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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Mortedeamor
1057
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
fw is a mode meant to be competitive ccp designed it to give the elite player base of dust something to do other than stomp all over the poor newer players in pub matches. it has friendly fire enabled much higher risk than pubs ..and an almost guarantee that the enemy will be coordinated. it is a much higher risk situation than pubs..but also with relatively same pay..you could actually say you make less in fw than you do in pubs.
a coordinated squad with high end gear is a mandatory in fw...and with the lower payout naturally this suits established mercs more than newer ones
we have the gear we have the teammates we have the money
so i call to question whether or not new players should be allowed to participate in fw.
currently i have seen bluedots that dont even know how to cut on their mics..being told how to cut push to talk off in team chat fw.
this mode is not a place to be learning the ropes..with ff on and coordinated play being mandatory.
newer players in fw introduce huge issues
when one side is stacked there is less of a chance you will have players on your side that can hold their own you can only control the 5 teamates you bring in with you..and with everyone having access you get 3 proto squads vs 1 proto squad with 12 bluedots randoms with no gear no money who dont know the maps, strategy, and tactics required to win, and dont have the money gear or skills to compete.
i feel that allowing fw to be played by anyone in new eden is breaking fw in itself this is a mode clearly designed for the veterans and elites.
ccp please enter in a mandatory point that must be achieved before fw becomes available to a dust merc.
this line should be much higher than the graduation for the newberry academy.
players entering fw should have all the things ive described here..and to play fw without those thing i can only imagine is a miserable exp.
any idea on what this line should be? i think it should be a sp line as sp is something that can only be accumulated so fast..someone whos played dust enough to get so much as 10 mill sp has the skills and in game knowledge if not the gear to compete in fw
ideas suggestions discuss
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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CRYPT3C W0LF
Null-Sec Operations
98
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:15:00 -
[2] - Quote
nay, Ima horse
Assuming Direct Control
Youtube Channel
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Mortedeamor
1057
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:18:00 -
[3] - Quote
CRYPT3C W0LF wrote:nay, Ima horse
i second that nay for all the reasons i listed here
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Kallas Hallytyr
Skullbreakers
189
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:27:00 -
[4] - Quote
I would suggest a lower limit, something like 2-5 million Skill Points. I don't think it would be fair to rule out new players completely, but once they're over a million in they've likely got at least the basics down and FW would actually be a good place for people to find Corps and get organised. |
Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe.
Public Disorder.
2419
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
Yes, but only if brought in by squad.
Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
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Monty Mole Clone
Shiv M
88
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
of course they should |
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4879
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
I'm a majestic cat.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Mortedeamor
1058
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:29:00 -
[8] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:I would suggest a lower limit, something like 2-5 million Skill Points. I don't think it would be fair to rule out new players completely, but once they're over a million in they've likely got at least the basics down and FW would actually be a good place for people to find Corps and get organised.
2-5 is reasonable its been so long since i was a newberry i couldnt honestly tell you at what point i felt confident in my knowledge and skills in dust and is why i feel discussion is needed i have no idea what the new player exp is like nowadays i dont run alts unlike most vets
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Mortedeamor
1058
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:Yes, but only if brought in by squad.
as brought in by a squad leader who is qualifyed for fw i personally like this idea
like you shouldnt be able to que in alone unless your over a certain sp limit but anyone can be pulled in by a higher memeber this in itself would cut out most of the issues with fw while not eliminating blue dots ability to play and exp it early on great idea thor +1
what do you think the line for being able to both pull underlings in and que alone should be? ive heard 2-5 mill sp so far
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Mortedeamor
1058
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:I'm a majestic cat.
ura flea ridden fur ball that needs to be made into chinese food
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Operative 1171 Aajli
Bragian Order
Amarr Empire
927
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
FW in EVE was designed for the new player to jump right into ready made fighting with some tangible rewards before they might move on to something totally player made.
