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Rodd of Nor
Nor Clan Combat Logistics
29
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:08:00 -
[61] - Quote
any time you want to talk about balance please ask the judge as he has answers for a lot of your questions already just have a look at this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lBjUlQNYR4&feature=c4-overview&list=UUy11xToip47aIW0M9TSOKrQ
It is better to be thought an idiot, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
1892
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:09:00 -
[62] - Quote
You probably did poorly in English class. How could you possibly come to that conclusion from what I said?[/quote]
Because I did do all of that and according to you; if I did all of that stuff I'd be considered a tanker who's opinion actually carries weight.[/quote]
But people don't see you. I've seen you twice in dom. Do you play ambush? Ambush is meaningless.
Like I said, if the tankers on here respected you, then your opinion about vehicles would mean something. Until then, just start a petition to have vehicles removed in their entirety. That's where your opinions lead to.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
1892
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:11:00 -
[63] - Quote
Another one of you people?
He wants railguns removed. Infantry wants blasters removed. That would leave missiles as the only turret tankers can use.
But wait... once infantry realizes we can use that against them as well, they'll want that removed, too.
And then infantry will finally achieve their goal of removing tanks from the game.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Rodd of Nor
Nor Clan Combat Logistics
30
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:21:00 -
[64] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:
Another one of you people?
He wants railguns removed. Infantry wants blasters removed. That would leave missiles as the only turret tankers can use.
But wait... once infantry realizes we can use that against them as well, they'll want that removed, too.
And then infantry will finally achieve their goal of removing tanks from the game.
Actually if you watch the video all the way to the end its talking about the fact you cant balance the game by buffing/nerfing damage/hp
the focus on the rail tank is because its the most obvious place to start with the forums the way they are, please watch the whole video.
It is better to be thought an idiot, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
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Atiim
5172
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:37:00 -
[65] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:
But people don't see you. I've seen you twice in dom. Do you play ambush? Ambush is meaningless.
Like I said, if the tankers on here respected you, then your opinion about vehicles would mean something. Until then, just start a petition to have vehicles removed in their entirety. That's where your opinions lead to.
I disagree. Tons of people on the forums have meet me.
I honestly don't care if tankers respect me. Most of them are a group of radicals who believe that being inside a vehicle should make them superior, and believes that the only people who should have a say in them are the ones who pilot vehicles themselves.
I have never once said, nor implied that I want vehicles removed. If you can present and link a quote from me stating that I want vehicles removed, I will leave the forums forever.
Go ahead Speaker. I'm waiting.
Atiim (Gunnlogi - 80GJ Particle Cannon) Tank Scrub
[s]Text[/s] <---------- That's how you make a strike-through
-HAND
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Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
639
|
Posted - 2014.03.02 19:43:00 -
[66] - Quote
Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:Mil tanks should only take one SL to destroy.
Swarm Launchers are assistant tools, not mainline AV...
If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Unless you are skimming
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JARREL THOMAS
Dead Man's Game
137
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:52:00 -
[67] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Atiim wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:Atiim wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:
Have you tried driving a tank? Have you tried escaping from a rail tank? Two blaster tanks? A suicide LAV? A LAV with 3 forge gunners in it? A missile tank if you're using armor? An orb?
1. Yes 2. Yes 3. Yes 4. Yes 5. Yes 6. Yes 7. Yes All without teamwork. I wasn't asking you. Go back to your cave. If you did all that, you'd be considered a tanker, and your opinion about vehicles would actually carry weight. So you admit that I am a tanker, and that my opinion about vehicles actually carries weight? :D You probably did poorly in English class. How could you possibly come to that conclusion from what I said?
Think about it he put yes for everything and you said that if you did everything that he put yes to then he answers were useful
You need a sence of humor my friend.
Caldari Loyalist
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Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
639
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Posted - 2014.03.02 19:58:00 -
[68] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Atiim wrote:[quote=Spkr4theDead]
Have you tried driving [...] Two blaster tanks? 3. Yes
Love to see the video of you driving two tanks at the same time.
