DUST Search - Dust 2.0 =Pseudo Streaming=

J-Lewis wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

Terry Webber wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

Ronan Elsword wrote:

Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose.

The academy missions has a chance to be racially specced instead. The idea is to drive home the notion that there are many nations and calling but you're free to wander and dont have to stick to one place.

You make a good point but how does that explain the racial NPC corporations new players currently start in?

As the intro mission npc explains, hes a contracted mercenary there to convert your mortal self into an immortal soldier. This is done to help reduce voice costs and the like. The academy missions hand you back over to your empires where voice acting is not needed nor scripted AI.

Aye, that would be the less costly option to develop.

But to be honest, you can't deny that it WOULD be ideal to have racial variations for these tutorials; it just provides so much more immersion to a new player. It makes a bit more "new player sense" to go from creating an Amarr avatar to doing a mission under Amarrian supervisors in an Amarrian dropship, because that's what you picked...

CCP is technically a AAA development studio (Dust was marketed as a AAA F2P shooter Roll

).
But, having said that, with what I've seen CCP put on the table since beta? Yeah no, that's not going to happen. Not anytime soon.

With those depressing facts taken into consideration, it makes complete sense to just focus on one well crafted tutorial. But in that case all the races should be represented instead of just the Caldari, at least in terms of infantry (did I read something about using other new players as actors in the opening sequence with the craft flying you to the battle? If so, kudos; that would be good use of instancing).

Again, this (your ideas) all looks great on paper. I just wish it was actually happening right now... Ugh

