DUST Search - The AR is missing a super important balancing factor...

Sirpidey Adtur wrote:

I-Shayz-I wrote:

What about the SMG? Why isn't it OP again? At point blank range the SMG is a beast...but it's limited because you can't hit people from more than 30 meters away because of DISPERSION.

HMG is the same way. If you are close enough to make all bullets hit their target you end up with a merc that looks like swiss cheese. At range, the HMG is balanced because of DISPERSION.

SMG is actually quite accurate and has very little dispersion when in ADS. The reason you can't hit people over 30m away is due to optimal and falloff ranges. Try again.

Quote:

What about CoD? Whenever you fire an automatic weapon it puts lines on the screen (Even when ADS) to show you how much dispersion the weapon has...and to explain why not all of your shots are hitting where you aim your sights.

Ahh yes, CoD. The golden shooter. Full of realism. Where players are frail to the point that shining a flashlight practically kills someone. In a game like that, where a single good bullet can kill someone, yes, you DO need dispersion, otherwise it would simply turn into a "who sees the other first" game. Dust is a game where you can actually survive being shot, and be fully repaired.

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I-Shayz-I I-----I 1243	Posted - 2013.11.06 05:30:00 - [1] - Quote DISPERSION WHILE ADS Why isn't this in the game? If it didn't shoot like an automatic sniper then maybe it would be balanced LIKE ALL THE OTHER WEAPONS. Go ahead, test it. Aim at a spot on the wall and fire while ADS. The muzzle won't start climbing until you've fired off about 30 rounds, and when you let go of the trigger it resets the muzzle climb for another 30 rounds. Where is the dispersion that is apparent when you hip-fire the thing? You can't blame it all on kick can you? I mean the assault scrambler rifle fires lasers and the thing has dispersion while ADS so you can't snipe with it like you can with the standard one. This is what makes it balanced. What about the SMG? Why isn't it OP again? At point blank range the SMG is a beast...but it's limited because you can't hit people from more than 30 meters away because of DISPERSION. HMG is the same way. If you are close enough to make all bullets hit their target you end up with a merc that looks like swiss cheese. At range, the HMG is balanced because of DISPERSION. _____________________________________ Have you ever played Halo? No, not the recent ones, I'm talking about combat evolved. Remember the Assault Rifle in that game? Remember how you could fire at players across the map and still hit them? But wait, you probably don't remember actually killing anyone from that kind of distance, do you... That's because it had DISPERSION (and no ADS). At close range it was able to do a ton of damage, but get too far away and it was pathetic compared to longer range weapons. _____________________________________ What about CoD? Whenever you fire an automatic weapon it puts lines on the screen (Even when ADS) to show you how much dispersion the weapon has...and to explain why not all of your shots are hitting where you aim your sights. _____________________________________ The Resistance series has a carbine weapon, heck it even has an underbarrel rpg. Can you guess why it was balanced? Their other automatic weapon (the bullseye) had an even faster rate of fire...but you probably know why that weapon was balanced too. DISPERSION! Is it that hard to understand? Is it really not obvious to our playerbase, the DEVs, and any gamer out there who has ever played a shooter? List of Most Important Threads I make logistics videos! (Insert future link here)
Meeko Fent Expert Intervention Caldari State 1393	Posted - 2013.11.06 05:38:00 - [2] - Quote Yup. The reason why I run AScR. It has that recoil. Not only is it a balancing factor, it brings the feeling of power that Sci-Fi Plasma Guns deserve. Meeko's Novelty Shop Opening Soon! We (will)sell all the novelty items you desire! Really! King of Uncertainty.
KING CHECKMATE AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS 2262	Posted - 2013.11.06 05:46:00 - [3] - Quote +1 But i have said this many times thou...XD u+Élop s-¦ -Äll+Én-ç+ö+É
castba Penguin's March 178	Posted - 2013.11.06 05:54:00 - [4] - Quote Remove sharpshooter and kick dampening skills.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2576	Posted - 2013.11.06 06:01:00 - [5] - Quote castba wrote: Remove sharpshooter and kick dampening skills. Won't help. I have 0 sp in ARs and use the exile. It has no dispersion GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢ Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà Forum Warrior LV. 2