If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Unless you are skimming
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Hunter Fencen
ROGUE SPADES
102
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Posted - 2014.03.02 20:02:00 -
[69] - Quote
I've tanked since day 1 open beta, tanks are fine atm, however militia tanks and speed mods are grossly OP and need nerfing highly as they are just far far too similar to their SP counterparts for much less price and AV can't hurt a tank if its moving at 90mph |
Derpty Derp
It's All Gone Derp
63
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Posted - 2014.03.02 20:02:00 -
[70] - Quote
Redzone tanks out of range of forges, hidden from tanks as soon as hit once by them... Can't be killed but can snipe at least half the map (usually the whole map.)
Tank with blaster turret, hardener and **** tons of armour rep, once had a team of 4 forgers shooting the thing and it just hit full hp between shots, didn't matter if we all shot at once or all shot one after the other, that armour rep is bullshite... I'll admit when out tank showed up it looked like the 5 of us could take out that 1 tank, but unfortunately that tank driver was stupid and missed every shot.
The only thing that balances the armour rep stacking is a jihad... Although Jihading starts out fun, it soon gets old and boring and you spend the whole match chasing tank after tank as they spawn 3 more for every 1 you kill.
Also no balance between tankyness and damage, I think they should make hardeners drop damage by 30% for each one active and any damage mods should drop the defence by 50%. All that extra power usage should have a downside, hitting a speed booster should also have consequences. |
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Skihids
Bullet Cluster
Legacy Rising
2975
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Posted - 2014.03.02 20:22:00 -
[71] - Quote
Tanks are one man fittings, so they need to be balanced against other one man fittings or they act as multipliers which throw these small matches way out of balance.
Tanks kill AI infantry and they kill AV infantry. AI infantry can't touch tanks. So right there you have the advantage of splitting up your enemy forces. On top of that you want to be worth a multiple of the remaining portion that can challenge you.
That is completely unbalanced.
Try to get past any preconceptions of the fitting and consider the role instead. You are an infantry killer just like all those other suits. You share a task/role with them. That is the crucial point.
Once you grasp that point you realize that fitting can't be worth multiples of any other or it's the clear winner and everyone would have to use it if they wanted to win.
No, that's not the conventional view of a tank, but then conventional tanks don't go around hunting individual infantry with their main gun, do they? No, they blow up the big stuff and rely on infantry to shoot infantry. |
Harpyja
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
1218
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Posted - 2014.03.02 21:08:00 -
[72] - Quote
Henchmen21 wrote:Slow tanks down and or buff prox mines. Problem solved.
They're both fine. I would've been killed multiple times by proxies (and I at full health) if it wasn't for my shield extender allowing me to escape with just armor left or a minimal amount of shield left.
Proxies should not be able to destroy a tank at full health if it is fitted with additional health.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Martyr Saboteur
Amarrtyrs
190
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Posted - 2014.03.02 21:15:00 -
[73] - Quote
In think it should take the concentrated fire of at least 3 large turrets to kill a dropsuit. Its teamwork!
Totally not Fizzer94's forum alt. Definitely just a random dude.
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
General Tso's Alliance
1554
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Posted - 2014.03.02 21:52:00 -
[74] - Quote
Defy Gravity wrote:Ever since the tank update came out people cry about how OP they are which they are not. If you get one other person to work with you you can kill any tank. It takes TEAMWORK to destroy tanks. If you can get 1 other person or even your whole squad to work together you will pose a serious threat to any tanker. ( Ex. 2 Forge, 4 AV Grenade Users ) Or any combination of team work. Even if the tank has hardeners on you can still kill it... its not invincible. Or even if you have a tanker working with you teamwork is the second best way to kill tanks. ( Other than people who use the Gunnlogi, Sica, Dual dmg modifier fit on a rail gun pew pew :( )
It takes teamwork to kill one person. Sounds about right. Needing at least two people to kill one person, who if left unopposed can devastate the other team single handedly...... Or you have to be forced into driving a tank yourself.
But you know what you might have failed to mention? What are we supposed to do when the tanker is working with the team? And by team, I mean the tank squad he's in? If theres one squad of tanks, by your logic we would need to run two squads of forge guns. (because that's totally realistic right?), or, if we want to maintain our infantry slaying suits we would need to have 24 guys running AV nades..... oh wait..... the player cap is 16.....
