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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1270
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Posted - 2013.11.21 23:27:00 -
[1] - Quote
Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
Marston VC, STB director
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Monkey MAC
killer taxi company
1034
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Posted - 2013.11.21 23:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
In all honesty why are Assults at the same skill tree level as logi suits?
The pen is mightier than the sword
The gun is mightier than both
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
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CAMille DANIELz
planetary retaliation organisation
1
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
I absolutely agree with you Marston. The problem is not that the logistic dropsuits are overpowered, but rather that every other top-tier suit is underpowered. Buffing the heavies was a small step in the right direction, but I think it will be a while before we see a true balancing of suit abilities. Right now CCP is enamored with the new racial-specific weaponry. For the time being, game focus is going to shift not towards what suits we are using, but the weapons and vehicles we use. Hoepfully this will at least keep things more interesting and varied.
As it stands - Dust is getting rather samey with nearly everyone running the same fits. I stopped playing eve to get away from the "one fit to rule them all", but I should have know better
The following statement is true. The previous statement is false.
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Mortedeamor
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
798
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:06:00 -
[4] - Quote
+1 buff assaults |
Roger Cordill
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar
DARKSTAR ARMY
26
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
Assaults don't need a buff. |
ACE OF JOKERS
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
165
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
I can get behind this.
Same as the logis get up to 5 armor rep per sec, Assaults yould get up to +5% Damage in their racial weapons. |
Ralden Caster
Omega Elite Mercs INC.
0
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
This post needs some blue tape. |
DEZKA DIABLO
Commando Perkone
Caldari State
61
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:24:00 -
[8] - Quote
As far as I'm concerned the assault players can wait their turn, heavies, camandos, scouts, have all stayed in a state of limbo for half a year, forced to either go logi or afk. Or spec inTo other things, weapons ect. An have had their whole skill tree destroyed.
Things like shotguns , nova knives, faylocks, mass drivers and grenade spam were either broke with hit detection or they were too op.
The scouts for example , the ones that went minmatar in uprising got about a month of the suit working well an spent the next 6 months in the dark due to the above problems plus scanners an speeds an turning an strafe speeds of other suits that two low slots an poor scanning isn't enough to get by that smart an not so stubborn scouts switched to gallente, an IMO that 6 month wait for 6 m of scan wasn't enough so people are sorely mistaken if they think scouts are done being worked on by ccp, fix the broken before you cater to the whinners they can wait just like everyone else.
Plus with new rifles shooting 100 m assaults can stop being Cqc an fit from ridiculous range, so they can wait as far as I'm concerned |
Jastad
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
218
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
why people think CRAZY solution for EASY SOLVING PROBLEMS.
Make mandatory the equip slot for a Logi fitting, like the weapon.
If you go further, ONE (and only one) of them need to be the same Metalvl as the suit.
BUM in one move we nerf BRICKDUAL tankers and don't **** on real logibros.
Easy as breath
...and may the FORGE be with you.
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Sgt Buttscratch
R 0 N 1 N
1011
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
Not just the assault!! Heavies, scouts and lolmando's all need a tweak, par them with logi's in their own way.
I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas
Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans
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True Adamance
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
4211
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
Most people don't want logis nerfed, they want them made niche role and different from assault. More often than not I have seen people calling for carbines, lighter higher RoF Rifles that impress the support role for the class but keep the CQC DPS high as possible.
"All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
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Foxbat 071
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar
DARKSTAR ARMY
36
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:41:00 -
[12] - Quote
lol@ assaults saying assaults aren't good enough and logis saying logis are just fine.
BLAP
( X ) Call For Help
( O ) Respawn
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Eris Ernaga
State Patriots
732
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
The assaults need better base attributes for every stat besides CPU and PG the Minmitar assault has worse shield recharge/depleted delay then the logi and worse scanning precision. That is unacceptable also all assault suits need a slight bump to pg and cpu.
