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NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 295	Posted - 2014.01.24 23:36:00 - [1] - Quote The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear Director: Diplomat Search DL514 to apply, include some character details
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 8339	Posted - 2014.01.24 23:37:00 - [2] - Quote You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Level 5 Proficiency 3 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
Marlin Kirby KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 253	Posted - 2014.01.24 23:42:00 - [3] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. This^ The not Logic Bomb! -->We need better comms!<--
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 72	Posted - 2014.01.24 23:44:00 - [4] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear We should be getting at least 300k if we were decent Decent is now 179k You have to get 3000 wp to get any isk 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 72	Posted - 2014.01.24 23:45:00 - [5] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Vehicles can If you do good in proto you should profit, slightly at least 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
Dustbunny Durrr ReD or DeaD 70	Posted - 2014.01.25 00:11:00 - [6] - Quote What do you mean by ubs? Also, whats wrong with basic gear? I have about half of my suits in the 14-20K range for ISK making, and the rest in the 100K+ range for ISK wasting. It's just finding a balance that is necessary, you can't always go uber proto unless you're good enough to afford it.
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 983	Posted - 2014.01.25 00:15:00 - [7] - Quote NK Scout wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Vehicles can If you do good in proto you should profit, slightly at least Well fit Vehicles cost around half a mill ISK (admittedly the militia vehicles and modules need to be removed, or reduced in functionality as they are simply too powerful to have with 0 SP investment).. they lose 1, and they lose profit... Sure if they don't die they turn a profit, but Dropsuits are the same there. If anything the ISK pay outs are sometimes too high, allowing Prototype Usage more than it really should. "Regard your soldiers as your children, and they will follow you into the deepest valleys." Sun Tzu
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 72	Posted - 2014.01.25 01:01:00 - [8] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: NK Scout wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Vehicles can If you do good in proto you should profit, slightly at least Well fit Vehicles cost around half a mill ISK (admittedly the militia vehicles and modules need to be removed, or reduced in functionality as they are simply too powerful to have with 0 SP investment).. they lose 1, and they lose profit... Sure if they don't die they turn a profit, but Dropsuits are the same there. If anything the ISK pay outs are sometimes too high, allowing Prototype Usage more than it really should. corps could spam proto while other people cant, it hurts non farmers dropsuits die easier than vehicles 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 299	Posted - 2014.01.25 04:54:00 - [9] - Quote Im not saying that you cant im saying its hard, i dont know how expensive yout suits are but if i die three times in my adbancee suit i dont make any isk on the match, i can die once in proto,8 in basic. With most matches id say i get five deaths, if im in basic ill be like 40/10 even in basic a 300k. Payout is not enough, especially if i lost all that getting a win Director: Diplomat Search DL514 to apply, include some character details
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 984	Posted - 2014.01.25 10:21:00 - [10] - Quote NK Scout wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: NK Scout wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Vehicles can If you do good in proto you should profit, slightly at least Well fit Vehicles cost around half a mill ISK (admittedly the militia vehicles and modules need to be removed, or reduced in functionality as they are simply too powerful to have with 0 SP investment).. they lose 1, and they lose profit... Sure if they don't die they turn a profit, but Dropsuits are the same there. If anything the ISK pay outs are sometimes too high, allowing Prototype Usage more than it really should. corps could spam proto while other people cant, it hurts non farmers dropsuits die easier than vehicles Then the answer is to help put a hold on the ISK farms, not increase the pay outs, which would only help the farmers more. "Regard your soldiers as your children, and they will follow you into the deepest valleys." Sun Tzu

NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 77	Posted - 2014.01.25 11:03:00 - [11] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: NK Scout wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: NK Scout wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Vehicles can If you do good in proto you should profit, slightly at least Well fit Vehicles cost around half a mill ISK (admittedly the militia vehicles and modules need to be removed, or reduced in functionality as they are simply too powerful to have with 0 SP investment).. they lose 1, and they lose profit... Sure if they don't die they turn a profit, but Dropsuits are the same there. If anything the ISK pay outs are sometimes too high, allowing Prototype Usage more than it really should. corps could spam proto while other people cant, it hurts non farmers dropsuits die easier than vehicles Then the answer is to help put a hold on the ISK farms, not increase the pay outs, which would only help the farmers more. Or just let people us proto to compete without going so isk negative 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 984	Posted - 2014.01.25 11:05:00 - [12] - Quote NK Scout wrote: Or just let people us proto to compete without going so isk negative And further punish the newer people who haven't got the SP to use proto. "Regard your soldiers as your children, and they will follow you into the deepest valleys." Sun Tzu
