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ALPHA DECRIPTER
Dragon-Empire
874
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Posted - 2014.03.29 15:12:00 -
[31] - Quote
My most commonly used fit is a G-Scout with a codebreaker, dampener, and precision mod in the lows. An extender and a range amp in the highs.
Most real scouts actually like to use there fits like they are meant to be used and so a nurf to the scouts' HP wouldn't really be beneficial for balance.
I suppose you could turn the plates to a % boost so that the mid and heavy frames receive more HP then lights. Problem is that this could end up nurfing the mids even more or making the heavies OP if done incorrectly.
Scout Tactician
Dance puppets, DANCE!
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Django Quik
Dust2Dust.
2579
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Posted - 2014.03.29 15:13:00 -
[32] - Quote
Once assaults get their stats adjusted (like should have happened alongside scouts and heavies), nobody will care about brick tanked scouts anymore because they won't be able to get to the same eHP as tanked assaults.
This really needs to happen to stop all these stupid nerf scouts threads sooner rather than later.
Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot
Scout community is the nuts
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Broonfondle Majikthies
Dogs of War Gaming
Zero-Day
1045
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Posted - 2014.03.29 17:51:00 -
[33] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:Broonfondle Majikthies wrote:Min Scout here
If I don't add some protection I have only 125 shields max - What the hell do you expect me do to do without the ability to add more health? Lol sneak up on ppl with knives, it does not take any health. With stealth mod you simply don't get shot at. 
I can't imagine you knife. It simply doesn't work as a viable tactic.
I am a stealthy player and an average knifer and its pathetic trying to knife in this game without having major advantages and a lot of luck.
Not saying its not possible to primary knives but its very niche and the mechanics are incredibly frustrating. So its not unreasonable to allow for other methods of combat.
Also, with cal scouts around knifing is next to impossible as we have to pull out our range amps for damps and loose all situational awareness
Edit:
Also, invisible Gëá immunity to bullets. were not even invisible
"...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
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Joel II X
Dah Gods O Bacon
2072
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Posted - 2014.03.29 17:55:00 -
[34] - Quote
If you nerf our hp, scouts who don't tank will die from fall damage. I already lose all my shields and then some most of the time.
Gallente Scout HP WITHOUT skills is 70s+130a. That's nothing. |
Alena Ventrallis
The Neutral Zone
1064
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Posted - 2014.03.29 17:56:00 -
[35] - Quote
Scouts with sidearms only. With the improvements to the cloak the dropsuit has no room to for light weapons, only 2 sidearms.
Balance.
Best PVE idea I've seen.
Fixed link.
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Cyrius Li-Moody
0uter.Heaven
4250
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Posted - 2014.03.29 17:58:00 -
[36] - Quote
Brick tanking isn't a scout centric problem. It's an overall problem in the game.
Logi's brick tank.
Scout's brick tank.
Assaults brick tank.
Heavies brick tank.
Everybody brick tanks because it's easy. It's not the suit.
Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
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Crimson Cerberes
Hammer Of Light
Vanguard of the Phoenix
522
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Posted - 2014.03.29 17:59:00 -
[37] - Quote
It is the cloaks, tey are just too good with ANY significant drawbacks. There is no trade off.......
It is easy to balance though:
1)Re-cloak delay
2) firing delay when decloaking
3) Make cloaking increase signature profile, not decrease it.
I am pretty sure cloaks were not meant to be an offensive tool.
"We are not ever going to respec weaponry and dropsuit command because the majority of our Aurum gear falls within those
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Smooth Assassin
Stardust Incorporation
IMMORTAL REGIME
1139
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Posted - 2014.03.29 17:59:00 -
[38] - Quote
More penalties to armor stack is needed.
Assassination is my thing.
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Rusty Shallows
1317
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:03:00 -
[39] - Quote
Umma Kabula wrote:Ludvig Enraga wrote:Yan Darn wrote:[quote=Ludvig Enraga]CCP went too far and gave scouts too many advantages. I am a scout and I like the new stealth play style but the ability to brick tank scouts and cloak at the same time hurts the game balance badly. Keep the stealth, cut down ability to brick tank. Which is different from nerfing HP. How about light frames can't use regular armour plates?[/quote I like it. 2 issues here, 1 is the fact tha basic plates give you a lot of hp with only a little cpu/pg need, the other is the chance to have more or less the same hp that a medium suit can have while wearing a cloak. I think that anyone can fit his dropsuit as he desires, I have some "tanked" fit to stick with the squad if it's needed. Probably the speed reduction on plates should affect more scouts than others, so if you want to brick tank you can do it, but you become way slower. The problem is not about brick tanked scouts in general, but about brick tanked scouts WITH a cloack.Scouts have lower hp due to their speed and profile reduction. Cloaks should work in the same way. If you don't want to pump up your bonuses with electronics and speed modules that's your choice and it affects your playstyle. Chance to fit your suit with what you want is good far variety. Brick tanking a cloaked scout lets you play like a moron. That's bad for everyone
If IWS's post on cloaks is any indication the Devs are trying to separate the two. They have no intention of removing Light Assaults from the game. Sandbox Solutions for the the win.
Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting.
Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
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Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster
1175
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:03:00 -
[40] - Quote
I'll play around with it more later, but when I built my "assault gallente scout" and put 2 complex shield extenders, proto assault SMG, boundless CR, M1 grenade, a enhanced armor repairer with 3 exhanced plates. I do not have room to fit a cloak. I also have electronics, engineering, and core upgrades all maxed so I am getting as much PG/CPU out of it as I can.
I am starting to think these tanked and cloaked scouts are mythical creatures of Dust because I'm just not seeing them out there
Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
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taxi bastard
Minor Trueblood
108
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:04:00 -
[41] - Quote
i play mini scout .
atm on my advanced suit i believe that with a cloak the most EHP i can get is 500 .... without a cloak 600.
on a BPO caldari assault suit i can get 900 EHP i believe .
i never wanted cloaks in game tbh, but i see that as the main problem. if you gut the durations to 1/3rd of their current scouts will be fine imo.
look at the KB and you will see that most people using scout suits are not really scouts at all - but they are simply abusing the scout suit because the cloak is too strong in its current form.
edit : most of my suits run under 200 EHP FYI |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster
1175
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:11:00 -
[42] - Quote
Rusty Shallows wrote:Umma Kabula wrote:Ludvig Enraga wrote:Yan Darn wrote:[quote=Ludvig Enraga]CCP went too far and gave scouts too many advantages. I am a scout and I like the new stealth play style but the ability to brick tank scouts and cloak at the same time hurts the game balance badly. Keep the stealth, cut down ability to brick tank. Which is different from nerfing HP. How about light frames can't use regular armour plates?[/quote I like it. 2 issues here, 1 is the fact tha basic plates give you a lot of hp with only a little cpu/pg need, the other is the chance to have more or less the same hp that a medium suit can have while wearing a cloak. I think that anyone can fit his dropsuit as he desires, I have some "tanked" fit to stick with the squad if it's needed. Probably the speed reduction on plates should affect more scouts than others, so if you want to brick tank you can do it, but you become way slower. The problem is not about brick tanked scouts in general, but about brick tanked scouts WITH a cloack.Scouts have lower hp due to their speed and profile reduction. Cloaks should work in the same way. If you don't want to pump up your bonuses with electronics and speed modules that's your choice and it affects your playstyle. Chance to fit your suit with what you want is good far variety. Brick tanking a cloaked scout lets you play like a moron. That's bad for everyone If IWS's post on cloaks is any indication the Devs are trying to separate the two. They have no intention of removing Light Assaults from the game. Sandbox Solutions for the the win.
Forgive my ignorance, as I probably should know this, but do armor plates affect your scan profile?
Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
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Chunky Munkey
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
3721
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:13:00 -
[43] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:CCP went too far and gave scouts too many advantages. I am a scout and I like the new stealth play style but the ability to brick tank scouts and cloak at the same time hurts the game balance badly. Keep the stealth, cut down ability to brick tank.
Scouts are useful now. Get over it.
No.
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Rusty Shallows
1318
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:43:00 -
[44] - Quote
Zahle Undt wrote:Rusty Shallows wrote:If IWS's post on cloaks is any indication the Devs are trying to separate the two. They have no intention of removing Light Assaults from the game. Sandbox Solutions for the the win. Forgive my ignorance, as I probably should know this, but do armor plates affect your scan profile?
No sir, just a movement penalty if the vanilla plates.
If you want a great resource this Wiki is excellent. Currently they are still updating to Uprising 1.8
Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting.
Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
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Fire of Prometheus
Alpha Response Command
4104
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Posted - 2014.03.29 18:44:00 -
[45] - Quote
Haha no.
