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Garth Mandra
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
225
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Posted - 2013.11.20 09:41:00 -
[31] - Quote
I think a scout should only need to put in a little effort to hide from proto scanners. No effort should be required to hide from advanced and basic scanners with max skills. The proto precision scanner should take a little more effort.
-Something like 1 enhanced damp to hide from proto scanners with max skills.
-The precision scanner should probably take two modules slots (I'm a little undecided) to hide from though. The only thing that scanner has going for it is the good precision, otherwise it has average range, arc, low duration and large fitting (18PG!). Keep in mind that this scanners only use is detecting super stealthy scouts in all other situations you're better with one of the other scanners. |
Baal Omniscient
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
742
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 10:44:00 -
[32] - Quote
Piercing Serenity wrote:I think that everyone should have to pay some sort of "price" to counter the scanners. But between the backwards math that prevents any suit from beating adv scanners with a complex dampener (I can't find the link now), beating the scan is *so* resource intensive that there is almost no point.
And the distance you can see out is less important/useful than being able to see if someone is waiting on a corner or climbing a ledge. Even more useful when the whole squad can see that
And it's not only that, but even if you DO manage to beat the scan, everyone in that squad knows there's at least one guy right behind whatever they just scanned.
And in come the Core Locus grenades....
EXERCISE... EX AR CISE... EGXS AR SISE... EGS ARE SISE... EGGS ARE SIDES.... FOR BACON.....
BACON.
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Baal Omniscient
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
742
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 10:51:00 -
[33] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:Piercing Serenity wrote:I had an alt account my brother made a while back, and decided that I would boot it up and try something else out, just so see how it was doing something new. Things were going okay (I picked up the PLC), but I noticed a trend while I was playing. Every time I had a match where people were running active scanners, the whole team was destroyed.
So, I figured "Well, they're running in squads. I can't really fault them for that. What am I going to do with a Plasma Cannon against six guys with mics". But then I noticed that not only were all of these matches blowouts, they were worse than usual redline camping. I'd see players not even able to walk around the "safezone" that the MCC and ground spawn were supposed to provide. Rather, I saw people dropping like flies for just poking their heads around a corner, or having a grenade land exactly beneath their feat, thrown from some normally bad angle.
The point that I'm trying to make is that these active scanners feel like tool to re-enforce camping more than anything else. I've heard the argument that if you want to combat scanners, you need to stealth tank or HTFU. I don't think that people who say that realize the counter-intuitive situation that brings up. If I use two of the two/three low slots on my suit to avoid advanced scanners, then I'm too weak to fight the people who I'm trying to avoid in the first place.
I have no problem with teams running together. The active scanner just needs to be tweaked - cooldown or range, angle or some other penalty. Right now, things look very bleak from the other end of the beam. The way you present it brings up some valid points. But I think adding more in depth electronic warfare would be more efficient than adjusting the scanners.
I don't disagree, however I think we'd have more luck waiting for a scanner adjustment than we would waiting for immediate EW updates. Once EW is properly implemented, then you can balance all the EW gear against each other, but until it's all in it needs to be balanced against what is currently in the game. Otherwise you ruin the balance of gameplay while we wait for an undisclosed amount of time HOPING that some day soon things will work correctly.
EXERCISE... EX AR CISE... EGXS AR SISE... EGS ARE SISE... EGGS ARE SIDES.... FOR BACON.....
BACON.
|
Piercing Serenity
Shattered Ascension
Top Men.
432
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Posted - 2013.11.20 18:06:00 -
[34] - Quote
Baal Omniscient wrote:Thor Odinson42 wrote:Piercing Serenity wrote:I had an alt account my brother made a while back, and decided that I would boot it up and try something else out, just so see how it was doing something new. Things were going okay (I picked up the PLC), but I noticed a trend while I was playing. Every time I had a match where people were running active scanners, the whole team was destroyed.
So, I figured "Well, they're running in squads. I can't really fault them for that. What am I going to do with a Plasma Cannon against six guys with mics". But then I noticed that not only were all of these matches blowouts, they were worse than usual redline camping. I'd see players not even able to walk around the "safezone" that the MCC and ground spawn were supposed to provide. Rather, I saw people dropping like flies for just poking their heads around a corner, or having a grenade land exactly beneath their feat, thrown from some normally bad angle.
The point that I'm trying to make is that these active scanners feel like tool to re-enforce camping more than anything else. I've heard the argument that if you want to combat scanners, you need to stealth tank or HTFU. I don't think that people who say that realize the counter-intuitive situation that brings up. If I use two of the two/three low slots on my suit to avoid advanced scanners, then I'm too weak to fight the people who I'm trying to avoid in the first place.
I have no problem with teams running together. The active scanner just needs to be tweaked - cooldown or range, angle or some other penalty. Right now, things look very bleak from the other end of the beam. The way you present it brings up some valid points. But I think adding more in depth electronic warfare would be more efficient than adjusting the scanners. I don't disagree, however I think we'd have more luck waiting for a scanner adjustment than we would waiting for immediate EW updates. Once EW is properly implemented, then you can balance all the EW gear against each other, but until it's all in it needs to be balanced against what is currently in the game. Otherwise you ruin the balance of gameplay while we wait for an undisclosed amount of time HOPING that some day soon things will work correctly.