And for the love of god don't say "Full squads of tanks don't happen that often" Because they do...... Ever played against nyan san? or Duna corp? It happens pretty frequently. Sometimes there doesn't even need to be a squad, one person pulls out a tank, then two people on the opposing team pulls out tanks and then eventually one team gets all their tanks washed out and the rest of the match is just a curb stomp.
You see, if there were only ever allowed to be 1 or 2 tanks on either side, I would possibly agree with you. (probably not) But the fact that there can be 6 tanks on any given team, totally breaks any attempt at gameplay balance.
Marston VC, STB Director
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Defy Gravity
Knights of Eternal Darkness
League of Infamy
219
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Posted - 2014.03.03 01:32:00 -
[75] - Quote
Necandi Brasil wrote:Defy Gravity wrote:Necandi Brasil wrote:Defy Gravity wrote:Necandi Brasil wrote:Your MLT costs less than my proto swarms fitting and you can
- 1 hit kill me
- Destroy me with machine gun fire
- run over me
- Redline Rail kill me
If you consider this balance, then I shall consider you stupid!
Tanks actually should be able to do everything you listed other than the reline thing. if you stand in front of an enemy tank and get yourself killed you sir are stupid and need to play something else Do me a video soloing 3 tanks in an ambush with a forge... Just that Its not hard. & thats not my point of the thread. 2 people with forges can kill 10 tanks if anything... they just have to play it smart. 1 tank can destroy 10 infantry guys never seen 2 forges destroy 10 tanks please... show some video evidence so I can shut up!
I don't need to show you anything lol its either adapt or die...
Amarr FW Supporter.
"I will melt you with my scrambler rifle Minmatar filth!"
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Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster
Legacy Rising
788
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Posted - 2014.03.03 01:55:00 -
[76] - Quote
Another tank driver with math deficiencies *sigh* Haven't we been through this argument enough times yet? Your thesis statement is: tanks are not OP is because they can be killed by 2-6 people working in perfect tandem using FGs and Av grenades. So let us take the midpoint and say 4 people to kill 1 tanks. SO with 1 tank on the field that leave 4 guys on the tank and 15 v 12 on the ground, 2 tanks and now we have 8 guys fighting tanks and leaving 14 v 8, 3 tanks = 13 v 4, 4 tanks and 12 v 0.... and boy does it get scary from there.
Your reasoning for tanks being balanced does no hold up to any sort of logic when you admit that tanks take multiple people to destroy. Tanks are not balanced by any means, not price wise, not power wise vs infantry AV. This is a fact, you tankers are a little better off arguing that tanks are imbalanced but they should be unbalanced, but even there you typically fail.
Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
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Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
930
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:03:00 -
[77] - Quote
Cool logic, love it. If it takes a full squad to take out a militia tank - that's according to OP. The question is .... wait for it... How many squads does it take to take out a squad of tanks? Go!
But yea def, tanks are not OP if you can deploy twice as many players on your team than what the red team has.
PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8.
That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
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Defy Gravity
Knights of Eternal Darkness
League of Infamy
221
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:04:00 -
[78] - Quote
Zahle Undt wrote:Another tank driver with math deficiencies *sigh* Haven't we been through this argument enough times yet? Your thesis statement is: tanks are not OP is because they can be killed by 2-6 people working in perfect tandem using FGs and Av grenades. So let us take the midpoint and say 4 people to kill 1 tanks. SO with 1 tank on the field that leave 4 guys on the tank and 15 v 12 on the ground, 2 tanks and now we have 8 guys fighting tanks and leaving 14 v 8, 3 tanks = 13 v 4, 4 tanks and 12 v 0.... and boy does it get scary from there.
Your reasoning for tanks being balanced does no hold up to any sort of logic when you admit that tanks take multiple people to destroy. Tanks are not balanced by any means, not price wise, not power wise vs infantry AV. This is a fact, you tankers are a little better off arguing that tanks are imbalanced but they should be unbalanced, but even there you typically fail.