Fare well my commando's fist of god o7
Patron saint of commandos
Ck.0-scout, commando // ak.0- logi (commando soonTM)
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Michael Arck
Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu
Lokun Listamenn
3790
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Posted - 2014.03.29 19:27:00 -
[46] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:Michael Arck wrote:So the same guy who ranted on and on about how Dust sucked, making multiple threads trying to convince people that Planetside 2 is the future, now makes a thread wanting CCP to nerf scout HP?
Hilarious. You know what else is hilarious: ppl talking out of their S. I don't even know what PS2 is - never played it.
lol stop lying. This is your alt character. Your primary got banned and you went on a tirade, opening up multiple threads saying Dust will die and that you were moving on to PS2.
You put on quite a dramatic show.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Are you OUKH?
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Yan Darn
Science For Death
438
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Posted - 2014.03.29 20:03:00 -
[47] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Once assaults get their stats adjusted (like should have happened alongside scouts and heavies), nobody will care about brick tanked scouts anymore because they won't be able to get to the same eHP as tanked assaults.
This really needs to happen to stop all these stupid nerf scouts threads sooner rather than later.
This.
Brick Tanking is a problem to the game as a whole, but the whole brick tank scout issue has as much to do with the relatively poor state of assaults.
Assaults are the new old scout. Anything it can do you might as well do with another frame. They need rebalancing as much as scouts once did.
That along with fixes to cloak and the brick tanking issue (which CCP have to be looking at surely...) should put scouts back to playing as a niche role.
The Ghost of Bravo
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BIind Shot
Dirt Nap Squad
Dirt Nap Squad.
78
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Posted - 2014.03.29 20:43:00 -
[48] - Quote
Brick tanking has been a problem ever since they gave plates that huge buff oh so long ago. The need to nerf plates and buff and make the other mods easier to fit.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=152280&find=unread
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SPACE SYPHILIS
Condotta Rouvenor
Gallente Federation
43
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Posted - 2014.03.29 20:53:00 -
[49] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:CCP went too far and gave scouts too many advantages. I am a scout and I like the new stealth play style but the ability to brick tank scouts and cloak at the same time hurts the game balance badly. Keep the stealth, cut down ability to brick tank.
I can agree somewhat. I am heavy first but I also have a proto scout and yes I can run a scout very well just do not like the squishy feel. So anyways the problem is the cloak needs a charge time and a deplete time is all. You cloak and then you only have so long to use it, once it is used there is a cool down before use no matter how long you use it, once used it has a mandatory cool down. That should solve the issue of abuse. |
LEHON Xeon
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
368
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Posted - 2014.03.29 21:36:00 -
[50] - Quote
Zahle Undt wrote:I'll play around with it more later, but when I built my "assault gallente scout" and put 2 complex shield extenders, proto assault SMG, boundless CR, M1 grenade, a enhanced armor repairer with 3 exhanced plates. I do not have room to fit a cloak. I also have electronics, engineering, and core upgrades all maxed so I am getting as much PG/CPU out of it as I can.
I am starting to think these tanked and cloaked scouts are mythical creatures of Dust because I'm just not seeing them out there
I don't run a full tanked scout and I guess I don't really understand why people would want to as they aren't all that effective. I like a nice balance between a bit extra reserve of HP in case someone spots me so I don't get insta-killed yet still be able to hide from scanners and people's view with the cloak.
Always the last person to leave. Always the one cleaning up people's messes.
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bamboo x
Eternal Beings
Proficiency V.
536
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Posted - 2014.03.29 21:38:00 -
[51] - Quote
I don't think so.
The cloak is the problem. It has no weakness, and it needs to be weak to flux or even drained by enemy fire.
B.D. Wong AKA Dr. Wu returns to Jurassic Park sequel
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AfroSunshineY Consequence
R 0 N 1 N
272
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Posted - 2014.03.29 21:50:00 -
[52] - Quote
The Eristic wrote:The base HP is low enough, just add penalties for stacking HP mods on lights.
Or rather, you can either brick tank or cloak. If you've using the cloak, shield and armor mods get a 50% efficiency reduction. |
Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2427
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Posted - 2014.03.29 21:55:00 -
[53] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:Michael Arck wrote:So the same guy who ranted on and on about how Dust sucked, making multiple threads trying to convince people that Planetside 2 is the future, now makes a thread wanting CCP to nerf scout HP?
Hilarious. You know what else is hilarious: ppl talking out of their S. I don't even know what PS2 is - never played it.
Then how do you know it is commonly abbreviated as "PS2"?
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II // MAG Vet
Gallente Neutron Rifle
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Lynn Beck
Wake N' Bake Inc
Top Men.