State Patriots a loyal Caldari based corporation is accepting all Caldari and Amarr to help fight on the front.
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TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR
F.T.U.
635
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:52:00 -
[14] - Quote
meanwhile in scoutville...
but seriously i think both suits are fine. i have a guy in my corp i commonly call the God of DUST who runs a caldari assault and he's 100x better than any logi i've ever seen. why don't you just give assaults the passive armor regen? i have no idea why logis got that in the first place.
and buff my scout while your at it.
*tries to flank a group of enemies. YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED (pâÄa¦át¢èa¦á)pâÄs+íGö+GöüGö+
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Denchlad 7
Heavy Reign inc.
Freek Alliance
18
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Posted - 2013.11.22 00:55:00 -
[15] - Quote
Only change I would make to Assaults is more CPU and PG for complex modules. No slot changes. I'll be happy with that.
-Flaylock Specialist. I even dual-wield it still. (GîÉGûá_Gûá)
-Likes ramming a HMG up Gallentes rear end.
-Pain in the arse
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CAMille DANIELz
planetary retaliation organisation
2
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Posted - 2013.11.22 01:01:00 -
[16] - Quote
There should be a tactical advantage to using an assualt suit.
The Logi suit should NOT be on-par, or even worse, better than the assualt in open conflict. This bonus needs to be TANGIBLE. Not +5% to ******* sidearm ammo or +1% to fart speed.
This also ties into shields being the piddle that they are now.
Again I dont think the answer is to nerf the Logis. But they need a visit to the re-balancing table, as do assaults and scouts.
The following statement is true. The previous statement is false.
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1279
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Posted - 2013.11.22 03:26:00 -
[17] - Quote
Denchlad 7 wrote:Only change I would make to Assaults is more CPU and PG for complex modules. No slot changes. I'll be happy with that.
And it would make sense too. Its the same size suit as the logi suits, but it has less overall module slots tier for tier. So idk why it doesn't have as much CPU/PG as a logi at least.
Marston VC, STB director
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ACE OF JOKERS
AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS
175
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Posted - 2013.11.22 03:29:00 -
[18] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Denchlad 7 wrote:Only change I would make to Assaults is more CPU and PG for complex modules. No slot changes. I'll be happy with that. And it would make sense too. Its the same size suit as the logi suits, but it has less overall module slots tier for tier. So idk why it doesn't have as much CPU/PG as a logi at least.
Well i wouldnt, because as it is Logis COULD fit the SAME amount of slots than as An assault with Complex modules, only difference is they STILL have CPU and PG AND More slots....
CPU+PG is something assault need,but it wouldnt close the gap at all.
Im telling you this because amarr assault Might fit all slots with Cx Stuff, and unless hes using laser weaponry, its NOTHING to the Amarr Logi, that has 2 more eq slots, 1 more Low slot, a 5Hp-sec repair bonus and More CPU....
>..> |
CharCharOdell
1635
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Posted - 2013.11.22 05:34:00 -
[19] - Quote
i agree
Gùñ-é-º+¼+ò+¦GÖÑ+ú+ú+¡ GÖÑ'Ðe+ü+üGùÑ
Gùú -ä>-üð+++Ç++§<-¡<-¡ Gùó
Speaker of the Mangrove / King of QQ / Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
855
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Posted - 2013.11.22 06:06:00 -
[20] - Quote
ACE OF JOKERS wrote:Marston VC wrote:Denchlad 7 wrote:Only change I would make to Assaults is more CPU and PG for complex modules. No slot changes. I'll be happy with that. And it would make sense too. Its the same size suit as the logi suits, but it has less overall module slots tier for tier. So idk why it doesn't have as much CPU/PG as a logi at least. Well i wouldnt, because as it is Logis COULD fit the SAME amount of slots than as An assault with Complex modules, only difference is they STILL have CPU and PG AND More slots....
CPU+PG is something assault need,but it wouldnt close the gap at all.