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Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 863	Posted - 2014.01.24 10:23:00 - [91] - Quote A lot of good stuff there IWS o7 Personally I like the current design aesthetic of the present Neocom, how it 'feels' for the lack of a better term. But the mechanics of how you interact with it is still built on the Eve philosophy of menus and drop down boxes. This is great for for of us that play Eve but it didn't give Dust a sense of its own identity. I can understand why this is the case. Design of the UI in Eve is a solid and efficient one, so its just easier to port over a complete design than think of a new way. This is however a sloppy way of thinking and a lack of imagination. It also demonstrates, once again, a major flaw in the design process that CCP institutionally can't seem to shake off. It's a console game. I'll say that again, a CONSOLE game. Now let's play a game of what if for a moment. Imagine that instead of its present situation with a hard core of loyal players but limited in number, that the launch of Dust 514 was a spectacular success and we are looking at 15,000 players being on it over a weekend at anytime..... Now what would be the primary control input of all those players, so much so that the other options would only be measured in fractions of a percent. It would be the input method that came in the box with the console. The pad. The current design of the majority of the UI in Dust is based in a design philosophy where mouse is king. Untill CCP can exorcise this mentality and work in a world where pad is king, I'm afraid that the UI for Dust is never going to get much better than it is. And UI is king in a game such as this. A complex and tactical shooter, with the most sophisticated customisation of a character possible in any other console FPS. The UI is the first point of contact for a player, it sets the tone of the game from the moment of boot up and getting it right is 90% of the battle of keeping a new player. So why is it that in Dust, right now, it takes 15 button presses to activate voice chat? And that if you know exactly how to do it? This is the triumph of mediocre design. It makes things more complicated that it should be and succeeds in frustrating players before they even get into battle. Now I said that the majority of the UI is from a philosophy where mouse is king. But where CCP actually have thought outside of the box and remembered this a console game with a pad, they succeeded spectacularly. So much so, I'm not sure they even know it. Uprising had many problems at launch. We all know that. But hidden in the multitude of bugs and balancing issues were two absolute gems of design. The potential expansion of them as a basis for the UI tragically got sidelined with the problems that needed fixing in the core mechanics of the game itself. The Starmap and The Skill Tree. These two new parts of the UI were clearly designed with just one input device in mind. The DS3. But they were also so good that a mouse user could use them as well. The Starmap in particular is something that CCP should be very proud of. In Eve, using it is a nightmare even with a mouse, but the one is Dust manages to get all of its complexity and displays it in a simple manner. Using the shoulder buttons, detailed infomation is rapidly brought to the player attention. The design is so good that when it shown to us at the Dust Keynote at Fanfest, Seamus Donahue, Professor at EVE University and known as the safest man in Eve, leant over to me and said that the Starmap in Eve should look like that. The Skill Tree design is also a corker. It could be the foundation of a really solid corporation UI, with different branches of corp mechanics hidden from those without the roles needed while those with them can see them and interact with them. A branch could be used purely for the infomation about your Merc, with links to other branches such as the skill tree itself and the Starmap to shown your location in New Eden. As new portals to New Eden are added, such as PvE, industry, Player Market, space elevator control etc etc, a new root branch can be added. The design of the skill tree is modular. It's futureproofed for what may come to Dust and Eve. I really hope that as Fanfest approaches and the inevitable reveal of 2.0, that CCP have had time to go back and expand on these two gems of UI design. They give Dust a sense of its own identity while firmly keeping it in the world of New Eden. Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12560	Posted - 2014.01.24 16:45:00 - [92] - Quote Blah, thanks to some twitter poster, this is now on CCP's radar... Now I have to work twice as hard on it. Thanks alot guys <^-^> ... hmm cant do grumpy wolf here that easily... CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5925	Posted - 2014.01.24 16:51:00 - [93] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Blah, thanks to some twitter poster, this is now on CCP's radar... Now I have to work twice as hard on it. Thanks alot guys <^-^> ... hmm cant do grumpy wolf here that easily... anyways done with the sparrow for now original design is by ccp so credit to them for my interpretation of how it might look a bit closer http://community.eveonline.com/backstory/chronicles/for-the-state/ Will update the movement tutorial to show the new design. http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2014/024/f/9/sparrowdropship_by_novafox-d73igu8.jpg Next up is the movement tutorial map and 'classic' soldier armor. Does grumpy cat for Ironwolf Good enough? Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Necandi Brasil DUST BRASIL S.A Covert Intervention 705	Posted - 2014.01.25 08:02:00 - [94] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Blah, thanks to some twitter poster, this is now on CCP's radar... Now I have to work twice as hard on it. Thanks alot guys <^-^> ... hmm cant do grumpy wolf here that easily... anyways done with the sparrow for now original design is by ccp so credit to them for my interpretation of how it might look a bit closer http://community.eveonline.com/backstory/chronicles/for-the-state/ Will update the movement tutorial to show the new design. http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2014/024/f/9/sparrowdropship_by_novafox-d73igu8.jpg Next up is the movement tutorial map and 'classic' soldier armor. YES!!! Thank you!!! Work hard IWS! Tanks 514! Cheap, fast, Indestructible and you see tankers telling it's balanced... Just makes you want to quit this BS
J-Lewis Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 337	Posted - 2014.01.26 17:56:00 - [95] - Quote This is looking really good IWS! I endorse this product and/or service.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12634	Posted - 2014.01.26 17:59:00 - [96] - Quote being a bit scattered today but work on the next document has begun. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VEXecdgmCJUzkFoD9vR3Fox_Zy0-ih35B4cGKBa63Vo/edit# CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12792	Posted - 2014.01.30 19:06:00 - [97] - Quote Going to try to wrap up social today. Then finish the caldari soldier concept maybe do the others and some more drones. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Chesyre Armundsen Thanes Of Dust 383	Posted - 2014.01.30 22:25:00 - [98] - Quote I'm getting giddy reading your stuff. Fantastic design! Can't wait to see more of this grow! ^_^ Mihi gravato Deus - "Let God lay the burden on me!"
Artificer Ghost Learning Coalition College 1175	Posted - 2014.02.01 01:17:00 - [99] - Quote This seems pretty good. I've not read everything (I'll probably delay it and treat it like a book, reading a couple paragraphs every day, just like Arkena's shield VS. armor thread), but the Neocom idea looks great. ~Art, CEO and DoE at Learning Coalition College, Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition Maken Tosch = 1000th Like!
Nezbur Zero Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 8	Posted - 2014.02.01 01:51:00 - [100] - Quote This is ******* bad ass! I likes! My best poem was written by the hornets that come out of my shotgun barrel.