I-Shayz-I I-----I 1247	Posted - 2013.11.06 06:33:00 - [6] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: castba wrote: Remove sharpshooter and kick dampening skills. Won't help. I have 0 sp in ARs and use the exile. It has no dispersion I think this is the first post I've liked of yours. You have my respect now. List of Most Important Threads I make logistics videos! (Insert future link here)
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. Top Men. 311	Posted - 2013.11.06 06:57:00 - [7] - Quote Got a recruit AR on my alt. Damn that **** it insane with some dmg mods. Refuse to use AR, refuse to use core locus. If you use these you are classified as a noskill easymode route going player. GûîGöéGûêGòæGûîGòæGûîGòæ la+äa+ú-ö-¦ +º-¦a¦Åt-ö-éta¦Ça¦Åa+á -ö+É-öa+¼-öa+ä-¦ a+¼a¦Çll a+áa¦Åt a+úa+ä+¬-ö +Éa¦Åa+ó +ª-¦a¦Åa¦ô t-Æa¦Ça+ú a¦Æ-öa+äa¦ô... GòæGûîGòæGûîGòæGûêGöéGûî
Garth Mandra The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 195	Posted - 2013.11.06 06:58:00 - [8] - Quote I agree. Who knows perhaps more modifications will be required but that one should come first.
Sirpidey Adtur Aloren Foundations 94	Posted - 2013.11.06 07:07:00 - [9] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: What about the SMG? Why isn't it OP again? At point blank range the SMG is a beast...but it's limited because you can't hit people from more than 30 meters away because of DISPERSION. HMG is the same way. If you are close enough to make all bullets hit their target you end up with a merc that looks like swiss cheese. At range, the HMG is balanced because of DISPERSION. SMG is actually quite accurate and has very little dispersion when in ADS. The reason you can't hit people over 30m away is due to optimal and falloff ranges. Try again. Quote: What about CoD? Whenever you fire an automatic weapon it puts lines on the screen (Even when ADS) to show you how much dispersion the weapon has...and to explain why not all of your shots are hitting where you aim your sights. Ahh yes, CoD. The golden shooter. Full of realism. Where players are frail to the point that shining a flashlight practically kills someone. In a game like that, where a single good bullet can kill someone, yes, you DO need dispersion, otherwise it would simply turn into a "who sees the other first" game. Dust is a game where you can actually survive being shot, and be fully repaired.
Borne Velvalor Endless Hatred 913	Posted - 2013.11.06 07:10:00 - [10] - Quote Yes, the AR is easy as hell to hit people with. It should either be high damage with moderate dispersion at range or be medium damage with low dispersion at range. Right now, it's got the fastest TTK in the game other than OHKO weapons and a godly Scrambler Rifle user that hits the fire cap with every round hitting, while also being dead accurate. Once the recoil gets to be too high, just let go of the trigger and pump again. Assault Rifle users complain about Mass Drivers that take 5 seconds to kill them while they walk around with boom sticks with little recoil and no special mechanics to worry about that can kill in 1-1.5 seconds. However, the Assault Rifle isn't bothering me as much now that 1.7 has been announced. I'll probably pick up a Rail Rifle. Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn. Panda.
Borne Velvalor Endless Hatred 913	Posted - 2013.11.06 07:11:00 - [11] - Quote Sirpidey Adtur wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: What about the SMG? Why isn't it OP again? At point blank range the SMG is a beast...but it's limited because you can't hit people from more than 30 meters away because of DISPERSION. HMG is the same way. If you are close enough to make all bullets hit their target you end up with a merc that looks like swiss cheese. At range, the HMG is balanced because of DISPERSION. SMG is actually quite accurate and has very little dispersion when in ADS. The reason you can't hit people over 30m away is due to optimal and falloff ranges. Try again. Quote: What about CoD? Whenever you fire an automatic weapon it puts lines on the screen (Even when ADS) to show you how much dispersion the weapon has...and to explain why not all of your shots are hitting where you aim your sights. Ahh yes, CoD. The golden shooter. Full of realism. Where players are frail to the point that shining a flashlight practically kills someone. In a game like that, where a single good bullet can kill someone, yes, you DO need dispersion, otherwise it would simply turn into a "who sees the other first" game. Dust is a game where you can actually survive being shot, and be fully repaired. Also, CoD has fall off damage just like Dust which changes the damage profile. Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn. Panda.