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1208	Posted - 2014.01.25 11:21:00 - [13] - Quote NK Scout wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear We should be getting at least 300k if we were decent Decent is now 179k You have to get 3000 wp to get any isk Untrue. I routinely get 300k isk in matches often with out breaking 3k wp. The trick is that ISK payout is not a direct link to the WP you earned or the amount of time you spent in game. ISK payout also partially depends on your how your WP earnings stack up against your team mates'. If you are in first place the larger the gap between you and the next closest player the more sp you seem to get. To the OP do you really want me earning more isk? At 500k a match I would never run out of isk even running proto all the time. I am one of the poorer vets at 100 mil. and I already have absolutely no trouble running any fit I want in any battle and still turning a profit in in the long run. A higher isk payout would only really benefit those of use who are already loaded. If anything newer players would benefit more from having the maximum payout for a match more closely resemble that of the lowest possible payout. By lowering the income disparity the suit disparity between older players and newer players in pubs would also be reduced. During beta CCP actually flattened out the damage of weapons between tiers since proto was overwhelmingly better than standard (it was far more dramatic than the difference is now). This had the effect of balancing out the game since proto was no longer an "I win button." Isk needs to be given the same treatment. Currently the lowest payed player will make around 60k isk if they are in the match from the start and totally worthless as far as play is concerned. The best players though can make almost a million isk per match (talk to Zero Bloom about that one, he earned over 900k isk in a single match and yes there are pictures but I can't be bothered to grab them from our facebook page). That kind of income disparity leads to people being able to overpower enemies with no regard for their finances. Sure, they might loose isk every few games running all proto, but in general they will come out ahead. PC is another reason for the massive wealth disparity in the game but that is a whole nother can 'o worms that dosen't need to be opened here. TL;DR ISK earning should actually all be lowered so that there is less of a difference between the best player on a team and the worst player. Fun > Realism
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 77	Posted - 2014.01.25 11:25:00 - [14] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: NK Scout wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear We should be getting at least 300k if we were decent Decent is now 179k You have to get 3000 wp to get any isk Untrue. I routinely get 300k isk in matches often with out breaking 3k wp. The trick is that ISK payout is not a direct link to the WP you earned or the amount of time you spent in game. ISK payout also partially depends on your how your WP earnings stack up against your team mates'. If you are in first place the larger the gap between you and the next closest player the more sp you seem to get. To the OP do you really want me earning more isk? At 500k a match I would never run out of isk even running proto all the time. I am one of the poorer vets at 100 mil. and I already have absolutely no trouble running any fit I want in any battle and still turning a profit in in the long run. A higher isk payout would only really benefit those of use who are already loaded. If anything newer players would benefit more from having the maximum payout for a match more closely resemble that of the lowest possible payout. By lowering the income disparity the suit disparity between older players and newer players in pubs would also be reduced. During beta CCP actually flattened out the damage of weapons between tiers since proto was overwhelmingly better than standard (it was far more dramatic than the difference is now). This had the effect of balancing out the game since proto was no longer an "I win button." Isk needs to be given the same treatment. Currently the lowest payed player will make around 60k isk if they are in the match from the start and totally worthless as far as play is concerned. The best players though can make almost a million isk per match (talk to Zero Bloom about that one, he earned over 900k isk in a single match and yes there are pictures but I can't be bothered to grab them from our facebook page). That kind of income disparity leads to people being able to overpower enemies with no regard for their finances. Sure, they might loose isk every few games running all proto, but in general they will come out ahead. PC is another reason for the massive wealth disparity in the game but that is a whole nother can 'o worms that dosen't need to be opened here. TL;DR ISK earning should actually all be lowered so that there is less of a difference between the best player on a team and the worst player. Im in the top 3 all the time, I should be getting 300k alot 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 94	Posted - 2014.01.25 11:32:00 - [15] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Currently the lowest payed player will make around 60k isk if they are in the match from the start and totally worthless as far as play is concerned. What the hell? I never got below 100k in a match that I played start to finish, even when I was new to the game and consistently ranked far at the bottom. How bad do you have to be to get 60k ISK? Get not a single WP and die thirty times?
X7 lion Swamp Tempo Canis Eliminatus Operatives 81	Posted - 2014.01.25 11:47:00 - [16] - Quote i think the point he is trying to make is grinding should never be a intentional GAME mechanic. becuse its a GAME there should be challenge, but there should be a GRIND because unless you are a fluffy lombax wearing grind boots on a grind rail GRINDING ISNT FUN. now NoxMort3m would that be a better way of putting it?
poison Diego NECROM0NGERS The CORVOS 300	Posted - 2014.01.25 12:04:00 - [17] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. WORD! WELCOME TO WORLDofTANKz514 put your seatbelts on, ITs GONNA BE A BUMPY RIDE!! and please SUCK ON MY BIG BLACK BLASTER!
poison Diego NECROM0NGERS The CORVOS 300	Posted - 2014.01.25 12:06:00 - [18] - Quote you just have to get double the amount of WP the person in second place has to get real money. That why you run solo if you want to make isk. WELCOME TO WORLDofTANKz514 put your seatbelts on, ITs GONNA BE A BUMPY RIDE!! and please SUCK ON MY BIG BLACK BLASTER!