Virtual Riot The Vanguardians INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 150	Posted - 2014.02.01 02:00:00 - [101] - Quote Wow this is a lot of good work here Mr. Saber Cool stuff
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12830	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:19:00 - [102] - Quote Now Offline for those of you who missed it the result of the last stream. http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2014/031/d/0/caldari_mortal_soldier_by_novafox-d74la51.jpg Enjoy. will be updating the tutorial to reflect the new design. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6097	Posted - 2014.02.01 08:37:00 - [103] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Now Offline for those of you who missed it the result of the last stream. http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2014/031/d/0/caldari_mortal_soldier_by_novafox-d74la51.jpg Enjoy. will be updating the tutorial to reflect the new design. Don't like the giant antenna, but the rest looks good. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Ronan Elsword Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 157	Posted - 2014.02.01 08:57:00 - [104] - Quote Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose. *"War doesn't determine who is right, only who is left."*
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12833	Posted - 2014.02.01 20:29:00 - [105] - Quote Ronan Elsword wrote: Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose. The academy missions has a chance to be racially specced instead. The idea is to drive home the notion that there are many nations and calling but you're free to wander and dont have to stick to one place. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Terry Webber Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 399	Posted - 2014.02.01 21:56:00 - [106] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Ronan Elsword wrote: Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose. The academy missions has a chance to be racially specced instead. The idea is to drive home the notion that there are many nations and calling but you're free to wander and dont have to stick to one place. You make a good point but how does that explain the NPC corporations new players currently start in? Join Turalyon 514 today! Click here for more info.
Meee One The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 266	Posted - 2014.02.01 23:22:00 - [107] - Quote This might sound kinda dumb..... But when it's completed will vets have the chance to use it?(tutorial) Even though i have been playing for a little while...i would like to. More emersion and all that jazz. Sexy jutsu Time to jaaam!
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12836	Posted - 2014.02.01 23:29:00 - [108] - Quote Meee One wrote: This might sound kinda dumb..... But when it's completed will vets have the chance to use it?(tutorial) Even though i have been playing for a little while...i would like to. More emersion and all that jazz. You can re run the tutorial segments as often as you like without rewards unless updated. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12836	Posted - 2014.02.01 23:30:00 - [109] - Quote Terry Webber wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Ronan Elsword wrote: Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose. The academy missions has a chance to be racially specced instead. The idea is to drive home the notion that there are many nations and calling but you're free to wander and dont have to stick to one place. You make a good point but how does that explain the racial NPC corporations new players currently start in? As the intro mission npc explains, hes a contracted mercenary there to convert your mortal self into an immortal soldier. This is done to help reduce voice costs and the like. The academy missions hand you back over to your empires where voice acting is not needed nor scripted AI. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
J-Lewis Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 342	Posted - 2014.02.02 02:03:00 - [110] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Terry Webber wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Ronan Elsword wrote: Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose. The academy missions has a chance to be racially specced instead. The idea is to drive home the notion that there are many nations and calling but you're free to wander and dont have to stick to one place. You make a good point but how does that explain the racial NPC corporations new players currently start in? As the intro mission npc explains, hes a contracted mercenary there to convert your mortal self into an immortal soldier. This is done to help reduce voice costs and the like. The academy missions hand you back over to your empires where voice acting is not needed nor scripted AI. Aye, that would be the less costly option to develop. But to be honest, you can't deny that it WOULD be ideal to have racial variations for these tutorials; it just provides so much more immersion to a new player. It makes a bit more "new player sense" to go from creating an Amarr avatar to doing a mission under Amarrian supervisors in an Amarrian dropship, because that's what you picked... CCP is technically a AAA development studio (Dust was marketed as a AAA F2P shooter ). But, having said that, with what I've seen CCP put on the table since beta? Yeah no, that's not going to happen. Not anytime soon. With those depressing facts taken into consideration, it makes complete sense to just focus on one well crafted tutorial. But in that case all the races should be represented instead of just the Caldari, at least in terms of infantry (did I read something about using other new players as actors in the opening sequence with the craft flying you to the battle? If so, kudos; that would be good use of instancing). Again, this (your ideas) all looks great on paper. I just wish it was actually happening right now...

Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12838	Posted - 2014.02.02 02:15:00 - [111] - Quote J-Lewis wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Terry Webber wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Ronan Elsword wrote: Looks good so far although I think the Tutorial should be based on what race you chose, and the person instructing you should be a cloned soldier that's just called Commander, Sir, something along those lines in the race you chose. The academy missions has a chance to be racially specced instead. The idea is to drive home the notion that there are many nations and calling but you're free to wander and dont have to stick to one place. You make a good point but how does that explain the racial NPC corporations new players currently start in? As the intro mission npc explains, hes a contracted mercenary there to convert your mortal self into an immortal soldier. This is done to help reduce voice costs and the like. The academy missions hand you back over to your empires where voice acting is not needed nor scripted AI. Aye, that would be the less costly option to develop. But to be honest, you can't deny that it WOULD be ideal to have racial variations for these tutorials; it just provides so much more immersion to a new player. It makes a bit more "new player sense" to go from creating an Amarr avatar to doing a mission under Amarrian supervisors in an Amarrian dropship, because that's what you picked... CCP is technically a AAA development studio (Dust was marketed as a AAA F2P shooter ). But, having said that, with what I've seen CCP put on the table since beta? Yeah no, that's not going to happen. Not anytime soon. With those depressing facts taken into consideration, it makes complete sense to just focus on one well crafted tutorial. But in that case all the races should be represented instead of just the Caldari, at least in terms of infantry (did I read something about using other new players as actors in the opening sequence with the craft flying you to the battle? If so, kudos; that would be good use of instancing). Again, this (your ideas) all looks great on paper. I just wish it was actually happening right now... Of course, there can be an advanced tutorial that actually teaches combat mantras of the empires as well post npe period. remember this is for the first 5 minutes. Empire difference is like something you want to hammer into the players a week after. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Ghost Kaisar Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising 2550	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:17:00 - [112] - Quote Skill Tree 2.0 looks fantastic. I'm loving how this will look in the future (if it will be somewhat like this). eWar seems more prevalent (those skills in Electronics look mouth watering. It seems like we will have ways of reducing module effectiveness on suits in combat. Be a great way to stunt armor regen, or even slow down a speed scout.) I like how module skills can decrease their fitting cost. Biotics especially (15PG for a complex Kincat FFS). Also, having Shield modules reduce the CPU required and Armor reduce the PG required seems like a good move as well since Shield suits typically have higher CPU and Armor suits typically have higher PG. This might allow some dual tanking (which isn't bad necessarily), but I have a feeling that shield hardeners and armor hardeners will negate this (Making it a better move to buff your main tank rather than dual tank) I see the shield repair tools. I really hope this is where we are headed. I see a HUGE amount of diversity in this thing. And I want Dust to have an EXTREMELY Diverse battlefield. Decoy and Jamming equipment? My scout is in love! Jetpacks and Grappling hooks? Okay, I'll stop here. This all looks great, and I really hope that this will all be down the road in the next few years. But it does look like we are headed in the right direction. If 1.8 becomes as good as it's hyped to be, I'll take the $60 I have saved up for Destiny and buy some AUR. You guys will have earned it Nothing says "F**K YOU!" like a direct Flaylock to the face. Minmatar. In Rust we trust.