I didn't say "Perfect Tandem" & I said many other combinations can be used aswell it was just an example. Grab a friend and kill a tank god damn it complaining dosn't help you big crybaby lol
Amarr FW Supporter.
"I will melt you with my scrambler rifle Minmatar filth!"
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Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
930
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:05:00 -
[79] - Quote
Defy Gravity wrote:Necandi Brasil wrote:
1 tank can destroy 10 infantry guys
never seen 2 forges destroy 10 tanks please... show some video evidence so I can shut up!
I don't need to show you anything lol its either adapt or die...
You are an effing clown, sir. Nuff said.
PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8.
That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
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Defy Gravity
Knights of Eternal Darkness
League of Infamy
221
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:06:00 -
[80] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:Cool logic, love it. If it takes a full squad to take out a militia tank - that's according to OP. The question is .... wait for it... How many squads does it take to take out a squad of tanks? Go!
But yea def, tanks are not OP if you can deploy twice as many players on your team than what the red team has.
Believe it or not its not hard to take out a squad of tanks if you work with your squad.
Amarr FW Supporter.
"I will melt you with my scrambler rifle Minmatar filth!"
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Justin Tymes
Dem Durrty Boyz
Renegade Alliance
725
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:06:00 -
[81] - Quote
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:Mil tanks should only take one SL to destroy. Swarm Launchers are assistant tools, not mainline AV...
Then they need to be removed from the Main weapon slot, because no competitive player is going to use an Assist Av weapon in the main that's useless against Infantry. |
Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
979
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:09:00 -
[82] - Quote
Speed needs a slow down, other than that I believe tanks are fine. I can't count how many tanks if destroyed with my buddy when we both used AV fits and minor teamwork.
Join the Channel - CPM1 Candidates - Get to know who's running.
Delt for CPM1
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The dark cloud
The Rainbow Effect
Negative-Feedback
2282
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:17:00 -
[83] - Quote
Defy Gravity wrote:Ever since the tank update came out people cry about how OP they are which they are not. If you get one other person to work with you you can kill any tank. It takes TEAMWORK to destroy tanks. If you can get 1 other person or even your whole squad to work together you will pose a serious threat to any tanker. ( Ex. 2 Forge, 4 AV Grenade Users ) Or any combination of team work. Even if the tank has hardeners on you can still kill it... its not invincible. Or even if you have a tanker working with you teamwork is the second best way to kill tanks. ( Other than people who use the Gunnlogi, Sica, Dual dmg modifier fit on a rail gun pew pew :( )
Aight if it requires teamwork to kill a tank then it should aswell require it to drive it. I say tankers should be forced to fit all turret slots again. And you obviously dont get it do you? If you need more then 1 player to take out a other player then there is a serious imbalance.
I shall show you a world, a world which you cant imagine, a world full off butthurt n00bs at the other end of my gun
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Godin Thekiller
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
1807
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:18:00 -
[84] - Quote
Beck Weathers wrote:Biggest reason tanks are OP? Is the engine torque buff they recived. After taking any serious damage tanks are able to get to max speed far to quickly and are usualy out of AV range in seconds, especialy if fit with a flue injector which has a insainely short cooldown.
lolno. the fact that hardeners became broken did it.
'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever!
Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
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Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
640
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:22:00 -
[85] - Quote
Justin Tymes wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:Mil tanks should only take one SL to destroy. Swarm Launchers are assistant tools, not mainline AV... Then they need to be removed from the Main weapon slot, because no competitive player is going to use an Assist Av weapon in the main that's useless against Infantry.
Ranged AV is like that to give you a choice. If you don't like it, then go Melee AV.
If ranged AV was a secondary, just imagine that everyone would carry one.. Then imagine how they'd have to upgrade tanks to endure everyone and their dog being AV...