Im telling you this because amarr assault Might fit all slots with Cx Stuff, and unless hes using laser weaponry, its NOTHING to the Amarr Logi, that has 2 more eq slots, 1 more Low slot, a 5Hp-sec repair bonus and More CPU....
>..>
Do you have both the Amarr Assault and Logi? I do. The Assault is FAR better at dealing damage and much more mobile, while the Logi is FAR better at taking damage and using equipment. These two are balanced with each other very well.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
Burner of faces.
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
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George Moros
Area 514
187
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Posted - 2013.11.22 06:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
@OP:
How is nerfing logi's CPU/PG while giving them a bonus to fitting equipment, breaking logi dropsuits? Practically every suggestion I read concerning CPU/PG nerf, also said that it should go along with equipment fitting bonus.
Why do you think assaults need a buff? Their usage on the battlefield is paling due to increased domination of scouts and heavies? Stop acting like the only dropsuits that exist in DUST are mediums. If you buff assaults, you'd have to buff every other dropsuit class in the game. So, basically, you're suggesting that it would be easier to buff everything, than to nerf the logi. Doesn't make much sense to me.
Pulvereus ergo queritor.
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Kalante Schiffer
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
465
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Posted - 2013.11.22 06:48:00 -
[22] - Quote
Denchlad 7 wrote:Only change I would make to Assaults is more CPU and PG for complex modules. No slot changes. I'll be happy with that. nice i want 1405pg so i can fit a good fkn nanohive. |
TheAmazing FlyingPig
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
4673
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Posted - 2013.11.22 06:56:00 -
[23] - Quote
Nerf the logi by buffing everyone (including the logi)
Never forget
Level 4 Forum Warrior
King of airborne swine.
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Assert Dominance
Ahrendee's Wafflehouse
473
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Posted - 2013.11.22 07:05:00 -
[24] - Quote
All equipment slots filled or invalid fitting forces logiing like behavior, dont like it go assault. which is how it should be. Better then the current, tempt logis to be super assaults abusing the extra cpu and pg they get for their slots is silly.
I eat blue waffles when i proto stomp.
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TheAmazing FlyingPig
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
4673
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Posted - 2013.11.22 07:11:00 -
[25] - Quote
Assert Dominance wrote:All equipment slots filled or invalid fitting forces logiing like behavior, dont like it go assault. which is how it should be. Better then the current, tempt logis to be super assaults abusing the extra cpu and pg they get for their slots is silly.
Nothing is stopping someone from filling their equipment with easy-to-fit cheap standard modules.
Before anyone says "at least it's something"... 30% HP revive / slow armor rep / insta-popping nanohives / worthless scanner
Never forget
Level 4 Forum Warrior
King of airborne swine.
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Infamous Erich
Inf4m0us
41
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Posted - 2013.11.22 07:17:00 -
[26] - Quote
Give assaults 2 equipment only on the proto varients of each race and i would say thats perfect. Nanohive and nanite FTW!
Closed Beta Vet
Shield Tank Vet
Bring back my Sagaris
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Cosgar
ParagonX
8001
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Posted - 2013.11.22 08:03:00 -
[27] - Quote
If logis do get nerfed, how long before everyone wants to burn assaults at the stake?
I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
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Dagger-Two
Villore Joint Task Force
Villore Accords
141
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Posted - 2013.11.22 08:06:00 -
[28] - Quote
I think a lot of the issues stem from the idea of people picking up Proto logi suits, not filling ANY equipment, and using the greater CPU/PG of the suit to fit a lot more tank and damage, quickly outclassing the assault suits.
One way to fix this without destroying the class, would be to give it a set role-bonus for the PG/CPU usage of equipment (lets say, 50% for the hell of it) but cutting the base CPU and PG to assault levels or maybe even a bit lower. Now, all equipment you fit to the suit gets its PG and CPU usage cut in half, so you still have room to fit a weapon and mods. Equipment-oriented Logi suits would be more effective that before, while the 'assault' logi would be less effective.