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12844	Posted - 2014.02.02 07:29:00 - [113] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Skill Tree 2.0 looks fantastic. I'm loving how this will look in the future (if it will be somewhat like this). eWar seems more prevalent (those skills in Electronics look mouth watering. It seems like we will have ways of reducing module effectiveness on suits in combat. Be a great way to stunt armor regen, or even slow down a speed scout.) I like how module skills can decrease their fitting cost. Biotics especially (15PG for a complex Kincat FFS). Also, having Shield modules reduce the CPU required and Armor reduce the PG required seems like a good move as well since Shield suits typically have higher CPU and Armor suits typically have higher PG. This might allow some dual tanking (which isn't bad necessarily), but I have a feeling that shield hardeners and armor hardeners will negate this (Making it a better move to buff your main tank rather than dual tank) I see the shield repair tools. I really hope this is where we are headed. I see a HUGE amount of diversity in this thing. And I want Dust to have an EXTREMELY Diverse battlefield. Decoy and Jamming equipment? My scout is in love! Jetpacks and Grappling hooks? Okay, I'll stop here. This all looks great, and I really hope that this will all be down the road in the next few years. But it does look like we are headed in the right direction. If 1.8 becomes as good as it's hyped to be, I'll take the $60 I have saved up for Destiny and buy some AUR. You guys will have earned it That's just a first pass I haven't done any deep level thinking and philosophy with the skills. Of course this all ideas and there is no guarantee any of this will make it in. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Ayures II Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 356	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:31:00 - [114] - Quote This is a collection of some of the worst suggestions for this game I've ever heard. Way to win the race to the bottom, IWS!
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 77	Posted - 2014.02.02 10:11:00 - [115] - Quote I have not read it all, but so far I like it a lot! Especially: - the NPE tutorial, which is sadly very lacking from the game. - character creation includes general strategies and philosophy of the 4 races. - Daily mission as a proctor in Academy Battles ---> this is absolutely brilliant! Although my hope is that CCP uses your ideas for adding the content which is currently missing, and not try to reinvent the things that are already in-game. New content first.
J-Lewis Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 342	Posted - 2014.02.02 13:07:00 - [116] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Ghost Kaisar wrote: Skill Tree 2.0 looks fantastic. I'm loving how this will look in the future (if it will be somewhat like this). eWar seems more prevalent (those skills in Electronics look mouth watering. It seems like we will have ways of reducing module effectiveness on suits in combat. Be a great way to stunt armor regen, or even slow down a speed scout.) I like how module skills can decrease their fitting cost. Biotics especially (15PG for a complex Kincat FFS). Also, having Shield modules reduce the CPU required and Armor reduce the PG required seems like a good move as well since Shield suits typically have higher CPU and Armor suits typically have higher PG. This might allow some dual tanking (which isn't bad necessarily), but I have a feeling that shield hardeners and armor hardeners will negate this (Making it a better move to buff your main tank rather than dual tank) I see the shield repair tools. I really hope this is where we are headed. I see a HUGE amount of diversity in this thing. And I want Dust to have an EXTREMELY Diverse battlefield. Decoy and Jamming equipment? My scout is in love! Jetpacks and Grappling hooks? Okay, I'll stop here. This all looks great, and I really hope that this will all be down the road in the next few years. But it does look like we are headed in the right direction. If 1.8 becomes as good as it's hyped to be, I'll take the $60 I have saved up for Destiny and buy some AUR. You guys will have earned it That's just a first pass I haven't done any deep level thinking and philosophy with the skills. Of course this all ideas and there is no guarantee any of this will make it in. I did a bit of community idea sourcing - just on the structure itself - a while back. There's a bunch of ideas collected in that thread from various players, and I'm happy to report it's one of the more civil threads on this forum.