If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Unless you are skimming
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Defy Gravity
Knights of Eternal Darkness
League of Infamy
221
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:23:00 -
[86] - Quote
The dark cloud wrote:Defy Gravity wrote:Ever since the tank update came out people cry about how OP they are which they are not. If you get one other person to work with you you can kill any tank. It takes TEAMWORK to destroy tanks. If you can get 1 other person or even your whole squad to work together you will pose a serious threat to any tanker. ( Ex. 2 Forge, 4 AV Grenade Users ) Or any combination of team work. Even if the tank has hardeners on you can still kill it... its not invincible. Or even if you have a tanker working with you teamwork is the second best way to kill tanks. ( Other than people who use the Gunnlogi, Sica, Dual dmg modifier fit on a rail gun pew pew :( ) Aight if it requires teamwork to kill a tank then it should aswell require it to drive it. I say tankers should be forced to fit all turret slots again. And you obviously dont get it do you? If you need more then 1 player to take out a other player then there is a serious imbalance.
it would also make it so blue berrys aren't running for an hour to get to the damn objective.
Amarr FW Supporter.
"I will melt you with my scrambler rifle Minmatar filth!"
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Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
640
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Posted - 2014.03.03 02:24:00 -
[87] - Quote
The dark cloud wrote:
Aight if it requires teamwork to kill a tank then it should aswell require it to drive it. I say tankers should be forced to fit all turret slots again. And you obviously dont get it do you? If you need more then 1 player to take out a other player then there is a serious imbalance.
You want to UPGRADE tanks so they take teamwork to drive? Your funeral.
If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Unless you are skimming
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Rodd of Nor
Nor Clan Combat Logistics
32
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Posted - 2014.03.03 17:16:00 -
[88] - Quote
Okay so all the other arguments aside I personally only have one real issue with tanks... ISK
A militia tank costs what? 60k I think (a little bit more then that but close enough) and it when in the hands of even a semi skilled player can do hundreds of thousands or even millions of ISK worth of damage with minimal risk.
ISK is what counts to me if I have a 60,000 ISK suit that is designed to kill tanks and I com across a 60,00 ISK tank it should be a fair fight and to me that is the bottom line
People say "Oh its a tank and IRL you wouldn't fight a tank 1 on 1" true but IRL tanks cost multi-million dollar pieces of equipment so by your reasoning shouldn't they cost that much in game?
It is better to be thought an idiot, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
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Rinzler XVIII
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
163
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Posted - 2014.03.03 23:09:00 -
[89] - Quote
Fire of Prometheus wrote:counter argument:
if it takes teamwork to kill a tank, why doesnt it take teamwork to use a tank effectively?
Because .. Tank
Just thought i'd use the tankers argument before they use it
I agree though .. large turrets should be AV eg railgun + missiles so why isn't the gallente version a large plasma cannon ? To get anti infantry capabilities Tanks should have to fit small turrets and have gunners
Blaster Tanks are just high HP damage and speed Assault suits
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Supernus Gigas
Star Giants
347
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Posted - 2014.03.03 23:34:00 -
[90] - Quote
JARREL THOMAS wrote:Defy Gravity wrote:Ever since the tank update came out people cry about how OP they are which they are not. If you get one other person to work with you you can kill any tank. It takes TEAMWORK to destroy tanks. If you can get 1 other person or even your whole squad to work together you will pose a serious threat to any tanker. ( Ex. 2 Forge, 4 AV Grenade Users ) Or any combination of team work. Even if the tank has hardeners on you can still kill it... its not invincible. Or even if you have a tanker working with you teamwork is the second best way to kill tanks. ( Other than people who use the Gunnlogi, Sica, Dual dmg modifier fit on a rail gun pew pew :( ) Tanks are op because there bigger better stronger faster they have no weakness unlike most other things in this game. And everybody already know the tanks are op no reason in trying to cover it up.
Delusional thoughts from fantasy island.
No weaknesses? Then please tell me how I am able to ONE-SHOT pretty much any HAV with my Wiyrkomi Breach Forge Gun?
That's right I can SOLO HAVs. The only drawback is that I need to ACTUALLY AIM for the rear weakspot. If I was coordinating with just one other Forger I can only imagine the devastation we could accomplish, but I only run Solo so whatever.
FIRE UP THE HEAVY MEAT GRINDER! WE'RE HAVIN' CLONE BURGERS TONIGHT, BOYS!
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