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 8350	Posted - 2014.01.25 12:14:00 - [19] - Quote NK Scout wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. Vehicles can If you do good in proto you should profit, slightly at least There are no proto vehicles. There are complex modules, but there are no proto hulls. When we previously had higher tier vehicle hulls, they most certainly did not turn a profit. And you can profit if you do well in proto. I do it regularly. Level 5 Proficiency 3 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 77	Posted - 2014.01.25 12:31:00 - [20] - Quote X7 lion wrote: i think the point he is trying to make is grinding should never be a intentional GAME mechanic. becuse its a GAME there should be challenge, but there should be a GRIND because unless you are a fluffy lombax wearing grind boots on a grind rail GRINDING ISNT FUN. now NoxMort3m would that be a better way of putting it? I prefer boots that lift you off the ground But ah, I liked grinding there 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set

Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 307	Posted - 2014.01.25 12:39:00 - [21] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 77	Posted - 2014.01.25 12:41:00 - [22] - Quote Im a adv logi and I die for my team if needed, so thats not much profit, sometimes I go negative, or 7 get alot 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 400	Posted - 2014.01.25 13:30:00 - [23] - Quote risk vs reward has no risk if you're guaranteed a profit i wish we had a more accurate way to pay the best performers but not a general here is more Proud Christian one of the most essential parts of eve is left out of dust: freedom, exploration, open-world gameplay.
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 301	Posted - 2014.01.26 02:21:00 - [24] - Quote Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, Director: Diplomat Search DL514 to apply, include some character details
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 990	Posted - 2014.01.26 02:33:00 - [25] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, The ideal of not making a profit for running proto is designed to level the playing field in pub matches. The issue is not the payout from the pub matches, it's the other ISK faucets. People who have been playing this game for the entire year, have been in PC, have hundreds of millions of ISK. This means that practically from now until they decide to leave they could run proto, even at a loss. Increasing the ISK payouts from Public Matches only feeds this fuel, and makes them capable for longer. The ISK faucets need to be less, not more, that way these guys who are capable of running Proto 'forever' will not be able to run it as long. Also, besides Gear, there are very few ISK faucets. One of the many reasons why I believe that Corporate Bases and other 'aesthetic' items should be introduced as ISK sinks. tl:dr Make pay outs less, and give us more stuff we 'want' to spend ISK on. "Regard your soldiers as your children, and they will follow you into the deepest valleys." Sun Tzu
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 302	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:35:00 - [26] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, The ideal of not making a profit for running proto is designed to level the playing field in pub matches. The issue is not the payout from the pub matches, it's the other ISK faucets. People who have been playing this game for the entire year, have been in PC, have hundreds of millions of ISK. This means that practically from now until they decide to leave they could run proto, even at a loss. Increasing the ISK payouts from Public Matches only feeds this fuel, and makes them capable for longer. The ISK faucets need to be less, not more, that way these guys who are capable of running Proto 'forever' will not be able to run it as long. Also, besides Gear, there are very few ISK faucets. One of the many reasons why I believe that Corporate Bases and other 'aesthetic' items should be introduced as ISK sinks. I disagree but it still stands that a good fight will result in ten advanced deaths and in most cases the top six players do not make more isk than they lost getting the victory for the oher ten players tl:dr Make pay outs less, and give us more stuff we 'want' to spend ISK on. Director: Diplomat Search DL514 to apply, include some character details
Fire of Prometheus Alpha Response Command 3168	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:51:00 - [27] - Quote I'm all for increasing the payouts but in all honesty, it will only reward the pub stompers more..... Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // C.E.O of Alpha Response Command A Balac's and a Thale's.....What's on your commando?
Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 308	Posted - 2014.01.26 10:01:00 - [28] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, Victories do have high payouts if you're in the top of the list of the victors The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 81	Posted - 2014.01.26 10:37:00 - [29] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, The ideal of not making a profit for running proto is designed to level the playing field in pub matches. The issue is not the payout from the pub matches, it's the other ISK faucets. People who have been playing this game for the entire year, have been in PC, have hundreds of millions of ISK. This means that practically from now until they decide to leave they could run proto, even at a loss. Increasing the ISK payouts from Public Matches only feeds this fuel, and makes them capable for longer. The ISK faucets need to be less, not more, that way these guys who are capable of running Proto 'forever' will not be able to run it as long. Also, besides Gear, there are very few ISK faucets. One of the many reasons why I believe that Corporate Bases and other 'aesthetic' items should be introduced as ISK sinks. tl:dr Make pay outs less, and give us more stuff we 'want' to spend ISK on. Terrible The payouts are pure **** right now 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 