Requin Toblat Glitched Connection 17	Posted - 2014.02.02 16:43:00 - [117] - Quote Wow! Some really great work and great ideas here IWS.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12845	Posted - 2014.02.02 16:45:00 - [118] - Quote Well here is my initial thoughts on the arrangement of the skills. Near the start or base of the tree you will have what you will be calling your core skills. Skills that translates into higher game play on base stats alone. This facilitates a few things. Empowers newer players to be more effective in areas they feel is lacking if they're reactive trainers (lack of hp, lack of damage application, lack of fitting, lack of speed ect ect) As the tree grows the skills begin to shift from a broad spectrum of built in stats to specific performances of the character then finally shifting into broad spectrum of modules before continuously narrowing down until only a very specific type of module or weapon benefits. The bonuses themselves need to be from most pronounced to least pronounced. For example its okay for an HP+ skill to be near the start but HP+ on shield extenders is not an 'end-game' skill. The power gains at 'end-game' are also marginal; the idea is to not make the peak so far well and beyond a new players 'influence' (IE I have max skills = newb immunity) and this is where handing out bonuses out like candy can and WILL get problematic. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Akdhar Saif Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative 212	Posted - 2014.02.02 17:44:00 - [119] - Quote This may be minor but can we get the Slayer game in our living spaces? Or maybe have a room people can join and play in their spare time.
J-Lewis Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 342	Posted - 2014.02.05 03:34:00 - [120] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Well here is my initial thoughts on the arrangement of the skills. Near the start or base of the tree you will have what you will be calling your core skills. Skills that translates into higher game play on base stats alone. This facilitates a few things. Empowers newer players to be more effective in areas they feel is lacking if they're reactive trainers (lack of hp, lack of damage application, lack of fitting, lack of speed ect ect) As the tree grows the skills begin to shift from a broad spectrum of built in stats to specific performances of the character then finally shifting into broad spectrum of modules before continuously narrowing down until only a very specific type of module or weapon benefits. The bonuses themselves need to be from most pronounced to least pronounced. For example its okay for an HP+ skill to be near the start but HP+ on shield extenders is not an 'end-game' skill. So instead there are more likely to be skills that help reduce the negativity of some modules such as the high fitting costs, the heavier plate penalties and drawbacks of tech 2 modules. The power gains at 'end-game' are also marginal; the idea is to not make the peak so far well and beyond a new players 'influence' (IE I have max skills = newb immunity) and this is where handing out bonuses out like candy can and WILL get problematic. Would you agree that the "support" skills (skills with big bonuses to damage, range, fitting requirement, ammo capacity) should be in a more accessible and separate part of the weaponry tree? Building the "core" for infantry weapons would primarily be training these skills. They don't unlock weapons, but they affect all weapons, and they unlock the relevant modules (damage mods, range mods, etc...). I keep coming back to the question of whether or not the range bonus on the old sharpshooter skill was really an issue, or if it was just the fact that you had to train it two to six times that made it "broken". Maybe it was that, and the fact that you had to virtually run towards one another until the one with superior range skills got into range and won. The old "all or nothing" damage model isn't used anymore, so perhaps it wouldn't hurt to reintroduce it. Perhaps it would revitalize the meta a bit? It's one of those occasions where CCP can give players another meta tool to help solve their own perceived balance problems. e.g. the general opinion is that the shotgun's range is so ridiculously low, to the point of "worthlessness", but what if you could fit a module or two and train a skill to buff the range by a combined 50-60%? Some will bicker about sacrificing damage mods, but just that mechanic alone creates meaningful choice: Do I fit for longer range engagements, or do I YOLO for damage? Same story for the laser rifle. What if you could choose between fitting damage modules and range modules? People would create fittings based on the maps and how they play. Basically DUST needs more variety in modules; more stats to play with; more fitting decisions to make, ideally using incomparables. Just a stray thought.



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