It is the same for DUST. Pub matches are total casual mode in addition to being an introductory mode. Pubs would be like cruising around in EVE looking for random fights with no predefined structure.
Ah well, console players.
Do your part. Join the revolution. Sabotage FW. Help this game burn!
BURN DUST 2014
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Patrick57
Fatal Absolution
2284
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:35:00 -
[12] - Quote
Nay, it's so damn annoying having 10 useless blueberries vs 2-3 squads of people in player corps.
When I'm depressed, I cut myself......A BIG SLICE OF CHOCOLATE CAKE! nú+
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Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe.
Public Disorder.
2420
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:37:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:Thor Odinson42 wrote:Yes, but only if brought in by squad. as brought in by a squad leader who is qualifyed for fw i personally like this idea like you shouldnt be able to que in alone unless your over a certain sp limit but anyone can be pulled in by a higher memeber this in itself would cut out most of the issues with fw while not eliminating blue dots ability to play and exp it early on great idea thor +1 what do you think the line for being able to both pull underlings in and que alone should be? ive heard 2-5 mill sp so far
I think it should be higher. Perhaps 10 mil SP to be able to que a squad in for FW.
Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
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Mortedeamor
1058
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:38:00 -
[14] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:Nay, it's so damn annoying having 10 useless blueberries vs 2-3 squads of people in player corps.
exactly and we can only control the 5 people we bring in. i feel if it were limited in the way thor suggested above it would drastically lower those instances where you have 10 useless bluedots on your side
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Mortedeamor
1059
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:39:00 -
[15] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Thor Odinson42 wrote:Yes, but only if brought in by squad. as brought in by a squad leader who is qualifyed for fw i personally like this idea like you shouldnt be able to que in alone unless your over a certain sp limit but anyone can be pulled in by a higher memeber this in itself would cut out most of the issues with fw while not eliminating blue dots ability to play and exp it early on great idea thor +1 what do you think the line for being able to both pull underlings in and que alone should be? ive heard 2-5 mill sp so far I think it should be higher. Perhaps 10 mil SP to be able to que a squad in for FW.
i agree +1
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Jack Kittinger
DUST University
Ivy League
72
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:Yes, but only if brought in by squad.
Factional Warfare contracts require you to be in a squad.
*after multiple attempts*
you wanna solo? here have a pub match |
Keri Starlight
0uter.Heaven
2100
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
There should be a required SP amount, but 10M would cut away a huge part of the playerbase...
Also with such a high requirement you would lose a lot of capable players, I started being confident at 2.5M and I joined O.H when I had around 7M.
I have 10.7M right now and I completely forgot of when I was a useless bluedot.
"I load my gun with love instead of bullets"
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Defy Gravity
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
162
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Posted - 2013.12.22 16:55:00 -
[18] - Quote
FW should be unlocked after you have earned 5mil Life Time SP
Amarr FW Supporter.
"I will melt you with my scrambler rifle Minmatar filth!"
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RECON BY FIRE
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
329
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:00:00 -
[19] - Quote
Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:FW in EVE was designed for the new player to jump right into ready made fighting with some tangible rewards before they might move on to something totally player made.
That's why you have to gain standing for that particular faction before doing FW in EVE right, because its made for noobs? Switching factions when you can roll lvl 4s as a vet is easy, but a newbie trying to first gain entry to it, not so much. And that grind helps teach the noobs how their ships work. There is no such equivalent in Dust.
Stuff....?
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Nocturnal Soul
Immortal Retribution
1322
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:06:00 -
[20] - Quote
Naaay mother freaking NAAAAAY!!!!!
"The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
2020
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:10:00 -
[21] - Quote
No
Intelligence is OP
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Lt Royal
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
2220
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
IMO there's 2 main problems here;
- No Squads (no one is in them)
- The FW selection mechanics (for new players)
No Squads I fight for Caldari and I this I see for the majority of contracts; your squad will be the only squad for the whole team and everyone else will running solo, not that they have chosen to run solo but they don't know any better or how competitive FW is supposed to be. I think anyone NOT in a squad searching for FW matches should be automatically shoved into squads or sort one out in the warbarge before they can deploy; if more blueberries were to be in a squad I really do think the FW imbalanced would be lesser of a problem.