To cap it all off, give the Logi bonuses to help its role: 5% bonus per level to equipment effectiveness and something racially flavored. |
Infamous Erich
Inf4m0us
41
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Posted - 2013.11.22 08:09:00 -
[29] - Quote
CCP could make it so the logi fit is unvalid unless you have all equipment filled 
Closed Beta Vet
Shield Tank Vet
Bring back my Sagaris
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THUNDERGROOVE
ZionTCD
Public Disorder.
331
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Posted - 2013.11.22 08:12:00 -
[30] - Quote
I don't exactly agree with the term buff. Give them something that pertains to their weapon like the Amarr assault(5% per level to overheat).
Gallente assault - AR bonus?
Caldari assault - Rail rifle/sniper rifle bonus?
etc..
Infamous Erich wrote:CCP could make it so the logi fit is unvalid unless you have all equipment filled
That fixes nothing.
I can still just run ****** equipment and brick tank my logi suit like I already do 
ZionTCD Director & Ammar Loyalist
Amarr Sentinel | Amarr Logi | Losematar Scout
What is a signature?
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1285
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Posted - 2013.11.22 12:14:00 -
[31] - Quote
Infamous Erich wrote:Give assaults 2 equipment only on the proto varients of each race and i would say thats perfect. Nanohive and nanite FTW!
They cant do that, because then everyone would run assault suits. It used to be like that in closed beta, and it was really rare to see a logi almost ever. The reason for it was because you'd have full proto squads who all ran a combination of equipment that allowed them to function without a logi.
Marston VC, STB director
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1285
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Posted - 2013.11.22 12:20:00 -
[32] - Quote
George Moros wrote:@OP:
How is nerfing logi's CPU/PG while giving them a bonus to fitting equipment, breaking logi dropsuits? Practically every suggestion I read concerning CPU/PG nerf, also said that it should go along with equipment fitting bonus.
Why do you think assaults need a buff? Their usage on the battlefield is paling due to increased domination of scouts and heavies? Stop acting like the only dropsuits that exist in DUST are mediums. If you buff assaults, you'd have to buff every other dropsuit class in the game. So, basically, you're suggesting that it would be easier to buff everything, than to nerf the logi. Doesn't make much sense to me.
Actually, that's not what I suggested at all. Nerfing the logi's CPU/PG but giving a buff to equipment usage is absolutely idiotic. Its the same as doing nothing. Buffing assaults would not in-balance the game anymore then it already is. If you haven't noticed, heavy suits have gotten three buffs over the last four months. Two indirect buffs, and one direct buff. Logis have remained largely the same. Scouts still suck. By buffing assault suits, it will allow for them to actually compete with well fitted logi suits, and feasibly be able to attempt a kill on a well fitted heavy.
Im not saying "buff every other suit" im saying buff the assault suit....... and I don't know how you could possibly twist my words any further then that to begin with.
Marston VC, STB director
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
3862
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Posted - 2013.11.22 12:37:00 -
[33] - Quote
Black or white fallacy:
"Also known as the false dilemma, this insidious tactic has the appearance of forming a logical argument, but under closer scrutiny it becomes evident that there are more possibilities than the either/or choice that is presented. Binary, black-or-white thinking doesn't allow for the many different variables, conditions, and contexts in which there would exist more than just the two possibilities put forth. It frames the argument misleadingly and obscures rational, honest debate."
Some things need to change with assaults, other things need to change with logis.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Korvin Lomont
United Pwnage Service
RISE of LEGION
257
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Posted - 2013.11.22 12:53:00 -
[34] - Quote
Sometimes I think CCP should just remove every suit apart from the assault suit from the game... |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
2363
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Posted - 2013.11.22 13:39:00 -
[35] - Quote
Who recalls when Logis were Logis?
Always at the ready with Hives and Reps and Pickups.