8213 Grade No.2 531	Posted - 2013.11.06 07:28:00 - [12] - Quote 100% agree! A gun that can fire 60 continuous rounds, at 30+ damage a piece shouldn't be so accurate, no matter what proficiency you have on it. AR doesn't have any balancing factors on it except that you can't kill past 100m... Either loosen the bullet spread, or reduce the clip size to 30, or lower the fire rate to 550...
dogmanpig black market bank 31	Posted - 2013.11.06 07:30:00 - [13] - Quote Sirpidey Adtur wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: What about the SMG? Why isn't it OP again? At point blank range the SMG is a beast...but it's limited because you can't hit people from more than 30 meters away because of DISPERSION. HMG is the same way. If you are close enough to make all bullets hit their target you end up with a merc that looks like swiss cheese. At range, the HMG is balanced because of DISPERSION. SMG is actually quite accurate and has very little dispersion when in ADS. The reason you can't hit people over 30m away is due to optimal and falloff ranges. Try again. Quote: What about CoD? Whenever you fire an automatic weapon it puts lines on the screen (Even when ADS) to show you how much dispersion the weapon has...and to explain why not all of your shots are hitting where you aim your sights. Ahh yes, CoD. The golden shooter. Full of realism. Where players are frail to the point that shining a flashlight practically kills someone. In a game like that, where a single good bullet can kill someone, yes, you DO need dispersion, otherwise it would simply turn into a "who sees the other first" game. Dust is a game where you can actually survive being shot, and be fully repaired. the SMG isn't OP because of its long TTK then ARs not range. You hate me, I hate you. Lets keep it that way. Level 7 1/3 Forum alt. "Its worth half a penny and a reach around"
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1001	Posted - 2013.11.06 08:51:00 - [14] - Quote Today I used a Gek with my heavy suit that had 1 complex dmg mod on it & after a few battles I questioned why I use Scr & Lrs instead of the Ar. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
Kasote Denzara A Vulture 679	Posted - 2013.11.06 08:55:00 - [15] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Today I used a Gek with my heavy suit that had 1 complex dmg mod on it & after a few battles I questioned why I use Scr & Lrs instead of the Ar. Because real men don't need the easy weapons. I go commando in my Commando. Feels good, man.
Laurent Cazaderon What The French 2004	Posted - 2013.11.06 09:14:00 - [16] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Today I used a Gek with my heavy suit that had 1 complex dmg mod on it & after a few battles I questioned why I use Scr & Lrs instead of the Ar. I know the feeling. This Char i only use on the forum. To contact me : "Cazaderon" in game and on Skype. Et vive la France !
superjoe360x D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 110	Posted - 2013.11.06 09:22:00 - [17] - Quote Sirpidey Adtur wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: What about the SMG? Why isn't it OP again? At point blank range the SMG is a beast...but it's limited because you can't hit people from more than 30 meters away because of DISPERSION. HMG is the same way. If you are close enough to make all bullets hit their target you end up with a merc that looks like swiss cheese. At range, the HMG is balanced because of DISPERSION. SMG is actually quite accurate and has very little dispersion when in ADS. The reason you can't hit people over 30m away is due to optimal and falloff ranges. Try again. Quote: What about CoD? Whenever you fire an automatic weapon it puts lines on the screen (Even when ADS) to show you how much dispersion the weapon has...and to explain why not all of your shots are hitting where you aim your sights. Ahh yes, CoD. The golden shooter. Full of realism. Where players are frail to the point that shining a flashlight practically kills someone. In a game like that, where a single good bullet can kill someone, yes, you DO need dispersion, otherwise it would simply turn into a "who sees the other first" game. Dust is a game where you can actually survive being shot, and be fully repaired. You used to be able to survive getting shot in Dust. Get it right.
Shadow heat Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 143	Posted - 2013.11.06 09:30:00 - [18] - Quote You mean that thing that you guys like to call an Assault Rifle ? Is more like a big SMG that spits rocks.
Laurent Cazaderon What The French 2006	Posted - 2013.11.06 09:48:00 - [19] - Quote Shadow heat wrote: You mean that thing that you guys like to call an Assault Rifle ? Is more like a big SMG that spits rocks. LOL. But you're close to the truth when considering the total absence of recoil it offers. God i miss it. This Char i only use on the forum. To contact me : "Cazaderon" in game and on Skype. Et vive la France !