8453	Posted - 2014.01.26 11:24:00 - [30] - Quote NK Scout wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, The ideal of not making a profit for running proto is designed to level the playing field in pub matches. The issue is not the payout from the pub matches, it's the other ISK faucets. People who have been playing this game for the entire year, have been in PC, have hundreds of millions of ISK. This means that practically from now until they decide to leave they could run proto, even at a loss. Increasing the ISK payouts from Public Matches only feeds this fuel, and makes them capable for longer. The ISK faucets need to be less, not more, that way these guys who are capable of running Proto 'forever' will not be able to run it as long. Also, besides Gear, there are very few ISK faucets. One of the many reasons why I believe that Corporate Bases and other 'aesthetic' items should be introduced as ISK sinks. tl:dr Make pay outs less, and give us more stuff we 'want' to spend ISK on. Terrible The payouts are pure ** right now They're 'pure **' if you want to run proto all day while being bad. If you think they're bad, you are dying much more than you should be in expensive gear. Level 5 Proficiency 3 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution

NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 83	Posted - 2014.01.26 11:32:00 - [31] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, The ideal of not making a profit for running proto is designed to level the playing field in pub matches. The issue is not the payout from the pub matches, it's the other ISK faucets. People who have been playing this game for the entire year, have been in PC, have hundreds of millions of ISK. This means that practically from now until they decide to leave they could run proto, even at a loss. Increasing the ISK payouts from Public Matches only feeds this fuel, and makes them capable for longer. The ISK faucets need to be less, not more, that way these guys who are capable of running Proto 'forever' will not be able to run it as long. Also, besides Gear, there are very few ISK faucets. One of the many reasons why I believe that Corporate Bases and other 'aesthetic' items should be introduced as ISK sinks. tl:dr Make pay outs less, and give us more stuff we 'want' to spend ISK on. Terrible The payouts are pure ** right now They're 'pure **' if you want to run proto all day while being bad. If you think they're bad, you are dying much more than you should be in expensive gear.[/quote] Ah, so sick of people saying "Your bad" "Get good" "Stop running proto stuff" Etc etc I get top 3, if not top 5, get 179k if stomped, I use adv suit, std weapon, and sometimes the payouts are good, (300k or 444k if I get 4k wp) but alot its no more than 210k 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 240	Posted - 2014.01.26 11:36:00 - [32] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: The average match Victory should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in pubs using anything other than basic gear We have problem in Dust with "Risk vs. Reward" Public matches are taking place in Empire - systems with high security status, defended by CONCORD(NPC) with for most of the time prevent EVE pilots from doing 'bad' stuff. For example: - In empire you can fly a ship from system A to system B completely safety(if his ISK value is lower than ISK required to invest into ship that would be capable to destroy that ship flying from system A to system B). On system with lower security(low-sec) status that requested "investment" is reduced because there is no CONCORD and NPC punishment is lower. So it is more risky for players to travel in low-sec but it also gives them more profit. Here Faction Warfare is placed and PC. At the end we have null-sec - systems where there is no NPC security, and player can do whatever they want - those system gives biggest reward. There is no content for Dust yet. Problem is that pub matches gives too much compare to Factional Warfare(like FF off, WarBarage strikes, RARE weapon drop, and others). If we want to increase rewards, we should start from tweaking FW because this low-sec deserve to be competitive with PC, and much better than pub matches. Today if we annihilate our enemy on FW all we get at the end is flat LP reward defined by our standing level, flat standing increase, and Militia salvage(this is unacceptable that we can not gather our own team salvage if we defended or conquered piece of land). I'm here since may 2012, my EVE alter ego is Nosum Hseebnrido.
Cooper Eudaemon DUST University Ivy League 147	Posted - 2014.01.26 11:42:00 - [33] - Quote So, I'm a decent player. I haven't been playing EVE for years, nor have I played any competitive FPS before this one. A great match for me would be 10/5, 1,200 WP. The last time I ran a match like that I made 140,000 ISK. An average match for me would be 5/6, 650 WP. I've made anywhere from 80,000 to 110,000 ISK in matches like that. A bad match would be 3/10, 400 WP. The last time I ran a match like that I made 160,000 ISK. ...so what the kitten is going on here? I need a break from Dust! I'll just go hop on the forums... I need a break from the forums! I'll just go hop on Dust...
Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 240	Posted - 2014.01.26 11:47:00 - [34] - Quote Cooper Eudaemon wrote: So, I'm a decent player. I haven't been playing EVE for years, nor have I played any competitive FPS before this one. A great match for me would be 10/5, 1,200 WP. The last time I ran a match like that I made 140,000 ISK. An average match for me would be 5/6, 650 WP. I've made anywhere from 80,000 to 110,000 ISK in matches like that. A bad match would be 3/10, 400 WP. The last time I ran a match like that I made 160,000 ISK. ...so what the kitten is going on here? If you gone kill a couple of times guy that is full proto with rare weapon in one match, and militia on one in second match, you will not get same isk reward at the end of every match. ISK reward is define by what Tier of items was used in match. Higher meta, higher reward. I'm here since may 2012, my EVE alter ego is Nosum Hseebnrido.
