DUST Search - How is increasing scout speed consider bad?

Bethhy wrote:

Maken Tosch wrote:

hgghyujh wrote:

negative49er wrote:

it define the purposes of a scout

because it breaks hit detection horribly, you wanna see scouts dodging through a solid steam of bullets with out taking damage again???

don't get me wrong I'm a scout and would love it but last time scouts moved reasonably fast they were game breaking.

You're basing that on an old patch that dates back to closed beta.

Since then, there have been a bunch of optimizations and refinements done to hit detection to the point where almost all of the bullets now his their mark nowadays. There is also the aim assist which has been revamped.

Back then, speed tanking really was a problem BECAUSE of the bad hit detection and no aim assist back in closed beta.

Nowadays, speed tanking is no longer practical. In fact, it's not longer viable as a valid tactic even in a random pub match because hit detection is now sooooooo good and aim assist is working so well. If I get spotted and I don't find cover in the next 0.5 seconds I'm dead.

Speed tanking was powerful in Chromosome but not OP. Hitting Calamity Jane and Annie Oakley was enjoyable because of the challenge.( and they had very little EHP so when you did it hurt them)

Uprising 1.0 launch and NO ONE could hit anything... even standing point blank the slippery aim would slip right off target and you would put it back on sometimes 20 times in an engagement.

We had decent hit detection and no active aim assist. and scout's where balanced.

We have good hit detection and Aim assist and speed tanking(we even have modules for this) is useless.. And hit and run suit's across the game became useless.

People can blame hit detection all they want. But it's not because bullets are going where poeple are shooting them. It's because they don't have to aim for a sprinting scout. a computer helps them.

Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
hgghyujh Expert Intervention Caldari State 184	Posted - 2013.12.10 00:18:00 - [61] - Quote negative49er wrote: hgghyujh wrote: negative49er wrote: it define the purposes of a scout because it breaks hit detection horribly, you wanna see scouts dodging through a solid steam of bullets with out taking damage again??? don't get me wrong I'm a scout and would love it but last time scouts moved reasonably fast they were game breaking. What do you mean back when the game didn't have AA and crap hit detection Stop bringing up the past look into the present trust me the only reason hit detection is as good as it is now is because of the current speed limits and AA. So yes i am looking back because not that much has changed.
negative49er Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 396	Posted - 2013.12.10 00:49:00 - [62] - Quote hgghyujh wrote: negative49er wrote: hgghyujh wrote: negative49er wrote: it define the purposes of a scout because it breaks hit detection horribly, you wanna see scouts dodging through a solid steam of bullets with out taking damage again??? don't get me wrong I'm a scout and would love it but last time scouts moved reasonably fast they were game breaking. What do you mean back when the game didn't have AA and crap hit detection Stop bringing up the past look into the present trust me the only reason hit detection is as good as it is now is because of the current speed limits and AA. So yes i am looking back because not that much has changed. I see that you want to continue this conversation. First i can see that you rarely play scout because you don't know its disadvantages to the other frame and that mediums can do everything a scout do but better. Don't ask i played everything in this game from the suits, weapons, playstyle, and vehicles with decent amount of sp into everything, therefore i think I have a clear idea of what op and what need to be fixed. Dedicated Shotgun Scout
Phazoid The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 121	Posted - 2013.12.10 00:56:00 - [63] - Quote AA was a nail our collective scouty coffin Ib'tuur jatne tuur ash'ad kyr'amur (Today is a good day for someone else to die).
mr musturd 0uter.Heaven Proficiency V. 158	Posted - 2013.12.10 02:09:00 - [64] - Quote hgghyujh wrote: negative49er wrote: hgghyujh wrote: negative49er wrote: it define the purposes of a scout because it breaks hit detection horribly, you wanna see scouts dodging through a solid steam of bullets with out taking damage again??? don't get me wrong I'm a scout and would love it but last time scouts moved reasonably fast they were game breaking. What do you mean back when the game didn't have AA and crap hit detection Stop bringing up the past look into the present trust me the only reason hit detection is as good as it is now is because of the current speed limits and AA. So yes i am looking back because not that much has changed. ok this whole thing about "if a scout moves any faster it will break hit detection" is a load of bullshyt. A LAV moves way faster than any scout suit in the game yet i can get hit markers and damage a LAV with my pistol even when the LAV is moving at full speed. Scout speed will not break hit detection if that was true LAVs would need to be just as slow as a scout
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5758	Posted - 2013.12.10 02:11:00 - [65] - Quote mr musturd wrote: ok this whole thing about "if a scout moves any faster it will break hit detection" is a load of bullshyt. A LAV moves way faster than any scout suit in the game yet i can get hit markers and damage a LAV with my pistol even when the LAV is moving at full speed. Scout speed will not break hit detection if that was true LAVs would need to be just as slow as a scout Someone give this guy a keg of beer, stat! OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved?
mr musturd 0uter.Heaven Proficiency V. 159	Posted - 2013.12.10 02:23:00 - [66] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: mr musturd wrote: ok this whole thing about "if a scout moves any faster it will break hit detection" is a load of bullshyt. A LAV moves way faster than any scout suit in the game yet i can get hit markers and damage a LAV with my pistol even when the LAV is moving at full speed. Scout speed will not break hit detection if that was true LAVs would need to be just as slow as a scout Someone give this guy a keg of beer, stat! musturd wins thread with logic?
DEZKA DIABLO Commando Perkone Caldari State 147	Posted - 2013.12.10 02:46:00 - [67] - Quote Musturd is right tho, but it's the same reason sg are crap now. An that's because SCOUTS ARE BETTER PLAYERS PERIOD! Not so much when you started, but once you got the point to survive an have the benifits you need. The reason I say this is because we chose the hardest thing to play knowing it was $hit when we chose it, we just expected it to evolve with the game, but we chose it because it was a challenge, in beta we took sg to a new level, made under working knives work an things like remotes pistol an SMGS main weapons, an the "great scouts" demoralized the best ftom players, with lower HP , short range weapons and a in your face style that made grown men act like children an throw the ds3 , rage quit an curse. This is what set the game in the state it's in now, extremely good players with great instincts for battle set the bar so high it scared the med frames that they might not be top of the food chain, an rightfully so, if ninjas fought soldiers my moneys on the ninjas! Take musturd, roner, disgruntled , morathi, Jane an annie an put them in a squad, give em all proto logis, an AR,SCR, an speed shot gunning assault suits, and other med frame rifle users would start crying nerf on the same crap they use just to not get pummeled by them. An that's why it's the way it is, speed, endurance, strafing, 5slots an 1 equip instead of 6/2 is because they based scouts ability on the stats of the best players to keep the majority of the player base. Ccp realized they made a suit that in the right hands is a vicious fast killer an that's why scouts get ignored an denied any balance , they want us gone, we're a thorn in their side.
Daxxis KANNAH Distinct Covert Initiative 511	Posted - 2013.12.10 03:00:00 - [68] - Quote mr musturd wrote: ok this whole thing about "if a scout moves any faster it will break hit detection" is a load of bullshyt. A LAV moves way faster than any scout suit in the game yet i can get hit markers and damage a LAV with my pistol even when the LAV is moving at full speed. Scout speed will not break hit detection if that was true LAVs would need to be just as slow as a scout Said this weeks ago - We move slower than vehicles so how are they all in the game. With impovement in lag reduction, hit detection and implementation of aim assist the least they can do is try to see if its fine. PPL just remember the horror stuff and dont put things into context - same with the flaylocks. Look how AA has exposed MD users in the open against rifles and rightfully so.
MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle 159	Posted - 2013.12.10 03:23:00 - [69] - Quote mr musturd wrote: ok this whole thing about "if a scout moves any faster it will break hit detection" is a load of bullshyt. A LAV moves way faster than any scout suit in the game yet i can get hit markers and damage a LAV with my pistol even when the LAV is moving at full speed. Scout speed will not break hit detection if that was true LAVs would need to be just as slow as a scout You can get that because a LAV has a fairly big hitbox. The game has issues with small hitboxes and fast movement. The bigger something is the faster it can move before it breaks the game.
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 708	Posted - 2013.12.10 03:35:00 - [70] - Quote I think the problem has been hit detection. As originally conceived scouts were supposed to be uber fast with god-like strafing ability. Now, in early beta it came to a flop as the perpetual problem with hit detection that Dust seems to be never able to rid itself of was in full bloom. To save hit detection scout speed had to be nerfed, and since that it has been established that it's near impossible to raise scout speed w/o running into terrible hit detection problems and that's why speed tanking is dead. Nerf TTK on AR and SCR and scout is gonna be ok-ish again even with CCP's aimbot still there. Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!

Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 708	Posted - 2013.12.10 05:53:00 - [71] - Quote After reading a lot of ppl going back and forth about TTK, AA, hit detection and speed tanking I felt the need to tell the obvious: If you did not realize, there is no 'hit detection' in Dust514: it's an illusion - it's part of AA mechanic where the computer drags your reticle toward the middle for a large hit box around the actual suit hit box - that 'AA magnetism box' that sets off AR barel drag toward the target. Once you aim down that magnetism 'hit box' the computer knows that it's supposed to drag your AR aim to the center - i.e. the actual drop suit with it's native hit box in the middle of the big magnetism AA box. Once this condition is met that computer knows to start scoring hits against the target as it knows that AA theoretically had enough time to drag your AR aim toward the magnetic center (the real hit box) - all the while you actually don't have to hit the true small hit box. So, it's just a special effect, not a true phenomenon of you hitting the drop suit you are aiming at with your bullets. Effectively what AA does except the obvious of bringing your aim toward the target is it blows up the size of the hit box while giving you the illusion that you are actually aiming and hitting the original drop suit hit box. I hope my explanation makes sense, I am happy to comment more on it if needed. The important part is that true hit detection has not been fixed and if you raised scout speed that fake hit box would have to be blown up to big. This would make it really obvious that the real suit hit box and the effective AA hit box are not the same thing - it will be too obvious that you don't have to hit the suit to score a hit. Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!
IraqiFriendshipExplosive Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 22	Posted - 2013.12.10 07:55:00 - [72] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: hgghyujh wrote: negative49er wrote: it define the purposes of a scout because it breaks hit detection horribly, you wanna see scouts dodging through a solid steam of bullets with out taking damage again??? don't get me wrong I'm a scout and would love it but last time scouts moved reasonably fast they were game breaking. You're basing that on an old patch that dates back to closed beta. Since then, there have been a bunch of optimizations and refinements done to hit detection to the point where almost all of the bullets now his their mark nowadays. There is also the aim assist which has been revamped. Back then, speed tanking really was a problem BECAUSE of the bad hit detection and no aim assist back in closed beta. Nowadays, speed tanking is no longer practical. In fact, it's not longer viable as a valid tactic even in a random pub match because hit detection is now sooooooo good and aim assist is working so well. If I get spotted and I don't find cover in the next 0.5 seconds I'm dead. Speed tanking was powerful in Chromosome but not OP. Hitting Calamity Jane and Annie Oakley was enjoyable because of the challenge.( and they had very little EHP so when you did it hurt them) Uprising 1.0 launch and NO ONE could hit anything... even standing point blank the slippery aim would slip right off target and you would put it back on sometimes 20 times in an engagement. We had decent hit detection and no active aim assist. and scout's where balanced. We have good hit detection and Aim assist and speed tanking(we even have modules for this) is useless.. And hit and run suit's across the game became useless. People can blame hit detection all they want. But it's not because bullets are going where poeple are shooting them. It's because they don't have to aim for a sprinting scout. a computer helps them. Calamity Jane was a major influence, almost the sole reason I decided to spec' into the scout suit to begin with. Granted I think he / she ran the shotgun gallente, I decided to go for the shotgun with minmatar. But your bang on, it was a challenge but not impossible. Once you figured out his/her game tactic you just had to wait in ambush or try and 'shoot ahead' - if that makes sense.


Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page