Well, what I'd really like to happen is a hot fix that was introduced with the understanding that things would be changed back to the way things were when new equipment came out. I can understand the damaging effects constant fixed can have for the game. So just be honest about the changes that you're going to make.
"Due to several issues with the active scanner, we are deploying a hot fix with the following changes. A more viable counter will be released in the next major patch, coinciding with the removal of the aforementioned hot fix"
Two birds, one stone
DUST 514 Vet
Born 06/12
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bunnywink
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
351
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Posted - 2013.11.20 18:25:00 -
[35] - Quote
I remember when there wasn't a need for active scanners and a sniper could simply highlight the enemies for their squad mates. I think the active scanners are fine the way they are now (it's definitely an improvement from how it was before). You should always have somebody in squad with an active scanner. |
Keri Starlight
0uter.Heaven
Proficiency V.
2156
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 18:39:00 -
[36] - Quote
In my honest opinion, Profile Dampening needs a buff. Scanners can stay the same.
-Level 5 Gallente Scouts without any Profile Dampener should deceive most, if not all scanners.
-One Complex Profile Dampener on a Medium frame should be enough to deceive ADV scanners (godly for flankers and skirmishers).
-One Complex Profile Dampener on any Scout suit should be enough to deceive any scanner, even that Duvolle Focused or whatever is the name.
This way Scouts and medium frame infiltrators are going to have a consistent stealth advantage over tanked suits without giving away a significant portion of their HP.
People without Dampeners or light suits should be picked by scanners easily, no matter what.
-> Balanced.
-1.7 ranges: AR 42m -> 48m, TAR 65m -> 60m
-Goodbye my love, Tac AR
"I load my gun with love instead of bullets"
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We are 138
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
441
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 18:43:00 -
[37] - Quote
Keri Starlight wrote:In my honest opinion, Profile Dampening needs a buff. Scanners can stay the same.
-Level 5 Gallente Scouts without any Profile Dampener should deceive most, if not all scanners.
-One Complex Profile Dampener on a Medium frame should be enough to deceive ADV scanners (godly for flankers and skirmishers).
-One Complex Profile Dampener on any Scout suit should be enough to deceive any scanner, even that Duvolle Focused or whatever is the name.
This way Scouts and medium frame infiltrators are going to have a consistent stealth advantage over tanked suits without giving away a significant portion of their HP.
People without Dampeners or light suits should be picked by scanners easily, no matter what.
-> Balanced.
She's making sense! quick someone stop her!
(Keri disappears into a burlap sack emblazoned with a CCP logo never to be seen again.) |
Keri Starlight
0uter.Heaven
Proficiency V.
2156
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 18:46:00 -
[38] - Quote
We are 138 wrote:Keri Starlight wrote:In my honest opinion, Profile Dampening needs a buff. Scanners can stay the same.
-Level 5 Gallente Scouts without any Profile Dampener should deceive most, if not all scanners.
-One Complex Profile Dampener on a Medium frame should be enough to deceive ADV scanners (godly for flankers and skirmishers).
-One Complex Profile Dampener on any Scout suit should be enough to deceive any scanner, even that Duvolle Focused or whatever is the name.
This way Scouts and medium frame infiltrators are going to have a consistent stealth advantage over tanked suits without giving away a significant portion of their HP.
People without Dampeners or light suits should be picked by scanners easily, no matter what.
-> Balanced. She's making sense! quick someone stop her! (Keri disappears into a burlap sack emblazoned with a CCP logo never to be seen again.)
LOL!
-1.7 ranges: AR 42m -> 48m, TAR 65m -> 60m
-Goodbye my love, Tac AR
"I load my gun with love instead of bullets"
|
Sana Rayya
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
410
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 18:52:00 -
[39] - Quote
Keri Starlight wrote:In my honest opinion, Profile Dampening needs a buff. Scanners can stay the same.
-Level 5 Gallente Scouts without any Profile Dampener should deceive most, if not all scanners.
-One Complex Profile Dampener on a Medium frame should be enough to deceive ADV scanners (godly for flankers and skirmishers).
-One Complex Profile Dampener on any Scout suit should be enough to deceive any scanner, even that Duvolle Focused or whatever is the name.
This way Scouts and medium frame infiltrators are going to have a consistent stealth advantage over tanked suits without giving away a significant portion of their HP.
People without Dampeners or light suits should be picked by scanners easily, no matter what.
-> Balanced.
1. Gallente Proto Scouts need only Lvl 2 in dampening and 1 basic or militia dampener to avoid 28dB proto scanners
2. A medium frame can already avoid advanced scanners using a single complex dampener.
3. Only the Gallente Proto Scout can avoid the 15 dB scanner, if equipped with four complex dampeners. Obviously not many people do this, so the Duvolle Focused will scan pretty much everyone you'll encounter in the game. Yet you almost never see them used. Why? Because they are sucky scanners, with crappy light up time, huge cool downs, and ridiculous PG fitting costs. So an argument that "scouts should be able to avoid this scanner just because" is purely academic since in reality, the use of this particular scanner is extremely rare. |
Eltra Ardell
Goonfeet
Top Men.
203
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 20:15:00 -
[40] - Quote
I want reddit humor to leave. |
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