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 84	Posted - 2014.01.26 11:50:00 - [35] - Quote Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: Cooper Eudaemon wrote: So, I'm a decent player. I haven't been playing EVE for years, nor have I played any competitive FPS before this one. A great match for me would be 10/5, 1,200 WP. The last time I ran a match like that I made 140,000 ISK. An average match for me would be 5/6, 650 WP. I've made anywhere from 80,000 to 110,000 ISK in matches like that. A bad match would be 3/10, 400 WP. The last time I ran a match like that I made 160,000 ISK. ...so what the kitten is going on here? If you gone kill a couple of times guy that is full proto with rare weapon in one match, and militia on one in second match, you will not get same isk reward at the end of every match. ISK reward is define by what Tier of items was used in match. Higher meta, higher reward. Untrue, still **** payouts against proto kills 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter militia frame, Templar set
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 313	Posted - 2014.01.26 16:10:00 - [36] - Quote If the payout was better blueberries could try harder in pubs, which is all the average players has to make isk, just because some corps lock thier districts for free and aare just farming doesnt mean th actually base game should have a low payout , punishing berries that dont even play pc or are not in a distict locking corp Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
TunRa D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 421	Posted - 2014.01.26 16:14:00 - [37] - Quote I normally 300k - 600k a match with my logi you jealous? Oh yeah and each logi suit cost me from 5k - 30k, and that is a mix of adv and basic gear. Edit: I'll tell you a secret, if you want more ISK get the team that sucks. That way you end up with 3000 WP and the guy below you ends up with 500k. That guarantees large ISK payouts. Thanks CCP Foxfour
Cooper Eudaemon DUST University Ivy League 151	Posted - 2014.01.26 16:18:00 - [38] - Quote Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: If you gone kill a couple of times guy that is full proto with rare weapon in one match, and militia on one in second match, you will not get same isk reward at the end of every match. ISK reward is define by what Tier of items was used in match. Higher meta, higher reward. It used to be based on meta, but they got rid of that recently, which I think was a huge mistake. I have no idea how it's figured now. I need a break from Dust! I'll just go hop on the forums... I need a break from the forums! I'll just go hop on Dust...
Hoover Damn H.A.R.V.E.S.T. Legacy Rising 22	Posted - 2014.01.26 17:08:00 - [39] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, lol. protoscrub wants to be able to hide behind his suit and make money.
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 321	Posted - 2014.01.27 01:17:00 - [40] - Quote NK Scout wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear We should be getting at least 300k if we were decent Decent is now 179k You have to get 3000 wp to get any isk Exactly and that is seriously crazy, the average blueberries averages around 1000 wp and thats being nice , the system makes no sense , i can go 24 and 3 in my advanced suit and still not make enough isk to pay for my suits ,if i win and i was a significant factor in that victory my payout should ATLEAST cover my losses,and it currently does not And this isnt even considering when the reds are a decent team that keeps the letter, in some cases you are going to die 5-10+ , worse if not atleast in advanced gear, in those cases there is no chance for a profit, even when turned back to victory ,in those cases it literally becomes who is willing to lose the most isk to win players should be rewarded for thier effort with the current payout players are discouraged from fighting for the victory, tell me 80% of pubs are not completly one sided with a straight face increasing the payout for victory would get players out of the redline and in fighting for objectives Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply

Dj grammer Red Star. EoN. 122	Posted - 2014.01.27 02:34:00 - [41] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You can easily turn a profit with advanced gear. You're not meant to turn a profit with prototype gear. And if you somehow did turn a profit while running proto more power to you. Open Beta (12/13/2012) to a 1-year Vet. Tends to flip the table when seeing the words: YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED
Breazilian KNIGHTZ OF THE ROUND Legacy Rising 3	Posted - 2014.01.27 03:19:00 - [42] - Quote Why not just give 2-3% percent of whoever you kill or whatever you destroy?
VikingKong iBUN Third Rock From The Sun INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 20	Posted - 2014.01.27 04:27:00 - [43] - Quote +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 994	Posted - 2014.01.27 06:01:00 - [44] - Quote VikingKong iBUN wrote: +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning And giving out more ISK will actually make this issue worse. As I explained above, Proto Stomping is not supposed to be profitable, and the public arena is really the only place for Newer Players to go. Which means in public matches you have a range of newer, less geared people (discounting poor matchmaking decisions in whatever form there are). They can't do anything with this ISK to bring themselves to parity with Prototype-Level Players. However, if you attack the high-geared players ISK faucets, (lowering income) AND give them something besides gear to spend ISK on, then you will bring them down closer to parity as they can't run proto in public matches as long. Don't step on the little guys to make sure you big guys can turn a profit stomping them. Once you go Black, you just never go back!