FW selection mechanics When you start a new account; all the factions are selected by default, meaning new players will be fighting for anyone who has a free slot open (for the team,) rather than fighting the ideology their race represents. Seeing how everyone running for Minmatar and Gallente are purposefully fighting for them for; the LP items or because they have EVE support, the newberries are just getting dumped into Amarr and Caldari contracts because there is no room for them to join the Gallente/Minmatar contracts.
In conclusion. I don't think there should be a SP entry amount for FW contracts but the tutorial system needs to be expanded to explain the motions of each contract types.
Let say they have completed this new bigger FW focused tutorial system; where upon completion they would gain a medal, certificated or cookie (whatever you want to call it) they then will be able to join a FW contract because their cert means they have learned the basics of the FW system etc.
Edit: You could even go as far to have NPC agents to talk to in this tutorial system, to show off what each racial LP store has to offer or have recruitment booths to join a said FW corp, choosing a side will gain you an automatic standing increase for the chosen faction and a standing loss for the faction your now at war with.
Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
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Zaria Min Deir
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
358
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:24:00 -
[23] - Quote
My personal preference: yes, there should be a restriction on who can enter FW, whether it be a minimum total SP or WP earned, or some combination of both... 10M SP is much too high though, something between 2 and 5 M would be more reasonable, maybe depending on the WP earned by the character. And I think WP should be considered, there are plenty of characters out there that have been "cooking" for months, with millions earned in passive SP with barely any game time (and I'm not just talking about alts of the "vets" here).
The idea about solo deployment being restricted, but being able to be pulled in by a squad leader is a good one, even though I see some problems with that too... you want to troll the "organized" proto squads being all tryhard in FW? Wander through a couple of pubs, pick up a squad full of newberries, and deploy them into FW... sit back and watch the mayhem 
Whether these restrictions would be overall harmful to the community or contradict the idea behind the game mode... well. What do I know (or care), I'm just a stupid console player. 
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Mortedeamor
1060
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:26:00 -
[24] - Quote
Lt Royal wrote:IMO there's 2 main problems here;
- No Squads (no one is in them)
- The FW selection mechanics (for new players)
No Squads I fight for Caldari and this I see for the majority of contracts; your squad will be the only squad for the whole team and everyone else will be running solo, not that they have chosen to run solo but they don't know any better or how competitive FW is supposed to be. I think anyone NOT in a squad searching for FW matches should be automatically shoved into squads or must sort one out in the warbarge before they can deploy into the match; if more blueberries were to be in a squad I really do think the FW imbalanced would be lesser of a problem. FW selection mechanics When you start a new account; all the factions are selected by default, meaning new players will be fighting for anyone who has a free slot open (for the team,) rather than fighting the ideology their race represents. Seeing how everyone running for Minmatar and Gallente are purposefully fighting for them for; the LP items or because they have EVE support, the newberries are just getting dumped into Amarr and Caldari contracts because there is no room for them to join the Gallente/Minmatar contracts. In conclusion. I don't think there should be a SP entry amount for FW contracts but the tutorial system needs to be expanded to explain the motions of each contract types. Let say they have completed this new bigger FW focused tutorial system; where upon completion they would gain a medal, certificated or cookie (whatever you want to call it) they then will be able to join a FW contract because their cert means they have learned the basics of the FW system etc. Edit: You could even go as far to have NPC agents to talk to in this tutorial system, to show off what each racial LP store has to offer or have recruitment booths to join a said FW corp, choosing a side will gain you an automatic standing increase for the chosen faction and a standing loss for the faction your now at war with.
so long as this tutorial were not justs skippable i could agree
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Smooth Assassin
Stardust incorporation
491
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:28:00 -
[25] - Quote
I guess they should but only from a squad of pros, i hate seeing ton of blueberries in my team and i'm just getting stomped.
