DUST Search - Dropship shopping in 1.7 - SP Costs and Which one first

Vulpes Dolosus wrote:

Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:

Vulpes Dolosus wrote:

The basics I think you'll need for a decent Caldari dropship (you'll need to look up Gallente and the SP totals yourself)

Vehicle Command- 3
Dropship Command- 3
Assault DS- 1
Caldari ADS- 1

Turret Op- 1
Small Turret Op- 5
Small Missle Op- 3 (5 for proto)

Vehicle Upgrades- 3
Shield Upgrades- 5
Shield Fitting Optimization- 4
Core Upgrades- 5

3, 283, 320 SP. Cheap but I really don't think its got the tank or enough punch. I think it will be a bit weak. HAve you done the numbers on the fitting cost PG/CPU wise. Can you even fit that build?

I've done multiple fits with this:

Two complex hardeners and either a basic heavy shield extender or a complex light booster. EHP of 6-4k with one hardener on (48 sec on, 36 off, but core skill brings it to 1min on, 15sec off), or 12-10k with both on (24 on, 60 off w/o skills), respectively.

If you want an AB, you can put on an Enhanced heavy shield extender and a complex booster with a complex AB. (3.5k EHP + booster).

All these with a proto missile launcher.

What fits did you have in mind?

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Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 882	Posted - 2013.12.05 20:22:00 - [1] - Quote I did some number crunching on the new 1.7 Dropship skill tree to see how many SP you will need to max out one of the racial dropships. I took the defence skills to level 5, skipped turret rotation and remote repping, CRUs and anything not related to defense or assault. I maxed one weapon type, Missiles in this case. 16, 975, 960 Skill Points This will give you a 1.6 equivalent of a python in terms of maxed trees. Im not talking about the same level of operational effectiveness, just maxing those skills that you will want to keep you alive longer and kill faster. Want to get a Gallente ADS too? : another 2, 039, 600 SP to level 5 it for the turret max bonus. Although you can fly it at level 1. Want to max blasters too? another 3, 793, 180 SP So to max out blasters, missiles and both available dropship to ADS level : 22, 298, 840 Skill Points My advice. Max one racial variant and missiles. I would choose caldari. That high shield regen on a shield ship which is designed for missiles seems on paper to be the strongest. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
gbghg L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder. 4120	Posted - 2013.12.05 20:40:00 - [2] - Quote O_O, damnit, i'm gonna suffer here, won't even be able to max out one ship, ah well. thanks for running the numbers judge. Lv 4 forum warrior Bringer of Bacon Knight of AMV's
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 384	Posted - 2013.12.05 20:57:00 - [3] - Quote I would max rails before blasters. Rails will have improved anti-vehicle/installation damage and some sort of aim assist/forgiveness (or so we're told) and should be nice against tanks and possibly other dropships. As far as total SP costs, I've calculated my ideal fit's minimum SP needs to be just over 3mill SP (that's proto missiles and complex modules). Don't let the max scare you, after 3.2mil, it optimization and branching. Dropship Specialist: AKA Clinically Insane Kills- Incubus: 3; Pythons: 0; Logistics: 0; Militia: 19; Tanks: 4
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 883	Posted - 2013.12.05 20:58:00 - [4] - Quote I maxed out armour and shields there in that first figure. I guess you could drop it some but not doing armour too. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 5813	Posted - 2013.12.05 20:59:00 - [5] - Quote How much would you estimate the SP cost to be for a decently built ADS rather than a maxed out one? Level 5 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution Supporter of CCP raRaRa.
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 884	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:01:00 - [6] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: How much would you estimate the SP cost to be for a decently built ADS rather than a maxed out one? Goes to Excel......... Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3704	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:03:00 - [7] - Quote This is why I've been telling you all that a full respec was needed. New SP sinks in vehicle skills means skill points I spent on infantry I would not have if I had known it would take even more SP to get vehicles. Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: How much would you estimate the SP cost to be for a decently built ADS rather than a maxed out one? Honestly, right now I can make a really good ADS with just under 3.5 million SP, so hopefully not much more than that. The trick is you only need the ADS skill to level 1 to unlock the ship, additional levels only provide marginal bonuses for heavy SP costs. Amarr faithful, join PIE Inc, the oldest EVE/Dust Amarr loyal corporation! Amarr Victor!
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 884	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:05:00 - [8] - Quote Well lets drop Damage mods to Level 0, Shield duration recharge to Level 3 , active Module duration to level 3 but leave missle buffs at max : Id say a decent ship is around 12, 188, 010 SKill Points. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
ALT2 acc The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 5	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:06:00 - [9] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: How much would you estimate the SP cost to be for a decently built ADS rather than a maxed out one? level 1 calsault ship, level 5 shield upgrades, level 3 missile how much?
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 5813	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:08:00 - [10] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Well lets drop Damage mods to Level 0, Shield duration recharge to Level 3 , active Module duration to level 3 but leave missle buffs at max : Id say a decent ship is around 12, 188, 010 SKill Points. Missile buffs at max? Is that truly necessary? Sorry to be a pain, but I'm only starting to spec into vehicles and I want to cut down that SP budget so I can actually fly them within the next few months. Level 5 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution Supporter of CCP raRaRa.

DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 8382	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:12:00 - [11] - Quote I'm still gonna get a ton of mileage out of my minimal SP Stupid Uprising, I WAS a maxed out pilot Win ISK / Vids / O7
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 885	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:14:00 - [12] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Missile buffs at max? Is that truly necessary? I think so. You have a limited window when your modules are up. You need to punch as hard as you can in that window if you plan on asualting rather than doing a transport drop. If i drop damage down a bit more then also only take the ADS to level 1... The best deal I can do you is 5, 596, 500 Skill points, It's not great but she runs, it's round back though. Not one I keep in the showroom. That's my lowest offer mate. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
ALT2 acc The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 5	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:19:00 - [13] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Missile buffs at max? Is that truly necessary? I think so. You have a limited window when your modules are up. You need to punch as hard as you can in that window if you plan on asualting rather than doing a transport drop. If i drop damage down a bit more then also only take the ADS to level 1... The best deal I can do you is 5, 596, 500 Skill points, It's not great but she runs, it's round back though. Not one I keep in the showroom. That's my lowest offer mate. level 1 calsault ship, level 5 shield upgrades, level 3 missile, how much?
T'orq DUST University Ivy League 3	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:23:00 - [14] - Quote Wow. I also am building a dropship pilot, knew it would take awhile, but not that long. My first character only have about 10 mil sp
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 885	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:23:00 - [15] - Quote T'orq wrote: Wow. I also am building a dropship pilot, knew it would take awhile, but not that long. My first character only have about 10 mil sp Around the 5 or 6 million mark. You'll need CPU skills up and PG skills too. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 386	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:36:00 - [16] - Quote The basics I think you'll need for a decent Caldari dropship (you'll need to look up Gallente and the SP totals yourself) Vehicle Command- 3 Dropship Command- 3 Assault DS- 1 Caldari ADS- 1 Turret Op- 1 Small Turret Op- 5 Small Missle Op- 3 (5 for proto) Vehicle Upgrades- 3 Shield Upgrades- 5 Shield Fitting Optimization- 4 Core Upgrades- 5 This all should cost about 3.5mil SP. It will allow you to fit complex shield mods and afterburners for defense and have a decent turret for offense. I'd suggest focusing on the core calibration (longer active mods) and core grid management (shorter cool downs). After that, turret and ADS skills for additional damage, etc. Dropship Specialist: AKA Clinically Insane Kills- Incubus: 3; Pythons: 0; Logistics: 0; Militia: 19; Tanks: 4
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 5814	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:39:00 - [17] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Missile buffs at max? Is that truly necessary? I think so. You have a limited window when your modules are up. You need to punch as hard as you can in that window if you plan on asualting rather than doing a transport drop. If i drop damage down a bit more then also only take the ADS to level 1... The best deal I can do you is 5, 596, 500 Skill points, It's not great but she runs, it's round back though. Not one I keep in the showroom. That's my lowest offer mate. I'll take it, I guess. Level 5 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution Supporter of CCP raRaRa.
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 389	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:45:00 - [18] - Quote The best thing for anyone looking into vehicles now (especially on a tight SP allowance) is to go to the stickied fitting too and see what you can fit and how much it will cost. Dropship Specialist: AKA Clinically Insane Kills- Incubus: 3; Pythons: 0; Logistics: 0; Militia: 19; Tanks: 4
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 885	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:52:00 - [19] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The basics I think you'll need for a decent Caldari dropship (you'll need to look up Gallente and the SP totals yourself) Vehicle Command- 3 Dropship Command- 3 Assault DS- 1 Caldari ADS- 1 Turret Op- 1 Small Turret Op- 5 Small Missle Op- 3 (5 for proto) Vehicle Upgrades- 3 Shield Upgrades- 5 Shield Fitting Optimization- 4 Core Upgrades- 5 3, 283, 320 SP. Cheap but I really don't think its got the tank or enough punch. I think it will be a bit weak. HAve you done the numbers on the fitting cost PG/CPU wise. Can you even fit that build? Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 2087	Posted - 2013.12.05 21:57:00 - [20] - Quote I've only spent 1.5 mil on vehicles and decided to wait until the overhaul was complete. I guess that'll be better than starting at zero but I'm going to have to wait and see if I want to fly again. I'm pretty bad at it. Maybe I'll wait for the Minmatar designs. // Adapt or Die // Matari Logistics / Scout / Dropship Crash Tester // @ReesNoturana

Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 391	Posted - 2013.12.05 22:18:00 - [21] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The basics I think you'll need for a decent Caldari dropship (you'll need to look up Gallente and the SP totals yourself) Vehicle Command- 3 Dropship Command- 3 Assault DS- 1 Caldari ADS- 1 Turret Op- 1 Small Turret Op- 5 Small Missle Op- 3 (5 for proto) Vehicle Upgrades- 3 Shield Upgrades- 5 Shield Fitting Optimization- 4 Core Upgrades- 5 3, 283, 320 SP. Cheap but I really don't think its got the tank or enough punch. I think it will be a bit weak. HAve you done the numbers on the fitting cost PG/CPU wise. Can you even fit that build? I've done multiple fits with this: Two complex hardeners and either a basic heavy shield extender or a complex light booster. EHP of 6-4k with one hardener on (48 sec on, 36 off, but core skill brings it to 1min on, 15sec off), or 12-10k with both on (24 on, 60 off w/o skills), respectively. If you want an AB, you can put on an Enhanced heavy shield extender and a complex booster with a complex AB. (3.5k EHP + booster). All these with a proto missile launcher. What fits did you have in mind? Dropship Specialist: AKA Clinically Insane Kills- Incubus: 3; Pythons: 0; Logistics: 0; Militia: 19; Tanks: 4
EternalRMG KNIGHTZ OF THE ROUND Legacy Rising 695	Posted - 2013.12.05 22:35:00 - [22] - Quote I am still going with an Incubus You can fit dmg mods and afterburner without loosing tank Bonus to rails is going to make them an awesome av weapon And who needs repairs modules? 2 hardeners onee plate is enough If you get low on health you just go to a supply depot and heal and resupply ammo The only problem would be another DS but my team can take care of him "Fight Togheter; Win Together" Duster Since: July 2012 Best DropShip Pilot; Soon To be best Jet Fighter Pilot
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 887	Posted - 2013.12.05 22:58:00 - [23] - Quote before investing in the AB test the base speed first, We are getting our speed doubled. I did a video where i compared, split screen, AB vs non AB. The AB was exactly twice as fast as non AB. So this may mean our max speed in 1.7 is the same as current AB speed. If this is the case an AB may not be needed. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
gbghg L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder. 4121	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:21:00 - [24] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: before investing in the AB test the base speed first, We are getting our speed doubled. I did a video where i compared, split screen, AB vs non AB. The AB was exactly twice as fast as non AB. So this may mean our max speed in 1.7 is the same as current AB speed. If this is the case an AB may not be needed. or it may become super fun if the same ratio is maintained , which it probably wont be. Lv 4 forum warrior Bringer of Bacon Knight of AMV's
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 8392	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:23:00 - [25] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: before investing in the AB test the base speed first, We are getting our speed doubled. I did a video where i compared, split screen, AB vs non AB. The AB was exactly twice as fast as non AB. So this may mean our max speed in 1.7 is the same as current AB speed. If this is the case an AB may not be needed. I'm definitely curious, especially with Proto ABs being a thing now. Gon' be cray Win ISK / Vids / O7
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 398	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:52:00 - [26] - Quote gbghg wrote: Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: before investing in the AB test the base speed first, We are getting our speed doubled. I did a video where i compared, split screen, AB vs non AB. The AB was exactly twice as fast as non AB. So this may mean our max speed in 1.7 is the same as current AB speed. If this is the case an AB may not be needed. or it may become super fun if the same ratio is maintained , which it probably wont be. You're right. The actual multiple for the new ABs areGÇª 2.5x!? Wow. If we already get a 2x increase, plus a 2.5x ABGÇª that's 5x current speeds. Dropship Specialist: AKA Clinically Insane Kills- Incubus: 3; Pythons: 0; Logistics: 0; Militia: 19; Tanks: 4