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 325	Posted - 2014.01.27 12:34:00 - [45] - Quote VikingKong iBUN wrote: +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning Thank you sir, that is exactly what im saying Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 325	Posted - 2014.01.27 12:40:00 - [46] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: VikingKong iBUN wrote: +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning And giving out more ISK will actually make this issue worse. As I explained above, Proto Stomping is not supposed to be profitable, and the public arena is really the only place for Newer Players to go. Which means in public matches you have a range of newer, less geared people (discounting poor matchmaking decisions in whatever form there are). They can't do anything with this ISK to bring themselves to parity with Prototype-Level Players. However, if you attack the high-geared players ISK faucets, (lowering income) AND give them something besides gear to spend ISK on, then you will bring them down closer to parity as they can't run proto in public matches as long. Don't step on the little guys to make sure you big guys can turn a profit stomping them. your so hung up on he idea of proto gear making a profit you dont realize that in any match where your fighting a good team you cant even make a profit with advanced grar Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 994	Posted - 2014.01.27 12:45:00 - [47] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: VikingKong iBUN wrote: +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning And giving out more ISK will actually make this issue worse. As I explained above, Proto Stomping is not supposed to be profitable, and the public arena is really the only place for Newer Players to go. Which means in public matches you have a range of newer, less geared people (discounting poor matchmaking decisions in whatever form there are). They can't do anything with this ISK to bring themselves to parity with Prototype-Level Players. However, if you attack the high-geared players ISK faucets, (lowering income) AND give them something besides gear to spend ISK on, then you will bring them down closer to parity as they can't run proto in public matches as long. Don't step on the little guys to make sure you big guys can turn a profit stomping them. your so hung up on he idea of proto gear making a profit you dont realize that in any match where your fighting a good team you cant even make a profit with advanced grar That is not a matter of ISK payouts then is it? It's a matter of A) Matchmaking, and b) teamwork. A coordinated team, even in STD gear, will generally trump a team of random blueberries, even if they run Advanced / Proto. Increasing ISK payouts wont solve this problem.. in fact it will make it worse because suddenly they CAN turn profits easily running prototype as a coordinated team. Your 'ass-whooping' will get worse, and for longer, since the payouts wont cut into their already swelling wallets. And again, I will reiterate... this will make it even harder on the new guys who ONLY have SP to run Standard and no amount of ISK will help them claw back the balance. They could buy Proto or Advanced Gear, but cannot use it. Same with Weapons. Once you go Black, you just never go back!
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 328	Posted - 2014.01.28 00:11:00 - [48] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: VikingKong iBUN wrote: +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning And giving out more ISK will actually make this issue worse. As I explained above, Proto Stomping is not supposed to be profitable, and the public arena is really the only place for Newer Players to go. Which means in public matches you have a range of newer, less geared people (discounting poor matchmaking decisions in whatever form there are). They can't do anything with this ISK to bring themselves to parity with Prototype-Level Players. However, if you attack the high-geared players ISK faucets, (lowering income) AND give them something besides gear to spend ISK on, then you will bring them down closer to parity as they can't run proto in public matches as long. Don't step on the little guys to make sure you big guys can turn a profit stomping them. your so hung up on he idea of proto gear making a profit you dont realize that in any match where your fighting a good team you cant even make a profit with advanced grar That is not a matter of ISK payouts then is it? It's a matter of A) Matchmaking, and b) teamwork. A coordinated team, even in STD gear, will generally trump a team of random blueberries, even if they run Advanced / Proto. Increasing ISK payouts wont solve this problem.. in fact it will make it worse because suddenly they CAN turn profits easily running prototype as a coordinated team. Your 'ass-whooping' will get worse, and for longer, since the payouts wont cut into their already swelling wallets. And again, I will reiterate... this will make it even harder on the new guys who ONLY have SP to run Standard and no amount of ISK will help them claw back the balance. They could buy Proto or Advanced Gear, but cannot use it. Same with Weapons. How are you going to say an organized team will trump blueberries as an arguing point , thats like saying a nuke is capable of killing cats, Secondly, what i want is for the other 10BB'S to be able to make enough isk to be less fearfull IF they participated enough and ESPECIALLY if they get the victory, Short of insane expenses due to whatever reason a victory should cover the isk lost getting it! Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 994	Posted - 2014.01.28 00:45:00 - [49] - Quote NoxMort3m wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The Black Jackal wrote: VikingKong iBUN wrote: +1 more isk would certainly be a good incentive to try and win games currently i dont care if i win or lose in a pub match, but if i use a good suit and actually try to win i'll only end up losing isk - which defies the point of winning And giving out more ISK will actually make this issue worse. As I explained above, Proto Stomping is not supposed to be profitable, and the public arena is really the only place for Newer Players to go. Which means in public matches you have a range of newer, less geared people (discounting poor matchmaking decisions in whatever form there are). They can't do anything with this ISK to bring themselves to parity with Prototype-Level Players. However, if you attack the high-geared players ISK faucets, (lowering income) AND give them something besides gear to spend ISK on, then you will bring them down closer to parity as they can't run proto in public matches as long. Don't step on the little guys to make sure you big guys can turn a profit stomping them. your so hung up on he idea of proto gear making a profit you dont realize that in any match where your fighting a good team you cant even make a profit with advanced grar That is not a matter of ISK payouts then is it? It's a matter of A) Matchmaking, and b) teamwork. A coordinated team, even in STD gear, will generally trump a team of random blueberries, even if they run Advanced / Proto. Increasing ISK payouts wont solve this problem.. in fact it will make it worse because suddenly they CAN turn profits easily running prototype as a coordinated team. Your 'ass-whooping' will get worse, and for longer, since the payouts wont cut into their already swelling wallets. And again, I will reiterate... this will make it even harder on the new guys who ONLY have SP to run Standard and no amount of ISK will help them claw back the balance. They could buy Proto or Advanced Gear, but cannot use it. Same with Weapons. How are you going to say an organized team will trump blueberries as an arguing point , thats like saying a nuke is capable of killing cats, Secondly, what i want is for the other 10BB'S to be able to make enough isk to be less fearfull IF they participated enough and ESPECIALLY if they get the victory, Short of insane expenses due to whatever reason a victory should cover the isk lost getting it! You have to look at it from both ends of the scale, however. The higher payouts will unbalance the matches even further. The new guys who CANNOT run Prototype Gear, no matter how much ISK they have, will be stomped even worse, and for longer. THe only way increased ISK payout should happen, if it will happen, is if you have completely segregated games with max-level gear for each. Example, Match STD - Militia / Standard Level Gear Only, any fit with Advanced / Prototype or Enhanced / Complex Modules are invalid Match ADV - Militia / Standard / Advanced Level Gear Only, any fit with Prototype or Complex Modules are Invalid Match PRO - All Gear is allowed. They did this once during closed beta, and while the games and matchmaking were far more balanced, it splintered the community and a lot of games had 4-8 people in them, not the full 32. Unless they can provide some measure for ISK to be able to balance low-end players, they need to try balance public matches by making your more expensive suits harder to turn a profit in. Once you go Black, you just never go back!
