
But yea...welcome back to the war... I don't know about 1.6, but TTK was increased from 1.7 to 1.8. TTK is a lot higher than 1.6. It's probably slightly lower than 1.5 was (before the hit detection fix in 1.6).
Best PvE idea ever!
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deepfried salad gilliam
Sanguine Knights
661
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 06:24:00 -
[10] - Quote
mimnatar assualt and a combat rifle and smg is where its at
It'll help define roles, i promise:)
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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
238
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Posted - 2014.04.26 06:55:00 -
[11] - Quote
I've settled with Galdari Scout for now, and as far as the suit is concerned I'm quite happy with it.
The weapons are a different story though. The AR feels awful, and TTK does seem to be higher. I have to say that after playing a few PC shooters again, the sluggishness of DUST is really hard to get used to... It's just an awful experience to be honest, and a longer TTK just makes it worse.
The standard combat rifle really isn't my thing, it reminds me of the tactical assault rifle which I never liked. I tried that BK assault combat rifle and that's better, but it empties a clip really fast and that doesn't work very well for my playing style. I'm also not so keen on specialising on a weapon if I only enjoy a single variant on it... (same reason I never got into the assault scambler rifle).
The rail rifle is a bit better, but the delay really annoys me. The game is already unresponsive enough as it is, so I don't need to make it even less fun for myself...
So I don't know... Maybe I'll still find a great setup with which I will have fun again, but so far it doesn't look good.
To be honest I was a little worried that this would happen eventually, when the weapons would become more "balanced". I actually like it when there is a "standard" weapon that most players play with, because then it's more about individual skill rather than the rock paper scissor element of tactical advantage and who's got the better fitting. But that probably puts me in a minority, so it seems that this might just not be the game for me anymore.
If you have any suggestions for builds I could try (ideally based around Gallente Scout and Assault Rifles), I'll give that a go though. I don't care if it's FOTM or whatever, as long as it works and I can have some fun with it on pubs. |
Spectral Clone
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
2441
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Posted - 2014.04.26 07:00:00 -
[12] - Quote
Csikszent Mihalyi wrote: To be honest I was a little worried that this would happen eventually, when the weapons would become more "balanced". I actually like it when there is a "standard" weapon that most players play with, because then it's more about individual skill rather than the rock paper scissor element of tactical advantage and who's got the better fitting. But that probably puts me in a minority, so it seems that this might just not be the game for me anymore.
Why do you play a CCP game if you dont like rock paper scissors?
HTFU Gë£ Live with CCP´s mistakes.
CCP Rogue is french, CCP Sabrewing is a beefcake.
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Autoaim Bot514
The Hetairoi
82
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Posted - 2014.04.26 07:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
Csikszent Mihalyi wrote:Please bring me up to speed, since I haven't played since 1.6.
Back then I eventually settled on Caldari Assault. Ultimately, the "run and gun" style is what I do best, especially at close and medium range (aiming, situational awareness, reflexes). I like flanking with speed, but if I'm surrounded by a bunch of enemies I also want to have a fighting chance to deal with that situation. A shield tanked Caldari Assault with an assault rifle used to fit that bill perfectly.
So now I'm back to square one thanks to the re-spec for dropsuits. I still got proto AR so I will stick to that for now. Between the re-spec and passive SP I got 5 mil SP to spend, so I need to make some choices. My questions are simple:
Is there currently a rough loadout which is considered ideal for the run and gun style like the Caldari Assault used to be?
I am very tempted to run a scout since it sounds like they do well now, which of the scouts would you say is most focused on plain and simple gun game? My gut feeling says Gallente. Staying hidden sounds rather useful for this style, and armor tanking a scout sounds like it could be a good compromise between speed and survivability. Or is Caldari Assault still the best suit for this after all (FOTM aside)?
Also, which weapon would you recommend? I still got my SP in assault rifles so I will stick with it for now and I will try out the new weapons before I make a choice, but I'd still like to hear some opinions. I like versatility and range isn't a huge concern for me (usually I find it easier to outflank somebody on a distance than to go into a long-range shootout) so I expect that I will stick with the assault rifle.
Any other important things I need to be aware of (loadout related)?
I'll appreciate all serious replies, thank you! :)
minmatar scout |
BIind Shot
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
120
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 07:08:00 -
[14] - Quote
Caldari scout. Trust me. Run some range amplifiers and precision enhancers with a combat rifle.. All the slayers are doing it.
and he said unto them, "Bring ye all your trolls, that they shall feed".
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Lynn Beck
Wake N' Bake Inc Top Men.
1268
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Posted - 2014.04.26 07:08:00 -
[15] - Quote
'Galdari scout' Lol.
Try the Gallente Medframe, fit with mainly reppers, make high slots either shield extenders or dmg mods.
