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[Request] Better Shield Scaling

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Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL 383	Posted - 2013.11.12 20:49:00 - [31] - Quote Rep tools and repping hives have made the absent or slow recharge of armor meaningless. Two Gal assaults in front of two logis with Six Kin or Lai Dai rep tools on each is 140-176 HP/sec repping, up to 20-30m away. Pretty much impossible to kill unless you core them.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 4334	Posted - 2013.11.12 20:52:00 - [32] - Quote Sana Rayya wrote: Rep tools and repping hives have made the absent or slow recharge of armor meaningless. Two Gal assaults in front of two logis with Six Kin or Lai Dai rep tools on each is 140-176 HP/sec repping, up to 20-30m away. Pretty much impossible to kill unless you core them. But that's two people (the repper and the one being repped). Think of the amount damage that can be done with two people. When you consider that, the fact that it can be repped doesn't change much. (Also, shield triage items coming SoonTM) As for hives, you can always kill them, even with that 140 HP/s from triage hives, as they have to stay inside the radius of that triage. *Oculus Felis Semper Vigilant* *Beta Vet* *Level 4 Forum Warrior*
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 4918	Posted - 2013.11.12 20:55:00 - [33] - Quote Sana Rayya wrote: Rep tools and repping hives have made the absent or slow recharge of armor meaningless. Two Gal assaults in front of two logis with Six Kin or Lai Dai rep tools on each is 140-176 HP/sec repping, up to 20-30m away. Pretty much impossible to kill unless you core them. So, four people? It'd be easily possible to kill them with even two people. A pair of militia ARs could kill the average Gallassault in a second if aimed properly, even with the rep tool on them. Level 4 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3712	Posted - 2013.11.12 21:37:00 - [34] - Quote Shield tankers aren't supposed to hold their own against Armor Tankers in frontline combat. That's the exact reason you armor tank. It's a philosophy of fighting style and a lot of people (still) can't wrap their head around it because of some misconception that running means you're a coward. A Gallente Assault is designed to be able to take a lot of punishment and dish a lot of it out, consequentially it is very very slow. A Caldari Assault, on the other hand, doesn't have as much absorption but can recover very very quickly and a good Caldari Assault will know when to disengage instead of trying to endure the punishment - this is an armor tanking style. The reason shield tanking started to lose it's flavor is because when Armor Tanking got it's much needed buffs and the Scrambler Rifle was introduced, diversity caused counters in playstyle. Accompany this with Aim Assist and mobility wasn't the end-all-be-all to countering your enemy as they could keep up with you a hell of a lot easier now that the controls weren't the threshold in who was going to win the fight. Consider that the Gallente Assault doesn't have that much shields. Three to five bullets, depending on what you're using, can hammer through them and you're applying armor damage. You will -always- be able to outrun him solely because he is using armor, so engage from range/cover and when he starts to engage you - run away. Shield tanking isn't about frontline combat, it's about guerilla warfare. You have to utilize that fast regeneration and keep the target guessing while you're recovering from the damage, since he can't. As far as Logi's having nothing to do with it? IMO, Logi's have EVERYTHING to do with it. The passive 5HP/sec armor repair rate from their skill bonus, combined with high resources and extensive slot layouts results in Logi suits that -should- be shield tanked being better armor tankers than the Gallente Assault. Point in case: Caldari Logi, which -normally- runs armor tanked with a bunch of stacked damage mods. In regards to omni-tanking? Some suits are practically designed for it, like the Amarr Assault which has even HP values and slot layout. Cross that with the fact that there's nothing really to put into the high slots outside of shield modules and damage modules and you're left with a conundrum in playstyle. A shield tanker can always fit shield regulators, codebreakers, profile dampeners, etc.... An armor tanker doesn't have much choice but to add shield modules or damage mods. ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
Cosgar ParagonX 7825	Posted - 2013.11.17 06:43:00 - [35] - Quote Minor update. I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic Top Men. 295	Posted - 2013.11.17 12:32:00 - [36] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Alright. Initially, I agreed with your premise. Shield extenders do need better scaling - the enhanced is silly. Then I saw that you were suggesting a 50% buff to the complex. A significant buff to shield HP is not needed. Running your numbers, we get Caldari assaults running 744 shields and 2.7/4.4 second shield delays at 31.25 HP/s with the following fit. Well in my defense I do say that merely buffing shields is not the answer. Thinking some mods need to go into the highs to compensate...like PG mods (after they get better tweaked). However your are forcing shields regulators onto the shields basically removes any argument about the disparity in number of mods because you MUST equip that (and CPU mod to compensate) to match anything. They also have a stacking penalty. You also force a nanohive on the build that doesn't really need it. Plus only focusing on Assaults generally makes Gal the loser just from PG/CPU. Now focusing on logis (them compared to each other not compared to the different class) I think you'll find that Gal logi wins.
Mordecai Sanguine What The French 126	Posted - 2013.11.17 13:54:00 - [37] - Quote Some people need to understand that Shield tanking does NOT exist. Shield Tanking means : Shoot and Run. You're pretty weak but you're fast (Caldari are damn fast and the right Slots are made for Biotic) regen your life really fast. Maded for Flanking and back all ennemies. Armor Tanking Means : Turrets Mode. Can stay on combat longer and are far more resistant the Shield tanker BUT have low Regen rate so battle by battle always lose life. An shield tanker is NEVER supposed to be more resistant than an Armor Tanker. And shield have integrated Shield Rgen while us Armor tanker need to waste 1 or 2 slots of armor JUST to have Armor regen.. If you wanted to have a lot of EhP it's not on shield.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic Top Men. 298	Posted - 2013.11.17 14:11:00 - [38] - Quote Mordecai Sanguine wrote: Some people need to understand that Shield tanking does NOT exist. Shield Tanking means : Shoot and Run. You're pretty weak but you're fast (Caldari are damn fast and the right Slots are made for Biotic) regen your life really fast. Maded for Flanking and back all ennemies. Armor Tanking Means : Turrets Mode. Can stay on combat longer and are far more resistant the Shield tanker BUT have low Regen rate so battle by battle always lose life. An shield tanker is NEVER supposed to be more resistant than an Armor Tanker. And shield have integrated Shield Rgen while us Armor tanker need to waste 1 or 2 slots of armor JUST to have Armor regen.. If you wanted to have a lot of EhP it's not on shield. Ugh, Armor reps is at an advantage in the short term not shields...it takes shields quite a while before they gain the advantage. They are NOT hit and run, their regen is not built for that. At best they are better in between fights with LONG breaks. Mobility is very much worthless in comparison to brick tanking. Battle by battle armor losses life? Not true. It's shields tankers that can be whittled away on, once you hit armor they can never get it back...pretty sure armor tankers have reps and inherent shield regen so they are most likely to be at 100% EHP. Also armor CAN run without reps...just need a triage hive or logi friend. Shields get no such advantage.
George Moros Area 514 178	Posted - 2013.11.17 14:23:00 - [39] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Complex is fine at 66 and certainly does not need a buff, enhanced just needs to be 44. THIS I approve of. Even raise basic to 33. So it's 33/44/66. 22/33/66 spread across tiers is totally wrong and imbalanced. The spread in armor plates is quite balanced, so based on that it should be more in the line of 44/55/66. That's assuming shield extenders must have a same-digit number bonus. Pulvereus ergo queritor.


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