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 336	Posted - 2014.01.28 18:49:00 - [50] - Quote Do i need to post pics of good matches with poo payout, ill use any tier gear you guys would like Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply

Johnny Guilt Algintal Core 470	Posted - 2014.01.28 20:39:00 - [51] - Quote id like to see increased payouts for pubs,it used to be higher first months of uprising and slowly lessened, as if we didn't notice CCP A strange game. The only winning move is not to play.
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 337	Posted - 2014.01.29 08:30:00 - [52] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: id like to see increased payouts for pubs,it used to be higher first months of uprising and slowly lessened, as if we didn't notice CCP Preach on brother man Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 340	Posted - 2014.01.30 06:31:00 - [53] - Quote Dev or cpm comment ? Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 1484	Posted - 2014.01.30 10:55:00 - [54] - Quote I agree, this would help little corp to try at least a couple of PC battles every year 1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 1497	Posted - 2014.01.31 11:57:00 - [55] - Quote Friendly bump 1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
Squagga The State Protectorate 102	Posted - 2014.01.31 14:15:00 - [56] - Quote I didn't read the whole thing here ... basically, besides the fact that you shouldn't be running fits you can't afford if you're not constantly winning PC matches, why isn't there a greater ISK reward for winning a match? Win with a good squad or lose to blue berries the payout seems the same Reloading, the silent killer.
NoxMort3m D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 373	Posted - 2014.01.31 18:28:00 - [57] - Quote Squagga wrote: I didn't read the whole thing here ... basically, besides the fact that you shouldn't be running fits you can't afford if you're not constantly winning PC matches, why isn't there a greater ISK reward for winning a match? Win with a good squad or lose to blue berries the payout seems the same Exactly, there should be insentive to win Director:Diplomat Search DL514 to apply
Eskel Bondfree DUST University Ivy League 176	Posted - 2014.02.02 11:45:00 - [58] - Quote That's a relevant discussion, and I agree that the current ISK payouts make it hard to turn a profit for anyone not ranking 1st place at the score board while using anything but std/mlt gear. Because a flat increase in ISK payout is not a good solution as pointed out by others already, here is another suggestion: Introduce an insurance system. If you win a battle, your insurance will replace some/all of your losses. If you lose, you get nothing (as it is now). This is how I imagine it: before a battle, you can chose to insure X number of drop suits for a maximum amount of Y ISK per suit. You have to pay the insurance before you enter a battle, and the active insurance will take effect for the next battle you enter. If you win this battle, your insurance will pay the total cost of each suit you lost (suit, weapons, modules, equipment), but only up to the max amount of Y ISK per suit and only for a maximum number of X suits (like you had chosen in the insurance). Example: I insure 5 drop suits for 20k ISK each. I win the battle, I lose 3 adv suits that cost 35k each, and 10 basic suits that cost 8k each. Insurance will pay me 20k ISK for each adv suit I lost (60k total), and 8k ISK for 2 basic suits I lost (16k total). I get nothing for the other 8 suits, because I had only insured a max number of 5 suits. Important addition: to prevent this from becoming a risk free money printing machine for proto stompers, the maximum insurance sum per suit should be capped for public contracts. Probably at the average cost of an adv suit, like maybe 30k - 50k ISK. The insurance cost should also scale exponentially with the total insured ISK sum. E.g., insuring 10 suits for 5k each might cost 5k ISK (10% of the insured sum of 50k ISK), but insuring 20 suits for 50k each would cost 250k ISK (25% of the insured sum of 1 mil ISK). I think this would spice up the whole risk vs. reward thing a bit for public contracts, and it would provide incentive to actually risk your gear for winning a battle.