Needed our protection as much as we needed their Logi Love.
Back then, no one set out to "pubstomp" in a Logi suit.
LOL @ Slayer Logi
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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
2363
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Posted - 2013.11.22 13:42:00 -
[36] - Quote
Better Assaults aren't the answer.
Assaults already outperform everything but Logis.
I suspect CCP set out to make the Logi better at defending itself.
I doubt they set out give Nyain San a better pubstomping suit.
Good intentions, but over-corrected.
If you want HP like a Heavy, shouldn't there be a tradeoff? |
AfroSunshineY Consequence
R 0 N 1 N
174
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Posted - 2013.11.22 15:46:00 -
[37] - Quote
I've got to say I'm a little appalled by an assault player asking for a buff with scouts the way they are right now |
broonfondle majikthies
Bannana Boat Corp
Relentless Heroes Alliance
484
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Posted - 2013.11.22 16:04:00 -
[38] - Quote
I don't know about a buff, but Gal Assaults could probably do with a different generic Assault Bonus.
Cal could do with a skill that directly affects their weapons (only ones that don't - Gal tech, i.e the PC, is difficult to load on a suit so in a way matches)
Wouldn't mind a change to Min assault bonus - Current one is fine (seeing as half sidearms are Min anyway) But won't help when 1.7 hits and we all want our Combat Rifles.
Edit - But that's me being selfish so I'll shut up
"...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
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Everything Dies
Chatelain Rapid Response
Gallente Federation
230
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Posted - 2013.11.22 16:13:00 -
[39] - Quote
Broonfondle Majikthies wrote:I don't know about a buff, but Gal Assaults could probably do with a different generic Assault Bonus.
BINGO. The biggest problem with my Gallente assault suit is the nearly-worthless bonus given to my shields; what I really want is the logi bonus of passive armor rep. If an assault suit is designed for fighting, it should receive a bonus that helps it to stay alive in a firefight.
As for nerfing the logi suit, a good first step would be to limit the usage of WP-farming equipment. Remove the ability to have each type of equipment (i.e. every type of uplink) all going at the same time and instead limit it to a set amount (for example, two uplinks--of any kind--can operate at the same time) and you might see a reduction in logi numbers.
Life is killing me.
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Korvin Lomont
United Pwnage Service
RISE of LEGION
258
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Posted - 2013.11.22 17:31:00 -
[40] - Quote
Shotty GoBang wrote:Who recalls when Logis were Logis?
Always at the ready with Hives and Reps and Pickups.
Needed our protection as much as we needed their Logi Love.
Back then, no one set out to "pubstomp" in a Logi suit.
LOL @ Slayer Logi
If you would remember the chromosome logies you would know that logies in chromosome were even stronger than now. And just a sidenote IF you tank a logi to have hp like an heavy he IS as slow as a heavy with less hp and without a sidearm. |
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chase rowland
The Enclave Syndicate
Dark Taboo
77
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Posted - 2013.11.22 17:33:00 -
[41] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
you forget, the medium assault suit is still OP compared to the heavy and scout. think about them for once |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
2380
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Posted - 2013.11.22 17:37:00 -
[42] - Quote
Korvin Lomont wrote:
If you would remember the chromosome logies you would know that logies in chromosome were even stronger than now.
Incorrect!
What I recall is a distinct lack of 1000+ HP "Slayer Logis" running around hipfiring Duvolles.
As a sidenote, the KR-17 OHK'd even the tankiest of Chromosome Logis.
Korvin Lomont wrote:
And just a sidenote IF you tank a logi to have hp like an heavy he IS as slow as a heavy with less hp and without a sidearm.
Assuming that Heavy runs KinCats instead of Armor?
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Korvin Lomont
United Pwnage Service
RISE of LEGION
258
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Posted - 2013.11.22 17:44:00 -
[43] - Quote
Shotty GoBang wrote:Korvin Lomont wrote:
If you would remember the chromosome logies you would know that logies in chromosome were even stronger than now.