I'm actually planning on getting into that, seeing as i need a Pub suit with decent armor and that fits with my gamestyle(run and gun, bombardment bores me)
General John Ripper
Like ALL the things!!!
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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
238
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 07:09:00 -
[16] - Quote
Spectral Clone wrote:Csikszent Mihalyi wrote: To be honest I was a little worried that this would happen eventually, when the weapons would become more "balanced". I actually like it when there is a "standard" weapon that most players play with, because then it's more about individual skill rather than the rock paper scissor element of tactical advantage and who's got the better fitting. But that probably puts me in a minority, so it seems that this might just not be the game for me anymore.
Why do you play a CCP game if you dont like rock paper scissors?
Fair question, I guess. Originally I downloaded the game out of curiosity more than anything, it just happened that I had quite a bit of fun with it, especially when I discovered the Caldari Assault playing style. I thought it was actually pretty good around 1.6 (aside from the awful sluggishness, which hasn't gotten one bit better). Perhaps I just haven't found the way to have fun with 1.8 yet, who knows. |
Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
238
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 07:13:00 -
[17] - Quote
Lynn Beck wrote:'Galdari scout' Lol.
I caught my fingers attempting to type that a few times, but I missed this one. No idea why. |
Spectral Clone
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
2441
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Posted - 2014.04.26 07:19:00 -
[18] - Quote
I think you want a caldari assault with the assault combat rifle for run and gun play.
You need to be situational aware, not engaging heavies straight on, being aware of cloaked scouts and sticking together with your squad.
HTFU Gë£ Live with CCP´s mistakes.
CCP Rogue is french, CCP Sabrewing is a beefcake.
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Spectral Clone
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
2441
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Posted - 2014.04.26 07:33:00 -
[19] - Quote
BIind Shot wrote:Caldari scout. Trust me. Run some range amplifiers and precision enhancers with a combat rifle.. All the slayers are doing it. It's like having the OP 360 scan at all times without having to actually scan. You'll have about 400ehp but you'll be able to see everyone and which way they're looking. You'll love it; and honestly 400 isn't that bad. I run 450 on my min scout with kincats.
It-¦s just that the gallente scout is better than the caldari scout.
HTFU Gë£ Live with CCP´s mistakes.
CCP Rogue is french, CCP Sabrewing is a beefcake.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12724
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 07:48:00 -
[20] - Quote
Spectral Clone wrote:BIind Shot wrote:Caldari scout. Trust me. Run some range amplifiers and precision enhancers with a combat rifle.. All the slayers are doing it. It's like having the OP 360 scan at all times without having to actually scan. You'll have about 400ehp but you'll be able to see everyone and which way they're looking. You'll love it; and honestly 400 isn't that bad. I run 450 on my min scout with kincats. It-¦s just that the gallente scout is better than the caldari scout.
Is 50 HP/s shield regen on a 3 second delay not enough for you?
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
238
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 08:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
I'll stick with the Gallente Scout for now, but what are typical loadouts? If it's kind of popular right now, then I guess there are some general ideas as to how it should be run? What are the most common weapons used with it? Would you say that the assault combat rifle is viable? |
Lorhak Gannarsein
Science For Death
2960
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 08:10:00 -
[22] - Quote
ACR is good with everything.
Aside from that, I see a lot of people with a lot of armour...
ak.0 4 LYFE
I am the Lorhak. I speak for the trees.
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Spectral Clone
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
2441
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Posted - 2014.04.26 08:12:00 -
[23] - Quote
I run 2 complex precision enhancers, 1 complex plate, 2 complex range amps and one enhanced profile dampener. If I use my proto suit, which I do not do much.
This of course assumes that you have all the core skills maxed.
HTFU Gë£ Live with CCP´s mistakes.
CCP Rogue is french, CCP Sabrewing is a beefcake.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12726
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Posted - 2014.04.26 08:23:00 -
[24] - Quote
Csikszent Mihalyi wrote:I'll stick with the Gallente Scout for now, but what are typical loadouts? If it's kind of popular right now, then I guess there are some general ideas as to how it should be run? What are the most common weapons used with it? Would you say that the assault combat rifle is viable?
Personally I see either the combat rifle or the shotgun as the most common weapon with it. I'm not sure if the shotgun fits your playstyle as you have to get very close to use it.
Personally, these are the loadouts I use on my Galscout:
ADV:
Combat rifle SMG 2x complex shield extender 1x kincat 1x enhanced plate 1x complex range amplifier
ARN-18 cloak field Compact nanohive
I'm not at my PS3 atm but I think that's the approximate fit. The kincat can be subbed for a second plate if you're not a fan of that much speed. It's quite tweakable, I'll have to check what exactly it is that I use.