Draco Cerberus BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 746	Posted - 2014.02.02 15:28:00 - [59] - Quote The Black Jackal wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: The average match should payout 500 k instead of the current average of 200-300k its nearly impossible to generate isk in ubs using anything other than basic gear play more conservatively, and it's easy to make profit in adv gear, I personally have given away over 100m ISK and still have 100 m for myself. Use cheaper gear if you can't sustain it. I shouldnt have to use basic every match make a profit and that almost promises a loss, victoris should a highe payout so if i die ten times in my proto heavy kepping the leter blue i should get nearly enough isk to pay for it,same for advanced or basic when i go 50/20 fighting for the win, The ideal of not making a profit for running proto is designed to level the playing field in pub matches. The issue is not the payout from the pub matches, it's the other ISK faucets. People who have been playing this game for the entire year, have been in PC, have hundreds of millions of ISK. This means that practically from now until they decide to leave they could run proto, even at a loss. Increasing the ISK payouts from Public Matches only feeds this fuel, and makes them capable for longer. The ISK faucets need to be less, not more, that way these guys who are capable of running Proto 'forever' will not be able to run it as long. Also, besides Gear, there are very few ISK faucets. One of the many reasons why I believe that Corporate Bases and other 'aesthetic' items should be introduced as ISK sinks. tl:dr Make pay outs less, and give us more stuff we 'want' to spend ISK on. Although I would like to agree with you on this I am not entirely sure how low payouts level the playing field considering the people you talk about run nothing but proto and have as you say hundreds of millions of isk. I have been playing for longer than just a year and have yet to have anywhere close to 100mil or even 20mil in earnings from pub matches and PC combined. As a logi I am normally somewhere in the top 5 and earn the WP through equipment usage in combination with killing. A lot of the time that gets me killed. If we need an ISK faucet as you say maybe the empires should start selling districts to the rest of us, so everyone can lock a few and farm the **** out of PC. LogiGod earns his pips
The Black Jackal The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 1004	Posted - 2014.02.02 16:17:00 - [60] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: Although I would like to agree with you on this I am not entirely sure how low payouts level the playing field considering the people you talk about run nothing but proto and have as you say hundreds of millions of isk. I have been playing for longer than just a year and have yet to have anywhere close to 100mil or even 20mil in earnings from pub matches and PC combined. As a logi I am normally somewhere in the top 5 and earn the WP through equipment usage in combination with killing. A lot of the time that gets me killed. If we need an ISK faucet as you say maybe the empires should start selling districts to the rest of us, so everyone can lock a few and farm the **** out of PC. I did state that it was the ideal. I didn't say it was working as yet. The idea behind any basic economy is to have income, and expenditure. Now in DUST, we have income, and expenditure, but the general trend is that income is generally higher for many (and I say this as a Tanker who can't afford 1 of his Gunloggi's to be lost in a battle to make a profit) than their expenditure. As stated in people's posts above, there are no incentives to win a battle, so people AFK... AFK, no loss, no risk, = ISK gained. It doesn't matter how much you get, because you got it at no risk whatsoever. Now onto the dilemma, how do you reward those who actually risk higher expenditure? A simple Win / Loss Ration of ISK payout wont work... I see this especially when playing on Oceanic Servers. We will have 3-4 AFK on one team, and I and 1 other will be actively fighting a squad of 6 actives. No matter what kind of gear we pull out, the odds are generally not in our favour. Should we get more ISK? How do you differentiate the guys who risk nothing from the guys who risk a lot? I have gone entire matches 'playing the objectives' by guarding my team's home point. My team keeps them busy inside the facility, they enemy never approaches the home point. I get 0/0 and 0 WP.... Yet I have a Tank on the Field, and / or run a Proto Suit. I risked a hell of a lot (much more than I would have earned) but because I had favourable terms, I get rewarded less? The balance will never be there at this stage. With any system from here on you implement, there will be some people who are punished no matter what they do, and some who are rewarded for risking nothing. Increase ISK pay outs for the Winning Team? What about the guys running proto on the losing team who go 5/10 because they're outnumbered 2 or 3 to 1? Shouldn't they be compensated in the same manner as any other proto-wearing team member? By trying to bring down the quality of gear in public matches by having an 'unsustainable' income if you run prototype gear, they are attempting to force a more balanced playing field between newer players (who can't wear Proto Gear) and Old Hands who can. Increasing the ISK payout wont help the newer players, it will only help the older players who can run prototype gear. What is required is a separate arena for 'Proto-users' to go to.. or PvE to help the Newer Players Gear and Skill into a higher level of gear before engaging hostile players. And cutting off ISK faucets, or increasing expenditures (such as buying warbarges, or materials to 'create' your fits, or customisation of your merc quarters for ISK, or any number of asked for features that can be used to 'build a balanced economy'. Balanced Economy is Income = Expenditures. But when things such as KDR and NPE are involved, we need alternatives. Once you go Black, you just never go back!



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