Incorrect! What I recall is a distinct lack of 1000+ HP "Slayer Logis" running around hipfiring Duvolles. As a sidenote, the KR-17 OHK'd even the tankiest of Chromosome Logis. Korvin Lomont wrote:
And just a sidenote IF you tank a logi to have hp like an heavy he IS as slow as a heavy with less hp and without a sidearm.
Assuming that Heavy runs KinCats instead of Armor?
The minni logi had the same slot layout was faster (vk1) with slightly more health.
In order to archieve 1200 hp you need to fit complex plates because of the movement penalty the logi then gets a similar speed while beeing close t the hp of an unfittet std heavy. |
Rynoceros
Rise Of Old Dudes
1350
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Posted - 2013.11.22 17:59:00 -
[44] - Quote
I have a stack of gK.0 Assaults I won't use.
I get better satisfaction from the performance of the Standard G/1 Logi.
The aK.0 Heavy is an atrocious waste of SP.
My MLT Heavy with 'Toxin' weapons, kills all of them.
Cheeseburgers.
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Roy Ventus
Foxhound Corporation
General Tso's Alliance
592
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Posted - 2013.11.22 18:05:00 -
[45] - Quote
When I go up against a Cal/Gal Logi with my Gal Assault, I'm usually in the fair chance to win. Idky but head to head, I usually win or come really close to it.
I think the issue people are having is that the Logistics can be used for Offensive capabilities on the same level as an Assault. That's not bad tho...considering that they're both medium frame suits with their own intended purposes. Assaults are mostly offensive/defensive while Logistics are for support and can either recon, replenish, or react to the field as it changes.
Logistics may be able to access the highest damage or the highest eHP or the highest speed/stamina or possibly even the lowest profile but overall they're not "balanced" in the same way the assaults are when it comes to getting into actual battles. I'll see a Logi with a lot of damage modifiers but little eHP or the opposite(usually the former) and they're not that tough... Or at least it seems that way from what I've heard and seen. |
George Moros
Area 514
189
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Posted - 2013.11.22 18:31:00 -
[46] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:
Actually, that's not what I suggested at all. Nerfing the logi's CPU/PG but giving a buff to equipment usage is absolutely idiotic. Its the same as doing nothing.
It's the same as doing nothing if (and only if) you play the logi with the intent of doing logistics, and not slaying. That's the whole point of the "nerf logi CPU/PG + equipment fitting bonus". It's not idiotic, it's simple and effective.
Marston VC wrote:Buffing assaults would not in-balance the game anymore then it already is. If you haven't noticed, heavy suits have gotten three buffs over the last four months. Two indirect buffs, and one direct buff. Logis have remained largely the same. Scouts still suck. By buffing assault suits, it will allow for them to actually compete with well fitted logi suits, and feasibly be able to attempt a kill on a well fitted heavy.
Medium suits are by far the most used suits currently in the game. Buffing assaults certainly wouldn't help to rectify that fact. Although, I agree that assaults should have more "assaulty" bonuses (like bonus to light weapon damage), I also think assaults should lose their equipment slot. Heavies received several buffs lately, but not the most important one - a truly effective anti-infantry weapon.
Marston VC wrote:Im not saying "buff every other suit" im saying buff the assault suit....... and I don't know how you could possibly twist my words any further then that to begin with.
I didn't twist your words mate, I used simple deduction as to how your proposed changes would affect the game.
Pulvereus ergo queritor.
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ELITE INQUISITOR
Eternal Beings
16
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Posted - 2013.11.22 18:33:00 -
[47] - Quote
Don't buff ANY medium suit. Especially the assault suit. Just make the logis have to put something in their equipment slots. Kinda like every suit has to have a primary weapon to be playable. The logis wouldn't be able to tank because pg/cpu would be used up on equipment. They could even put all re's if they wanted.