PRO:
RS-90 Combat rifle/BK-42 ACR M209 Assault SMG Flux Grenade
2x complex precision enhancer 2x enhanced plate 1x complex repairer 1x complex range extender
ARN-18 Cloak field K-2 Nanohive
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
238
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 08:35:00 -
[25] - Quote
Thanks, that looks very useful. The ACR is growing on me, and I just realised that there is a proto version. The Six Kin looks like a beast. A bit of a shame about my AR skill points, and somehow I don't really see why both AR and ACR need to exist when they are so similar, but whatever... I guess one of them is always going to have the edge, so no harm in skilling both.
Why do you run precision enhancers on the proto but shields on the ADV? Just because the fitting requirements worked out better this way, or is there another reason?
What about active scanners, have they fallen out of fashion for solo play? When I stopped playing they were really useful in 1on1 fights and to pick out targets. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12730
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 16:21:00 -
[26] - Quote
Csikszent Mihalyi wrote:Thanks, that looks very useful. The ACR is growing on me, and I just realised that there is a proto version. The Six Kin looks like a beast. A bit of a shame about my AR skill points, and somehow I don't really see why both AR and ACR need to exist when they are so similar, but whatever... I guess one of them is always going to have the edge, so no harm in skilling both.
Why do you run precision enhancers on the proto but shields on the ADV? Just because the fitting requirements worked out better this way, or is there another reason?
What about active scanners, have they fallen out of fashion for solo play? When I stopped playing they were really useful in 1on1 fights and to pick out targets.
I feel that there's more need for buffer on the ADV to make up for not dual plating it.
Active scanners are pretty much just bad now. The passive scanner is superior in just about every way if you mod it properly.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Scheneighnay McBob
Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
4918
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 16:44:00 -
[27] - Quote
Run-and-gun is bad and you should feel bad.
I'm from the weird side of the internet
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12732
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 16:50:00 -
[28] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Run-and-gun is bad and you should feel bad. Your post is bad and you should feel bad.
This is a valid playstyle, if you don't like it deal with it.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Csikszent Mihalyi
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
239
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 16:55:00 -
[29] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Csikszent Mihalyi wrote:Thanks, that looks very useful. The ACR is growing on me, and I just realised that there is a proto version. The Six Kin looks like a beast. A bit of a shame about my AR skill points, and somehow I don't really see why both AR and ACR need to exist when they are so similar, but whatever... I guess one of them is always going to have the edge, so no harm in skilling both.
Why do you run precision enhancers on the proto but shields on the ADV? Just because the fitting requirements worked out better this way, or is there another reason?
What about active scanners, have they fallen out of fashion for solo play? When I stopped playing they were really useful in 1on1 fights and to pick out targets. I feel that there's more need for buffer on the ADV to make up for not dual plating it. Active scanners are pretty much just bad now. The passive scanner is superior in just about every way if you mod it properly.
Ok, makes sense. I went all in on combat rifles now and spent my remaining SP on level 5 for it.
I'm still confused why the assault combat rifle is a better assault rifle than the assault rifle, but I guess in the long run it won't hurt to have some flexibility (as I understand it, the AR is _supposed_ to be better in closer encounters).
With this setup I've been having some fun again, I'm loving the cloak mechanic and hit and run tactics. It's quite different to what I'm used to, but that's to be expected.
Maybe I'm just out of practice, but I get the impression that it's harder to deal with the low framerates than it used to be with my old setup. At least I can somewhat reduce that problem by staying out of the cities, but I don't really get how the people do it who consistently perform well in cities or in blobs (which is one of the reasons I have had more fun playing solo so far). |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12732
|
Posted - 2014.04.26 17:08:00 -
[30] - Quote
Csikszent Mihalyi wrote:
Ok, makes sense. I went all in on combat rifles now and spent my remaining SP on level 5 for it.
I'm still confused why the assault combat rifle is a better assault rifle than the assault rifle, but I guess in the long run it won't hurt to have some flexibility (as I understand it, the AR is _supposed_ to be better in closer encounters).
The assault combat rifle does more DPS than the AR, and has a higher weighting towards RoF which means it's more reliable in a spray and pray situation. It also has a much preferable damage profile to the AR - the damage profile is -5/+10 as opposed to +10/-10. Not only is it then barely penalised against shields but it does more damage against armour, which is a higher buffer type. It also has a fair bit more range.
Quote: With this setup I've been having some fun again, I'm loving the cloak mechanic and hit and run tactics. It's quite different to what I'm used to, but that's to be expected.
Maybe I'm just out of practice, but I get the impression that it's harder to deal with the low framerates than it used to be with my old setup. At least I can somewhat reduce that problem by staying out of the cities, but I don't really get how the people do it who consistently perform well in cities or in blobs (which is one of the reasons I have had more fun playing solo so far).
Lag is a sad problem in Dust, but it'll always be there. I carry flux so I can deal with obvious equipment spam in cities to reduce the lag. That's also another reason why the ACR is better - being able to spray so many more shots helps in a laggy situation.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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