965
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Posted - 2014.03.29 22:05:00 -
[54] - Quote
My galscout uses a enhanced ferroscale, kincat and range amp or dampener.
Highs are dmg mod(lemme hear the 'y u do dat') and precision amp.
My minscout (at proto) uses 1(one, **** man, i'm tanking eh?) shield, maybe a basic reactive(2!? Holy hell i'm OP.)
Funny enough, Pyrex is abusing the Gallente scout day 1, 87/750 HPs and moves faster than a gal assault.
Maybe we should use a 'weight' measurement? Spaceships don't use weight as they're gravityless, but i mean, a scout stacking myrofibs should have the musculature to carry an HMG, eh?
The closer to your weight you get, the slower you go, go even 1 point over and your speed is dropped by like 20%.
Ever play Armored Core 3/Nx/SL/NB/LR? Thing's pretty darned fun with the weight.
Give heavies a super ridiculous weight fitting, along with making heavy weapons super heavy.
Plates add as much weight as a light weapon, sidearms as much as a reactive.
If you want to tank your scout, better fit a Myrofib and drop the shotty for an Ion pistol. Wanna fit a forge on a logi?(huehue) stack 3 myros, and use ferroscales instead of plates.
Sounds like fun, eh?
I refuse to gve honor to your 'god' so therefore i dual tank.
Also i feel itchy. Anybody got a tube of Rust-It?
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xSir Campsalotx
G0DS AM0NG MEN
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
176
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Posted - 2014.03.29 22:17:00 -
[55] - Quote
what if we take some help from the vehicles of past updates... a 60mm 120 mm and 180mm plate. or another idea i had was simply make plates have different penalties based on frame size. Have heavy frames affected by a plate multiplier of .5, have medium frames affected by a multiplier or 1 and scouts with a multiplier of 2. In this scenario the ones who should be tanking a lot of health get to with minimal drawbacks in speed because they are already very slow, medium suits dont change compared to current movement speed, and skinny scouts get heavily weighed down by the large encumbering plates.
G0DS AM0NG MEN Director
1.8 is going to be Heavy 514 they said... Looking around all I see are twig men
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xSir Campsalotx
G0DS AM0NG MEN
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
176
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Posted - 2014.03.29 22:21:00 -
[56] - Quote
If i was being unclear a complex plate on a heavy would have 2.5% reduction speed, a medium frame 5%, and a light frame 10%. If this is not enough perhaps a hp multiplier as well... heavy 1.2 medium 1.0 and light .8
G0DS AM0NG MEN Director
1.8 is going to be Heavy 514 they said... Looking around all I see are twig men
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1300
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Posted - 2014.03.29 22:26:00 -
[57] - Quote
As much as the Devs talk about a change to TTK, its not that much of a difference as before.
Sure, you can put a decent amount of EHP on a scout but it reduces the effectiveness of its inherent abilities and allows other scouts to take advantage of this.
This isnt so much about scouts needing a nerf as much as assault class needing better bonuses toward damage.
I think that CCP is going in the right direction but need to tweak some of the bonuses for the medium suits.
Assaults need a little better damage/weapon bonuses
Logis need a little better equipment bonuses (keep their current racial and have something like half the bonuses for allied racials - gal/min and amarr/cal)
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Ghost Kaisar
Fatal Absolution
Negative-Feedback
3953
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Posted - 2014.03.29 22:44:00 -
[58] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:Ghost Kaisar wrote:Rusty Shallows wrote:You might want to change that thread title a little.... my Minja almost sent you to hell.  Same here. I have 357 eHP at Proto, is that low enough for you!?!? Yeah, we prolly should all talk about you instead!?!? Cuz that's a much more interesting topic to everyone.
Why whatever do you mean
I got my cloak and daggers, I'm a very happy Ghost
I hack at Mach V
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Patrick57
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
6378
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Posted - 2014.03.29 22:59:00 -
[59] - Quote
I have 400+ Armor on my Proto Amarr Scout, in addition to a 12.5 Armor repair rate.
Deal with it. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust.
2583
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Posted - 2014.03.30 00:00:00 -
[60] - Quote
Anyone advocating for armor plating to have a greater effect on lighter frames in terms of speed penalties clearly doesn't understand that since the penalty is percentage based and scouts have the highest base speed, we already lose more from wearing plates than medium or heavy suits.
5% of 8.1m/s > 5% of 6.3m/s
Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot
Scout community is the nuts
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