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. Top Men. 313	Posted - 2013.11.06 09:50:00 - [20] - Quote Protest against AR by only using AR!!!! Lets make Dust 514 BURRRRRRRRRRRRRRN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GûîGöéGûêGòæGûîGòæGûîGòæ la+äa+ú-ö-¦ +º-¦a¦Åt-ö-éta¦Ça¦Åa+á -ö+É-öa+¼-öa+ä-¦ a+¼a¦Çll a+áa¦Åt a+úa+ä+¬-ö +Éa¦Åa+ó +ª-¦a¦Åa¦ô t-Æa¦Ça+ú a¦Æ-öa+äa¦ô... GòæGûîGòæGûîGòæGûêGöéGûî
DeadlyAztec11 Gallente Federation 2387	Posted - 2013.11.06 10:09:00 - [21] - Quote Personally, I would rather have a lot more kick and no dispersion. Dispersion is BS because it is built in 'bad hit detection'. It also makes weapons like the HMG UP. Dispersion should just be done away with. Madness is the emergency exit. You can just step outside, and close the door on all those dreadful things that happened.
Garth Mandra The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 197	Posted - 2013.11.06 23:56:00 - [22] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Personally, I would rather have a lot more kick and no dispersion. Dispersion is BS because it is built in 'bad hit detection'. It also makes weapons like the HMG UP. Dispersion should just be done away with. Not a bad idea. The accuracy just needs to come down.
ReGnYuM Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1241	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:19:00 - [23] - Quote These threads make me lol If you never heard of ReGnYuM, you're neither Good or Relevant in Dust 514. KDR > EVERYTHING
Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1647	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:21:00 - [24] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: These threads make me lol I disagree your lack of skill makes me lol... CEO of The Corporate Raiders, We're still recruiting... Level 1 Forum Warrior
I-Shayz-I I-----I 1262	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:30:00 - [25] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: These threads make me lol I make them just for people like you :) List of Most Important Threads I make logistics videos!
ReGnYuM Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1242	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:37:00 - [26] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: ReGnYuM wrote: These threads make me lol I make them just for people like you :) I enjoy when people go out of their way to please me Would you like to be one of many Logi Whores and please me more? If you never heard of ReGnYuM, you're neither Good or Relevant in Dust 514. KDR > EVERYTHING
Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1650	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:39:00 - [27] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: ReGnYuM wrote: These threads make me lol I make them just for people like you :) I enjoy when people go out of their way to please me Would you like to be one of many Logi Whores and please me more? You shouldn't rep him... though you should needle **** him... Kill Revive Kill Revive... 1 million ISK if he cries... CEO of The Corporate Raiders, We're still recruiting... Level 1 Forum Warrior
ReGnYuM Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1243	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:41:00 - [28] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: ReGnYuM wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: ReGnYuM wrote: These threads make me lol I make them just for people like you :) I enjoy when people go out of their way to please me Would you like to be one of many Logi Whores and please me more? You shouldn't rep him... though you should needle **** him... Kill Revive Kill Revive... 1 million ISK if he cries... I shield Tank Repping is irrelevant to me. If you never heard of ReGnYuM, you're neither Good or Relevant in Dust 514. KDR > EVERYTHING
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 683	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:42:00 - [29] - Quote ROFL The recoil doesn't even matter, because If I just aim at their feet the recoil will bring me to my targets face, for a headshot! (Assuming they survive the first 30 rounds) There there Mr. Scout and Ms. Heavy, don't cry You'll still be useful in my eyes
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 683	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:43:00 - [30] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: [quote=Killar-12][quote=ReGnYuM] I shield Tank Repping is irrelevant to me. It's a good thing you don't play Minmatar FW There there Mr. Scout and Ms. Heavy, don't cry You'll still be useful in my eyes

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