if you are having trouble with your scout you are probably trying to assault with it.

Not all heavies.

But seriously. This game has been 'released' for how long and their is still only 2 Heavy weapons?!

I don't think it's them being greedy. I think they just want more than 2 things to call their own.

if you are having trouble with your scout you are probably trying to assault with it.

This is going to be my one and only post in response to the least productive but most vocal person in the vehicle/AV debate:

Just because you can do it, doesn't mean it's balanced.

1. Just because you can do it, doesn't mean it's balanced. I know a dropship pilot who six months ago was able to stay in the air a whole game, move troops around, get kills, and never get shot out of the sky--and I saw him do it in Planetary Conquest, Factional Warfare, and pub matches. Does that mean dropships were balanced and pilots just needed to HTFU and adapt? I don't believe that, and I don't think I've ever seen anyone claim that.

2. Just because you can do it, doesn't mean it's balanced. Balance in a role-based game is predicated on the idea that a role that is strong in one way is weak in another. Therefore the question is not whether AV are capable of destroying tanks, it's a question of what they have to give up to do it, and whether they're being proportionately compensated for their weaknesses in their area of strength. Right now, people are using militia tanks and suicide LAVs because they're able to accomplish the job better without making sacrifices. Just because they could do the job with forge guns and swarm launchers doesn't mean it's the best way to get it done--and if you can get better results without sacrificing flexibility, why wouldn't you?

3. Just because you can do it, doesn't mean it's balanced. I want to emphasize this point because you seem to be under the delusion that what is possible must be balanced. Tankers didn't believe this in 1.6, despite many of them going multiple matches without being destroyed. There are scouts who run around in ninja fits with nova knives--they get kills, therefore they are balanced? I regularly go positive on my skill-less alt with starter fits, so obviously a starter fit is just as good as a proto. There's not a problem with the matchmaking system, people just need to learn to adapt.

4. And finally: Just because you can do it, doesn't mean you should. You talk about teamwork, but what you really mean is buddy-work. If I'm working on a team, and not just out to kill vehicles, I likely have a more important responsibility than chasing down tanks the whole game. Because while I'm off chasing one tank, me and my buddy are leaving the rest of the team defenseless against any other vehicle that decides to sidle up and give them hell. That's not teamwork, that's selfishness.

These are the reasons why your anecdotes and continuing posts are irrelevant. You're setting out to prove a limited point, with limited applicability, and pretending as though the results prove some universal truth.

But of course I'm doing this for the benefit of the people reading your threads, not for you yourself. You've already made up your mind, and wouldn't change it if I presented you with a thousand pages of hard, incontrovertible evidence. So to all of you who have any sense, I leave you this TL;DR:

Don't feed the troll. If you don't respond to his posts, they will just disappear into the archive. Let them.

and what can I, a scout, call my own?

Technically they can't just "use any weapon in the game", they have to invest the SP first.

Considering that heavy suits are the most expensive suits to invest SP in I think it is the SP thats the balancing factor.

they can use ANY weapon in the game PLUS 2 other ones?

I see posts and hear people talking about how heavies only have 2 weapons when in reality, they have EVERY weapon. and then they want more heavy weapons, which is reasonable I suppose, but those are weapons ONLY heavies will be able to use. I can see why they want them, but they shouldn't be a priority in this game. last time I recall, my scout suit can't carry a HMG, but that heavy can carry a Shotgun, Rail Rifle, or any other weapon that I can carry.

plus did anyone ever think about the fact that if there's a heavy weapon that has similar dps to the HMG but is LONG RANGE, that would be ridiculously OP? already, all 4 of the rifles are considered OP, now imagine a gun with twice the dps and even more range, and is fitted on the highest ehp suit in the game.

also, I won't say that HMGs are OP, but I will say that I find it funny that heavies want to have the most ehp in the game AND the most dps. sounds a bit greedy if you ask me, especially when there are other much more important mechanics that need fixing.

but I digress. maybe it's just me.

they can use ANY weapon in the game PLUS 2 other ones?

I see posts and hear people talking about how heavies only have 2 weapons when in reality, they have EVERY weapon. and then they want more heavy weapons, which is reasonable I suppose, but those are weapons ONLY heavies will be able to use. I can see why they want them, but they shouldn't be a priority in this game. last time I recall, my scout suit can't carry a HMG, but that heavy can carry a Shotgun, Rail Rifle, or any other weapon that I can carry.

plus did anyone ever think about the fact that if there's a heavy weapon that has similar dps to the HMG but is LONG RANGE, that would be ridiculously OP? already, all 4 of the rifles are considered OP, now imagine a gun with twice the dps and even more range, and is fitted on the highest ehp suit in the game.

also, I won't say that HMGs are OP, but I will say that I find it funny that heavies want to have the most ehp in the game AND the most dps. sounds a bit greedy if you ask me, especially when there are other much more important mechanics that need fixing.

but I digress. maybe it's just me.

they can use ANY weapon in the game PLUS 2 other ones?