CELESTA AUNGM Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 55	Posted - 2013.12.09 15:30:00 - [27] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The best thing for anyone looking into vehicles now (especially on a tight SP allowance) is to go to the stickied fitting too and see what you can fit and how much it will cost. ...MUCH TOO CRITICAL, TOO SOON. Judge, I love what you do with the videos and analyses in this game, but I have to say in this case, it's just too RISKY to calculate anything based on those charts and trees CCP posted (those charts started off as "for discussion" only, now they're being taken as Bible when any one of us can find half a dozen illogical entries on them.) I endorse Vulpes Dolusus' approach as at least SAFER approach to the new changes coming: Whatever DS fitting you have right now that you LIKE,... make a note of its overall Sheild/Armour strength, its Sheild/Armour bonus % that you were able to tweak with your Skill investments,... and when the OFFICIAL skill trees and marketplace items arrive in 1.7, shop for the modules and Skills that will deliver that same (or better maybe?) strength/bonus. Hey, that may end up being an entirely different variation of Skill investment than what you went through before---it might not mean MAXING 1/3 of what you maxed before. (looking at SOME of the modules on those new charts, some of those bonuses may no longer enough bang to justify the SP Lvl 5 bucks). If this is an indication of Dust becoming more like EVE, how do the EVE Online players handle their Skill management? Do they just go for MAX on as many categories as possible, or is it so intricate they have to "work the numbers" and pick what NOT to invest in?
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 911	Posted - 2013.12.09 17:54:00 - [28] - Quote i think you missed my point slightly. I said that i was talking about tree maxing and not a comparisson of performance. What I was meaning was ignore the actual stats, and just look at level 5. Topping all the trees now is cheaper than topping all the trees tomorrow. That was my point. As for performance, no one really knows till we play it. Everything Dropship youtube channel my Community Spotlight
richiesutie 2 The Rainbow Effect 538	Posted - 2013.12.09 17:57:00 - [29] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The basics I think you'll need for a decent Caldari dropship (you'll need to look up Gallente and the SP totals yourself) Vehicle Command- 3 Dropship Command- 3 Assault DS- 1 Caldari ADS- 1 Turret Op- 1 Small Turret Op- 5 Small Missle Op- 3 (5 for proto) Vehicle Upgrades- 3 Shield Upgrades- 5 Shield Fitting Optimization- 4 Core Upgrades- 5 3, 283, 320 SP. Cheap but I really don't think its got the tank or enough punch. I think it will be a bit weak. HAve you done the numbers on the fitting cost PG/CPU wise. Can you even fit that build? I've done multiple fits with this: Two complex hardeners and either a basic heavy shield extender or a complex light booster. EHP of 6-4k with one hardener on (48 sec on, 36 off, but core skill brings it to 1min on, 15sec off), or 12-10k with both on (24 on, 60 off w/o skills), respectively. If you want an AB, you can put on an Enhanced heavy shield extender and a complex booster with a complex AB. (3.5k EHP + booster). All these with a proto missile launcher. What fits did you have in mind? compilation of Patch/build notes Check it out! :)
richiesutie 2 The Rainbow Effect 538	Posted - 2013.12.09 18:02:00 - [30] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The basics I think you'll need for a decent Caldari dropship (you'll need to look up Gallente and the SP totals yourself) Vehicle Command- 3 Dropship Command- 3 Assault DS- 1 Caldari ADS- 1 Turret Op- 1 Small Turret Op- 5 Small Missle Op- 3 (5 for proto) Vehicle Upgrades- 3 Shield Upgrades- 5 Shield Fitting Optimization- 4 Core Upgrades- 5 3, 283, 320 SP. Cheap but I really don't think its got the tank or enough punch. I think it will be a bit weak. HAve you done the numbers on the fitting cost PG/CPU wise. Can you even fit that build? I've done multiple fits with this: Two complex hardeners and either a basic heavy shield extender or a complex light booster. EHP of 6-4k with one hardener on (48 sec on, 36 off, but core skill brings it to 1min on, 15sec off), or 12-10k with both on (24 on, 60 off w/o skills), respectively. If you want an AB, you can put on an Enhanced heavy shield extender and a complex booster with a complex AB. (3.5k EHP + booster). All these with a proto missile launcher. What fits did you have in mind? Where did you pull those numbers from? compilation of Patch/build notes Check it out! :)



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