If you accept your limitations you go beyond them
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1290
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Posted - 2013.11.22 19:36:00 -
[48] - Quote
ELITE INQUISITOR wrote:Don't buff ANY medium suit. Especially the assault suit. Just make the logis have to put something in their equipment slots. Kinda like every suit has to have a primary weapon to be playable. The logis wouldn't be able to tank because pg/cpu would be used up on equipment. They could even put all re's if they wanted.
Or I just put three compact nanohives in my slots.......
Marston VC, STB director
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Marston VC
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1290
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Posted - 2013.11.22 19:37:00 -
[49] - Quote
chase rowland wrote:Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean. you forget, the medium assault suit is still OP compared to the heavy and scout. think about them for once
The scout suit is weak ill give you that. But the heavy suits can have about 1700 HP now...... If a heavy suit cant make something work with the tank of an LAV then idk what were supposed to do.
Marston VC, STB director
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pdiddy anfama
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
86
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Posted - 2013.11.22 19:50:00 -
[50] - Quote
Marston VC wrote:Tons of people are calling for CCP to nerf logi suits. That's just nonsensical. I haven't seen a single post bring up a valid way to nerf the logi suits without breaking them. (and before you guys say "hes just biased because he only uses logi suits" Actually..... I have three proto assault suits, and only 1 proto logi suit......). So rather then nerfing PG/CPU, or reducing damage, or taking away weapon availability. Why not just make it so that assault suits are better at slaying then logis????
One way or the other, an entire class of suits has to be changed. So rather then nerfing things and pissing people off, why not just buff things and make some people happy about it? The reason I think assaults should be buffed is because of the Calogi fiasco we had back in 1.0-1.1.
Somebody posted a fit of their Calogi before and after the nerf it got. The fit was literally the exact same but instead of having a bunch of logi like equipment, there was just 1 nanohive. Which means........ it was still a slayer fit...... Same exact suit, just a little bit less health in shields (because of the nerf to shields it got). So what happens if CCP nerfs things to the logi suits? Well..... history shows that it actually damages logiing like behavior, so instead of nurfing logis, I think it would be better to just make assaults better at what they do.
Give assault suits damage buffs to racial specific weapons, increase there CPU and PG so that they can use all those complex modules. (which would make sense considering its the same as a logi suit just without equipment slots). Make it so that its actually worth using assault suits, and stop talking all this nonsense about how "logis are OP" Buffing the calogi assault was a good start, but I don't personally believe it was enough because I know for a fact I see way more logi suits in PC battles then assaults. So yeah..... that's just my take on what should actually be done. IDK how you guys feel, and honestly it really doesn't concern me either way CCP decides to lean.
Very good our corp was just talking about this same exact thing last night. |
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CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation
488
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Posted - 2013.11.22 20:01:00 -
[51] - Quote
im against the damage buff for assault suits.
im going to try to make an example on what i think should be done for the logi suit.
lets take a proto galente logi suit and proto assault suit of the same type and race.
the fully fitted versions with just stacked plates and shield extenders.
logi gets more total hp than the assault suit does.
because the higher tiered logi suits have more high and low slots than their high tiered assault versions.
and since the logi already has a base hp weaker than an assault suit.
lets make it to where that logi suit could have either the same amount of slots as the assault version or less slots.
equipment slots and things of that sort should be uneffected.
this could get rid of slayer logis all together making an assault more preferable than a logi suit for killing/assaulting objectives. |
SteelheadPep
SAM-MIK
1
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Posted - 2013.11.22 22:30:00 -
[52] - Quote
BURN HER, BURN HER, she's a witch! I'm not a witch they dressed me like this. It is comical that there are a lot of similarities here. Keep up the good work you will drive this game into the dirt then blame everyone else. Have made suggestions in the numerious other insane posts that seem to pop up like mushrooms.Becareful of what you wish for because your precious suit maybe next. |
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