Assassination is my thing.
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Lt Royal
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
2220
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Posted - 2013.12.22 17:35:00 -
[26] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:so long as this tutorial were not justs skippable i could agree
Lets say it could be skippable but if one was to skip it, it would then be added to the battle finder where the FW contracts are selected; making it be a completed requirement to run FW.
Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4898
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Posted - 2013.12.22 18:35:00 -
[27] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:Cat Merc wrote:I'm a majestic cat. ura flea ridden fur ball that needs to be made into chinese food
I eat Chinese people.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Llast 326
An Arkhos
934
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Posted - 2013.12.22 18:45:00 -
[28] - Quote
I play a lot of FW, before the LP store it was all I played.
Limiting who can play FW is not a good idea.
The belief that eliminating low experienced players from FW will increase the likelihood of better battles is a bit misleading. The imbalance is less about the "quality" of players and more about who players decide to fight for. If you eliminate the portion of players under 5mil sp who chose to play FW, what happens when you have your full squad of "elite players" against a full team of "elite players"?
Perhaps using the opportunity to recruit and teach new players in FW is a better idea than limiting them to Pubs.
FW is designed for lower SP charactersGǪ look at the benefits of the LP store. Yes the 'Specialist' gear has lower fitting cost which is great for those of us trying to fit better gear on our suits, but the majority of the gear benefits from lower skill requirements. For those with less SP spent this is huge, it allows them access to better gear, and the ability to test out what they want to spend their low levels of sp on.
FW should remain available to all players as it is intended to be. The issue that needs to be addressed is getting the numbers up in Factions that need larger player pools, and perhaps some of the experienced players need to start teaching the newer players about the game.
I know that there is a number of groups that do this already, but perhaps FW learning groups need to become prevalent.
KRRROOOOOOM
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Mortedeamor
1061
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Posted - 2013.12.22 19:34:00 -
[29] - Quote
Llast 326 wrote:I play a lot of FW, before the LP store it was all I played.
Limiting who can play FW is not a good idea.
The belief that eliminating low experienced players from FW will increase the likelihood of better battles is a bit misleading. The imbalance is less about the "quality" of players and more about who players decide to fight for. If you eliminate the portion of players under 5mil sp who chose to play FW, what happens when you have your full squad of "elite players" against a full team of "elite players"?
Perhaps using the opportunity to recruit and teach new players in FW is a better idea than limiting them to Pubs.
FW is designed for lower SP charactersGǪ look at the benefits of the LP store. Yes the 'Specialist' gear has lower fitting cost which is great for those of us trying to fit better gear on our suits, but the majority of the gear benefits from lower skill requirements. For those with less SP spent this is huge, it allows them access to better gear, and the ability to test out what they want to spend their low levels of sp on.
FW should remain available to all players as it is intended to be. The issue that needs to be addressed is getting the numbers up in Factions that need larger player pools, and perhaps some of the experienced players need to start teaching the newer players about the game.
I know that there is a number of groups that do this already, but perhaps FW learning groups need to become prevalent.
how is fw designed for lower players you make less money in fw..and you lose more its competitive i disagree with everything you've said here
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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Mortedeamor
1061
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Posted - 2013.12.22 19:35:00 -
[30] - Quote
Lt Royal wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:so long as this tutorial were not justs skippable i could agree Lets say it could be skippable but if one was to skip it, it would then be added to the battle finder where the FW contracts are selected; making it be a completed requirement to run FW.
i dont even think the tutorial would help im sick of going against 3 proto squads with my guys and 10 newbies they cant kill ****..unless it's their teamates and all they do is hold everyone back..
closed beta veteran
37mill sp
proto ammar logi, assault, heavy
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