I see posts and hear people talking about how heavies only have 2 weapons when in reality, they have EVERY weapon. and then they want more heavy weapons, which is reasonable I suppose, but those are weapons ONLY heavies will be able to use. I can see why they want them, but they shouldn't be a priority in this game. last time I recall, my scout suit can't carry a HMG, but that heavy can carry a Shotgun, Rail Rifle, or any other weapon that I can carry.

plus did anyone ever think about the fact that if there's a heavy weapon that has similar dps to the HMG but is LONG RANGE, that would be ridiculously OP? already, all 4 of the rifles are considered OP, now imagine a gun with twice the dps and even more range, and is fitted on the highest ehp suit in the game.

also, I won't say that HMGs are OP, but I will say that I find it funny that heavies want to have the most ehp in the game AND the most dps. sounds a bit greedy if you ask me, especially when there are other much more important mechanics that need fixing.

but I digress. maybe it's just me.

Dear OP,

You're aiming at the wrong target. Heavies do not want more heavy weapons at the expense of scouts. That doesn't mean heavies don't want more heavy weapons, or that heavy weapons should not be a priority. Everyone is lobbying for their own play style, but that doesn't mean we don't all want the same thing--a fun game with a lot of specialization. We're all playing a New Eden game because we love dirty cutthroat oneupsmanship--but only in the game. Out here, we're all in this together.

Sincerely,

Goric

You're making a big mistake lashing out at people in the same boat as you, Biscuit. Yes, most dedicated Heavy players complain about the complete lack of new heavy-oriented content since closed beta. Those same Heavy players rally behind Scouts when you guys ask for content. You got it just as bad as us, and we recognize that.

Stop bitching about people who have your back.

(In any caseGǪ it looks like 1.8 might answer all our prayers, skinny and fattie alike.)

Medium suits should be able to use the HMG, and Forge guns.

No

or if they did, make them run slower, like heavy speed.

they can use ANY weapon in the game PLUS 2 other ones?

I see posts and hear people talking about how heavies only have 2 weapons when in reality, they have EVERY weapon. and then they want more heavy weapons, which is reasonable I suppose, but those are weapons ONLY heavies will be able to use. I can see why they want them, but they shouldn't be a priority in this game. last time I recall, my scout suit can't carry a HMG, but that heavy can carry a Shotgun, Rail Rifle, or any other weapon that I can carry.

plus did anyone ever think about the fact that if there's a heavy weapon that has similar dps to the HMG but is LONG RANGE, that would be ridiculously OP? already, all 4 of the rifles are considered OP, now imagine a gun with twice the dps and even more range, and is fitted on the highest ehp suit in the game.

also, I won't say that HMGs are OP, but I will say that I find it funny that heavies want to have the most ehp in the game AND the most dps. sounds a bit greedy if you ask me, especially when there are other much more important mechanics that need fixing.

but I digress. maybe it's just me.

But then heavies would have a good argument to get faster when using light weapons.

And we all know how that will end.

or if they did, make them run slower, like heavy speed.

you know what? just forget that I even said anything, I'm apparently hated by most heavies now...

well no personal attacks were intended, if that means anything at this point.

and what can I, a scout, call my own?

you know what? just forget that I even said anything, I'm apparently hated by most heavies now...

well no personal attacks were intended, if that means anything at this point.

Hey you shouldn't mess with a crowd who has been neglected since closed beta you'll just add fuel to the flame. At least scouts have equipment, speed, stealth, and soon to be cloaks. Heavies got what hp and a big gun. Oh did I mention we only have two.

you know what? just forget that I even said anything, I'm apparently hated by most heavies now...

well no personal attacks were intended, if that means anything at this point.

please work on my fits, others aren't as important.

please fix the lag issues, as this is most important out of all.

Don't hate ya, man.

But I do disagree with your basic logic. It isn't that "it's been a while since they added new heavy weapons," it's that they HAVE NEVER added new heavy weapons.

In the mean time, they've added:

Laser Rifle
Gallente Medium Frame
Amarr Medium Frame
Minmatar Light Frame
Scrambler Rifle
Flaylock Pistol
Plasma Canon
Combat Rifle
Rail Rifle
Active Scanner

GǪand Commando: a gimped, slow, medium-frame-wannabe palette swap.

CCP very clearly has had the time and the bandwidth to develop a lot of new content. But you're absolutely correct that Heavy content has not ever been a priority. With the exception of the Minmatar light frame, Scout content has not been a priority either.

What we're saying is, given everything else that's been introduced to the game, it's about damn time for it to be a priority.

And with a bit of luck, 1.8 will be it.